Which issue is the biggest concern for the Skins in 2009?

[fleetus]

2. Kurt Warner, Moss and ARE and the rookies playing behind the Skins current Offensive line.

This option would be the winner and this is why the team is in the pickle it's in now. They know Jason isn't the answer.

yeah, and their knowledge has been so successful in the past It sounds like the bulk of your logic is based on, "well, since there are rumors about trading for Cutler, then they MUST not want JC. And if they don't want JC, he MUST not be the answer at QB." Pretty faulty logic, IMO.

[CanesSkins26]

So let me illustrate some comparisons and you can consider what you think the results would be:

Tell me which offense would do better this year, without the difficulties players have learning a new system. Just your best guess, if all players involved knew the offensive system fairly well. Portis and ey are included in all three options.

1. Campbell, Moss, ARE and the rookies playing behind the 5 starting NFC O-linemen from the Pro Bowl.

2. Kurt Warner, Moss and ARE and the rookies playing behind the Skins current Offensive line.

3. Campbell, L. Fitzgerald, A. Boldin, S. Breaston playing behind the Skins current O-line.

If you are considering injury prone players, then assume an average scrub backup player will take their place.

Now, which of the three options scores more points, creates fewer turnovers, controls the ball best and wins the most games?

Definitely scenario 2.

[Chris Luva Luva]

2. Kurt Warner, Moss and ARE and the rookies playing behind the Skins current Offensive line.

This option would be the winner and this is why the team is in the pickle it's in now. They know Jason isn't the answer.

yeah, and their knowledge has been so successful in the past It sounds like the bulk of your logic is based on, "well, since there are rumors about trading for Cutler, then they MUST not want JC. And if they don't want JC, he MUST not be the answer at QB." Pretty faulty logic, IMO.

I can see right now that "discussing" this with you is pointless. You know that I really don't care if you like my opinion or not BUT my opinion on Jason has not changed due to the news, check my post history. I've been saying he's the epitome of mediocrity for many months now.

[SkinsSince96]

1. Campbell, Moss, ARE and the rookies playing behind the 5 starting NFC O-linemen from the Pro Bowl.

This option would allow the running game to make more big plays and set up the passing game. Campbell still has to make the throws and even with good protection at times he struggled to hit short throws.

2. Kurt Warner, Moss and ARE and the rookies playing behind the Skins current Offensive line.

Warner would get killed if our offensive line played like it did last year. Dockery is a upgrade but we need a RT baddd. The current WR core isnt anywhere as good as what Warner had. This is the worst option because Warner cant throw while on his back.

3. Campbell, L. Fitzgerald, A. Boldin, S. Breaston playing behind the Skins current O-line.

This would be better than the 2nd option because we would have Portis, Fitz, Boldin, and ey. Very hard to stop that offense and also very hard to send blitzes with the talent at those positions.

Id go with option 1 with option 3 a close 2nd.

With everything going on with the Cutler drama. Im rethinking what the biggest issue will be going into 2009. QB, WR, or OL. If we dont get Cutler I think Campbell is going to be really good or really bad. At least we have Brennan though. If we dont get a RT like I thought at 13 because we trade the pick for Cutler id say OL is the biggest issue. If we draft a RT at 13 like I said earlier I think the biggest issue will shift to WR if the rookies from last year dont step up.

Right now im projecting the biggest issue is still WR. If we dont get a RT at 13 like I was banking on all along id say OL shifts to easily the number 1 issue.

[Chris Luva Luva]

How is option 3 the best option when Jason can't even hardly get the ball to the WR's he's got now???? We know this group of WR's are AT LEAST decent because Todd Collins did awesome with them when he played in 2007.

The WR's aren't the problem because they're USELESS without a ball in their hands.

- Jason couldn't get the WR's the ball in 2007.
- Todd got the ball in the WR's hands in 2007.
- Jason could not get the ball to the WR's in 2008.

You can add in Randy Moss, TO, Burress, Ocho and whomever else and they'll do you know good if the QB can't get them the rock.

[fleetus]

How is option 3 the best option when Jason can't even hardly get the ball to the WR's he's got now???? We know this group of WR's are AT LEAST decent because Todd Collins did awesome with them when he played in 2007.

The WR's aren't the problem because they're USELESS without a ball in their hands.

- Jason couldn't get the WR's the ball in 2007.
- Todd got the ball in the WR's hands in 2007.
- Jason could not get the ball to the WR's in 2008.

You can add in Randy Moss, TO, Burress, Ocho and whomever else and they'll do you know good if the QB can't get them the rock.

Wr's got the ball to their hands over 62% of the time last year. But hey, it's fine. We all have different opinions. Nothing is absolute. JC is not a star. Moss and ARE are not stars. The O-line is not pro bowl caliber. Even Portis is limited in how much of the load he can handle by himself.

But, I agree with the assessment that Option 1 and 3 are the best ones. Not by a mile, but they would make for more wins, IMO. It is overly simplistic to point at the QB as the problem. It takes 11 men working together. and in reality in the NFL, it takes almost the whole roster working together, because injuries are a constant threat. You're only as good as your weakest link, because all teams watch game tape and they figure out your weakest link in short order.

JC could be better, but I think he is getting better. The O-line is decent only so long as the starting 5 stay on the field. This isn't likely to happen given their ages and injury histories. Portis is great, but has a lot of mileage and some injury history of his own. Moss is on the downside of an inconcisitent career where speed has been his biggest ally. What happens when he isn't faster than the CB's covering him? Has that already happened? ARE? 'nuf said. Rookies have to do a 180 from last year. I don't see how anyone could think that you could plug any QB, other than maybe Steve Young (in his scrambling hey day) into this team and expect to go deep into the playoffs.

Give me a pro bowl offensive line and we'll pound the crap out of every team and JC will stay upright long enough to keep defenses honest.

Give me Pro Bowl WR's and we keep defenses guessing all year long. JC's 62% completion % goes up to nearly 70%. TD's go up. Sacks would still be an issue, but if JC has open targets, bigger than 5'9", who can hold on to the ball more often, we could make defenses pay for blitzes.

It all starts up front. You would think a forum called "thehogs.net" would understand this.

[fleetus]

So let me illustrate some comparisons and you can consider what you think the results would be:

Tell me which offense would do better this year, without the difficulties players have learning a new system. Just your best guess, if all players involved knew the offensive system fairly well. Portis and ey are included in all three options.

1. Campbell, Moss, ARE and the rookies playing behind the 5 starting NFC O-linemen from the Pro Bowl.

2. Kurt Warner, Moss and ARE and the rookies playing behind the Skins current Offensive line.

3. Campbell, L. Fitzgerald, A. Boldin, S. Breaston playing behind the Skins current O-line.

If you are considering injury prone players, then assume an average scrub backup player will take their place.

Now, which of the three options scores more points, creates fewer turnovers, controls the ball best and wins the most games?

one more time...

[Chris Luva Luva]

Wr's got the ball to their hands over 62% of the time last year.

Big deal. That's just one of those bullcrap stats that people tout to make themsevles sleep at night. POINTS win games. Just like that bullcrap record MB04 set (completions), big deal.

Todd Collins proved that with the mediocre talent on the offense, we could go places. The difference between Todd and Jason? Decisiveness and a quick release. You get a QB back there that has those qualities, he'll make the rest of the offense look better and you can still improve those areas in future years.

It all starts up front. You would think a forum called "thehogs.net" would understand this.

Nobody is debating this but you. The line has been addressed thus far. The line will continue to be addressed, you'd think that a Redskin fan would realize that. You're arguing with yourself.

[skinsfan#33]

1. Campbell, Moss, ARE and the rookies playing behind the 5 starting NFC O-linemen from the Pro Bowl.

This option would allow the running game to make more big plays and set up the passing game. Campbell still has to make the throws and even with good protection at times he struggled to hit short throws.

2. Kurt Warner, Moss and ARE and the rookies playing behind the Skins current Offensive line.

Warner would get killed if our offensive line played like it did last year. Dockery is a upgrade but we need a RT baddd. The current WR core isnt anywhere as good as what Warner had. This is the worst option because Warner cant throw while on his back.

3. Campbell, L. Fitzgerald, A. Boldin, S. Breaston playing behind the Skins current O-line.

This would be better than the 2nd option because we would have Portis, Fitz, Boldin, and ey. Very hard to stop that offense and also very hard to send blitzes with the talent at those positions.

Id go with option 1 with option 3 a close 2nd.

With everything going on with the Cutler drama. Im rethinking what the biggest issue will be going into 2009. QB, WR, or OL. If we dont get Cutler I think Campbell is going to be really good or really bad. At least we have Brennan though. If we dont get a RT like I thought at 13 because we trade the pick for Cutler id say OL is the biggest issue. If we draft a RT at 13 like I said earlier I think the biggest issue will shift to WR if the rookies from last year dont step up.

Right now im projecting the biggest issue is still WR. If we dont get a RT at 13 like I was banking on all along id say OL shifts to easily the number 1 issue.

Option #2 would be the clear cut winner. I'll explain after I talk about #1 & #3.
#1. The Offense would improve, but eventually the Ds would just stack 8 9 in the box to stop Portis and if Moss gets nicked like he did last year they wouldn't wait more than a half to start stacking the box. Knowing that JC is either incapable or doesn't have the sack to throw against man coverage.

#3. Not much better than last year. Campbell just isn't very good at reading coverages and is late getting the ball to his players and when they are wide open he usually screws that up if he has time to think about it.

#2 Kurt Warner's O-line last year was worse the the Skins! Yes, you heard me. Worse! Zona was #32, Skins #8, in the league in rushing, the biggest indicator of how well an O line is playing. Next is sacks Warner was sacked ten times less than Campbell, so on the surface that looks better expecially considering he threw over 100 more passes. However you also have to remember he plays in a devision that doesn't get after the QB as well as the NFC East. He (and his #11) is the reason that he didn't get sacked very often. He reads the D extremely well, pre-snap, and knows where he is going with the ball almost as soon as it is snapped. Combine that with his lightning fast release and he just won't get sacked very often.

Add just him to what we have right now, and a healthy S Moss and the Skins would no longer have an O-line problem or a scoring problem! The right QB makes everone better.

[Kilmer72]

How is option 3 the best option when Jason can't even hardly get the ball to the WR's he's got now???? We know this group of WR's are AT LEAST decent because Todd Collins did awesome with them when he played in 2007.

The WR's aren't the problem because they're USELESS without a ball in their hands.

- Jason couldn't get the WR's the ball in 2007.
- Todd got the ball in the WR's hands in 2007.
- Jason could not get the ball to the WR's in 2008.

You can add in Randy Moss, TO, Burress, Ocho and whomever else and they'll do you know good if the QB can't get them the rock.

Wr's got the ball to their hands over 62% of the time last year. But hey, it's fine. We all have different opinions. Nothing is absolute. JC is not a star. Moss and ARE are not stars. The O-line is not pro bowl caliber. Even Portis is limited in how much of the load he can handle by himself.

But, I agree with the assessment that Option 1 and 3 are the best ones. Not by a mile, but they would make for more wins, IMO. It is overly simplistic to point at the QB as the problem. It takes 11 men working together. and in reality in the NFL, it takes almost the whole roster working together, because injuries are a constant threat. You're only as good as your weakest link, because all teams watch game tape and they figure out your weakest link in short order.

JC could be better, but I think he is getting better. The O-line is decent only so long as the starting 5 stay on the field. This isn't likely to happen given their ages and injury histories. Portis is great, but has a lot of mileage and some injury history of his own. Moss is on the downside of an inconcisitent career where speed has been his biggest ally. What happens when he isn't faster than the CB's covering him? Has that already happened? ARE? 'nuf said. Rookies have to do a 180 from last year. I don't see how anyone could think that you could plug any QB, other than maybe Steve Young (in his scrambling hey day) into this team and expect to go deep into the playoffs.

Give me a pro bowl offensive line and we'll pound the crap out of every team and JC will stay upright long enough to keep defenses honest.

Give me Pro Bowl WR's and we keep defenses guessing all year long. JC's 62% completion % goes up to nearly 70%. TD's go up. Sacks would still be an issue, but if JC has open targets, bigger than 5'9", who can hold on to the ball more often, we could make defenses pay for blitzes.

It all starts up front. You would think a forum called "thehogs.net" would understand this.

I agree with how you are thinking here Fleetus. So I wont elaborate on what you already said but you did miss one thing. What if we get a new Water Boy? If we get a Pro Bowl Water Boy everything will click and we will be on the way to the Super Bowl!!!!! Hehe

[PulpExposure]

For 2009, I voted o-line. However, for the future of the Redskins, 2009 and beyond, it's clearly the Front Office...

[SkinsSince96]

#2 Kurt Warner's O-line last year was worse the the Skins! Yes, you heard me. Worse! Zona was #32, Skins #8, in the league in rushing, the biggest indicator of how well an O line is playing. Next is sacks Warner was sacked ten times less than Campbell, so on the surface that looks better expecially considering he threw over 100 more passes. However you also have to remember he plays in a devision that doesn't get after the QB as well as the NFC East. He (and his #11) is the reason that he didn't get sacked very often. He reads the D extremely well, pre-snap, and knows where he is going with the ball almost as soon as it is snapped. Combine that with his lightning fast release and he just won't get sacked very often.

Add just him to what we have right now, and a healthy S Moss and the Skins would no longer have an O-line problem or a scoring problem! The right QB makes everone better.

Moss and Randle El arent Boldin and Fitz. The defense would still lock down Portis like they did in the 2nd half and come after Warner. When Warner gets the throw off Moss and Randle El wont do anything with it. They arent that good.

Give my a Pro Bowl Offensive line and I can turn any QB into a Pro Bowler. Give me Boldin/Fitz with ey/Portis and no defense could defend them all. Warner with the Skins offense last year would look like Warner with the Giants.

[fleetus]

#2 Kurt Warner's O-line last year was worse the the Skins! Yes, you heard me. Worse! Zona was #32, Skins #8, in the league in rushing, the biggest indicator of how well an O line is playing. Next is sacks Warner was sacked ten times less than Campbell, so on the surface that looks better expecially considering he threw over 100 more passes.

C'mon man, do you really think that one player, the Qb, really makes THAT much difference all by himself? He's important sure, but good QB's have ALWAYS been made by good O-lines. Why do you think crap teams always seem to have the worst luck developing players even though they get to draft a top3 pick franchise Qb's and WR's every year? NFL defenses eat future franchise QB's for lunch every year! Give me a good O-line any day and I guarantee the rest of the team will "magically" start to play beyond expectations

Look at what Parcells did last year taking over the 1-15 Dolphins. #1 pick he goes OT. Brings in re-tread Pennington and despite no great talent at WR, they won more games than anyone predicted. Parcells knew it would be pointless to bring in Matt Ryan with the existing offensive line. So he made several moves to shore up the O-line and made Pennington look brilliant. IMO, Detroit should do the same thing this year and draft J. Smith. But I digress...

Do you understand that run blocking and pass blocking are two different skill sets? Do you understand the difference between Clinton Portis and Edgerrin James/Hightower? Did you ever notice how Kurt Warner is almost a statue inside the pocket? This makes him especially easy to sack. In comparison, JC is very difficult to sack. He moves quite well, scrambles when he has too and is very hard to bring down in the pocket. There is a huge difference between the Cards O-line and the Skins of 2008.

You need to go back and watch guys like Jacoby, Grimm, Bostic, May, Lachey and Starke as they protected the QB and opened up big running lanes. Then come back and tell me how it's all about the QB, if you still have the gall.

[skinsfan#33]

#2 Kurt Warner's O-line last year was worse the the Skins! Yes, you heard me. Worse! Zona was #32, Skins #8, in the league in rushing, the biggest indicator of how well an O line is playing. Next is sacks Warner was sacked ten times less than Campbell, so on the surface that looks better expecially considering he threw over 100 more passes. However you also have to remember he plays in a devision that doesn't get after the QB as well as the NFC East. He (and his #11) is the reason that he didn't get sacked very often. He reads the D extremely well, pre-snap, and knows where he is going with the ball almost as soon as it is snapped. Combine that with his lightning fast release and he just won't get sacked very often.

Add just him to what we have right now, and a healthy S Moss and the Skins would no longer have an O-line problem or a scoring problem! The right QB makes everone better.

Moss and Randle El arent Boldin and Fitz. The defense would still lock down Portis like they did in the 2nd half and come after Warner. When Warner gets the throw off Moss and Randle El wont do anything with it. They arent that good.

While I agree that Moss and ARE aren't Fitts or Bolden, but if Moss is healthy (and that is a big if) they would be more than enough, when combined with ey finding wholes in the zone and Thomas running deep routes (Campbell almost never looked his way), Warner would be FAR more productive than Campbell. I saw at least three or for passes each game, had the ball been thrown better they would have scored. I'm not saying Warner would make all of those those throws, but a lot more than Campbell.

And here is the kicker, I don't even think that highly of Warner, but he would be a major upgrade over Campbell. I would say the gap between Campbell and Peyton or Brady, Warner is about half way between the two groups.

Give my a Pro Bowl Offensive line and I can turn any QB into a Pro Bowler. Give me Boldin/Fitz with ey/Portis and no defense could defend them all. Warner with the Skins offense last year would look like Warner with the Giants.

If a probowl offensine line could turn any QB into a Pro Bowler why is that when the Hogs were at there best the Skins didn't have pro Bowl QBs every years. If fact, whenever the Skins got above average QB play they went deep into the play offs.

And to further offer proof I give you the Minnisota Vikings!

Of course Campball would play better behind a Pro Bowl line, much like he did at the beginnig of the season when three of the OL were having a probowl type season. They got hurt and so did Moss. Once that happened Deffenses starting putting 8-9 in the box to stop Portis because no one else scared them and they new our OL wouldn't give Campbell enough time to make up his mind on what to do with the ball.

But it would have been enough time for Warner! Campbell is like a 486 computer trying to run XP. It might get the job done if you don't ask it to do too much too quickly and if every other part of your computer is top notch.

[SkinsSince96]

While I agree that Moss and ARE aren't Fitts or Bolden, but if Moss is healthy (and that is a big if) they would be more than enough, when combined with ey finding wholes in the zone and Thomas running deep routes (Campbell almost never looked his way), Warner would be FAR more productive than Campbell. I saw at least three or for passes each game, had the ball been thrown better they would have scored. I'm not saying Warner would make all of those those throws, but a lot more than Campbell.

Moss has been taken out of 50% of Redskin games because teams are locking him down. Randle El and Thomas havent showed me anything to think that with better QB play they would be that much better. You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success. The only reason Warner could do it in Arizona is because his WRs wither got open so quick he could find them or he chucked it up and one of them came down with it.

I honestly dont think any QB could of made plays in our offense the 2nd half of last year.

If a probowl offensine line could turn any QB into a Pro Bowler why is that when the Hogs were at there best the Skins didn't have pro Bowl QBs every years. If fact, whenever the Skins got above average QB play they went deep into the play offs.

All 5 Hogs were in the Pro Bowl in one season? Last time I checked it never happened. If you give me the 5 Pro Bowl lineman from the NFC last season with the Skins team they would be a top 5 offense. It would look like the Panther offense from last season when they were running all over people. Hell Portis would be a lock for 2000 yards.

[CanesSkins26]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

[PulpExposure]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

Can you please stop using Big Ben as your one example? Campbell is not Big Ben, and in any case, Big Ben is the aberration, not the rule.

[Kilmer72]

While I agree that Moss and ARE aren't Fitts or Bolden, but if Moss is healthy (and that is a big if) they would be more than enough, when combined with ey finding wholes in the zone and Thomas running deep routes (Campbell almost never looked his way), Warner would be FAR more productive than Campbell. I saw at least three or for passes each game, had the ball been thrown better they would have scored. I'm not saying Warner would make all of those those throws, but a lot more than Campbell.

Moss has been taken out of 50% of Redskin games because teams are locking him down. Randle El and Thomas havent showed me anything to think that with better QB play they would be that much better. You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success. The only reason Warner could do it in Arizona is because his WRs wither got open so quick he could find them or he chucked it up and one of them came down with it.

I honestly dont think any QB could of made plays in our offense the 2nd half of last year.

If a probowl offensine line could turn any QB into a Pro Bowler why is that when the Hogs were at there best the Skins didn't have pro Bowl QBs every years. If fact, whenever the Skins got above average QB play they went deep into the play offs.

All 5 Hogs were in the Pro Bowl in one season? Last time I checked it never happened. If you give me the 5 Pro Bowl lineman from the NFC last season with the Skins team they would be a top 5 offense. It would look like the Panther offense from last season when they were running all over people. Hell Portis would be a lock for 2000 yards.

Thank you SkinsSince96. I just got off the phone with a good friend from VA and he thinks that better play from JC would have gotten us to the super bowl. He did admit that we only had 1 receiver and lousy O line but it was still all JC fault lol.

[CanesSkins26]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

Can you please stop using Big Ben as your one example? Campbell is not Big Ben, and in any case, Big Ben is the aberration, not the rule.

There are other examples of qb's that played better than JC despite having struggling offensive lines.

Matt Cassell was sacked more than any other qb in the NFL (47 sacks) and still had a qb rating of 89 and threw 21 td's.

Aaron Rodgers was sacked 34 times and yet had the 6th best qb rating in the NFL and was 4th in the NFL in td's with 28.

[Kilmer72]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

Can you please stop using Big Ben as your one example? Campbell is not Big Ben, and in any case, Big Ben is the aberration, not the rule.

There are other examples of qb's that played better than JC despite having struggling offensive lines.

Matt Cassell was sacked more than any other qb in the NFL (47 sacks) and still had a qb rating of 89 and threw 21 td's.

Aaron Rodgers was sacked 34 times and yet had the 6th best qb rating in the NFL and was 4th in the NFL in td's with 28.

Did they have receivers? Did the Redskins?

[CanesSkins26]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

Can you please stop using Big Ben as your one example? Campbell is not Big Ben, and in any case, Big Ben is the aberration, not the rule.

There are other examples of qb's that played better than JC despite having struggling offensive lines.

Matt Cassell was sacked more than any other qb in the NFL (47 sacks) and still had a qb rating of 89 and threw 21 td's.

Aaron Rodgers was sacked 34 times and yet had the 6th best qb rating in the NFL and was 4th in the NFL in td's with 28.

Did they have receivers? Did the Redskins?

Our receivers aren't that bad. We also have one of the best tight ends in the NFL. JC had enough to work with, he just couldn't get the job done.

Like CLL has pointed out numerous times, if the receivers are so bad how come Collins did so well with them when he played in 2007?

[Kilmer72]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

Can you please stop using Big Ben as your one example? Campbell is not Big Ben, and in any case, Big Ben is the aberration, not the rule.

There are other examples of qb's that played better than JC despite having struggling offensive lines.

Matt Cassell was sacked more than any other qb in the NFL (47 sacks) and still had a qb rating of 89 and threw 21 td's.

Aaron Rodgers was sacked 34 times and yet had the 6th best qb rating in the NFL and was 4th in the NFL in td's with 28.

Did they have receivers? Did the Redskins?

Our receivers aren't that bad. We also have one of the best tight ends in the NFL. JC had enough to work with, he just couldn't get the job done.

Like CLL has pointed out numerous times, if the receivers are so bad how come Collins did so well with them when he played in 2007?

Because he had at least or around 10 years in the same system

[CanesSkins26]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

Can you please stop using Big Ben as your one example? Campbell is not Big Ben, and in any case, Big Ben is the aberration, not the rule.

There are other examples of qb's that played better than JC despite having struggling offensive lines.

Matt Cassell was sacked more than any other qb in the NFL (47 sacks) and still had a qb rating of 89 and threw 21 td's.

Aaron Rodgers was sacked 34 times and yet had the 6th best qb rating in the NFL and was 4th in the NFL in td's with 28.

Did they have receivers? Did the Redskins?

Our receivers aren't that bad. We also have one of the best tight ends in the NFL. JC had enough to work with, he just couldn't get the job done.

Like CLL has pointed out numerous times, if the receivers are so bad how come Collins did so well with them when he played in 2007?

Because he had at least or around 10 years in the same system

So the receivers weren't a problem for him then?

[Kilmer72]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

Can you please stop using Big Ben as your one example? Campbell is not Big Ben, and in any case, Big Ben is the aberration, not the rule.

There are other examples of qb's that played better than JC despite having struggling offensive lines.

Matt Cassell was sacked more than any other qb in the NFL (47 sacks) and still had a qb rating of 89 and threw 21 td's.

Aaron Rodgers was sacked 34 times and yet had the 6th best qb rating in the NFL and was 4th in the NFL in td's with 28.

Did they have receivers? Did the Redskins?

Our receivers aren't that bad. We also have one of the best tight ends in the NFL. JC had enough to work with, he just couldn't get the job done.

Like CLL has pointed out numerous times, if the receivers are so bad how come Collins did so well with them when he played in 2007?

Because he had at least or around 10 years in the same system

So the receivers weren't a problem for him then?

Did he have Thomas or Kelly? Were they in their second year in the same offense? Was the O line playing better? Did we have a running game in the second half of the season?

[Kilmer72]

You put any QB behind a subpar line and ask him to make throws odds are he wont have great success.

Last time I checked Big Ben won a Super Bowl with a subpar offensive line. He was sacked 54 times last season.

Can you please stop using Big Ben as your one example? Campbell is not Big Ben, and in any case, Big Ben is the aberration, not the rule.

There are other examples of qb's that played better than JC despite having struggling offensive lines.

Matt Cassell was sacked more than any other qb in the NFL (47 sacks) and still had a qb rating of 89 and threw 21 td's.

Aaron Rodgers was sacked 34 times and yet had the 6th best qb rating in the NFL and was 4th in the NFL in td's with 28.

Did they have receivers? Did the Redskins?

Our receivers aren't that bad. We also have one of the best tight ends in the NFL. JC had enough to work with, he just couldn't get the job done.

Like CLL has pointed out numerous times, if the receivers are so bad how come Collins did so well with them when he played in 2007?

Because he had at least or around 10 years in the same system

So the receivers weren't a problem for him then?

Did he have Thomas or Kelly? Were they in their second year in the same offense? Was the O line playing better? Did we have a running game in the second half of the season?

oops and yes the receivers were a problem imagine how much better our season would have been if we had better receivers. I understand where you are coming from CanesSkins26 but believe me qb is the least of our problems.