Ramifications of Sean Taylors actions.

weneedcharlesmann · Post by **weneedcharlesmann** » Sat Jun 04, 2005 6:51 pm

that's an interesting idea that he should be sent to iraq for a tour of duty. as long as you're willing to commit any of your kids to that same punishment if say they get a DUI, which he didn't, or if they don't call their boss back.

the fact that he's 22 is very relevant. he's immature and growing still. comparing him with people who are in the midst of fighting a war is ridiculous, unless, like kellen winslow jr., you also think football players are "soldiers."

one thing is true--right now, we know nothing but the police are looking for him. if sean did shoot into a house, well then that was pretty stupid, and he'll go to jail. end of story. if he didn't and it involves his stolen car or whatever, then it'd be kind of unfair for us to ship him to a war zone for being the victim of a crime.

in the end, what it boils down to is that you guys would like him, because he's a football player, a potential star, and a redskin, to act with poise and essentially be a "character guy." fine. now, how about giving him more than a year to develop into those things?

if the skins get rid of sean taylor over this, or come down hard on him, then we can look for another ricky williams situation, or even better, him going to another team and developing into a "character guy" and a pro bowler who eventually will kill jason campbell and celebrate over his broken leg. I for one would prefer seeing him do that to drew henson or eli manning (though i don't really want to wish injuries on people)

JPFair · Post by **JPFair** » Sat Jun 04, 2005 8:10 pm

the fact that he's 22 is very relevant. he's immature and growing still.

I disagree. Sean Taylor is 22 years old. Once someone turns 18, they're adults. Me, you, him, ANYONE!! Take, for instance, Maria Sharapova. She's 18 years old, and we never hear of her being the immature type of person Sean Taylor is. What about Andre Agassi? It would be unfair to say something like "Sharapova is a female, or she's not playing in the NFL". The bottom line is when you become a professional athlete, the rules are the same as if you're not a professional athlete, once you become 18, you're an adult. Sean Taylor is 22 years old. He's old enough to drink, to vote, and to make adult type decisions. He is an adult. No matter how you flower it up, he's an adult and is expected to act like one. There are plenty of 22 year old people in the NFL that do not have the same level of immaturity that Taylor has shown. Let's see if Alex Smith or Ronnie Brown have similar type of problems. So, while Sean Taylor is young, he's also an adult. He's well educated and should act accordingly. The University of Miami is a respectable school, and Sean Taylors family is well respected. So, yes, you're right, he's 22 years old. BIG DEAL!! When I was 22, and I'm sure many of the posters on this board can say the same thing, but I didn't display this type of immaturity. Are his actions excusable because he's in the NFL? His age is of no consequence. One time you can accept it. Twice, maybe! Sean Taylor, IMO, ran out of "Get out of Jail" passes a long time ago and it's time to grow up, because, in the eyes of the law, he's been an adult for the last five years.

one thing is true--right now, we know nothing but the police are looking for him.

You don't think that's an "issue"? The very fact that they're looking for him, irrespective of why, is part of a larger pattern that he's displayed. So, while he may not be guilty of a crime, he shouldn't put himself in a position to be a "person of interest". People may say "Hey, maybe he was in the wrong place and he didn't do anything wrong". Well, my response to that would be that if he was in his living room at night, studying a playbook, the Police wouldn't wanna speak to him.

if sean did shoot into a house, well then that was pretty stupid, and he'll go to jail.

You think so huh?

end of story

Not by a long shot! Maybe in this particular instance it might end, but IMO, we have yet to see the worst case scenario with Sean Taylor. He hasn't shown me anything to make me think he's maturing at a normal rate, and in fact, I think he's on a downward spiral. I think his problems are only going to get worse. I hope I'm wrong, but I honestly think Sean Taylor is headed for self destruction.

fine. now, how about giving him more than a year to develop into those things?

A year? He's had twenty two of them!! Just because he's only been in the NFL for one season doesn't excuse his actions. NFL players adjust their lives once they enter the NFL, and are expected and required to act responsibly upon entry to the NFL, not after a year or two. The NFL is not an educational institution that teaches you how to mature. It's a professional sports league, not a lesson in how to mature.

, or even better, him going to another team

That's NOT going to happen. Gibbs is smart enough to know not to trade him. We essentially OWN Sean Taylor, and if we can't have him, NOBODY can.

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:41 pm

welch wrote:(a) Taylor is showing a pattern of behavior that might call for a different sort of professional help than NFL coaching. We can't say for certain, but there is a pattern.

I hate to disagree but I do not see a pattern. We do not have enough information to say so. Bad judgment in a couple of instances does not make a pattern.

But I agree that this guy may need more than coaching help. Unfortunately, the first step to be helped is to want or even accept to be helped. Sadly, I am not sure that he is anywhere near that stage.

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:44 pm

JPFair wrote:That's NOT going to happen. Gibbs is smart enough to know not to trade him. We essentially OWN Sean Taylor, and if we can't have him, NOBODY can.

Al Davis is already rubbing his hands in anticipation.

ANT7088 · Post by **ANT7088** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 1:14 am

Safety charged with assault, battery

Washington Redskins safety Sean Taylor, described as a "person of interest" in an assault case, turned himself in to Miami-Dade County police on Saturday, ESPN.com's Len Pasquarelli reported. Taylor has been charged with aggravated assault with a firearm, a felony, and simple battery.

The assault happened Wednesday night and shots were fired, police spokesman Mary Walters said. No one was injured.

The Washington Post reported on its Web site the assault case involved a stolen car. Taylor and a friend were reportedly at the scene of a crime, but it was unclear who the stolen car belonged to and why Taylor was there. A public information officer for the Miami-Dade County Police Department told The Post that shots were fired into the vehicle.

"We have just been made aware of a potential situation in Miami regarding Sean Taylor," the Redskins said in a statement Saturday night. "The representatives for Taylor are keeping us informed as to the developments of the situation. There is nothing we can add to the process at this time."

Taylor's agent, Drew Rosenhaus, declined comment Friday.

Taylor, who wants a new contract, has been working out in Miami despite pleas from coach Joe Gibbs to join the team in voluntary workouts at their home base in suburban Washington. He signed a seven-year, $18 million deal as the No. 5 overall draft pick in the 2004 draft.

The former Miami Hurricanes standout has had a tempestuous start to his NFL career.

He has fired two agents, was fined for skipping one day of the NFL's mandatory rookie symposium and was accused of spitting on a player during a game at Cincinnati, although he was not punished because the league said there was no video evidence.

He was also charged with drunken driving in October, when he was pulled over at 2:45 a.m. after attending a birthday party for receiver Rod Gardner. Those charges were dismissed in January.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2075361

welch · Post by **welch** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 1:36 am

that's an interesting idea that he should be sent to iraq for a tour of duty. as long as you're willing to commit any of your kids to that same punishment if say they get a DUI, which he didn't, or if they don't call their boss back.

Curious, but about a minute ago I jokingly / bitterly suggested this on another of the 33 [Baugh's number: Redskins luck] threads about Taylor.

My daughter-in-law deployed to Iraq last summer, and returned safe to Ft Hood this February. She doesn't drink and drive, and only shoots guns on the target range; her "punishment" came when she couldn't pay off all her college loans.

So, let's say we've done it, son and daughter; neither actually commited any crime more serious than wanting an education, and hoping to protect the country.

I'm beginning to feel irritated by this Taylor kid. He may not have graduated (I don't remember), but he finished college a millionaire. My son's basic training platoon contained people like the urban planner who couldn't find work, and became a "topographical analyst", or the 22 year old car mechanic who lost his job, and is repairing Army trucks.

Would Taylor survive BCT? I doubt it. You don't refuse to return phone calls from your drill sergeant.

SirSmizzy · Post by **SirSmizzy** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 1:43 am

Redskins | Police and Courts: S. Taylor - from www.KFFL.com
Sat, 4 Jun 2005 22:16:25 -0700

WUSATV9.com reports Washington Redskins S Sean Taylor has been charged with aggravated assault with a firearm, and simple assault. He was taken into police custody at Miami-Dade County police headquarters Saturday, June 4. The earliest Taylor can appear in court is Monday, June 6.

Punu · Post by **Punu** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 4:38 am

fine... that's all.
a 700.00 lawyer can take care of that.
(trust me ) :wink:

SKINZ_DOMIN8 · Post by **SKINZ_DOMIN8** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 9:19 am

Bottom Line: The Redskins now have him by the Cahones. If we wanted to we could sit him for the remainder of his contract which I think is at least 5 more seasons if not more. I hope Gibbs doesn't do anything rash and try to trade him for nothing. You just cannot do that in this NFL. He would be immediately picked up by another team. :evil:

JPFair · Post by **JPFair** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 9:59 am

Gibbs is NOT going to trade Sean Taylor, no matter WHAT happens. Sean Taylor can go out and "go postal" somehwere and he's NOT going to be traded. He'll sit on the bench for two or three years before he's traded. Joe Gibbs is not that stupid!

oafusp · Post by **oafusp** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 10:54 am

UPDATE:

MIAMI (AP) - After firing two of his agents almost one year ago Washington Redskins 2004 first round pick Sean Taylor has been fired by his current agent Drew Rosenhaus. This ironic twist of events came to light after Sean Taylor was arrested Saturday in Miami for aggravated assault with a firearm, a felony, and simple battery. When reached for comment Rosenhaus declared that he parted ways with Taylor since he did not follow Rosenhaus' strict "How to Weasel More Money From Your Employer Plan". This plan is currently in use by dozens of other NFL players and strictly forbids the player from shooting guns at people or property.

In other news, Sean Taylor had changed his jersey number again. First he was number 36, and recently changed to 21. He will now be sporting 149538-22.

UK Skins Fan · Post by **UK Skins Fan** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 10:54 am

Gibbs is NOT going to trade Sean Taylor, no matter WHAT happens. Sean Taylor can go out and "go postal" somehwere and he's NOT going to be traded. He'll sit on the bench for two or three years before he's traded. Joe Gibbs is not that stupid!

Well, I think the way the Coles situation turned out may contradict your assertion that Taylor wouldn't be traded. However, I think that trading Taylor in the next couple of years would be impossible because of the cap situation. So the fact is that Taylor is stuck with the Redskins and the Redskins are probably stuck with Taylor.

air_hog · Post by **air_hog** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 1:57 pm

Well, at least he turned himself in...

I think this is becoming worse and worse. I think he may be in the same mold of Ron Artest, a very troubled young man wiht exceptional talent.

I think he needs to have a long hard talk with ALL of the coaches, and maybe they can get him some help.

oafusp · Post by **oafusp** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 2:58 pm

Ok, does anyone know the details of Sean Taylor's contract?

Is there a clause in it like Kevin Winslows where he would have to return the bonus money if he injures himself or gets incarcerated?

There's got to be a clause like that huh?

What happened to 1st round pick Ray Carruth when he got locked up? Did the Panthers get money back?

Anyone?....

welch · Post by **welch** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 7:16 pm

Ok, does anyone know the details of Sean Taylor's contract?

Is there a clause in it like Kevin Winslows where he would have to return the bonus money if he injures himself or gets incarcerated?

There's got to be a clause like that huh?

What happened to 1st round pick Ray Carruth when he got locked up? Did the Panthers get money back?

Anyone?....

I don't know Taylor's contract, but the Yankees terminated Aaron Boone's contract when he tore a knee playing basketball. They considered breaking Giambi when the Bonds/Giambi/McGwire scandal broke. They way Giambi is playing, it might still happen.

Common sense (meaning I am not a lawyer) says that if a player does something off-field that makes him incapable of playing, he has probably broken some part of the contract. Snyder, and the other owners, would have to be foolish businessmen otherwise.

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 7:34 pm

SKINZ_DOMIN8 wrote:Bottom Line: The Redskins now have him by the Cahones.

The Cahones? What is that in what language? If it is Spanish, it would be close to cajones (drawers).

The Redskins have him by the "drawers"? :hmm:

Maybe you mean cojones and not cahones. Maybe. :roll:

REDEEMMED may help clarify this for you :lol:

gibbs#1 · Post by **gibbs#1** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:27 pm

what do you guys think the redskins will do suspend? cut? i don't no but it would suck to lose taylor for the season opener

washington53 · Post by **washington53** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:37 pm

well i think we should lsn to him and change his contract under a rule that he doesnt get into trouble or he will pay for it, and sit out, and that he has to attend all voluntary workouts.

Thats if he doesnt go to jail for a short while.

SKINZ_DOMIN8 · Post by **SKINZ_DOMIN8** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:42 pm

Sit him down and give him the carrot and stick speech. He either follows Gibbs direction from this point forward or he languishes on the bench for the rest of his stay here making no incentives. That would certainly send a message.

Irn-Bru · Post by **Irn-Bru** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:46 pm

I'm merging this with the main thread on the ramifications of Sean Taylor's actions. Please feel free to discuss topics in existing threads if they've already been started.

The Hogster · Post by **The Hogster** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:56 pm

Taylor's contract could be worth 40 million dollars if he hits all of his incentives. Simply continuing to play well would have given him the full 40, and after two or three years, and a pro-bowl appearance etc. he would have been able to get a new contract.

I am not relieving the kid of irresponsibility, but the Rosenhaus tactic has once again led to a ridiculous outcome. He should have been in camp doing the right thing this spring, and not told to parade around Miami with the rest of the Rosenhaus holdout bunch.

Just think, if he goest to camp and stays out of trouble for another year, he has the chance to continue growing, learning and maturing. He may well never have had a run in with the law. On the other hand, he may have been a ticking time bomb, and it was only a matter of time before he exploded.

who knows...but as of now, Rosenhaus for one should feel even a little responsible.

Irn-Bru · Post by **Irn-Bru** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:59 pm

TheHogster wrote:Taylor's contract could be worth 40 million dollars if he hits all of his incentives. Simply continuing to play well would have given him the full 40, and after two or three years, and a pro-bowl appearance etc. he would have been able to get a new contract.

While, if Taylor had just plays well, he would end up with quite a bit of cash, I am sure that the Redskins would force a renegotiation of his current contract (or trade / release him) long before any of the 'big years' on the contract actually hit. So, while I don't think that he's got any right to try and get more from the Redskins at this point in time, I don't think that we can say that Taylor is turning his nose up at a 40 million dollar contract. He simply will never see a lot of that money.

SKINS#1 · Post by **SKINS#1** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 9:24 pm

[quote=" Rosenhaus for one should feel even a little responsible.[/quote]

Rosenhaus and his parents, both should feel disappointed. Who has/is providing direction to ST. Seems like he doesn't want any advice. If he continues to ignore JG, the Redskins should let him become a fixture on the bench (assuming he stays out of jail).

General Failure · Post by **General Failure** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 9:28 pm

Rosenhaus isn't his daddy. He's Taylor's employee. His job is to get the spoiled brat the most money he can, not make sure he's living a wholesome life.

ANT7088 · Post by **ANT7088** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 9:34 pm

He's Out

Washington Redskins free safety Sean Taylor was released on $16,500 bond after he was arrested and charged with aggravated assault with a firearm.

Taylor, 22, turned himself in to Miami-Dade County police Saturday and was released later that night, Miami-Dade corrections spokeswoman Janelle Hall said Sunday. Since Taylor was set free, the Miami-Dade County clerk's office will set an arraignment date later.

Taylor was accompanied by defense attorney Fred Moldovan when he surrendered on charges of aggravated assault with a firearm and simple battery, police said.

According to a police statement, Taylor pointed a gun at an unidentified person Wednesday during a dispute over two all-terrain vehicles he claimed were stolen. Taylor left the scene but returned about 10 minutes later and punched one person.

Another man, Charles Elwood Caughman, threatened and chased another victim with a baseball bat, police said. Caughman, 19, was arrested later that day and charged with aggravated assault.

Police said the Redskins have cooperated during the investigation.

"The representatives for Taylor are keeping us informed as to the developments," Redskins spokesman Karl Swanson said.

Taylor's agent, Drew Rosenhaus, didn't return phone messages left at his office Saturday and Sunday. Moldovan didn't immediately return a call to his answering service for comment Sunday.

Taylor, who wants a new contract, has been working out in Miami despite pleas from Redskins coach Joe Gibbs to join the team in voluntary workouts at their home base in suburban Washington. He signed a seven-year, $18 million deal as the No. 5 overall draft pick in the 2004 draft.

The former Miami Hurricanes standout has had a tempestuous start to his NFL career.

He has fired two agents, was fined for skipping one day of the NFL's mandatory rookie symposium and was accused of spitting on a player during a game at Cincinnati, although he wasn't punished because the league said there was no video evidence.

He was also charged with drunken driving in October, when he was pulled over at 2:45 a.m. after attending a birthday party for receiver Rod Gardner. Those charges were dismissed in January.

In his rookie season, Taylor had 89 tackles, four interceptions, two forced fumbles and one sack and started 13 games.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2076897[/list]

The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Ramifications of Sean Taylors actions.

How should gibbs react?