SkinsJock wrote:there's a better chance of Mariotta making it to #5 than Williams or Winston, so that means he only needs to fall 2 more spots ...
IF a franchise wants him, that's going to help but if not ... he's got to be some place on Scot's top 5 BPA
now that would be pretty amazing .....
Mariotta is NOT NFL ready, therefore, is not in anyone's top 5 list without being weighted for quarterback need. I doubt Scott's board gives any extra weight to quarterbacks (for this year), so I see no scenario that puts Mariotta in B&G. Too many players better than him.
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
yupchagee wrote:If he doesn't fit Gruden's system, he's not in the top 5.
I think it's more of a question of whether or not he fits in Scot's system.
Unless Scpt has specific plans to get rid of Jay, then Scots system and Jays system are the same thing. Our GM and coaches are on the same page, which is why this whole thing may have a chance of actually working.
SkinsJock wrote:there's a better chance of Mariotta making it to #5 than Williams or Winston, so that means he only needs to fall 2 more spots ...
IF a franchise wants him, that's going to help but if not ... he's got to be some place on Scot's top 5 BPA
now that would be pretty amazing .....
Mariotta is NOT NFL ready, therefore, is not in anyone's top 5 list without being weighted for quarterback need. I doubt Scott's board gives any extra weight to quarterbacks (for this year), so I see no scenario that puts Mariotta in B&G. Too many players better than him.
you're right about that - reality is that Mariotta is not very high on most franchise wish lists ...
If he does fall to 5 though, it only takes 1 to want to get him before he goes to the jets ... hell, even the Jets could decide to move up
you also bring up an interesting point in that it's Scot's board that is important here and we don't know if Gruden is going to be the HC, so Scot is going to bring in the players he thinks are going to be good NFL players over players that Gruden might think he needs
I'd like to think that Gruden is going to show that last season was an aberration but we don't know how Scot feels about that
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
yupchagee wrote:If he doesn't fit Gruden's system, he's not in the top 5.
I think it's more of a question of whether or not he fits in Scot's system.
Unless Scpt has specific plans to get rid of Jay, then Scots system and Jays system are the same thing. Our GM and coaches are on the same page, which is why this whole thing may have a chance of actually working.
Not necessarily. It's Scot's job to get players, it's Jay's job to decide who plays. Jay may not be here in two years, but the players Scot brings in will.
Andre Carter wrote:Damn man, you know your football.
SkinsJock wrote:there's a better chance of Mariotta making it to #5 than Williams or Winston, so that means he only needs to fall 2 more spots ...
IF a franchise wants him, that's going to help but if not ... he's got to be some place on Scot's top 5 BPA
now that would be pretty amazing .....
Mariotta is NOT NFL ready, therefore, is not in anyone's top 5 list without being weighted for quarterback need. I doubt Scott's board gives any extra weight to quarterbacks (for this year), so I see no scenario that puts Mariotta in B&G. Too many players better than him.
you're right about that - reality is that Mariotta is not very high on most franchise wish lists ...
If he does fall to 5 though, it only takes 1 to want to get him before he goes to the jets ... hell, even the Jets could decide to move up
you also bring up an interesting point in that it's Scot's board that is important here and we don't know if Gruden is going to be the HC, so Scot is going to bring in the players he thinks are going to be good NFL players over players that Gruden might think he needs
I'd like to think that Gruden is going to show that last season was an aberration but we don't know how Scot feels about that
the strategy, I'm sure, includes convincing the Jets that we would take Mariotta at 5, should he be there, for the very reason you cite. If they want him, they would then be disposed to, possibly, pay too much.
Scot is clearly stocking football players... That is, players who will fit in almost any system... And who give the head coach the tools he needs to prove himself. They are also players who will provide the next head coach the same, should that be necessary.
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
^^ I agree with that - obviously Jay Gruden has some input but, your right - Scot's job is to bring in players that will be good players for whomever the HC is
it would be neat for Mariotta to fall to the 5 spot only because he's a QB and could make a team be forced to consider trading up for because most would anticipate that the Jets will take him
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
seems the Browns are getting antsy ... they have been talking with the Redskins recently
but - there's also this ...
It's also possible that the Browns could get involved in a three-way deal that ends with Mariota in Philadelphia, Sam Bradford in Cleveland -- and the Titans landing two first-round picks (12th and 20th), a deal outlined by CBSSports.com colleague Will Brinson in his most recent mock draft.
Scot is stating that the redskins are hoping to end up with 10 picks instead of 7
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
SkinsJock wrote:seems the Browns are getting antsy ... they have been talking with the Redskins recently
but - there's also this ...
It's also possible that the Browns could get involved in a three-way deal that ends with Mariota in Philadelphia, Sam Bradford in Cleveland -- and the Titans landing two first-round picks (12th and 20th), a deal outlined by CBSSports.com colleague Will Brinson in his most recent mock draft.
Scot is stating that the redskins are hoping to end up with 10 picks instead of 7
I hope so too.
Skins fan since '55
"The constitution is not a suicide pact"- Abraham Lincoln
SkinsJock wrote:seems the Browns are getting antsy ... they have been talking with the Redskins recently
but - there's also this ...
It's also possible that the Browns could get involved in a three-way deal that ends with Mariota in Philadelphia, Sam Bradford in Cleveland -- and the Titans landing two first-round picks (12th and 20th), a deal outlined by CBSSports.com colleague Will Brinson in his most recent mock draft.
Scot is stating that the redskins are hoping to end up with 10 picks instead of 7
That's entirely do-able. I'd be really happy though if two of those extra picks are in the top four rounds!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax "We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
If we trade down I wouldn't go past #10. For what we need there simply no one going to be there past that worth value in my opinion. What I'm saying is if the guy can't be a day 1 playmaking starter then I'm not trading down.
You can get a good starting rb, te, ilb and probably can get Landon Collins (not high on him) but that is about it.
mastdark81 wrote:If we trade down I wouldn't go past #10. For what we need there simply no one going to be there past that worth value in my opinion. What I'm saying is if the guy can't be a day 1 playmaking starter then I'm not trading down.
That's crazy talk man! Not saying this is how it plays out exactly, but look at Peter King's mock today:
11. Trae Waynes 12. Danny Shelton 13. Kevin White 14. Todd Gurley 15. Devante Parker
Those are all day 1 starters. Landon Collins is probably somewhere in that 15 - 25 range.
I agree though trading back from #5 you have to get real value for the pick. I want to see the Browns pony up #12 and #19!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax "We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
I love Shelton and Flowers. They are big, bad men. I smell no character issues. A trade with Cleveland could land us both.
Shelton was the talk of the Senior Bowl with his combination of power, size and burst. He was a load and nearly impossible to single-block. In the pass-rushing one-on-ones and in run defense, Shelton had his way with blockers. He was one of the nation's sack leaders at defensive tackle in 2014 with nine. Shelton totaled 87 tackles and 16.5 tackles for a loss, too. The 6-foot-1, 339-pounder is a big, disruptive tackle who has a surprising burst.
Flowers has an excellent combination of size, strength, quickness and athleticism. The 6-foot-6, 329-pounder didn't get a lot of publicity at Miami, but has become something of a hot prospect. Flowers played extremely well in 2014. After missing a few games because of a torn meniscus, he came back in impressive fashion against Florida State. Flowers also had an impressive game against Nebraska taking on Randy Gregory. For the year, Flowers was a very consistent run-blocker for Duke Johnson and pass-protector. Flowers is shockingly quick and agile for such a big and strong blocker who can bully defensive linemen.
There are also reports that the Saints may be willing to spend a lot to move up. Create a Green Bay like situation having a good QB sitting the bench a couple years while a future hall of famer finishes out his last productive years on the team.
Wouldnt be a bad idea for them... imagine a player like Mariota studying under brees for 2-3 before playing.
Prowl33 wrote:There are also reports that the Saints may be willing to spend a lot to move up. Create a Green Bay like situation having a good QB sitting the bench a couple years while a future hall of famer finishes out his last productive years on the team.
Wouldnt be a bad idea for them... imagine a player like Mariota studying under brees for 2-3 before playing.
Mariota has to first be available at 5... I'll look for your source
OldSchool wrote:The Skins have lots of holes in the line up so I hope they trade down and get multiple picks.
I would love to see our first round pick become three second round picks. No more "studs" -- just three solid, above average starters. But I dream . . .
mastdark81 wrote:If we trade down I wouldn't go past #10. For what we need there simply no one going to be there past that worth value in my opinion. What I'm saying is if the guy can't be a day 1 playmaking starter then I'm not trading down.
That's crazy talk man! Not saying this is how it plays out exactly, but look at Peter King's mock today:
11. Trae Waynes 12. Danny Shelton 13. Kevin White 14. Todd Gurley 15. Devante Parker
Those are all day 1 starters. Landon Collins is probably somewhere in that 15 - 25 range.
I agree though trading back from #5 you have to get real value for the pick. I want to see the Browns pony up #12 and #19!
I was saying FOR WHAT WE NEED there are no day 1 starters if you move down (on paper-wise). I highly doubt they feel we need a RB, WR, and a pressing need for a NT. From what I can tell from positions we could use (og,ot, olb, fs) there is no one really elite at those positions if we trade down that is a day 1 starter out of the top 10. Every scout says Collins have coverage deficiencies So I wouldn't mess with him unless he drop waaaay down.
My logic is I will take 1 probowler/allpro level talent over two "average" players anyday. That is all I'm saying. Now if we can get Vic Beasley at #12 and a OT at 19 then cool but I don't think Beasley is going to go past the #10 slot.
It is a poor draft folks. The draft to get multiple picks was last year. A good portion of the guys entering last year should have been in this years draft, so the well is dry. Even the QBs are not rated high as passers individually as in past drafts. Bridgewater would have went #1 this year. But back on topic, keep the pick and get the best available player.
mastdark81 wrote:I was saying FOR WHAT WE NEED there are no day 1 starters if you move down (on paper-wise). I highly doubt they feel we need a RB, WR, and a pressing need for a NT. From what I can tell from positions we could use (og,ot, olb, fs) there is no one really elite at those positions if we trade down that is a day 1 starter out of the top 10. Every scout says Collins have coverage deficiencies So I wouldn't mess with him unless he drop waaaay down.
Gotcha. Well if we're talking day 1 starters at a position of need, I'm sure we could get one of the top OTs, La'el Collins, Andrus Peat, Ereck Flowers in that 10-15 range.
I'm with you on Landon Collins btw.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax "We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
the closer it gets the more interesting it becomes ...
Browns are now reportedly offering the Titans both of their first round picks
BOTH the Browns and the Titans say this is NOT true
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
SkinsJock wrote:the closer it gets the more interesting it becomes ...
Browns are now reportedly offering the Titans both of their first round picks
BOTH the Browns and the Titans say this is NOT true
True or not, you can be sure the Titans leaked that to drive up the potential trade value!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax "We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
SkinsJock wrote:the closer it gets the more interesting it becomes ...
Browns are now reportedly offering the Titans both of their first round picks
BOTH the Browns and the Titans say this is NOT true
True or not, you can be sure the Titans leaked that to drive up the potential trade value!
I love the games that are played at this time of year!
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
SkinsJock wrote:the closer it gets the more interesting it becomes ... Browns are reportedly offering the Titans both of their first round picks BOTH the Browns and the Titans say this is NOT true
True or not, you can be sure the Titans leaked that to drive up the potential trade value!
I love the games that are played at this time of year!
and the real value to a franchise is mostly from the players that are drafted later
Scot has a plan - I hope the guys he inherited (talent evaluators and scouts) step up for him here in a big way
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
So I wouldn't mess with him unless he drop waaaay down.