Who Would You Start @ QB?

[EA7649]

Well Robert is the scheduled starter vs Philly
http://www.csnwashington.com/redskinsbl ... iants-game

[EA7649]

Heard on the radio McCoy might go on the IR

[markshark84]

Yeah, I see no reason to start anyone other than RGIII. He's 0-5 in games he's played the majority of snaps this year, thrown 3 TDs, and a 25 QBR..... Honestly, the guy played better with the bum leg last season.....

I didn't watch the NYG game, but it appeared he played a little better based on stats --- although his QBR was still an embarassing 21. IMHO, he can only go up from here. This season is in the trash, so you might as well. And if Gruden really thinks he stinks, he can use his upcoming play as ammo to toss/replace/demote him next season.

[welch]

RG3 is your best QB, and it's not really even that close. QBs generally perform much better and more efficiently when they have the confidence and support of the coaching staff. Gruden does not like RG3, he has a man crush on Colt McCoy. Unless Gruden changes his tune and stops being an idiot, RG3 will have to find his way without the support of the coaching staff.

I agree.

McCoy should not have been dressed for the Giants' game. A neck injury is bad...not a minor "ouch" that heals in a few days.

Does the team know enough to decide who plays QB next season? Cousins has not been impressive. Let Gruden coach, let Griffin play, and evaluate them both in January. Griffin is is due $15 million next season, and the Redskins must decide, by about April, whether to keep Griffin and pay the money.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

Rgiii was playing very well, 6/6 75 yards and a td then drove down and scored by all accounts w his legs.. no need to argue. Most other teams and thats six points. Its who we are..

Then Gruden stops going to the well, aborts the roll outs and lets JPP and co tee off on our patch work oline. Idk what was worse the grotesque play calling w over 2 mins (giving up) or the second half five step drop backs that were called when we didnt even have the protection to convert a three step. We can "change" robert in the off-season, and build an oline to be effective, or play Cousins. . But why would you stop calling what suites the garbage line and mobile qb best??

[Kilmer72]

Hire Rex Grossman. He will throw less picks than Cousins and he can take a beating behind that line and not be fazed.

[StorminMormon86]

Griffin did play better against the Giants...but still could only muster 10 (or if you think we got screwed 17) points. He just completely fell apart in the 2nd half. The bootlegs and roll outs can only take you so far, and it was smart for Gruden to employ them early...but it's not always going to work, which is why Gruden got away from that in the 2nd half and you saw just how unprepared Griffin was to play in that system. He was still missing wide open receivers, and still was holding the ball too long.

[riggofan]

Rgiii was playing very well, 6/6 75 yards and a td then drove down and scored by all accounts w his legs.. no need to argue. Most other teams and thats six points. Its who we are..

Then Gruden stops going to the well, aborts the roll outs and lets JPP and co tee off on our patch work oline. Idk what was worse the grotesque play calling w over 2 mins (giving up) or the second half five step drop backs that were called when we didnt even have the protection to convert a three step. We can "change" robert in the off-season, and build an oline to be effective, or play Cousins. . But why would you stop calling what suites the garbage line and mobile qb best??

Because the Giants adjusted to that. Seriously, Tom Coughlin has been around forever. You don't think he saw what the Skins were doing well with the roll outs and made his own adjustments to take that away? He played the defensive ends wider and took away the roll outs.

[riggofan]

Griffin did play better against the Giants...but still could only muster 10 (or if you think we got screwed 17) points. He just completely fell apart in the 2nd half. The bootlegs and roll outs can only take you so far, and it was smart for Gruden to employ them early...but it's not always going to work, which is why Gruden got away from that in the 2nd half and you saw just how unprepared Griffin was to play in that system. He was still missing wide open receivers, and still was holding the ball too long.

Exactly, man. I can't believe people are acting like Gruden just completely stopped doing what was working like he's a total idiot.

Gruden believes and he has been basically telling us all year that the QB has to be able to pass from the pocket to win in this league. We all know that is true, so why are so many people crying that he isn't trying to employ some gimmicky offense tailored for this scrambling QB that we know is eventually going to get the QB hurt?

People on this forum were saying all last year that RGIII's weakness is passing from the pocket. They've been saying he needs to learn and develop into a pocket passer. Well, that's what he's doing right now for better or worse. Why beat up Jay Gruden about it? He's doing exactly what you asked for.

I was kind of laughing listening to the radio where they were giving RGIII a B- or whatever for his performance on Sunday. Look, I was as happy as anyone to see him come out in the first half and play with confidence. But the team punted on five of six drives in the second half. I can't imagine what kind of curve we're grading on if that's a B-

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

^ because you refuse to let Gruden share any blame..

The giants stoped the rroll outs or we stopped running them? Dont feed me *sh$t* cus I saw the game too. This pathetic oline is going to get any qb who takes the snap hurt much faster then implementing more roll outs.

Griffin earned a B B-. Coach gave up the final 3 minutes.

Asked for? I think we all asked for a pass protecting Oline.. regardless of who is back there. EVERY team in the nfl gets home w a four man rush vs our porous oline. There has to be an AFL player we can promote or SOMETHING.

I havent said Gruden is an idiot, his lackadaisical performance all year, inability to make adjustments (of his own), stubborn play calling (wide open doesnt mean jack when the ab is getting pile drived man come on w that crap), zero control of the team (players checking out/ fighting refs), his now habitual dumbfounded gaze on game day, and his inability to find this teams identity on either side of the ball says it alll for me.
Gruden isnt the savior. The honeymoon phase is over.. and he is breaking worse then our qbs behind this garbage ass o line.
Blame Robert for our record- I could careless.. but to church up Gruden like hes done squat ro help this team and your more delusional then the Colt McCoy bandwagoners

[StorminMormon86]

^ because you refuse to let Gruden share any blame..

The giants stoped the rroll outs or we stopped running them? Dont feed me *sh$t* cus I saw the game too. This pathetic oline is going to get any qb who takes the snap hurt much faster then implementing more roll outs.

Griffin earned a B B-. Coach gave up the final 3 minutes.

Asked for? I think we all asked for a pass protecting Oline.. regardless of who is back there. EVERY team in the nfman fjfn

Did you listen to C00ley's breakdown on the sacks yesterday?

I missed the final 5 sacks, but the first 3 sacks he put the blame squarely on Griffin. If a play is called for a 3 step drop, the line blocks for a 3 step drop...not 5. So when the QB (usually Griffin) takes 5 steps instead of 3 and runs around in the pocket, the o-line cannot block for him. It's not always the o-line. Compare the amount of sacks Griffin has taken (28 in 150 drop backs) to Cousins (7 in 204) and you'll see where the real issue is.

[riggofan]

^ because you refuse to let Gruden share any blame..

The giants stoped the rroll outs or we stopped running them? Dont feed me *sh$t* cus I saw the game too. This pathetic oline is going to get any qb who takes the snap hurt much faster then implementing more roll outs.

lol. Yeah we're just going to roll out every play and we'll be all good. Tom Couglin would have been completely powerless to stop us.

[SkinsJock]

It's amazing that some think we should be getting more from our QBs in the passing game, when we have an offensive line that is one of the worst pass protect O lines in the NFL - the word 'protection' does not exist when you describe this line

It's obvious that Griffin needs to do better as a drop back passer but how in the world is he mean't to gain any confidence with this O line

[riggofan]

^ because you refuse to let Gruden share any blame..

The giants stoped the rroll outs or we stopped running them? Dont feed me *sh$t* cus I saw the game too. This pathetic oline is going to get any qb who takes the snap hurt much faster then implementing more roll outs.

Griffin earned a B B-. Coach gave up the final 3 minutes.

Asked for? I think we all asked for a pass protecting Oline.. regardless of who is back there. EVERY team in the nfman fjfn

Did you listen to C00ley's breakdown on the sacks yesterday?

I missed the final 5 sacks, but the first 3 sacks he put the blame squarely on Griffin. If a play is called for a 3 step drop, the line blocks for a 3 step drop...not 5. So when the QB (usually Griffin) takes 5 steps instead of 3 and runs around in the pocket, the o-line cannot block for him. It's not always the o-line. Compare the amount of sacks Griffin has taken (28 in 150 drop backs) to Cousins (7 in 204) and you'll see where the real issue is.

I'll be honest. I actually agree with cowboyKillerz about the line. Its just a no win situation. We can't run the bootleg for the entire game, and the line isn't good enough to protect the passer in the pocket. Not to mention RGIII sucks from the pocket.

Of course, the big problem is that Gruden isn't calling good plays. lol.

[StorminMormon86]

I'll be honest. I actually agree with cowboyKillerz about the line. Its just a no win situation. We can't run the bootleg for the entire game, and the line isn't good enough to protect the passer in the pocket. Not to mention RGIII sucks from the pocket.

Of course, the big problem is that Gruden isn't calling good plays. lol.

I'm just going off of what C00ley's has said all year long. The offensive line has been "meh". But he also thinks it's a line that is good enough to win games with. And he hates when callers call in and say we need to draft a line, etc. when the sacks for this team are more on the TEs, RBs, and the QB rather than the o-line.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

^ because you refuse to let Gruden share any blame..

The giants stoped the rroll outs or we stopped running them? Dont feed me *sh$t* cus I saw the game too. This pathetic oline is going to get any qb who takes the snap hurt much faster then implementing more roll outs.

Griffin earned a B B-. Coach gave up the final 3 minutes.

Asked for? I think we all asked for a pass protecting Oline.. regardless of who is back there. EVERY team in the nfman fjfn

Did you listen to C00ley's breakdown on the sacks yesterday?

I missed the final 5 sacks, but the first 3 sacks he put the blame squarely on Griffin. If a play is called for a 3 step drop, the line blocks for a 3 step drop...not 5. So when the QB (usually Griffin) takes 5 steps instead of 3 and runs around in the pocket, the o-line cannot block for him. It's not always the o-line. Compare the amount of sacks Griffin has taken (28 in 150 drop backs) to Cousins (7 in 204) and you'll see where the real issue is.

Riiiight.. so if Robert would just throw the ball to the other team wed be better off?
This line sucked then- hence all Kirks TOs and Colts broken neck.
and is even worse now.

How does C0oley know how many step drop backs were called for? Oft time to me there was a defender already at the three step mark so backing up is only logical when your desperately trying to do ANYTHING on offense.

What was Colts sack rate? "Vet"? Knows the system so well?

Everyone is looking for a scapegoat and coach has gotten a pass all year... News flash- this oline cant pass protect fpr a 1-10 step drop back.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

^ because you refuse to let Gruden share any blame..

The giants stoped the rroll outs or we stopped running them? Dont feed me *sh$t* cus I saw the game too. This pathetic oline is going to get any qb who takes the snap hurt much faster then implementing more roll outs.

lol. Yeah we're just going to roll out every play and we'll be all good. Tom Couglin would have been completely powerless to stop us.

I didnt say that did I? You do, however, force old man Tom (whom im glad we mightve saved his job #awful) to stop it.. which he didnt have to cus we aborted it. Like Gibbs would do with the run.. shove it down their throats until they stop it... then shove it down some more!

At some point Gruden has to realize, despite wideouts running free, his scheme/playcalling/whaaaatever is unfunctional with the current linemen he has. Adjust. Run the ball heavily. Bootleg on first instead of the predictable run.

Man rob had the diving td.. then had Djax if djax had his gas pedal pegged- lingering injury or lack of effort- depends on if u ask a philly fan.

Theres a ton of bashing on the interwebs this week.. and surprisingly less of rg and more of the mind boggling ending and coaching tactics/ or lack there of.

[SkinsJock]

This O line is not the main reason the offense is not working well but it is not helping the offense at all

we have allowed 53 sacks and 1014 yards in penalties on offense - give me a break

[riggofan]

I didnt say that did I? You do, however, force old man Tom to stop it.. which he didnt have to cus we aborted it. Like Gibbs would donin the run.. shove it down their throats until they stop it... then shove it down some more!

Its a fact that Coughlin adjusted to the rollouts. There's a reason we started facing a bunch of third down and 6+ yards. Let me know when you're finished breaking down the tape, I think you'll see it more clearly then.

[riggofan]

Theres a ton of bashing on the interwebs this week.. and surprisingly less of rg and more of the mind boggling ending and coaching tactics/ or lack there of.

Because that's how the fans and the local media are. We've bashed everything else already:
- its RGIII's fault
- Haslett sucks!
- no wait Cousins is terrible
- we need Colt!
- its RGIII's fault again
- Haslett is still terrible
- we need a new GM
- Snyder!
- Snyder!
- Colt has to go
- If Joe Gibbs were still here...
- Bruce Allen is horrible
- ok let's see what we can hang on Gruden

At some point we have to come to grips with the fact that we're a 3-11 team with nothing to play for, with a bad QB situation, lacking depth to deal with injuries. It just is what it is.

People started going Snyder crazy a few weeks back and that IMO is probably the right direction to point your anger. All this stuff about Gruden's scheme and play calling is just masturbatory fan wankery, because we've run out of things to blame. I'm looking forward to the "Sean McVay must go!" chants in week sixteen.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

So when a coach adjusts our answer is to let them impose their will on our qb?

If they spread the DEs/olbs the clear answer would be run the ball up the middle- or pull our "athletic" guard and have Robert following the fb guard and te for two check down options and what ever else is out there with the wide outs.

I didnt see Nyg STOP the roll outs, merely imploy an unfavorable front for us to run it against.. turns out the alternative plays we ran were just as bad or WORSE, against that same look.

So who does that fall on? We got out adjusted- and resorted to the Jay Gruden step back run for life give the other team a career day in sacks offensive scheme?
At least keep the d honest and force them to stop the roll outs enough to open up the middle.
we did not. Just gave in- and ultimately gave up.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

Theres a ton

of bashing on the interwebs this week.. and surprisingly less of rg and more of the mind boggling ending and coaching tactics/ or lack there of.

Because that's how the fans and the local media are. We've bashed everything else already:
- its RGIII's fault
- Haslett sucks!
- no wait Cousins is terrible
- we need Colt!
- its RGIII's fault again
- Haslett is still terrible
- we need a new GM
- Snyder!
- Snyder!
- Colt has to go
- If Joe Gibbs were still here...
- Bruce Allen is horrible
- ok let's see what we can hang on Gruden

At some point we have to come to grips with the fact that we're a 3-11 team with nothing to play for, with a bad QB situation, lacking depth to deal with injuries. It just is what it is.

People started going Snyder crazy a few weeks back and that IMO is probably the right direction to point your anger. All this stuff about Gruden's scheme and play calling is just masturbatory fan wankery, because we've run out of things to blame. I'm looking forward to the "Sean McVay must go!" chants in week sixteen.

The "give up" down 11 w the ball and three minutes is squarely on coach. Punt? Kneel at worse.. so much went wrong that is squarely on the hc. Sorry.
not sure if you are just sick of the HC carousel, love the Gruden family, or havent been paying attention.

Playing Robert before the bye? Almost daring him to get reinjured. U go w the the hot hand- and give the ankle time to heal reps in practice to build on. Ignorant.
Blasting Robert in a presser? Selfish and ignorant. Point the finger at thy self before casting blame.

He is in to deep and his rookie coaching mistakes are pointing to 'not suited for the job'.

[riggofan]

The "give up" down 11 w the ball and three minutes is squarely on coach. Punt? Kneel at worse.. so much went wrong that is squarely on the hc. Sorry.
not sure if you are just sick of the HC carousel, love the Gruden family, or havent been paying attention.

Playing Robert before the bye? Almost daring him to get reinjured. U go w the the hot hand- and give the ankle time to heal reps in practice to build on. Ignorant.
Blasting Robert in a presser? Selfish and ignorant. Point the finger at thy self before casting blame.

He is in to deep and his rookie coaching mistakes are pointing to 'not suited for the job'.

Yeah you're right. Its the coach. Let's get another one next month, I'm sure that will fix everything.

[StorminMormon86]

The "give up" down 11 w the ball and three minutes is squarely on coach. Punt? Kneel at worse.. so much went wrong that is squarely on the hc. Sorry.
not sure if you are just sick of the HC carousel, love the Gruden family, or havent been paying attention.

Playing Robert before the bye? Almost daring him to get reinjured. U go w the the hot hand- and give the ankle time to heal reps in practice to build on. Ignorant.
Blasting Robert in a presser? Selfish and ignorant. Point the finger at thy self before casting blame.

He is in to deep and his rookie coaching mistakes are pointing to 'not suited for the job'.

Just to be clear: you are advocating for more time to develop Griffin, but Gruden doesn't get a pass despite the fact that he's a rookie head coach?

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

Actually no.
I'd LIKE some humilty from both of em honestly. . Both remind me of myself talking my way out of a whooping as a youngster.. neither of them are owning isht that they aught to. Griffin has gotten better in that regard this year, but the media picks him apart.
Coach has been too open and quick to pass blame, even judgment, when I feel he should zip it like Bilicheck stfu and own it. Best thing I ever learned as a manager was to own my employees poor performance, pointing out their deficiency just magnifies the fact that I KNOW what their issues are but havent facilitated the means for them to overcome those hurdles.
Yes its different, but very similar too. Gruden needs to lead by example, and as much as reports say the locker room is divided on RG3 (and even that is on the hc to a degree- wtf questions who I start?!?) I think Gruden is losing the players buy in even more so.

To your point; id flip it on ya and ask. . Gruden gets a pass but Griff gets the ax? I dont think you can write off either person until we get the rest of the team firing on all cylinders.

So no I dont want Gruden gone. I want him to be a man and admit when he is wrong. This last games ending has people reeeeally questioning if he knows wtf he is doing. Thought Robert was hurt? Then kneel it and run out the clock. Run another cple pass plays instead? Punt? Short pass???
Just say I mis managed our time down there when we needed two quick scores. Next question. Instead its blame robert for not getting up fast enough but I don't care enough to protect him and kneel it so I call another short dump off.. Ummmmmm what?

Only team to punt, down by two scores in final 5 minutes this year? Us. Thats not on Snyder, or Le'Rib, or old man Clark, or Haz, McVay, or Robert... thats on HC Gruden. Who would instead deflect that to someone else like a kid.
/rant off