OFFENSIVE LINE OPINION ...

redskinz4ever · Post by **redskinz4ever** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:54 am

is it me or is our O-LINE not getting the job done ??? giving up sacks (brunell needs to make quicker reads)so thats not all the o-line fault .... but everyone seems to be riding PORTIS ...if the line is not blocking for him how in the hell can he be productive ??? every game he has improved on waiting for the block on the counter trey but if the line is not blowing the D-LINE off the ball what do you expect ???
would it be better if we ran some out of the "I" TO GIVE PORTIS A LEAD BLOCKER ???

a thought on BRUNELL ....can anyone tell me why he is not checking down to the third and forth guys out in the passing game ?? to me he seems locked on coles or gardner or the waterboy.

trey53 · Post by **trey53** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:07 am

I hate to say it but the offense just needs more time. There are major problems across the board. We can't run and we can't pass. The O-line is doing a decent job pass blocking but their run blocking is not good...hence Portis being dumped on his butt after three yards...if we are lucky. 3rd and 1 are battles our O-line should win...no excuse for their lack of production in short yardage.

I can't say how well the WRs are running their routes the last two games because I can't see them on tv. At the two games I saw live there were definitely good and bad routes. But dropping passes is bad.

Brunell has looked ok. He was doing fine for the first couple of games but has looked progressively worse since. I don't understand why he has happy feet since the line is actually giving him a decent amount of time to throw. He is checking down...unfortunately he's not hitting the WRs enough (ok...at all) deep to have anyone back off of the underneath or flat routes. Glad I'm not Gibbs right now...

35yrskinsfan · Post by **35yrskinsfan** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:20 am

Lets see if we can figure this out.

First down we have 6/7 guys blocking
Defense has 8/9 guys rushing.
Portis gets stuffed at the line because there is at least one more guy rushing than blocking.

Third and second down in passing situation.
6/7 guys blocking, 4/6 guys rushing.
equal number of blockers to rushers and Brunell has all day to look for an open receiver with 5/7 guys in coverage.

jaw32 · Post by **jaw32** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:05 pm

After doing a TIVO analysis, it seems that by always pulling left or right it is taking our OL out of there element and putting them into the Defenses element. What I mean is we are asking the OL to get up and move laterally against quicker and more agile defenders. The OL is just forming a giant floating ball of people. There are no holes, the Defense is just going with the flow. They ain't the Hogs!

Side note: Cool

ey is a great receiver.

hkHog · Post by **hkHog** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:11 pm

Our O-line is terrible. But then again, I don't think Gibbs protection schemes are that good. There are always blitzers running free in the backfield (ie Ed Reed). Most of the time it seems as though Portis is getting hit in the backfield before he can even get a block from the line. So we have a bad line and bad blocking schemes, Portis cannot get free, Brunell cannot stand in the pocket, the recievers cannot hang onto the ball, so basically our offense is not very good. I think that it all starts with the O-line and once they get better (if they can get better) the offense will start clicking more.

Now here's what I want to see. I want to see the gunslinger Brunell. I want to see Gibbs calling more plays where he will roll out of the pocket and try to make plays with his feet and his arm and not sit in the pocket where he is clearly uncomfortable because it implodes half of the time. In the Dallas game Brunell did this and had good results. That is the way he plays. He may not be as fast as he once was, but he can still move around. If Brunell moves around, it will make Portis and Cool

ey more dangerous targets as LBs may be forced to follow him. Coles and Gardner will have more time to run their routes as well. Most important though, if the QB starts running around a bit, that may stretch the D a little as they can't just stack the line and try collapsing the pocket, and this could free up Portis (the bootlegs to Cool

ey we ran on the first possesion of the Giants game were very successful, the entire D bit on this and tried to stuff Portis). Now, Brunell may be limited because of his hammies, but if he can move, this is a weapon that must be used. We have been successful when he is outside the pocket on bootlegs (it seems like the opposing D bite on this every time as they're just trying to smash Portis), QB sneaks (when Portis throws some punishing blocks), and some of the nice plays he made against Dallas. That's his game, he isn't going to beat anyone from the pocket but he can if he starts moving around.

35yrskinsfan · Post by **35yrskinsfan** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:12 pm

That agrees with the stats.
When we ran to the outside (outside the tackles) we gained an average of less than 1 yd per carry.

When we ran inside the tackles it was closer to 4 yards.
Inside the guards was between 1 and 2 yds.

On TVO during the runs up the middle, was our line pushing the 'D' off the ball or were they penetrating?

VRIEL1 · Post by **VRIEL1** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:45 pm

It starts and ends with two things...no long threat and 8-9 men in the box. If you can't throw long to stretch the defense then teams will put a safety out their and pull everyone up to the line. Play man on man and were screwed! We need someone who can get the ball out of his hands within 7 sec. watch the tapes and count how many times Brunell goes beyond 7 sec. We need a sharp crisp passer who can get the ball beyond 10 yards to a receiver and not throw it to the water boy or the dirt. The long pass will open up the Defense and push them back 5 yrs giving Portis a place to run. No passing game no running game. Remember last year. No running game no passing game. We won some of the plays because of our track team mentality. Gardner should only be used on 3rd downs as well as Thrash. We should be using Jacobs and Mcants for their speed to open up the defense. Those two with Coles would be a defensive killer.

jaw32 · Post by **jaw32** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:53 pm

35yrskinsfan - It was a mix, some penatration, but for the most part the plays are slow developing giving time for the LBs and safties to move in, flow with the pulling OL and it just is a large mess of bodies.

There were a few obvious missed blocks, and linemen looking clumsy, but I just don't think they are powerful and nimble enough for the counter stuff. When the pulling lineman turn upfield they need to be able to blast through. That is not happening. It's not that they are that bad, I think it just takes a special group to pull it off.

Also, it was so obvious when we were running, 3 guys were pulling or running horizontally. In the play action passes, they weren't pulling, so it was real obvious to tell run from pass, especially in slow motion

After watching Chris Brown torch the Packers with simple seal blocking, it made me wonder if the Skins should reconsider.

chicosbailbond · Post by **chicosbailbond** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:33 pm

brunell is locked in on just coles and gardner... b/c that is all there is out there...

gibbs max protects so there are only two receivers out on routes...

redskinz4ever · Post by **redskinz4ever** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:57 am

chicosbailbond wrote:brunell is locked in on just coles and gardner... b/c that is all there is out there...

gibbs max protects so there are only two receivers out on routes...

not always gibbs runs alot of three wide reciever sets with a back out of the back field ....all i'm saying is check down to your drop off guy or to thrash or jacobs. :wink:

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:18 am

redskinz4ever - I think the point you are trying to make has some merit in that the offensive personell just need to do their collective job better and the QB needs to make the progressions and get to the 3rd option if the first 2 are not there. Too many times it seems the ball is being thrown away too soon. Now I don't want him holding on to it either but he seems to be a little nervous making his reads.

Now I also want to say that IMO this needs to be resolved by the coaches with who they have on the field and I think they know who is going to be giving them the best chance to win. If they think that players (who they know better than we do) are the right choice for their game plan then those are the players that are getting the playing time.

redskincity · Post by **redskincity** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:28 am

I think its time for some zone blocking. Teams that are using smashmouth style of football all have losing records.

redskinz4ever · Post by **redskinz4ever** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:30 am

SkinsJock wrote: (who they know better than we do)

i hope they do .... they are the coaches and we are the fans :wink:

time will tell and i'll be right here cheering !!!! :wink:

redskinz4ever · Post by **redskinz4ever** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:32 am

redskincity wrote:I think its time for some zone blocking.

DeathByLinebacker#56 · Wed Oct 13, 2004 10:02 am

Boy do they miss jansen. It's sore spot on the right side.