DarthMonk wrote:.... not the end of the world - just the end of the best free agent signing we've made in quite some time and the loss of an incredible leader.
OTOH - It's hard to place a dollar value on leadership. I'll say that in this case it's worth less than $27 M over 3 years.
I'll kind of agree with that ....
then
you add in the playing as well and you get to about $9M + a year - for as long as he wants
PAY THE MAN - it's not going to take that much - HE's WORTH EVERY CENT
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
Skinsfan55 wrote: Not re-signing him isn't the end of the world.
If you ever played football at a high level, I am confident you wouldn't have made that statement.
If you have and are still making the statement, then you didn't leave with the understanding of how important leadership is.
Gotta side with SF33 on this one - not the end of the world - just the end of the best free agent signing we've made in quite some time and the loss of an incredible leader.
OTOH - It's hard to place a dollar value on leadership. I'll say that in this case it's worth less than $27 M over 3 years.
DarthMonk
There is definetely a price tag on anything. $27M/3yrs is a HUGE price for Fletcher. If that is the asking price, I am not sure it is worth the cost only because of his age. If Fletch was 30, that would be a different story.
Skinsfan55 wrote: Not re-signing him isn't the end of the world.
If you ever played football at a high level, I am confident you wouldn't have made that statement.
If you have and are still making the statement, then you didn't leave with the understanding of how important leadership is.
Gotta side with SF33 on this one - not the end of the world - just the end of the best free agent signing we've made in quite some time and the loss of an incredible leader.
OTOH - It's hard to place a dollar value on leadership. I'll say that in this case it's worth less than $27 M over 3 years.
DarthMonk
There is definetely a price tag on anything. $27M/3yrs is a HUGE price for Fletcher. If that is the asking price, I am not sure it is worth the cost only because of his age. If Fletch was 30, that would be a different story.
I was thinking more in the 4-5M range.
Me too.
DarthMonk
Hog Bowl III, V, X Champion (2011, 2013, 2018)
Hognostication Champion (2011, 2013, 2016)
Hognostibowl XII Champion (2017, 2018)
Scalp 'em, Swamp 'em, We will take 'em big score! Read 'em, Weep 'em Touchdown, We want heap more!
I want the Skins to pay London. I understand the value of LB may be far less than what he wants....and that is part of negotiations... But, if we had to go higher than a certian benchmark, I guess I would probably lean more in his favor as well.
I just see Fletcher as a linchpin in our defense, and an anchor in the locker room. He carries the been there, done that clout that nor many others on the team have. Could we get along without him, most likely, but it will prolong even more the gel period of the team for next season, and who would fill his spot?
He is a stand up guy, and want him in burgundy and gold next season. God forbid we would overpay for a player (see Haynesworth among others) that actually
1. WANTS to practice, stay in shape, and play
2. Wants to play for the Skins
3. Can STILL play at a high level (pro bowl)
4. Team Leader
What is the value in the above?
A winning effort begins with preparation.
Failures are expected by losers, ignored by winners.
Skinsfan55 wrote: Not re-signing him isn't the end of the world.
If you ever played football at a high level, I am confident you wouldn't have made that statement.
If you have and are still making the statement, then you didn't leave with the understanding of how important leadership is.
Gotta side with SF33 on this one - not the end of the world - just the end of the best free agent signing we've made in quite some time and the loss of an incredible leader.
OTOH - It's hard to place a dollar value on leadership. I'll say that in this case it's worth less than $27 M over 3 years.
DarthMonk
There is definetely a price tag on anything. $27M/3yrs is a HUGE price for Fletcher. If that is the asking price, I am not sure it is worth the cost only because of his age. If Fletch was 30, that would be a different story.
I was thinking more in the 4-5M range.
Me three
I'm sure if they could make three years 21.75M I wouldn't complain...
Might look like 5 years $42M on paper though
..__..
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When you reach the end of your rope, tie a knot in it and hold on....
rskin72 wrote:I want the Skins to pay London. I understand the value of LB may be far less than what he wants....and that is part of negotiations... But, if we had to go higher than a certian benchmark, I guess I would probably lean more in his favor as well.
I just see Fletcher as a linchpin in our defense, and an anchor in the locker room. He carries the been there, done that clout that nor many others on the team have. Could we get along without him, most likely, but it will prolong even more the gel period of the team for next season, and who would fill his spot?
He is a stand up guy, and want him in burgundy and gold next season. God forbid we would overpay for a player (see Haynesworth among others) that actually
1. WANTS to practice, stay in shape, and play 2. Wants to play for the Skins 3. Can STILL play at a high level (pro bowl) 4. Team Leader
What is the value in the above?
You tell us. What is your limit? Mine is 3 years $15 M with $10 guaranteed.
PS - I love the guy but we can't just say "Pay him no matter what."
DarthMonk
Hog Bowl III, V, X Champion (2011, 2013, 2018)
Hognostication Champion (2011, 2013, 2016)
Hognostibowl XII Champion (2017, 2018)
Scalp 'em, Swamp 'em, We will take 'em big score! Read 'em, Weep 'em Touchdown, We want heap more!
Surely the person who has more combo tackles and assists than Ryans or Tulloch last season, and has over 100 combo's for the past decade, is worth as much or more. If he were a decade younger, he would blow the doors off of the current crop of available ILB's (stats wise). I am far from a cap person...and just trying to find all the stats to compare Fletcher with the others has consumed a bit of my time.....but it has lead to reconfirm that we need to keep him. Taking age into account....Darth prob is not far from the path of what he is worth....but I would add a year on the contract and add another million on the guarentees. Just looking at Fletcher's career stats and starts...it seems as if he may be in the Brett Farve mold ....and he is more productive (according to stats) that others that are a decade younger.
Could be wrong, not a total stats nerd here, but to me he is worth investment.......maybe not 9 mil per season, though......or even 7 or 8. Should be paid fairly equal to his peers regardless of his age, and maybe with a little more when considering team impact and leadership in locker room.
A winning effort begins with preparation.
Failures are expected by losers, ignored by winners.
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
I do. He's 37 and we have a rookie quarterback. If he seriously wants 9 large then I say wish him well, and bye bye. I am a huge fan of his like the rest of the Skins fans who are so much behind him and I'm not downplaying his contributions to the team and I want him back. It may not be popular and I'm the first I've seen say this. But 9 large? No, just no.
Hail to the Redskins!
Groucho: Man does not control his own fate. The women in his life do that for him
Twain: A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way
I do. He's 37 and we have a rookie quarterback. If he seriously wants 9 large then I say wish him well, and bye bye. I am a huge fan of his like the rest of the Skins fans who are so much behind him and I'm not downplaying his contributions to the team and I want him back. It may not be popular and I'm the first I've seen say this. But 9 large? No, just no.
RGIII does not NEED his leadership mentoring, but it can't hurt... and I suspect that there are one or two still on the team who can occasionally need a dose of London's "guidance".
Pay the man.
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
KazooSkinsFan wrote:It may not be popular and I'm the first I've seen say this. But 9 large? No, just no.
There have been several here that said that. I don't think you have to back more than a page to find a couple.
Nope. Riggo was closest saying maybe we can't afford 25 mil over three years. Others raised questions. I'm the first to say "No" in this thread, though I see ATX closely followed me.
Hail to the Redskins!
Groucho: Man does not control his own fate. The women in his life do that for him
Twain: A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way
ATX_Skins wrote:Fletch is a good guy and a good leader but 9 mil a year? Take a hike old man. I liked what I saw out of Perry Riley last year. Replacement time?
DC is no longer a place for dinosaurs to get their pension checks before retiring. At least I want to think it's not.
I hope he gets more realistic and stays, but we agree that for this price tag it's "No Deal," Howie...
Hail to the Redskins!
Groucho: Man does not control his own fate. The women in his life do that for him
Twain: A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way
Darth at the top said 15 million three years is as high as he'd go.and we can't just pay.the.man whatever..
And I agree along those lines. The teams these days tho.wouldn't be surprised if he walks and get a fat check.from a ilb starved team
#21 forever in our hearts “I wanted to just… put his lights out ….because, you know, …Dallas sucks…” - Dexter Manley
cowboykillerzRED wrote:Darth at the top said 15 million three years is as high as he'd go.and we can't just pay.the.man whatever.. And I agree along those lines. The teams these days tho.wouldn't be surprised if he walks and get a fat check.from a ilb starved team
When you get into multi-year deals for a 37 year old linebacker, apples to apples is a challenge.
Regarding someone paying it, A big part of my argument is that since we are going with RG3, we're now in a 2-3 year cycle to get good and he's 37. I could totally see a good team seeking a trophy this year paying it, or at least getting close. What about the Pats? He could have been the difference last year. I still can't see them tying up big dollars for several years though.
Hail to the Redskins!
Groucho: Man does not control his own fate. The women in his life do that for him
Twain: A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way
ATX_Skins wrote:DC is no longer a place for dinosaurs to get their pension checks before retiring. At least I want to think it's not.
I agree his price is too high.. totally.
Your right about the pension check thing too HOWEVER... nothing's wrong with him, plus all the other good stuff he does, and Snyder should really start rewarding players who have been sticking it out through all the crap while maintaining some integrity here for us. (Moss comes to mind as well)
Bottom line is Fletcher will come around or he will not be playing in the NFL. Do you really think any other team is willing to give him that much? No, they won't and that's why eventually he will sign for less.
He knows the deal, he knows we have something good going on and he wants to be a part of it. He also knows EVERYONE on this team is on a short leash and wants to lock up some years.
London, I applaud your efforts but you know you are not going anywhere so sign for less and enjoy the next few years as a Redskin.
Every day I wake up and check the news hoping to see that London is back on board. And every day nothing....
It would be so Redskins to get RGIII and a revamped offense scoring 30+ points every week next season but we still end up losing BECAUSE THE SODDING DEFENSE HAS FALLEN APART DUE TO LONDON NOT GETTING HIS CONTRACT!!!!!
I don't care that he's 37, he's as good as there is and everything revolves around him in the D. He's been here whilst we've been nothing short of an embarrasment some weeks, through dodgy coaches and ordinary teammates, he's been Mr. Reliable, Mr. Dependable and Mr. Lead by Example.
](./images/smilies/eusa_wall.gif "Brick wall")
