RB pecking order....

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:16 am

I must say that I was surprised to not see Torrain start and have been publicly stating (ie. whining) about it on the boards from time to time. I think what bothered me more is that he wasn't even on the field, especially in lieu of how in-effective Hightower has been.

My question to you is, what is the RB pecking order from here on out? Or what should it be?

In my opinion...

1. Torrain
2. Helu
3. Tim

emoses14 · Post by **emoses14** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:56 am

My feeling is that your order is correct. My suspicion is that the order might stay the same as we saw in St. Louis, with Tim and Ryan swithching the lead back roles and Helu serving as the change of pace for both, simply due to the fact that Ryan has injury issues. Stepping inside Mike's head and pretending to know what he's thinking, I see Tim softening up the defense (and running better stretch plays) with Helu filling in as the far better 1 cut and go speed guy and then giving way to a bruising Ryan (w/helu as the speed relief) once the defense is soft and tired.

I guess that way you get all three on the field, and Ryan isn't getting hit by fresh bodies, thus making his punishment a little less severe??

Its a little nuts, but my $.02

Deadskins · Post by **Deadskins** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:13 am

I don't have a problem with the order right now. Then bringing in Torain, later in the game, to batter a worn down defense into submission.

Warmother · Post by **Warmother** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:17 am

Chris I think your right. Torian looked great. He was fast and punishing. If he stays healthy it's a no brainer to me.
Helu has been very effective in his roll and I see no reason to change it.
I think Hightower could be a nice 3rd down back. His pass catching is good and his pass blocking has been much improved.

Skinsfan55 · Post by **Skinsfan55** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:12 am

I voted for Torain (one R btw) but I was surprised how lopsided the vote was. The Rams have the worst run defense in football. It would be kind of foolish to had RT the reigns based on one game against them. I think Helu is the eventual successor once he brings the other aspects of his game up to speed but Torain and Hightower should be splitting the bulk of the carries until a clear winner is determined IMO.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:22 am

Skinsfan55 wrote:I voted for Torain (one R btw)

Noted.

Skinsfan55 wrote: but I was surprised how lopsided the vote was. The Rams have the worst run defense in football. It would be kind of foolish to had RT the reigns based on one game against them.

It's not just one game. There was a 2010 season y'know... LOL

Skinsfan55 wrote:I think Helu is the eventual successor

Possibly, I don't really disagree.

ATX_Skins · Post by **ATX_Skins** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:28 am

Look, just run Torain until he bangs himself up. We know it will happen but we should get the most out of him when we can.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:31 am

ATX_Skins wrote:Look, just run Torain until he bangs himself up. We know it will happen but we should get the most out of him when we can.

Right... That's the way to go. :roll:

ATX_Skins · Post by **ATX_Skins** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:33 am

Chris Luva Luva wrote:
ATX_Skins wrote:Look, just run Torain until he bangs himself up. We know it will happen but we should get the most out of him when we can.

Right... That's the way to go.

It's not?

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:35 am

Sorry to intrude in this party with a DIFFERENT idea:

Why not have a running game by COMMITTEE???

What is wrong with a rotation that includes all three players in different stages and plays of the game?

They would be fresh. They would last longer throughout the season. They would be used to apply their best skills at the right times.

What is wrong with a rotation? Why do we have to have an order?

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:43 am

Redskin in Canada wrote:Sorry to intrude in this party with a DIFFERENT idea:

Why not have a running game by COMMITTEE???

What is wrong with a rotation that includes all three players in different stages and plays of the game?

They would be fresh. They would last longer throughout the season. They would be used to apply their best skills at the right times.

What is wrong with a rotation? Why do we have to have an order?

Nothing wrong with a rotation. I'm not against it. The only thing about that is that apparently some backs need to build up a lather to get going. Other don't... So, do you in a sense dimension a guys effectiveness by not giving him a certain # of touches? #shrug

But I'm for a committee. I just think that Torain needs to be featured more than once every 3 games.

ATX_Skins wrote:It's not?

We need to do what RIC stated to preserve him.

ATX_Skins · Post by **ATX_Skins** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:56 am

I would also like to do what RIC says. The issue I'm seeing is that Torain beats the crap out of defenses. The way he runs and how hard he runs can wear a team down quickly. I would not be opposed to Torain first half, then Tim and Helu second half. Torain isn't the kind of runner you preserve imo. It's all out or nothing for him. He also seems to get stronger the more he plays. I was also very surprised how well he was making cuts and hitting holes yesterday. He had a very quick push through the hole and he ran like he was possessed.

I think we need to play him right out the gate and set the tone for as many games as possible, using hightower and Helu as third down backs.

44diesel · Post by **44diesel** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:51 am

emoses14 wrote:My feeling is that your order is correct. My suspicion is that the order might stay the same as we saw in St. Louis, with Tim and Ryan swithching the lead back roles and Helu serving as the change of pace for both, simply due to the fact that Ryan has injury issues. Stepping inside Mike's head and pretending to know what he's thinking, I see Tim softening up the defense (and running better stretch plays) with Helu filling in as the far better 1 cut and go speed guy and then giving way to a bruising Ryan (w/helu as the speed relief) once the defense is soft and tired.

I guess that way you get all three on the field, and Ryan isn't getting hit by fresh bodies, thus making his punishment a little less severe??

Its a little nuts, but my $.02

I agree. I don't care who's labeled "starter" rather I see Shanahan keeping fresh legs in the game to pound the football by committee.

I think the first half/second half "starter" will depend on the opposing defense. If you have a defense who's tough against the run then start with Hightower who can spread the ball and catch passes. If you have a faster defense then start with the punishing downhill running of Torrain to slow them down and make them stack the box to open up plays downfield.

What's nice is that we have legitimate "options." Our ground game is gonna give a lot of Defensive Coaches headaches to gameplan against.

If our defense can keep teams from lighting up the scoreboard (which they've been doing a nice job of) and the running game can burn up the clock, we'll win quite a few games this season.

Skeletor · Post by **Skeletor** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:52 am

Heck, why run the ball when you can Sexy Rexy air it out? Particularly late in games when you're trying to milk the clock...

frankcal20 · Post by **frankcal20** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:00 am

Hightower starts the game. Helu get's his 10 carries in 3rd down situations. Torrain closes it out. Focus on the run as long as we have the lead.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:04 am

I like all three. I'd pick the "starter" based on the D we're playing. But in terms of order, Torain is the best now probably because he's the bruiser and our OL is mediocre. Hightower's better then people are giving him credit for because he's the best at picking up blitzes.

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 1:29 pm

I went with Hightower...

Best back to start, with "the Train" you know it won't be a deep pass to start the game but some type of run, draw or screen.

With Hightower they have all their options open, but seem to keep calling that stretch play where Hightower never picks a hole, plants and makes the cut. He just lets the play get strung out (the O-line could help a little here), but Tim can stay in the backfield and help protect Grossman if Kyle wants to open it up early, Hightower is also the best pass catcher in the group.

Helu is a rookie, he'll come along in time. Start this poll in week ten and see where he stands but not yet.

Torain looked real good on Sunday for one game and has never not been dinged up. The word was if Helu or Royster (I forget which one) hadn't got a concussion in the last preseason game RT would not have made the final 53

cvillehog · Post by **cvillehog** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 2:37 pm

1niksder wrote:I went with Hightower...

Best back to start, with "the Train" you know it won't be a deep pass to start the game but some type of run, draw or screen.

With Hightower they have all their options open, but seem to keep calling that stretch play where Hightower never picks a hole, plants and makes the cut. He just lets the play get strung out (the O-line could help a little here), but Tim can stay in the backfield and help protect Grossman if Kyle wants to open it up early, Hightower is also the best pass catcher in the group.

Helu is a rookie, he'll come along in time. Start this poll in week ten and see where he stands but not yet.

Torain looked real good on Sunday for one game and has never not been dinged up. The word was if Helu or Royster (I forget which one) hadn't got a concussion in the last preseason game RT would not have made the final 53

Great points niks!

markshark84 · Post by **markshark84** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:26 pm

frankcal20 wrote:Hightower starts the game. Helu get's his 10 carries in 3rd down situations. Torrain closes it out. Focus on the run as long as we have the lead.

The skins avg. about 12-16 3rd downs a game -- I'm not sure that Helu would get 10 carries out of a situation that presents itself 12-16 times a game. I do agree, though that we should try to get Helu 10 carries a game.

After last game, I do think that we need to give Torain more carries. It is up to him to prove that this wasn't a one time deal or that it was a product of a poor run defense. I, however, wouldn't give Torain a huge leash. Because of our RB situation, we have the luxury of replacing a guy early if they don't perform well after 5 carries or so.

I haven't been extremely impressed with Hightower this year, so I was very happy to see a nice rotation agains STL. That was something I had been requesting they do last week. Right now, I would say to start Torain, but if he doesn't perform well, pull him for Helu. We should still use Hightower -- he is still a good RB, just not playing as well as expected. With all this being said, I voted for Helu, mainly because I would like to see what he does with 20 carries in a game.

ATX_Skins · Post by **ATX_Skins** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:32 pm

Had Torain lost that fumble I don't think as many people would be calling for him to start. However he recovered it and we won, all is good.

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:15 pm

I'm not going with any... depends on the strength of the opposing front seven. Fast, pursuing d... Torrain, where his bruising style is likely to inflict damage. Rock like stout Front seven... Hightower, because the edge and stretch plays will be productive. Helu to drive them crazy as they overpursue, leaving him to cut back behind them.

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:17 pm

ATX_Skins wrote:Had Torain lost that fumble I don't think as many people would be calling for him to start. However he recovered it and we won, all is good.

That fumble was really the result of a very good defensive play... not of a weakness in Torrain's ball security, in that case.

ATX_Skins · Post by **ATX_Skins** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:38 pm

Countertrey wrote:
ATX_Skins wrote:Had Torain lost that fumble I don't think as many people would be calling for him to start. However he recovered it and we won, all is good.

That fumble was really the result of a very good defensive play... not of a weakness in Torrain's ball security, in that case.

I would agree with you if it wasn't during a cut, around the D-line with one hand on the ball.

Again though, at least it was recovered, by Torain somehow lol

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:20 pm

ATX_Skins wrote:
Countertrey wrote:
ATX_Skins wrote:Had Torain lost that fumble I don't think as many people would be calling for him to start. However he recovered it and we won, all is good.

That fumble was really the result of a very good defensive play... not of a weakness in Torrain's ball security, in that case.

I would agree with you if it wasn't during a cut, around the D-line with one hand on the ball.

Again though, at least it was recovered, by Torain somehow lol

My view was that he had it covered with both hands, though it was cradled mostly in the Right... probably for balance, as he was attempting to change directions to the left. Again, I think his ball security was good... this was a solid play by the tackle.

ATX_Skins · Post by **ATX_Skins** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:25 pm

Countertrey wrote:
ATX_Skins wrote:
Countertrey wrote:
ATX_Skins wrote:Had Torain lost that fumble I don't think as many people would be calling for him to start. However he recovered it and we won, all is good.

That fumble was really the result of a very good defensive play... not of a weakness in Torrain's ball security, in that case.

I would agree with you if it wasn't during a cut, around the D-line with one hand on the ball.

Again though, at least it was recovered, by Torain somehow lol

My view was that he had it covered with both hands, though it was cradled mostly in the Right... probably for balance, as he was attempting to change directions to the left. Again, I think his ball security was good... this was a solid play by the tackle.

I'm not 100% sure but I remember yelling to cover up. It looked to me as if he had the ball in his left hand and was trying to cut inside when it was knocked out from behind. Either way it was a good play by the defender. Not trying to split hairs here. Just bringing up that had he lost the fumble, maybe people would be singing a different song about Torain.

The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

RB pecking order....

Who should the starting RB be?

RB pecking order....