Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by Kilmer72 »

SkinsJock wrote:
StorminMormon86 wrote:I just would like to see some legitimate competition for the starter next year if Cousins performs well in these next three games.


Both QBs will be given every opportunity and assistance to be better QBs this off season but Kirk Cousins is not going to be able to look like he's the better QB


It is always about the other QB for some people. I can't blame them. They get excited. It was the same thing with Grossman and Beck. It was people calling for Beck and got what the wished for. As bad as things were for Grossman he was way better. Next year people will see Robert more like his old self. The minute he has a bad game though they will be calling for Cousins. The minute Cousins has a bad game then the same people wont be calling for Robert. They will dismiss his rookie season as being lucky to be as accurate as he was.
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by OldSchool »

Barring an injury or a coaching change before the end of the season everyone is going to see Cousins play three games in a row and I will not be surprised if he plays well and the Skins win a couple of games. If Cousins lights it up and another team is willing to swap a 1st or 2nd round pick for him than I think they should trade Cousins if they are still convinced Griffin is an NFL starter.

I don't like Griffin's chances of improving enough in the pocket to be a quality starter. I've see so many of these option quarterbacks fail to transition to the NFL game because they can't read, process and release quick enough to be really effective. The ability to read, process and release quickly is what separates pocket passers from all the other guys with strong accurate arms. But if they think Griffin can get over that hurdle and another team is willing to swap a high pick for Cousins than they should make the trade to draft a player who can help Griffin on the line or the receiving corps because a team with as many needs as the Redskins shouldn't forgo an opportunity for a high pick to retain a backup quarterback. Conversely, they could trade Griffin is Cousins can play better.
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by SkinsJock »

SkinsJock wrote:
StorminMormon86 wrote:I just would like to see some legitimate competition for the starter next year if Cousins performs well in these next three games.
Both QBs will be given every opportunity and assistance to be better QBs this off season

I really would like Kirk Cousins to play well - he's our back up QB and the real game experience will be good for him and the coaches

what some forget is that Mike (& the FO) saw that he was available and felt they could not pass on a QB they felt might be good to have

Kirk Cousins was not drafted for any ulterior motives - he was worth the pick IS ALL and he's shown that was a very good pick

now he's here and Robert has been benched - this is an opportunity for Kirk to get some good experience - this is NOT an opportunity to maybe be the starter
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by Kilmer72 »

RayNAustin wrote:You know, it's fine to say Robert is going to learn and get better. That should be an expexted given with any young QB. But, what CC is saying here is as disturbing as it is remarkably candid, as you cannot ignore the fact that we traded so much to get him, while Cousins is by CC'S assessment much further along, when he was a 4th round pick.

Does anyone read CC's critique of RG3 as anything other than damning? Now, my take is that while Chris is obviously far better qualified to make such judgments than the average fan like us, some of these things that look true this year were absolutely not true last year. Particularly the accuracy problems. Last year RG3 seemed to be very accurate, so there must be an explanation for this dramatic decline, and accuracy issues are generally caused by poor mechanics (in players that have previously proven to be accurate).

So what is the root cause of the poor mechanics? Is it th knee or the brace? They insist that the knee is fine. You can't blame missing camp and preseason as a valid excuse in week 14, with 13 games under his belt. So that leaves only two possibilities ... RG3 is not responding well to his coaching ... or he's not being coached very well. We better hope it's the latter.



Ray, I think it is more of a case that Robert is more of a project. The reason why people went out on a limb for him was because he has so much upside and is a smarter,and way better athlete. If I have a really good QB already in place, then no way I play him (Robert). We had nothing and no way of getting anyone other than trading up and trying to get someone. He is coming back from repaired knees.

Yes, I read CC critiques as being spot on. He hangs up on people blasting Robert. He says "I wont take that" I listen to it live on my way home from work."

The root cause IMO is Shanahan taking on too much responsibilities. If he was the just HC, then I think we are way better. He has done good things as both the head coach and personnel guy. He has also screwed up many things as personnel and HC. For example, if he is straightening out our FO, or having to deal with the Washington press, or having to deal with a bad hand given, or having to deal with an owner that makes his presence known, or a young QB that is acting his age, I think I can understand just how difficult that can be.

I wont forgive Shanahan for the leak or atleast not putting a stop to it. Joe Gibbs never would have let this manifest.

IMO he is just a good coach in his day.
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by RayNAustin »

Hey, I think some of you guys are misunderstanding my points ... I don't think it's possible to say at this point, whether the price paid for Robert was too high, and certainly there is no justification for considering him an error. Furthermore, I won't even entertain the notion that Captain Kirk is a better option. I like Cousins, and I think he could be an effective starter, but he doesn't have the raw talent that RG3 possesses.

My opinion is, RG3 has suffered two setbacks .. the injury being one, and the way he was used last year being the other. He wasn't groomed and developed as a drop back passer last year, but instead, Kyle incorporated a more familiar college style read option for which Robert excelled, but left him injured, which was the big fear voiced by many (including myself) when drafting a running QB.

So this year, he's slowed by the injury, and nobody will convince me he's 100% ... if he is fully healed, then he sufferef permanent damage, because he has nothing close to the speed and mobility-elusiveness of last year. So, combine that with a big change in moving to a drop back style for which he has little familiarity, and problems with throwing mechanics, and you have what we have ..... a young QB struggling to make the transition this year which should have begun last year. In effect, he's a first year rookie hampered by a serious injury that he hasn't fully recovered from.
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by emoses14 »

Chris Cooley ✔@thecooleyzone
The Redskins offense and @RGIII looked solid today at practice. Rob had great presence and accuracy and he took control of the day.#redskins
I know he got a pretty good zip on the ball. He has a quick release. . . once I seen a coupla' throws, I was just like 'Yeah, he's that dude.'"

-Santana Moss on Our QB
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by cowboykillerzRGiii »

have we no training camp thread?? When do the joint practices start?? wheres my daily updates and highlights?? Whos slacking???

we need to get this sorted out people!!
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by redskinz4ever »

i don't trust either one right now with future of the QB position in washington ..... rg3 is 16 games away from being done in dc ..... kirk has shown that he can't stop throwing INTs .... i think just my opinion our qb of the future is yet to be picked by our new front office people that know football.
TOUCHDOWN .....WASHINGTON REDSKINS !!!!
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by SkinsJock »

the coaches now have some game tape to go with what they've seen on the practice field

there are still questions about Griffin's ability and his showing last night was (apparently) not good but not bad either

I can understand that some might be wondering why Cousins is not given more of an opportunity to take over and I would have no problem with that but I think these guys are not looking at who might be the best QB right now but who might be the better QB in 2016 and beyond

I'm still not convinced that Cousins offers more upside than Griffin but guys like Cavanaugh, Callahan and Gruden have a far better handle on that than we do and Gruden's future might depend on how well he handles the QB situation here

we do not need these guys to give Griffin more time on the field to get injured - if they think he can be coached up but is not quite there yet, then let Cousins play and let's see what he can do while we continue to help Griffin become a good NFL QB

surely these guys must have some idea by now if Griffin is worth working with
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by StorminMormon86 »

SkinsJock wrote:I can understand that some might be wondering why Cousins is not given more of an opportunity to take over and I would have no problem with that but I think these guys are not looking at who might be the best QB right now but who might be the better QB in 2016 and beyond

That's all well and good, and if this were 2012, I'd agree with you. But this is 2015. There might not be a 2016 for any of these QB's on the roster.
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Re: Cooley on RG3 and Cousins

Post by SkinsJock »

StorminMormon86 wrote:
SkinsJock wrote: ... these guys are not looking at who might be the best QB right now but who might be the better QB in 2016 and beyond
... this is 2015. There might not be a 2016 for any of these QB's on the roster.


true dat - fact is just about everyone here from the HC down is really just a part of a rebuilding process that is going to take at least 2 seasons
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
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