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Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 9:24 pm
by Kilmer72
SkinsJock wrote:these are all facts ....
there was nobody that thought we could get a 2nd or 3rd round pick except fans like me that were wishing & hoping ...
there was no way that Allen and Gruden wanted to let Cousins go although they might have for something more than a 4th ...
there was no franchise that was going to give up a 3rd or 2nd for Cousins
so - we have a very good back up QB despite what some idiots here thought about how good he could be
AND - McCoy is a very good QB to have at this time - I doubt that he gets to start though
Kyle Shanahan knew this. That's why they only offered a 4th round pick. He evidently (along with everyone else) saw the tape.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 9:58 pm
by Kilmer72
“No,” Gruden said. “If we’re talking about Kirk having limited reps in training camp and OTAs, Colt really had very limited reps, so we’d really be starting almost over again. And I think Kirk’s making some progress. Obviously he’s not being the consistent all-around quarterback that we want him to be or we think he could be. He’s making a few of his mistakes every week, and we just have to get those corrected, and that comes with playing.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc- ... olt-mccoy/
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 10:21 pm
by Kilmer72
No... Colt was only here if Kirk was traded by some chance. They wanted something for him. Colt is now an emergency QB because of Roberts injury history (as freak as it is) and because you need someone if the back up is damaged. You can't keep 3 starting QBs on the roster and hell pressed to keep 2.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 10:11 am
by langleyparkjoe
markshark84 wrote:langleyparkjoe wrote:Yes we should 100% start him because he's a bum and he'll help us with getting a better draft position.
Make a positive out of a crappy team, why not?
Having top draft picks is only a benefit when you have a GM that can make good picks. Since Allen has only had 1 real draft (since he wasn't a real GM under MS), the jury is still out --- so we'll see......
But with 3 total wins and actually having all our picks (wait, we do have all right?)... he can't mess that up.. oooorrr maybe he can.. lol
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:01 pm
by Countertrey
Anybody change their mind?
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:11 pm
by Kilmer72
Countertrey wrote:Anybody change their mind?
About starting McCoy? Not really. He came off the bench. When they game plan and he has a few games then maybe for me.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:39 pm
by EA7649
Yes until Robert is 100% better. Honestly, I'd be comfortable if Colt was the back not Kirk.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:51 pm
by SkinsJock
Countertrey wrote:Anybody change their mind?
not me - although it was a REALLY GUTSY call by Gruden
Gruden proved that he is going to play the QB that he feels is best for the offense
Griffin will start when Gruden thinks he's best for the offense and until then it will be up to McCoy and I'm not sure about Cousins ...
LOVE that McCoy took full advantage of his opportunity when it came, unlike Cousins
Cousins looked like he would be a good back up QB to Griffin but he really blew it ....
be interesting to hear from all the fans that felt that Cousins would be a better QB than Griffin - he's just a back up QB is all
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 8:12 pm
by DarthMonk
cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:^ Then let it be so!
I'm guessing he starts next week.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 8:18 pm
by welch
Question seems to have been answered.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 7:54 am
by StorminMormon86
Gruden pretty much spelled it out in his presser that McCoy will start against the Cowpukes.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 9:37 am
by SkinsJock
McCoy should start - I doubt that Griffin is really ready to go yet
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 9:56 am
by emoses14
StorminMormon86 wrote:Gruden pretty much spelled it out in his presser that McCoy will start against the Cowpukes.
Good. Excellent, actually. While I'd like to have him for the division game, its more important that he be really, really fully healed and have had at least a week of solid practice to get back in the swing of things. Actually, if Colt looks pretty good, I'd rather Griffin sit out the Vikings game, too. That gives him what would be a short week of practice (if he's ready to go now) before cowgirls, a full week before vikings (let him take some/half of first team snaps in this week) and then the bye to keep working on things, fully healthy and a full week to prepare for the bucs.
I want to see him sooner, but I'd rather wait an extra game (and a week) to see him play really well and get us going.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:14 am
by riggofan
Kilmer72 wrote:Countertrey wrote:Anybody change their mind?
About starting McCoy? Not really. He came off the bench. When they game plan and he has a few games then maybe for me.
Yeah I'm mostly with Kilmer72 on this one. You see this stuff in the NFL all the time where the backup comes in late and plays well. We've certainly seen it with the Redskins. I'm not feeling all that confident that we can start McCoy and play much better than we've done with Cousins. These guys have been backups for a reason, and the flaws will show over time.
All that said, I wouldn't blame Gruden for starting McCoy v. the Pukes. Cousins' confidence just seems completely shot. I admire how hard he takes his mistakes, but he would do well to watch Romo next Monday night. That guy is an object lesson in how to make a crappy play and shake it off.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:18 am
by DarthMonk
I'd imagine the scripts for McCoy and Griff would be more similar than would the scripts for Cousins and Griff. I'd like to see the pistol/read option look a few times each quarter Monday. Might help Alf get untracked.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:39 am
by welch
Don't use Griffin until:
(1) He is fully healed. Lesson from 2012.
(2) The OL can block properly. If that's not 2014, then so be it.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 11:44 am
by SkinsJock
welch wrote:Don't use Griffin until:
(1) He is fully healed. Lesson from 2012.
(2) The OL can block properly. If that's not 2014, then so be it.
+1 - it's going to be hard to resist putting Griffin back on the field but Gruden showed he's a very gutsy HC in pulling Cousins
if we're not going to have better pass and run blocking from this O line then we should make Griffin sit it out and take the time to become the future great QB this franchise needs
THAT IS THE GUTSY CALL
The fact is that even if Griffin is fully healed, if the O line continues to play as it has, we are risking his future
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 1:00 pm
by riggofan
The o-line has blocked Kirk Cousins and Colt McCoy for the past five games. RGIII is too precious to play behind them?
This year's line is no worse than what he played behind in 2012. Dude is getting paid to play football. Get healthy and go play football. If we're going to sit him until the line is full of pro bowlers, his contract will be up by that time.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 2:07 pm
by SkinsJock
riggofan wrote:The o-line has blocked Kirk Cousins and Colt McCoy for the past five games. RGIII is too precious to play behind them?
This year's line is no worse than what he played behind in 2012. Dude is getting paid to play football. Get healthy and go play football. If we're going to sit him until the line is full of pro bowlers, his contract will be up by that time.
you (and others here) LOVE to make stuff up ... why would you think that Gruden will sit Griffin "until the line is full of pro bowlers .." why insinuate that I meant that? that's just stupid and argumentative
IF this line cannot protect Griffin and he's not really ready physically, or ready to run the offense the way Gruden wants it done, why put him in there? that's all welch and I are asking
I want Griffin playing QB the way Gruden wants him to play and that also includes using the read/option plays but I also want an O line that can run block and pass block a little more effectively than what we've seen so far
AND
"the O line has blocked for Kirk Cousins and Colt McCoy the last 5 games ... " REALLY - Why is this O line ranked last or 31st on 3rd down percentage? WHY? - Because this O line is not getting the running yards from Morris that we need and they are horrible at pass blocking
Griffin will play well behind any O line but this line is not good for QBs to play behind - Griffin needs to be ready in more ways than one
I'm sure that Gruden will play Griffin as soon as he's ready but this O line is a nightmare and has not helped this offense much at all
I'm looking forward to seeing this O line play better but I have had my doubts about this group since the season began
we'll soon see
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 3:55 pm
by StorminMormon86
Griffin holding the ball too long = making the line look like crap. Cousins was releasing the ball extremely fast, thus the lack of sacks compared to Griffin.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:22 pm
by Deadskins
StorminMormon86 wrote:Griffin holding the ball too long = making the line look like crap. Cousins was releasing the ball extremely fast, thus the lack of sacks compared to Griffin.
Not really though. Cousins has 8 sacks through 4 1/2 games (avg of ~2 per game) while RGIII had 4 in his one+ outing, but a couple of those were scrambles where he went OOB before getting back to the LOS against a tough Houston defense. Basically, Cousins is being sacked at half the rate of RGIII, but I'm willing to bet, once RGIII had established that he could run again, his sack rate would have declined. Also, it doesn't really matter how fast you're getting it out, if you're throwing it to the other team. I'd rather take the sack than the INT. We'll see how it goes when RGIII comes back.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:33 pm
by riggofan
SkinsJock wrote:riggofan wrote:The o-line has blocked Kirk Cousins and Colt McCoy for the past five games. RGIII is too precious to play behind them?
This year's line is no worse than what he played behind in 2012. Dude is getting paid to play football. Get healthy and go play football. If we're going to sit him until the line is full of pro bowlers, his contract will be up by that time.
you (and others here) LOVE to make stuff up ... why would you think that Gruden will sit Griffin "until the line is full of pro bowlers .." why insinuate that I meant that? that's just stupid and argumentative
I know that "waiting for the line to be full of pro bowlers" is a crazy exaggeration, but how exactly is it any more stupid than saying "Don't play him until the o-line can block."? The line has been blocking for the past six games. I haven't seen Cousins or McCoy getting battered like Patrick Ramsey or anything. So what does the line have to do with starting RGIII?
I'm not trying to be argumentative, I'm just responding to the comment above (which wasn't yours btw). The current state of the offensive line has zippy to do with starting RGIII or not. There isn't a team in the NFL that has the luxury of sitting their franchise QB until they feel awesome about their offensive line.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2014 9:58 pm
by tribeofjudah
McCoy to start vs. Cowboys according to Shefter.
Colt goes back to to TX where he played college ball.
LET'S BEAT THEM PUKES....!!!
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:26 pm
by StorminMormon86
Starting McCoy makes sense in the short term, obviously. But what if he struggles? Does Gruden pull him and go back to Cousins?!
One other point that bothers me about starting McCoy is what exactly is he playing for? With Cousins he was playing to unseat Griffin or beef up his trade value (to show other teams he's a good starter). McCoy doesn't necessarily have that option. And with Gruden already proclaiming Griffin the starter once he's healthy, how is that supposed to boost McCoy's confidence? Or maybe I've just been thinking about it too much today.
Re: Should We Start McCoy ??
Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:47 pm
by SkinsJock
riggofan - i think that they will start Griffin as soon as they feel he's ready - we don't have the luxury of holding him out
I don't think we're making the playoffs no matter what and with that in mind, I'd rather wait a few games and let him get in more work before they put him back in - he definitely needs the playing time but why rush it like I think they will
I will also add that I think that Griffin will help the O line a bit because he fully understands that he needs to protect himself and he can use his athleticism to ensure that but .... this is not a good O line is all I'm pointing out