The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:

HTTRRG3ALMO wrote:

cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:

HTTRRG3ALMO wrote:

spudstr04 wrote:@incarceratedbob reporting Fred Davis back to #Redskins. Has been ahead on some things.

I'm very relieved about this at this point. Heard rumors Seattle was interested in him.

So long as its not just a rumor too!

Yeah...guess I am getting all relieved prematurely Here's hoping for the best...

....








.




That's what she said!

Lmmfao!


..... Did he sign yet? Ive been avoiding making eye contact with the bottom line on espn all week!

HAHAHAHA!!!

I don't know brother. I'm in the same boat as you. Just kinda waiting for a brave soul to post the latest. Been a hard week to not be glued to the internet and not working

OT Tyler Polumbus re-signs - 2 year deal

spudstr04 wrote:OT Tyler Polumbus re-signs - 2 year deal

Sounds good to me! I like the idea of upgrading at RT but bringing Polumbus back gives us a decent baseline to work from. I was a little concerned with us only having those two vets coming off injuries.

Don't know if I would call Pashos our Trueblood and upgrade. They might end up being an upgrade but I don't see it yet. My guess is one of the three makes the 53 man roster, two of them at the max.

skinsfan#33 wrote:Don't know if I would call Pashos our Trueblood and upgrade. They might end up being an upgrade but I don't see it yet. My guess is one of the three makes the 53 man roster, two of them at the max.

I don't think either are an upgrade. I said I like the idea of upgrading, but we have yet to see it. I'm still holding out hope for Eric Winston, though the sheer numbers at RT make me think that's getting to be unlikely.

Mike and the boys have a plan

and

we will be 'better off' than we were at CB, FS and RT

and

we will have depth - maybe not as great as we'd like, but, we will have depth

SkinsJock wrote:Mike and the boys have a plan

and

we will be 'better off' than we were at CB, FS and RT

and

we will have depth - maybe not as great as we'd like, but, we will have depth

SJ,
We all know you get paid to be the Mike AND Bruce propaganda machine here, but let's just turn off that machine for a little bit to answer this question.
How do you think we will get better at those spots?

If your answer is that the answer is already on the roster then I would counter with. If any of our backups from last year can step in and improve those spots then why didn't they get a crack last year? And if they do that would mean we got worse at that backup spot.

If your answer is the draft then I would say that is pretty unreasonable to expect 3 starters from the draft that are an improvement over what we had.

If your answer is FA, then who?

But I really think your answer is you haven't got a frakkin clue and you just make statements like that out of blind homerism!

Now I'm not saying your wrong and I do have a lot of faith in what they are doing, but it doesn't prevent me from questioning the work in progress. However, I would say the odds are, based on our resources we will be at best better at one spot, even at the other, and worse at the third spot. Now, I hope I am completely wrong, but my scenario is MUCH more likely than yours!

skinsfan#33 wrote:How do you think we will get better at those spots?

If your answer is that the answer is already on the roster then I would counter with. If any of our backups from last year can step in and improve those spots then why didn't they get a crack last year? And if they do that would mean we got worse at that backup spot.

If your answer is the draft then I would say that is pretty unreasonable to expect 3 starters from the draft that are an improvement over what we had.

Skinsjock can fight his own battles, but I will say that the answer is probably not on the roster at Cornerback. But, Tanard Jackson is on the roster, and was the starter going into last year. Believing him to be an upgrade over Madieu Williams isn't a stretch...and we don't need to draft or sign him.

As for Corner. The answer is not on the roster. We will need to add someone. But, I don't think it's a stretch to think that you can address that spot with a 2nd or 3rd round pick. Fred Smoot came in and played right away his rookie year with Champ Bailey. Depending on how the draft shakes out, we can address corner in it.

I agree with you on Right Tackle. But, this was Top 5 offense last year. Polumbus is the weakest link, but that's not as glaring of a hole as some people think.

skinsfan#33 wrote:How do you think we will get better at those spots?

If your answer is that the answer is already on the roster then I would counter with. If any of our backups from last year can step in and improve those spots then why didn't they get a crack last year? And if they do that would mean we got worse at that backup spot.

If your answer is the draft then I would say that is pretty unreasonable to expect 3 starters from the draft that are an improvement over what we had.

Skinsjock can fight his own battles, but I will say that the answer is probably not on the roster at Cornerback. But, Tanard Jackson is on the roster, and was the starter going into last year. Believing him to be an upgrade over Madieu Williams isn't a stretch...and we don't need to draft or sign him.

As for Corner. The answer is not on the roster. We will need to add someone. But, I don't think it's a stretch to think that you can address that spot with a 2nd or 3rd round pick. Fred Smoot came in and played right away his rookie year with Champ Bailey. Depending on how the draft shakes out, we can address corner in it.

I agree with you on Right Tackle. But, this was Top 5 offense last year. Polumbus is the weakest link, but that's not as glaring of a hole as some people think.

+1
And I will add that backups who didn't crack the starting lineup last season, may still be works in progress. Not every player steps in as a starter in his rookie season. There is a learning curve form the majority of NFL players, and sometimes it takes a year or two to learn the game at the higher level, especially if there is a position change involved.

The Hogster wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:How do you think we will get better at those spots?

If your answer is that the answer is already on the roster then I would counter with. If any of our backups from last year can step in and improve those spots then why didn't they get a crack last year? And if they do that would mean we got worse at that backup spot.

If your answer is the draft then I would say that is pretty unreasonable to expect 3 starters from the draft that are an improvement over what we had.

Skinsjock can fight his own battles, but I will say that the answer is probably not on the roster at Cornerback. But, Tanard Jackson is on the roster, and was the starter going into last year. Believing him to be an upgrade over Madieu Williams isn't a stretch...and we don't need to draft or sign him.

As for Corner. The answer is not on the roster. We will need to add someone. But, I don't think it's a stretch to think that you can address that spot with a 2nd or 3rd round pick. Fred Smoot came in and played right away his rookie year with Champ Bailey. Depending on how the draft shakes out, we can address corner in it.

I agree with you on Right Tackle. But, this was Top 5 offense last year. Polumbus is the weakest link, but that's not as glaring of a hole as some people think.

I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster, but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL. Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team?

Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.

Deadskins wrote:+1
And I will add that backups who didn't crack the starting lineup last season, may still be works in progress. Not every player steps in as a starter in his rookie season. There is a learning curve form the majority of NFL players, and sometimes it takes a year or two to learn the game at the higher level, especially if there is a position change involved.

I agree with this and hope all of out younger players do get better. But if any step into a starting rule, then that means we got worse at the back up spot.

skinsfan#33 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:+1
And I will add that backups who didn't crack the starting lineup last season, may still be works in progress. Not every player steps in as a starter in his rookie season. There is a learning curve form the majority of NFL players, and sometimes it takes a year or two to learn the game at the higher level, especially if there is a position change involved.

I agree with this and hope all of out younger players do get better. But if any step into a starting rule, then that means we got worse at the back up spot.

How do you figure? If the the old starter now becomes the new backup, how does that make our backup situation worse?

Deadskins wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:+1
And I will add that backups who didn't crack the starting lineup last season, may still be works in progress. Not every player steps in as a starter in his rookie season. There is a learning curve form the majority of NFL players, and sometimes it takes a year or two to learn the game at the higher level, especially if there is a position change involved.

I agree with this and hope all of out younger players do get better. But if any step into a starting rule, then that means we got worse at the back up spot.

How do you figure? If the the old starter now becomes the new backup, how does that make our backup situation worse?

Usually that isn't what happens. If a back up Atlanta the starter on an off season the old starter is normally cut. Leaving the back up to the back up to fill that roll. The only place I could see that happening is at RT. It definitely can't happen at CB.

I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster,

He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.

but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.

No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.

Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team?

Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.

Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.

I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.

How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team.

I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster,

He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.

but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.

No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely--got reinstated. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.

Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team?

Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.

Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.

I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.

How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team. We don't need to sign Namdi, Charles Woodson etc just to improve the secondary. We were the 30th ranked secondary last year WITH DHall. There's room for improvement, even if a rookie is in the rotation.

The Hogster wrote:

I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster,

He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.

but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.

No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.

Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team?

Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.

Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.

I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.

How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team. We don't need to sign Namdi, Charles Woodson etc just to improve the secondary. We were the 30th ranked secondary last year WITH DHall. There's room for improvement, even if a rookie is in the rotation.

Great points about signing FA talents. Hard not to get sucked into that mentality of signing "better" players from other teams.

Not sure what the coaches have been doing but they're rock solid on player development. Some players obviously respond better than others.

I think the real mystery is Shanny's mind; how he can spot that "fit" everyone else seems to overlook. Gotta love it!!

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/ ... nerslosers

Washington Redskins: Loser. They've actually done well to hold together as much of their division-champion team as they have, considering the $18 million in cap penalties they're still dealing with this year. But they had to cut cornerback DeAngelo Hall, lost special-teams captain Lorenzo Alexander, and have yet to re-sign tight end Fred Davis. More importantly, though, they still have major needs in the secondary and have been unable to land the free safety or the starting cornerback they need. E.J. Biggers is probably better as a No. 3 cornerback, though at this point he may project as one of their starters. The good thing is that the safety and cornerback market still has lots of options, and the prices aren't going up. But the Redskins have no first-round pick next month, so they have some challenges ahead.

Yeah I'm a homer, but I couldn't disagree with this more. Given the cap penalty, I've been really happy that we've been able to retain as many of our own free agents as possible. Keeping your division champion team largely intact under those conditions sounds like a win to me.

I know in these things winning/losing free agency is pretty much about who was able to land the most big names. Don't these writers remember when we "won" Albert Haynesworth? How about when the Eagles beat everybody in FA to assemble the vaunted "dream team"? lol.

The Hogster wrote:

I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster,

He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.

but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.

No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely--got reinstated. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.

Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team?

Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.

Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.

I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.

How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team. We don't need to sign Namdi, Charles Woodson etc just to improve the secondary. We were the 30th ranked secondary last year WITH DHall. There's room for improvement, even if a rookie is in the rotation.

I think his suspension will be lifted as soon as we release him.

The Hogster wrote:

I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster,

He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.

but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.

No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely--got reinstated. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.

Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team?

Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.

Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.

I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.

How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team. We don't need to sign Namdi, Charles Woodson etc just to improve the secondary. We were the 30th ranked secondary last year WITH DHall. There's room for improvement, even if a rookie is in the rotation.

I know that TJ was on the "reserve - suspended" list. What I was unsure of (and do are you) is if that is technically part of the roster. It certainly isn't part of the 53 man roster or the off-season 80 (or however many it is) man roster. So it seems like he isn't on our roster right now. He is on a reserve list.

I must bee older than you (45) because these indefinite drug suspensions used to be called life time suspensions. It was exactly the same suspension when Dexter Manley got suspended for "life" then ended up playing for the Cardinals a year or two later.
So we are talking about the same punishment. Kind of like arguing whether the name of a small horse like animal is a donkey or an ass. Two different names for the same animal, just one seams a bit more harsh.
I agree that a player drafted next year might be better for the team down the road that Hall, but that wasn't what I was arguing. I'm on my phone so I'm not going to cut an paste where this all started but basically I was saying that getting better at RT, S, and CB next year true the draft is extremely unlikely. You would have to agree that if we improved at two of those three spots over what we had last year via the draft then Shanny pulled a minor miracle. I'm not talking down the road improvement or over all team play, I'm talking improvement next year at those spots.

^^^ ... THEN

IF we added a CB and a Safety thru the draft and found another RT to go with the 6 or 7 already thinking they have a shot

you'd have to say that the guys in charge 'IMPROVED' the team and have pulled of a 'minor miracle' ..

For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anythg that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh

Deadskins wrote:For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anything that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh

for a moment there ... I took it that you must be referring to skinsfan#33 ...

then I realized that you, mostly, don't read all the posts and took my "you'd have to say ..." as being my thoughts ...
when obviously, I was referring to skinsfan#33's post that anything like that happening would be a 'minor miracle'

no worries - I like helping you out

SkinsJock wrote:

Deadskins wrote:For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anything that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh

for a moment there ... I took it that you must be referring to skinsfan#33 ...

then I realized that you, mostly, don't read all the posts and took my "you'd have to say ..." as being my thoughts ...
when obviously, I was referring to skinsfan#33's post that anything like that happening would be a 'minor miracle'

no worries - I like helping you out

No, I generally just glance over your posts, figuring I've already read what you have to say a hundred times before.

I was talking to sf33. You're no optimist.

Deadskins wrote:No, I generally just glance over your posts, figuring I've already read what you have to say a hundred times before.
I was talking to sf33. You're no optimist.

WHEW - well that's a relief - I'm glad you haven't lost all your marbles .. yet