markshark84 wrote:- Hilton is a slot (not #2), playing #1 --- big problem.
markshark84 wrote:mastdark81 wrote:
Honestly the Colts have enough talent on their offense. Duane Allen is a stud and Coby Fleener is serviceable (better than Paulsen/Paul). TY Hilton is a legit #2 (ask Legion of Boom). Moncrief and Dorsett are better than our role receivers (Crowder, Grant). The Colts problem lies with their philosophy. The Colts want to pass the ball a million times to make their superstar qb numbers look great and put fans in the stand. Their offensive line is bottom half of the league for sure but they would be much better if the Colts could run the ball more often. Defenses bring the heat because they know they are passing 65% of the time. Andrew Luck lastly isn't the perfect qb everyone thinks. The same things that all of our qb's are bashed for mechanic wise...drop backs/ release time/ taking un-needed hits/ turning the ball over he does as well. The difference is he makes a lot more plays than our qb's because he has had the green light to throw whatever without a lot of criticism.
Back on topic. It is just like the media to try to stir controversy when the Redskins win a game or we have some light of hope. Happens everytime.
Well, I disagree with your talent assessment.
- Allen is not a "stud" -- not even CLOSE. The guy had 29 --- YES 29 --- receptions last year. So these days a TE who is 27th in the league in receptions is now a "stud"..... His best year was 2012 when he had 50 receptions.....I can name 15-20 better TEs (and Flener is one of them).
- Flener is serviceable but not talented -- big difference.
- Hilton is a slot (not #2), playing #1 --- big problem.
- Role receivers (outside of #1, 2 and slot) shouldn't even be considered. Sort of grasping at straws even bringing these guys into the conversation.
Their real issue is that they do NOT have a #1 WR OR a RB. That is a HUGE deal. Without a real #1 WR threat, it shortens the field. Without an RB and a BAD OL, it exacerbates things even further.
As far as the bold ---- so you think they should run the ball with a bad RB and OL and a stacked DEF more often???? Sooooo, how do you think that would work out.......
Luck is literally the only shread of talent their offense has. While I don't consider him a top 5 QB, he is in the top 10 (and close to top 5). As far as his mechanics --- first off, only 1 of our QBs has mechanics issues and that is RGIII. Cousins has solid mechanics and make lighting fast reads. I don't care about McCoy. That being said, Luck's mechanics are NOWHERE near similar to RGIIIs.....
And sorry man, this isn't some conspiracy theory to sell tickets. Their HC knows that they have no run game and poor OL. It's not a big secret. Every team in the league laces up to WIN --- because that is what puts fans in the chairs.
mastdark81 wrote:
Duane Allen has been as healthy as Jordan Reed the last few years that's why his numbers are low. He's a stud TE when playing. Is he an all pro? No...capable of being a pro bowler? YES. Fleener only seen time because Allen was injured, Fleener was the backup who made plays when asked of.. I mentioned the other WRS because they are apart of the offense. I'm just comparing our teams. Their talent is good enough to win. Running backs are good enough to be middle of the pack of the league.
Reggie Wayne was arguably the best WR in NFL a few years 2012 ago under Luck's watch...what they do then? In fact most NFL teams that are consistent winners do not have #1 WRs or close (Seattle, New England, Ravens,). Saying their offensive line is bad is part of the problem for sure. But they don't want to run the ball trust me!! If they did they would. Now yeah they may not be a great running team but no offensive lineman want to run backward all day. Their philosophy needs to change just like ours did this year. We made it a point mentally and physically in practice to shore up our running game because we knew the QBS that we have (all of them) aren't capable of winning games by themselves.
You must don't actually watch the Colts games. I do. Having happy feet and not having a solid base when throwing, rushing your throws.... Luck does this consistently but what makes him a good QB is he typically will make MORE plays than mistakes. That's the key! No QB is perfect.
I know you want to believe that Kirk Cousins have the perfect mechanics of a QB but he doesn't. Throwing the ball quickly is great when your guy is open but not when your DB on the other side anticipates your timing. A good defense calls that "rushing" your throw. Kirk has a tendency to be off balance when his first read is not open and the defense gets him off his plant spot. He has improved on it since his rookie year but trust me there are a lot of qbs that get rid of the ball quick (Fitzpatrick, Rex Grossman, Jay Cutler). Only the great ones know how to change their typical cadence and timing, only a few know how to keep you guessing and throw to a variety of WRS and make enough plays to WIN GAMES.
Luck will be fine once they put more resources to their olines/dlines/youth and change their mentality.
SkinsJock wrote:this all sounds very relevant to me - but what do I know
maybe we should check with DEHog .. he's on top of everything here
we have a number of supposed fans here that think they're knowledgeable about the game when they're obviously not
markshark84 wrote:mastdark81 wrote:
Duane Allen has been as healthy as Jordan Reed the last few years that's why his numbers are low. He's a stud TE when playing. Is he an all pro? No...capable of being a pro bowler? YES. Fleener only seen time because Allen was injured, Fleener was the backup who made plays when asked of.. I mentioned the other WRS because they are apart of the offense. I'm just comparing our teams. Their talent is good enough to win. Running backs are good enough to be middle of the pack of the league.
Reggie Wayne was arguably the best WR in NFL a few years 2012 ago under Luck's watch...what they do then? In fact most NFL teams that are consistent winners do not have #1 WRs or close (Seattle, New England, Ravens,). Saying their offensive line is bad is part of the problem for sure. But they don't want to run the ball trust me!! If they did they would. Now yeah they may not be a great running team but no offensive lineman want to run backward all day. Their philosophy needs to change just like ours did this year. We made it a point mentally and physically in practice to shore up our running game because we knew the QBS that we have (all of them) aren't capable of winning games by themselves.
You must don't actually watch the Colts games. I do. Having happy feet and not having a solid base when throwing, rushing your throws.... Luck does this consistently but what makes him a good QB is he typically will make MORE plays than mistakes. That's the key! No QB is perfect.
I know you want to believe that Kirk Cousins have the perfect mechanics of a QB but he doesn't. Throwing the ball quickly is great when your guy is open but not when your DB on the other side anticipates your timing. A good defense calls that "rushing" your throw. Kirk has a tendency to be off balance when his first read is not open and the defense gets him off his plant spot. He has improved on it since his rookie year but trust me there are a lot of qbs that get rid of the ball quick (Fitzpatrick, Rex Grossman, Jay Cutler). Only the great ones know how to change their typical cadence and timing, only a few know how to keep you guessing and throw to a variety of WRS and make enough plays to WIN GAMES.
Luck will be fine once they put more resources to their olines/dlines/youth and change their mentality.
First off --- I totally hear what you are saying. Here are my comments.
Duane Allen -- injuries have to be taken into account as part of the package. Reed is a great TE, but I'd rather have someone with a little less talent but can stay on the field. I just thought "stud" was a total exaggeration to put it mildly.
Comparing teams: Our team has FAR more talent on it. It's not even close. INDY's RBs are not middle of the pack; they are bottom 5.
#1s -- I recall hearing that stat and totally agree, but I think that has to do with having around the board talent. Luck has none. Every single player is below average at their position/role. For example, Hilton is an above average WR, but a below average #1 WR. Also, all those teams had defenses just as good as their offenses (yes, even NE). INDY's is below average. That being said --- I am not saying Luck is Tom Brady. Brady is arguably the best QB in the history of the game. That said, 2012 was Luck's rookie year.
INDY's desire to run: Agree. They don't want to run BECAUSE they don't have the personnel to. It isn't because they want to pad Luck's #s. That is ridiculous. It's not "if they did, they would" --- more like "if they COULD, they would".
Watching games --- I don't watch many Colts games. I'd say I've watched around 10-15 of Luck's pro games. At least enough to gadge his fundamentals. Trust me, I don't think they are flawless. In fact, if I were his coach, I would be all over him to improve his footwork. He makes good progressions, though.
Cousins --- I don't think he has "perfect" mechanics --- because I didn't say that!!!! Solid and perfect are very different. I agree with much of what you say otherwise. One of Cousins biggest issues is his ability to "make" a play resulting from a broken play --- which is what makes him a "game manager" IMHO. These are the situations were he throws INTs and otherwise makes his errors. Cousins thrives off structure. Which is why I agree that he has issues in situations where he drops back, plants, sees no one, then moves up in the pocket and plants, and no one is open. He is okay if he plants and makes a throw or when he plants, moves up subsequently plants and then throws. It is the 3rd progression in his drop back that hurts him. Also, the best QBs in the league get the ball out quick, not just the 3 bums you named. In fact, 2 of the 3 (Grossman and Cutler) actually do NOT make quick reads...... Brady and Manning are the two best at it.
SkinsJock wrote:I'm convinced there's no rift
Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:SkinsJock wrote:I'm convinced there's no rift
There is so a rift because the media says so, and they have sources!
