Josh Gordon

Colorado Skin Fan · Post by **Colorado Skin Fan** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 8:33 pm

I saw an interesting debate on another site about whether the Skins should consider drafting Josh Gordon, formerly from Baylor, in the supplemental draft.

The pro's are the guy is a physical beast. 6-4, 225, runs between a 4.3-4.4 40. I watched him at Baylor RGIIIs junior year and thought he was a sure fire first round talent for the next year.

The cons are he left Baylor for Utah after that year due to pot use he was about to be suspended for. He never played at Utah due to the transfer. I read after it happened that RGIII went to coach Briles to ask for him to get another chance. Obviously that didn't work out.

It seems he's anywhere from a 4th to 7th round supplemental pick. Should the Skins take a chance he has learned from his mistake or take a pass? Is it worth giving up a next year pick knowing we are already short? RGIII and he had quite a connection his junior year.

aswas71788 · Post by **aswas71788** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:37 am

I would say pass and keep our draft pick. I do not remember any of the supplemental draft candidates that have ever made it in the NFL as a starting player. Anyone is welcome to correct me if I am wrong. Ther3e may be some out there but I just can not remember any. I think we have enough young receivers to fill our needs.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:51 pm

^ The only supplemental draft pick that comes to my mind that became a starter was Steve Walsh of the Cowboys. I remember him alternating starts with Troy. He was later traded to the Saints where he started with them

I would give up a 6th for Josh Gordon if RGIII vouched for him.

Here's a complete history of the Supplemental draft. Interesting names on there like Bernie Kosar and Chris Carter. I had forgotten that Jeremy Jarmon was a supplemental pick.

Late round supplemental picks don't have a good track record, but then again, Late round picks rarely make it any way.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_F ... ague_Draft

Colorado Skin Fan · Post by **Colorado Skin Fan** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 1:51 pm

I would go for a 6th as well. I don't think you will typically find players with that type of physical talent and production at that stage of the normal draft. I've seen some opinions he could be better over time than Stephen Hill. I really haven't watched Stephen Hill much to know. Being short on picks for the next few years we need to find some late round gems to fill our void of 1st round selections.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6R_VKhnpNA

yupchagee · Post by **yupchagee** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:31 pm

From what I've read, he is far from the sort of high character guy Shanny wants. Pass.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:02 pm

NFC team assigns Josh Gordon third-round grade

A source with knowledge of multiple teams’ thinking told PFT that Gordon has generated a third-round supplemental draft grade from at least one club. The club plays in the NFC.

The source also says high-ranking people at Baylor believed Gordon was a superior player to Kendall Wright during both receivers’ time in Waco. Wright was drafted with the 20th overall pick by the Titans this year.

Gordon didn’t end up with the same body of work as Wright in college, but NFL teams are enamored with his size, speed, and potential. In his lone full season at Baylor, Gordon recorded 42 receptions for 714 yards and seven touchdowns, averaging 17 yards per catch.

Tony Pauline of SI.com reported late Friday that Gordon will hold a personal Pro Day on Tuesday at Rice University.

Probably means someone will take him with a 4th or 5th round pick.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... und-grade/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxWbMH3O ... re=related

Colorado Skin Fan · Post by **Colorado Skin Fan** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:23 pm

A 3rd is definitely too high due to the character risk. A 5th might be worth it if there is a lot of perceived competition. I watched most of Baylor's games his last season and thought he was the most pro ready receiver on the roster.

You have to believe he can beat out everyone after Garcon, Morgan, Hankerson, and Moss to take the risk. I think he has the type of ability to do that and adds something different to the mix in terms of size.

Man can Griff deliver the ball!

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 1:49 am

This:

The story on Josh, is that he was suspended after the 2010 season and did not play last year after transferring to Utah. He left Baylor after facing a number of incidents, including an indefinite suspension from the team before preseason camp began for a violation of team rules.

Gordon was arrested last October after being found in a car that had marijuana inside near the Baylor campus. Another story has him out cold in the drive-thru of a Taco Bell.

VS

This:

While Gordon did not produce eye-popping numbers in his lone season as a collegiate starter, his measurables has certainly caught the attention of pro scouts. At 6'4" and 225 pounds, Gordon is a big, physical receiver with the size to create mismatches against smaller defensive backs, and his speed (Gordon was clocked in the low 4.3s in the 40-yard dash at Baylor) could make him a game-breaker at the NFL level.

"The 6-foot-4, 225-pound Gordon has good speed and looks like a pro receiver. He could be the most talented supplemental pick since linebacker Ahmad Brooks, who went to the Cincinnati Bengals in the third round in 2006 and later made noise as a member of the San Francisco 49ers." NFL.com's Gregg Rosenthal recently wrote.

http://www.milehighreport.com/2012/7/2/ ... er-broncos

http://www.nationalfootballauthority.co ... esday.html

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 2:03 am

What Utah and Baylor folk have say recently about Josh Gordon's Character:

I spoke with someone at Utah in the Athletic Communications Department. Here's what they said on Josh Gordon:

"It wasn't the right situation for Josh so we parted ways."

However, someone in close to the Baylor football program was much more helpful. Keep in mind that these comments are made without bias. The person does not still have contact with Gordon, and Gordon was dismissed from Baylor University. Gordon has little to zero connection to Baylor as of now outside of still keeping in touch with some coaches.

"I'll tell you what I've been telling the NFL: Josh is a great kid, super talent, just bad decisions. All the coaches here liked him."

"He was arrested in October 2010, and suspended for 4 quarters, spread out over a couple of games I believe, but then failed a Baylor drug test late last spring. The Baylor administration kicked him out of school for the failed drug test, but Coach Briles went to bat for him with the 'higher ups', trying to let him stay. Coaches were disappointed about his leaving."

"Nobody thought he had a problem. It's not like he showed up to meetings or practice high or anything like that. I think he just got around with the wrong people not associated with the football team that persuaded his bad decisions."

"I'm not aware of any concerns the staff had for him coming out of high school, as his arrest in October of 2010 was his first incident.

"It seemed he got along with everyone on the team and I can't think of any point where he was in confrontation on field or off. If football is all he has to focus on, then he'll thrive because he knows this is his last chance. I've gotten a lot of calls from NFL scouts about him, so I know there's interest."

The fact that this same person has been the main voice for Josh Gordon's time at Baylor for NFL scouts should be noted. This glowing report of Gordon shows that he's not the major character risk that he has been portrayed as, at least during his time with Baylor. Coaches, the people who knew him best, didn't want a mistake mean he had to move on.

http://network.yardbarker.com/college_f ... t/11139131

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 2:19 am

Scouting Report on Josh Gordon:

As a receiver, he grabs the ball away from his body smoothly and has natural steps to transition upfield. He doesn't have dynamic turn and run ability after the catch, but never really had the chance to thrive in that area thanks to a lot of hitch routes arriving late thanks to a mis-timing quarterback (Robert Griffin as a sophomore).

Finally, his blocking ability really was apparent on film. He delivers a pop, extends, and finishes blocks (rare compared to most college big talent receivers). He also showed composure and focus on his blocks, keeping his hands in tight, keeping his feet upfield, not losing leverage vs. cornerbacks towards the play side, and not committing penalties.

After reading the comments of the Baylor unamed source in my previous post and reading about his blocking ability, I believe that Shanny is inquiring about this guy. RGIII can tell Shanny a lot about the inside stuff that went on. The question is: What is RGIII saying to Shanny? For those who think that Shanny stays away from gambling on guys with character concerns - think Maurice Clarett. Not saying that it is the same situation, but I am saying that I won't be surprised if Shanny puts a bid on Gordon. What round? Depends on what RGIII says and what Shanny sees on the film. If Shanny likes him, in Shanny's mind, there is no player that he can't fix.

http://network.yardbarker.com/college_f ... t/11139131

Deadskins · Post by **Deadskins** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 7:52 am

OMG, Gordon smoked pot in college?!?

I'm more surprised that they're now testing for that in college.

riggofan · Post by **riggofan** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 12:52 pm

Interesting. Seems like a big difference between the media/word on the street and what the Baylor source is saying about the kid. Its cool that we have a player on our team who probably knows the real deal.

I saw something on espn yesterday about him likely costing a 3d round pick. Not sure we're in position to spend that.

6-4 225 though. Gotta like that!

frankcal20 · Post by **frankcal20** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 2:16 pm

Question is, who's place does he take on the roster? What if it doesn't work out? You've given up on a player who's probably experienced and talented for an unproven guy who, while has measurables, hasn't done it at this level and also has had some problems.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 2:46 pm

Riggo, looking at our draft situation, I would have to agree that a third rounder might be too big a risk.

Let's say Shanny loves him and RGIII vouches for him and we get him with a third rounder:

*What's the chances of him playing well this year considering that he has been out of football for a year?
*We can say that he is next year's third with a head start, but he would be taking up a roster spot for this year.
*You can't cut him and risk him to the practice squad, so he is practically guaranteed a roster spot for this year.
*He has shown that he can return kicks, so, IMO, he would need to be our return guy to make it worthwhile.

The problem with Shanny is when he locks on to someone, he thows caution to the wind (Donovan), but the great thing about Shanny is when he is right, he good things happen (Terrell Davis, Rod Smith, Helu?, Royster?). I am not going to try to guess what Shanny will do.

Finally, think about another receiver that we know who had one good year of college ball. He was 6'2" 221 LBS 4.4 in the 40 at the combine. He did return kicks. Who am I talking about? Devin Thomas. Wideouts are risky business especially in a supplemental draft at #3 when you don't have a number one next year.

From what I read so far, I am now willing to go with a 5th rounder and if someone gets him earlier so be it.

Colorado Skin Fan · Post by **Colorado Skin Fan** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 5:26 pm

After Garcon, Morgan, Moss, and Hankerson I see very little in the way of potential game changers or players with high upside. I keep stepping up draft position each time I post based on the info I'm seeing in the thread. I know when it happened, I read that RGIII was one of several players that went to Briles to make a pitch to keep him on the team so we know where he stands.

i'm now in for a 4th. Shanny has a lot more intel that we do based on the contacts he made with the Baylor staff during the courting of RGIII. I'll trust he has the right info whatever he does.

This guy has such intriguing tangibles, he's hard to look past. Most importantly to me, he already has proven on-field chemistry with our new franchise leader.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 9:11 pm

Rotoworld reported yesterday that "high-ranking members" of Baylor's team felt Gordon was a better prospect than his former teammate Kendall Wright, prior to Gordon's departure from the team. Wright was selected with the 20th overall pick in this year's Draft by the Tennessee Titans.

Of course, leading into any NFL Draft, there is a ton of rumors, speculation, and misinformation. Draft "experts" have Gordon going anywhere from early in the draft, to not being worth a sixth round choice. And, the teams interested in Gordon varies almost as much. The Cleveland Browns have been both in the bidding and out of it for Gordon. SB Nation Kansas City found a mock draft that has the Washington Redskins getting Gordon in the fifth round, teaming him up with his former Baylor quarterback Robert Griffin III. (The mock also has the Dolphins ending up with Carson-Newman linebacker Larry Lumpkin in the seventh round.) Rotoworld also has a report that "one NFC East" team is "prepared to put a third-round bid" on Gordon.

And, of course, ESPN's Mel Kiper, Jr., the draft "expert of all experts" and the only man whose hair moves less than Jimmy Johnson's, weighed in on Gordon:

Mel Kiper Jr.✔
@MelKiperESPN

Former Baylor WR Josh Gordon (talented 6-3-220 pounder with 4.40 speed & big hands) could be a 4th rd pick in July 12 Supplemental Draft.

2 Jul 12 Reply
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SI.com's NFL Draft analyst Tony Pauline tweeted on July 6:

Tony Pauline@TonyPauline

Several sources confirmed w/me tonight Josh Gordon/WR/Baylor was targeted as a potential 1st/2nd prospect after his sophomore season in '10

6 Jul 12 Reply
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How the supplemental draft works:

Thursday will clarify everything, after the Supplemental Draft is concluded. The NFL's Supplemental Draft is conducted like a silent auction. Any team that is interested in a player may place a bid on that player, choosing whichever round they feel they would select him in the full NFL Draft. Then, whichever team placed the lowest bid wins the rights to the player, but concedes the corresponding pick from the following year's Draft. For example, if a team places a third round bid on Gordon, while another places a fifth round bid, the third round bid would win, and that team would lose its third round choice in next April's Draft.

This year's Supplemental Draft will take place electronically beginning at 1pm Easter on Thursday, July 12

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 9:35 pm

This article was written as rumors spread that the University of Utah was thinking about recruiting Gordon.

He was arrested in October 2010, allowed to continue the 2010 season with Baylor. Just prior to the pre-season workout with Baylor, he is suspended indefinitely.

Apparently, the Utes found it alright to recruit him.

Why did Baylor wait so long to suspend him indefinitely? He has got to be forthcoming on this question to the scouts.
Why did he leave the Utes? He needs to be forthcoming on this one as well.
Are there more details out there that the media isn't privy to?

What we do know, there is no way that he compares to Janoris Jenkins as far as character issues.

The reports don't even say that he tested positive for marijuana. They say that he was found in a car with marijuana in it.

So far, I can't rule the guy out for character issues, when I look at everything posted in this thread.

Utes have interest in Baylor receiver, what would you do?

Published on Aug 19, 2011 08:46AM

ESPN has reported that Josh Gordon, a junior receiver who has left the Baylor program, possibly could be transferring to Utah, however, no offer has been extended to him from Utah.
The Utes are interested in Gordon, but are looking into his situation, which sounds like a messy one. Gordon, a 6-foot-4, 220-pounder who was the Bears' second-leading receiver in 2010, was suspended indefinitely before preseason camp began. He was arrested last October after being found in a car that had marijuana inside it.
Utah's coaches will examine thoroughly Gordon's situation before making any kind of decision.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogsutahs ... r.html.csp

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 9:49 pm

Josh Gordon was arrested with Willie Jefferson a TE with Baylor. Jefferson was driving and Gordon was passed out in the in the front passenger's seat. Jefferson was immediately released from the team.

Willie Jefferson Arrested

October 14, 2010

Name: Willie Jefferson
Team: Baylor University (College Football)
Charge: Possession of Marijuana
Story:

Baylor University tight end Willie Jefferson arrested on Thursday (October 14, 2010).

Jefferson, 19, was pulled over by police and was found in possession of one ounce of Hydro (a high-potency form of marijuana).

Jefferson was dismissed from the team after this incident. This is his second arrest in October, he was arrested with teammate Josh Gordon on October 3.

Josh Gordon and Willie Jefferson Arrested

October 8, 2010

Names: Josh Gordon and Willie Jefferson
Team: Baylor University (College Football)
Charges: Marijuana Possession
Story:

According to usatoday.com, Baylor University wide receiver Josh Gordon and tight end Willie Jefferson were arrested Sunday (October 3, 2010) in Waco, Texas.

Police were called around 2 a.m. about a man passed out in a Taco Bell drive-through lane. Jefferson was driving the vehicle and Gordon was in the front passenger seat. Police searched the vehicle and found bags of marijuana.

Gordon and Jefferson, both sophomores, were later released on their own recognizance.

http://arrestnation.com/tag/baylor-university/

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 10:24 pm

More details from the Baylor suspension:

By John Werner and Chelsea Quackenbush
Tribune-Herald staff writer
Sunday July 24, 2011

Baylor junior receiver Josh Gordon has been suspended indefinitely from the football program for violation of team rules, head coach Art Briles announced Saturday night.
A Harris County Jail spokesman said Saturday night Gordon had a pending charge of credit card/debit abuse with a $2,000 bond, but it was unclear if he had been arrested.
Briles didn’t indicate if the suspension from the team was related to the credit card/debit abuse charge.
“Josh has been suspended from our program for team rules violations,” Briles said.

“Josh has been suspended from our program for team rules violations,” Briles said in a statement. “This disciplinary action, as all past and future actions, will be handled internally.”
Briles had no further comment.

Gordon and former Baylor receiver Willie Jefferson were charged on Oct. 3, 2010, for misdemeanor marijuana possession in Waco. After sitting out for one quarter in the following game against Texas Tech, Gordon entered in the second quarter and caught a 34-yard touchdown pass from Robert Griffin.
The marijuana charge against Gordon was later dropped by the state. Jefferson was dismissed from the team following a second arrest for marijuana possession last October. Jefferson returned for spring drills, but left Baylor following the spring semester.jwerner@wacotrib.com

This might explain why Baylor waited 6 months to suspend him indefinitely:

Originally Posted by Trevious02 (Baylor Fan site)

Glad to see that the media isn't putting out BS info in regards to the kid missing practice and not being a hard worker. To my knowledge he has done everything that the Judicial Affairs Council has asked, however the previous piss poor decision Josh made last season scares them from giving him that second chance. It's unfortunate that they waited 6 months before dropping the news on him. Good luck to him getting situated with a new school in this short of a period of time!

Ironically the credit card incident happened prior to him joining Baylor while in high school, and definitely seems to have been brought up by a small market media hack with nothing better to report than something that took place 2-3 years back? This kid really pissed off the wrong people for that information to be leaked!

http://www.baylorfans.com/forums/showth ... 138&page=2

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:20 am

Some of you seem DESPERATE.

PASS on the guy. Just say NO.

langleyparkjoe · Post by **langleyparkjoe** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 7:51 am

Redskin in Canada wrote:Some of you seem DESPERATE.

PASS on the guy. Just say NO.

i haven't read anything about this guy but if RIC says pass on um, well pass on him den.

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:16 am

langleyparkjoe wrote:
Redskin in Canada wrote:Some of you seem DESPERATE.

PASS on the guy. Just say NO.
i haven't read anything about this guy but if RIC says pass on um, well pass on him den.

Aside from the INTENDED pun in your post, this guy has far many more red lights than a Friday traffic jam in Manhattan.

The risk is huge and if he even finds a roster spot, trouble will surely follow.

langleyparkjoe · Post by **langleyparkjoe** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:34 am

Redskin in Canada wrote:
langleyparkjoe wrote:
Redskin in Canada wrote:Some of you seem DESPERATE.

PASS on the guy. Just say NO.
i haven't read anything about this guy but if RIC says pass on um, well pass on him den.
Aside from the INTENDED pun in your post, this guy has far many more red lights than a Friday traffic jam in Manhattan.

The risk is huge and if he even finds a roster spot, trouble will surely follow.

Actually no RIC, I really meant that because alot of times your opinion is pretty similar to mine.

riggofan · Post by **riggofan** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 10:28 am

frankcal20 wrote:Question is, who's place does he take on the roster? What if it doesn't work out? You've given up on a player who's probably experienced and talented for an unproven guy who, while has measurables, hasn't done it at this level and also has had some problems.

Probably Anthony Armstrong or Terrence Austin, I would guess. I get your point though, and I pretty much agree. I kinda think we would just have to trust the coaches on whether they think he is a likely upgrade to either of those two.

I keep reading that Armstrong and Austin are both likely in their last year to show that they can get it done. If that is the case, then I don't think its entirely crazy to consider.

DarthMonk · Post by **DarthMonk** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 4:35 pm

Any chance no one bids?

Can we bid a 7th rounder?

Would he be worth that risk?

DarthMonk