Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

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Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

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http://www.stationcaster.com/player_ski ... &f=3671033

THE SPORTS FIX

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11-25-14 ESPN's Trent Dilfer (19:44)

Some excerpts:

Back in September, ESPN analyst Trent Dilfer said that Robert Griffin III’s development as a pocket passer was his No. 1 storyline in the NFL this season.

“[If] he doesn’t develop this year, and if he doesn’t buy in, and if it is like pulling teeth to get him to play the way they need him to play to win, then you have to start talking bust,” Dilfer told Colin Cowherd after the Redskins’ Week 1 loss to Houston. “But if he does evolve, and if he does buy in to a system playing football that emphasizes his unique talents, which he has, but he lets all of those talents come out and he trusts that over a few years he’ll grow more comfortable in the pocket, now we can be talking about a perennial Pro Bowler. I don’t think there’s anything in between. I think it’s high ceiling, low floor with RGIII.”

With Griffin’s career path continuing to inch closer to the floor, Dilfer joined ESPN 980′s The Sports Fix with Kevin Sheehan and Thom Loverro on Tuesday to discuss the Redskins quarterback.

Dilfer called Kyle Shanahan “one of the most brilliant football minds” in the league and said Griffin would be more successful running the offense he did in his rookie year, but he also didn’t rule out Griffin eventually finding success as a pocket passer in Jay Gruden’s offense, without the increased risk of shortening his career.

“There’s no reason why a guy with Robert’s talent and his mind can’t learn all the things you need to learn to be a pocket passer,” Dilfer said. “But it takes a ton of work. It takes a ton of buying in. It takes a lot of lonely moments in the offseason when you could be flying around in private jets and doing fun things. It means doing boring things, and hard things that no one’s going to pat you on the back for. And that’s where this conversation needs to go.”


Dilfer talked a lot about the importance of Griffin “buying in” and putting in time during the offseason, and he said the Redskins should invest everything in developing Griffin as long as he continues to do so. Dilfer also made it clear that if he owned the Redskins, Griffin would be the starting quarterback for the rest of the season.

“If you’re an owner and I drafted him and I plan on keeping him, I’m telling my coach, ‘Play him, develop him,’” Dilfer said. “So I don’t blame Dan [Snyder] if he’s doing that. My point is this: If you guys care about being 6-10 at the end of the year, 7-9, making a real run at 7-9, or do you care about getting the most out of a guy that could possibly be your franchise quarterback?”

Dilfer’s ESPN colleague and fellow Super Bowl-winning quarterback Steve Young recently said that he’d talked to coaches who said Griffin wasn’t putting in the time, but later backtracked on those comments. Dilfer suggested that Griffin’s best days could still be ahead of him.

“Kids do change,” Dilfer said. “What you are at 24 or 25 is very different from what you are at 27, 28, 29…. I think part of this [is] we might just be expecting too much from a young player too early, and especially with brokenness. He’s broken right now. When you go through this, it crushes your spirit. And when you’ve got to fight to dig yourself out of that hole that you put yourself in, to a certain degree, there’s a lot of growth that comes in. It would not surprise me if Robert goes somewhere else and is a star in this league because he figures it out, and somebody else has a little more patience with him.”


Former Steelers coach Bill Cowher also suggested that the Redskins exercise patience with Griffin during an interview with the Sports Junkies on 106.7 The Fan.

“I just know right now that I’ve seen this kid throw,” Cowher said Tuesday. “I think that he can be a quarterback in the National Football League.”

When asked what route the Redskins should take to move on from Griffin and improve next year — whether by taking a quarterback in the draft or addressing issues along the offensive line — Cowher cautioned against giving up on Griffin.

“The other element of this is, this is [Griffin’s] first year in the system,” Cowher said. “I would encourage them to be very careful about making a rash decision when you don’t have to. If you have this quarterback for another year, why are you going to get rid of him? Unless the dynamic is so damaged … give him a chance. The kid has been humbled. Give him a chance to come back into camp. Why get rid of the kid in the fourth year when you don’t have to? So, I would encourage them, next year, that if you want to make sure you cross that bridge and cut it off, so be it, but make sure you have a plan in place.”
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by SkinsJock »

I agree with Dilfer ..

I certainly hope we do not let Griffin go or give up on him - he's too talented and has too much ability to not succeed as an NFL QB

time will tell
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by riggofan »

“Kids do change,” Dilfer said. “What you are at 24 or 25 is very different from what you are at 27, 28, 29…. I think part of this [is] we might just be expecting too much from a young player too early, and especially with brokenness. He’s broken right now. When you go through this, it crushes your spirit. And when you’ve got to fight to dig yourself out of that hole that you put yourself in, to a certain degree, there’s a lot of growth that comes in. It would not surprise me if Robert goes somewhere else and is a star in this league because he figures it out, and somebody else has a little more patience with him.”


This crap makes my bones hurt. The guy is in his third year. Given the injury and the coaching change, I don't realistically expect that he's going to be playing like Aaron Rodgers right now. But is it really too much to ask that he play as well as Zach Mettenberger?

There isn't time to spend five years developing a QB anymore.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

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He is done in DC.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by markshark84 »

If there is anything I agree with in this article it is that Kyle Shanahan is an excellent OC. I have always maintained that and said this multiple times on this site --- both during and after his tenure in DC. In fact, I would rank him in the top 5 currently in the NFL. I am not sure how he would do as a HC, but it takes tremendous talent to be successful in multiple places in the NFL on a consistent basis. He was very successful in Houston, as well as in DC (by creating an offense) when he didn't have a limping QB, and is again successful in Cleveland.

We had a good thing in DC, but the majority of fans are sheep. People thought getting rid of the Shanahans was a great idea (citing ego, record, and other non-relevant items) ---- based on information given by the only person with authority to do so; the owner. The best players on our roster remain from their time in DC. I still would LOVE to know who was the true force behind the RGIII pick (and there are only a couple media sources I trust --- none of which have provided insight).

But it highlights once again the cancer that is our owner.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by StorminMormon86 »

Guess that means all of that crap that Shanahan leaked turned out to be true all along. Where there's smoke there's fire.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by SkinsJock »

:lol: I agree with you about 'reports' or stuff being crap from Shanahan

I do not agree that Griffin is done in DC - we shall see
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by riggofan »

markshark84 wrote:If there is anything I agree with in this article it is that Kyle Shanahan is an excellent OC. I have always maintained that and said this multiple times on this site --- both during and after his tenure in DC. In fact, I would rank him in the top 5 currently in the NFL. I am not sure how he would do as a HC, but it takes tremendous talent to be successful in multiple places in the NFL on a consistent basis. He was very successful in Houston, as well as in DC (by creating an offense) when he didn't have a limping QB, and is again successful in Cleveland.


Did it in Houston. Did it in 2012 here. And doing it in Cleveland. People were BRUTAL on him here and what was their big complaint? He's the coach's son.

markshark84 wrote:We had a good thing in DC, but the majority of fans are sheep. People thought getting rid of the Shanahans was a great idea (citing ego, record, and other non-relevant items) ---- based on information given by the only person with authority to do so; the owner. The best players on our roster remain from their time in DC. I still would LOVE to know who was the true force behind the RGIII pick (and there are only a couple media sources I trust --- none of which have provided insight).


Yeah I've been thinking about that too. I still think Shanahan deserves credit for righting (or trying to) right the ship, show Snyder how to run a professional organization and build a football team. Much like Marty was doing. The only problem with that opinion is his trading those picks for Griffin. Completely goes against what you'd expect from a stable football organization.

I didn't know much about Griffin as a college player. My thinking at the time was that it sounded crazy to trade that number of picks for a player, but if SHANAHAN was willing to do it then the guy MUST be as close to a sure thing as you get in the draft.

In either case, if Shanahan chose to do that on his own or he was somehow arm twisted into doing it by Snyder, it doesn't reflect well on him.

markshark84 wrote:But it highlights once again the cancer that is our owner.


Seems likely.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by mastdark81 »

I agree with the article. Shanahan made the Rg3 pick as far as how they negotiated maybe Bruce helped but the picks doesnt matter much if you dont know how to evaluate talent.

The Redskins management still had a bunch of picks to make them count but they didnt. Its not like they traded a entire draft were youth was not available. Good teams around the league know how to draft real talent consistently in the lower rounds. Seahawks botched the Percy Harvin trade (not comparing with rg3 trade just in relation to giving up high picks) and still won the SuperBowl. The Rams who we gave alllllllll those precious picks to havent made the playoffs since.

Thing is, if you invest in your qb you suppose to invest in him, especially if he has had success. Snyder picked the wrong coach to be patient enough. Kyle did extensive research and they put Rg3 in position to win. Instead of fixing the relationship early Snyder empowered Griffin and the Shanahans lost him.

On game day hes regressed hes lost it amd seems more mental than physical ala Roy Hibbert last year amd will never get it back behind a pourous oline and a coach that half heartedly want to adapt his offense.

This team is lost once again with no plan.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by SkinsJock »

we all need to understand a few things ... I posted some links earlier this week about this ...


We now know that Bruce Allen and Dan Snyder put together the trade with the Rams against the wishes of HC Mike Shanahan

we also now know that making a trade like we did is a very bad move
at the time, I thought that it was worth it if you end up with a good QB for 10 years, right? WRONG!

We now know that when you give up 2 x #1 picks and 2 x #2 picks, the reality is, you need to end up with a Tom Brady
RG3 might have been a very good NFL QB if he was prepared properly by Mike & Kyle, but he's not a Tom Brady

OK - I admit at the time, I was excited about the possibilities of having a really good QB

HOWEVER, I did not realize that Mike and Kyle did not want this QB on their roster - as a result, we now have a disaster on our hands

Gruden was brought here to try and straighten out and help RG3 become a good NFL QB - it might be too late

it is now clear RG3 needed a lot more help than he got under Mike & Kyle - whether he can make the adaption/transition to the NFL that he needs to do, is a concern and I'm not sure that he will be given another shot here



I am looking forward to seeing this offense play out the season with Colt and maybe Cousins as the QBs



the fact remains this franchise is in a world of trouble with Dan Snyder continuing to make a mess of everything

what an incredible mess we have on our hands
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by StorminMormon86 »

Kevin Sheehan pretty much thinks the worst thing this franchise has ever done under Snyder was fire Shanahan. And he brought up a bunch of good points on the radio.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

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Taking RG3 was a huge risk, particularly because of the cost in picks, and because running QBs historically don't pan out in the NFL. Everyone kept repeating that mantra about him being a throw first QB that can run, rather than a running QB, but in retrospect, it wasn't true. He's a running QB, and Kyle Shanahan basically installed a Baylor offense to capitalize on Robert's running ability. Kyle and Dad ran that horse dead, in a win now mode rather than develop this kid into a pro style QB.

There is no way of knowing whether that decision stunted RG3's development into an NFL quality QB, or whether the Shanahans recognized that he needed way more development time than they had to mold him, so they chose the path of least resistence. Be that as it may, clearly looking at him now shows that he is WOEFULLY ill prepared in virtually every category from basic fundamentals, to basic offense execution/defense analysis. From fundamental footwork, to fundamental reads, the kid is lost, which begs the question .... is he fixable/coachable, or is he looking for that easy magic he became accustomed to in his rookie year, and unwilling to go back to basics and learn what he should have been learning right from the beginning?

One thing is clear .... Gruden is stuck between a rock and a hard place ... he's got a supposed super star that is utterly lost and playing much worse than his 2nd, and now 3rd stringers, and it doesn't look like RG3's issues can be fixed on the field, on the fly, or whether he is fixable at all. From what C.Cooly defined in his critique of Robert's performance, he's not doing much of anything right .... bad footwork, improper drop back distances, not stepping up into the pocket, not seeing the field and open receivers, not reading coverages correctly, combined with poor accuracy. How do you fix all of that in game conditions? I don't think you can. Consequently, keeping him out there amidst that type of struggling can only lead to continuing embarrassment and confidence crushing failure, not to mention the frustration imposed on the rest of the team with some legit talent running open and waving their arms for the QB that can't find them
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by RayNAustin »

StorminMormon86 wrote:Kevin Sheehan pretty much thinks the worst thing this franchise has ever done under Snyder was fire Shanahan. And he brought up a bunch of good points on the radio.



I'm of the opinion that the worst thing was hiring him in the first place. Mike didn't produce much in his 4 years here, nor in his last few years in Denver, who also fired him. Joe Gibbs II ... while much less successful than Joe Gibbs I, was still more successful in his 4 years than Shanahan was.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

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I disagree that having Mike Shanahan was a big mistake - I do agree that he did not do well as HC but I now believe that despite his assurances, Dan Snyder's meddling created an atmosphere here that made it difficult for any HC to do well

The reason that it was not a mistake IMO to bring in Mike is that it was a step in the right direction, but that's about it :lol:

This franchise now needs to take the next step and move Bruce Allen to President and bring in a real NFL GM that has the power to put together a short and long term plan and make Dan Snyder get out of all things to do with players and coaches

Whether that GM will like the fact that Gruden is the HC and was basically hired by Snyder & Allen to fix the mistake that is RG3 is not easy to answer - IMO, Gruden can become a good HC here and should be given a chance - plus he'd be working for a GM with a plan and one that will not be stupid and give away draft picks like Allen & Snyder (Dumb & Dumber II)

this franchise continues to be a huge joke amongst the guys in the know and NFL insiders

Dan Snyder has to take ownership of all that is wrong here

I don't expect Dan Snyder to sell the franchise but the only other way things get better here is for him to stop doing what he's been doing
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by Irn-Bru »

riggofan wrote:Did it in Houston. Did it in 2012 here. And doing it in Cleveland. People were BRUTAL on him here and what was their big complaint? He's the coach's son.

People were brutal on him here because DC is one of those places where fans pick a scapegoat and stick to it regardless of evidence.

That said, I always thought his playcalling wasn't great. I have much prefered Gruden's / McVay's system and playcalling to what we ran under the Shanahans. So far, I love McVay.

Yeah I've been thinking about that too. I still think Shanahan deserves credit for righting (or trying to) right the ship, show Snyder how to run a professional organization and build a football team. Much like Marty was doing.

Agreed. The fact that we finally have depth and very little overpaid talent is a testament to what Shanahan was able to achieve in his few years here. The RGIII situation is its own phenomenon, but even there I think in 2013 Shanahan basically did what he could to ensure that RGIII and the team had every chance at success down the road after he was gone.

Personally, I'm glad we had Shanahan for that stretch of time, even though it ultimately didn't work out.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

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I hope we get to see more from the Gruden/McVay combination

I was never a really big fan of Mike as HC and while I think Kyle did well in Houston, I felt he was not really the OC here, he just had the title - I also think that the franchise is better off for having had Mike Shanahan here as this was a step we needed to make and hopefully Dan Snyder will make the next step and bring in a real GM and finally stop interfering with players and coaches
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by aswas71788 »

I'm having a difficult time digesting the love for Mike Shanahan. What you got is what was happening in Denver. he was fragmenting the team, playing god on the owner and being disruptive to the Denver Broncos organization. There was always some turmoil within the team while Shanahan was here. Yes, the Redskins looked great RGIII's first year, not so great the second year and now terrible the third year. RGIII has great athletic ability but has been injured more than healthy the past 5 years. He had the same type of knee surgery in his junior year in college (not the same knee but same type of injury). Then he won the Heisman in his senior year, got drafted and had a fantastic first year, had another injury, had a dismal year trying to function injured and is now cannot function in almost every category of quarterbacking. How much of it can be blamed on the Shanahans, how much on RGIII? The fault is probably equal. IMO, Griffin is done in the NFL., not because he isn't athletic enough but he is now questionable in every category. If he goes somewhere and runs the same type of offense he did in his first year, how long before he is injured again.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by cowboykillerzRGiii »

^ it WAS the same knee actually..

I think that Shanny and co stunted his growth by not developing him as a qb better.

Even in 2012 people forget we were 3-6 and Shanny already in "evaluation" mode.. he had given up on the season and the team- shouldered by RG3 took us to the playoffs IN SPITE OF Shanny.

Kyle is an effective OC- but wasnt as good here. I attribute that to the imbalance of- well the checks and balances of the coaching staff. Having daddy as HC and "buddies" as assistants it was a futile system. I know I wasnt the only one who was screaming at the tv in his time here, "RUN THE F'N BALL"!!!!
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by RayNAustin »

cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:^ it WAS the same knee actually..

I think that Shanny and co stunted his growth by not developing him as a qb better.

Even in 2012 people forget we were 3-6 and Shanny already in "evaluation" mode.. he had given up on the season and the team- shouldered by RG3 took us to the playoffs IN SPITE OF Shanny.

Kyle is an effective OC- but wasnt as good here. I attribute that to the imbalance of- well the checks and balances of the coaching staff. Having daddy as HC and "buddies" as assistants it was a futile system. I know I wasnt the only one who was screaming at the tv in his time here, "RUN THE F'N BALL"!!!!


I'm with ya on this. What I seem to recall is constant drama during his entire time here, marked by questionable honesty coupled with some glaring swings and misses at the most crucial position ... QB. Lest we forget about the McNabb mishandling, followed by the "I'll stake my reputation on him" support of Beck" who was a complete failure, with Sexy Rexy getting his job taken away and given back every 3-4 weeks, all of which culminated in producing one of the worst win loss records in the past two decades in that final year. Did I mention breaking the superstar rookie QB by using him as a running back and allowing him to continue playing on a broken leg?

Of course, some want to blame Snyder if it rains, but this team was rebuilt by Shanahan, with almost the entire roster hand selected by Mike. And Mike kept telling us each year how much better the talent was now compared to what he inherited .... yet the results were no better than what Zorn produced.

And the biggest error, IMHO, was Mike's first faulty decision in choosing to convert a pretty decent 43 defense into a 34 without the proper personnel to run it, thereby neglecting the most needy side, the offense. (We shall not even explore the glarring failure in special teams).

The only potential excuse available to mitigate Mike's disastrous culpability is the big cap hit he had to manage around, which in truth was a big blow, so in fairness, that has to be considered. Nevertheless, at the end of the day, we have 3-5 win team, which is exactly what we had when Super-Shanny-Savior arrived.

So I'm not seeing anything remotely resembling a "legacy" left here by Mike and mini-me, unless one exercises some very selective memory.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by Deadskins »

StorminMormon86 wrote:Kevin Sheehan pretty much thinks the worst thing this franchise has ever done under Snyder was fire Shanahan. And he brought up a bunch of good points on the radio.

No, it was firing Marty.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by Bishop Hammer »

markshark84 wrote:If there is anything I agree with in this article it is that Kyle Shanahan is an excellent OC. I have always maintained that and said this multiple times on this site --- both during and after his tenure in DC. In fact, I would rank him in the top 5 currently in the NFL. I am not sure how he would do as a HC, but it takes tremendous talent to be successful in multiple places in the NFL on a consistent basis. He was very successful in Houston, as well as in DC (by creating an offense) when he didn't have a limping QB, and is again successful in Cleveland.

We had a good thing in DC, but the majority of fans are sheep. People thought getting rid of the Shanahans was a great idea (citing ego, record, and other non-relevant items) ---- based on information given by the only person with authority to do so; the owner. The best players on our roster remain from their time in DC. I still would LOVE to know who was the true force behind the RGIII pick (and there are only a couple media sources I trust --- none of which have provided insight).

But it highlights once again the cancer that is our owner.


The main reason Kyle got sacked was because he and RG3 couldn't coexist together. Snyder being buddies wirh Griffin sided with him.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by DarthMonk »

Deadskins wrote:
StorminMormon86 wrote:Kevin Sheehan pretty much thinks the worst thing this franchise has ever done under Snyder was fire Shanahan. And he brought up a bunch of good points on the radio.


No, it was firing Marty.


Yep. Pretty ironic too since hiring him in the first place was the best thing this franchise has ever done under Snyder. This was kinda like Jeruh firing Jimmy.
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by Mirttinur »

SkinsJock wrote:I disagree that having Mike Shanahan was a big mistake - I do agree that he did not do well as HC but I now believe that despite his assurances, Dan Snyder's meddling created an atmosphere here that made it difficult for any HC to do well

The reason that it was not a mistake IMO to bring in Mike is that it was a step in the right direction, but that's about it :lol:

This franchise now needs to take the next step and move Bruce Allen to President and bring in a real NFL GM that has the power to put together a short and long term plan and make Dan Snyder get out of all things to do with players and coaches

Whether that GM will like the fact that Gruden is the HC and was basically hired by Snyder & Allen to fix the mistake that is RG3 is not easy to answer - IMO, Gruden can become a good HC here and should be given a chance - plus he'd be working for a GM with a plan and one that will not be stupid and give away draft picks like Allen & Snyder (Dumb & Dumber II)

this franchise continues to be a huge joke amongst the guys in the know and NFL insiders

Dan Snyder has to take ownership of all that is wrong here

I don't expect Dan Snyder to sell the franchise but the only other way things get better here is for him to stop doing what he's been doing


This exactly. We need a competent person running this team. It used to be that Snyder and his good ole boy ran this team, and it was awful. Then it was Shanahan, who was arguably just as bad. Now we have Bruce Allen running this team who has no clue what he's doing and is looking like Snyder's puppet. It's not just RG3. It's not just Gruden. It's not just the offensive line. It's Everyone. It's the entire team that was built by this organization with dumbasses at the helm.
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HEROHAMO
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Re: Trent Dilfer on Griff and Kyle Shanahan

Post by HEROHAMO »

Who cares what Trent Dilfer has to say?

Seriously Trent Dilfer has sucked his whole career. All of a sudden he becomes an analyst and hes an expert?
Sean Taylor starting free safety Heavens team!

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