why we should trade up for a franchise QB

elprez19 · Post by **elprez19** » Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:52 pm

You can only trade down if you have a willing partner. Trading down and aquiring more talent is fine but if you have a mediocre QB, with who does not posses all of the intangibles then your never going to win CHAMPIONSHIPS. Elite QBs do not come out every year and if you are in a position to trade up a couple picks to get one then well you better do it or itll be another 20 yrs before we win a superbowl

Kilmer72 · Post by **Kilmer72** » Thu Jan 26, 2012 7:29 pm

elprez19 wrote:I am a believer that if shanny and Bruce think RG3 is a franchise QB then well... they will get him. If its trades, draft picks or whatever brilliant plan they come up with that will not affect our current track to GREATNESS. There is no way in hell that shanny passes up a "FRANCHISE" QB just because they cant afford to give up a couple picks. No one has any FACTS about the QB situation or the draft. To say that we wont trade up a couple picks to secure a potential stud is absurd. I think mike and kyle were embarrassed this year and are not gonna go through it again with underachieving qb play. Im not saying we will trade up but its definetly not out of the realm of possibilities and I would welcome RG3 after all these years of a carousel of inept qbs. Now is the time, we can fix our offense dramatically this year between the draft and FA.

This is how I feel about it. I also understand how some fans are reluctant to mortgage the future also, because we have done this so many times and failed. I would welcome RG3 myself and if he failed we would be behind the 8ball. I think that this could also buy Mike Shan some time. RG3 might not be ready to start but, if and when he does click, going by what little I have seen but heard, he can make plays when the line breaks down.

Lets face it. A stationary pocket passer is going to need more help than what we had this year. At times our line blocked well and there was many times it didn't. A bigger back would help also. I am not convinced that Helu or any of our backs can take the beating that Jacobs could take or dish out. So what do you do? You can build the rest of the team up and hope you get your franchise QB another year or take a chance on RG3 and work with what we have.

Any QB could come in here and fail (vet QB or not).

DarthMonk · Post by **DarthMonk** » Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:35 pm

I risk sounding like an idiot on this one but here it goes.

The "excitement" around RGIII is generally brought up in its negative aspect - "let's not get so excited that we mortgage our future for the latest eye candy" type stuff. I get that. It could be a mistake. On the other hand ...

There is a lot to be said for an entire city being excited. Imagine the feeling in this town if that guy ends up in B&G. Crowds at home games would be more heavily home-team crowds, the stadium would be packed, and the fans would be JACKED. The players would be jacked as well. I think the spirit of the team would soar. If he has any success at all we become a much more attractive destination for good free agents too.

I think there is a lot more to be said about this but you don't need to read more from me. I think he's the right move at the right time.

Football is truly a game of emotion. Flat teams lose to spirited teams - almost every time.

Deadskins · Post by **Deadskins** » Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:35 pm

riggofan wrote:
Kilmer72 wrote:How do you know for sure that the Skins wont trade up?

You have to insert your own "In my opinion" in front of every thing SkinsJock writes.

Deadskins · Post by **Deadskins** » Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:39 pm

SkinsJock wrote:These guys have resisted the quick fix

Getting a franchise QB is NOT a quick fix. :roll:

Kilmer72 · Post by **Kilmer72** » Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:50 pm

DarthMonk wrote:I risk sounding like an idiot on this one but here it goes.

The "excitement" around RGIII is generally brought up in its negative aspect - "let's not get so excited that we mortgage our future for the latest eye candy" type stuff. I get that. It could be a mistake. On the other hand ...

There is a lot to be said for an entire city being excited. Imagine the feeling in this town if that guy ends up in B&G. Crowds at home games would be more heavily home-team crowds, the stadium would be packed, and the fans would be JACKED. The players would be jacked as well. I think the spirit of the team would soar. If he has any success at all we become a much more attractive destination for good free agents too.

I think there is a lot more to be said about this but you don't need to read more from me. I think he's the right move at the right time.

Football is truly a game of emotion. Flat teams lose to spirited teams - almost every time.

Yep, and I wasn't even thinking about that. I was thinking about how empty the stadium could be if we do not try to get someone; Flynn or anyone that is a possible upgrade. If we get the best player available at 6th, I hope it = 9 and 7 at least. The spark you are talking about would give me more hope.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:23 pm

I'm glad this FO is making the decisions and not Snyder or a lot of fans here who think like him :lol:

I like seeing this franchise get put back together by guys that know what their doing and not by a bunch of fans who think they know what they're doing - like Snyder & Cerrato did :roll:

Kilmer72 · Post by **Kilmer72** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:00 am

LMAO!!!

I know I am not an expert unlike some fans.

Maybe you are right or maybe not. I suppose am totally wrong and everything will be peachy soon enough HTTR

!!!

cowboykillerzRGiii · Post by **cowboykillerzRGiii** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:00 am

Of course SJ I'm glad fans like you aren't calling the shots as well. Even tho you seem to know shanny better then most be it Friends on FB or what ever. Us RG supporters upport this FO making good decisions for the long hall. 2nd tier QBs and cast away FAs NOT being the answer... At all. How many Brad johnsons and brunells can you honestly support?

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:39 pm

KazooSkinsFan wrote:He says how he talked to Danny, how Danny was part of the process, but none of them say Danny overruled him or he even seriously considered his opinions on players.

Why would have need to overrule Gibbs when it was Gibbs that said the team philosophy was modeled after Dan's personality. How much more control does he need to have than that? Why would he need to overrule when the entire team direction is already modeled after his desires....? You can try to minimize his apparent impact on the overall team but it's obvious.

And I'm sure that they didn't do everything Danny wanted but he was there and he was influential from the start. That was the problem and why the team was inconsistent. Gibbs succeeded in spite of being involved with a flawed system.

In regards to how this relates to the topic at hand. If we trade up for RGIII, it'll be Mike and Bruce's decision. Donovan, I dunno where he fits in. But since that bad trade, this franchise has been the opposite of what it's been in the past 10+ years. That to me is evidence enough that a trade up for RGIII is spurred by the FO and not Uncle Money Bags.

spudstr04 · Post by **spudstr04** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:42 pm

spudstr04 wrote:My off-season QB predictions:

Peyton Manning (if healthy): Cardinals (Kurt Warner pt. II)

Matt Flynn: Dolphins (New coach has ties to GB)

Kyle Orton: Browns (I think he could succeed with the Holmgren offense)

RGIII: Redskins (Trade our 1st, 2nd, one of our 4th rounders, and next year's 2nd)

Rex Grossman: Redskins (re-signed as the vet back-up)

I also could see the Skins trading back into late 1st round to draft Tannehill, or another QB that might rise during pre-draft workouts. Overall though, I think this will be the year we get our Franchise QB we have lacked.

Well, now with Mike Sherman as the new OC, the Dolphins might trade back to pick up Ryan Tannehill. Basically, we have about 95 days to speculate!

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 4:11 pm

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Why would have need to overrule Gibbs when it was Gibbs that said the team philosophy was modeled after Dan's personality. How much more control does he need to have than that? Why would he need to overrule when the entire team direction is already modeled after his desires....? You can try to minimize his apparent impact on the overall team but it's obvious.

And I'm sure that they didn't do everything Danny wanted but he was there and he was influential from the start

Everything? You don't have a single specific thing that Gibbs did because Danny told him to. Not one. He was more "aggressive." How? What did he do he wouldn't have? Danny was involved in "strategy." How? What does that mean? How did Danny set strategy that Gibbs didn't sign off on? All those are things you say your manager participated in if they did even if you did nothing more then listen and reject their stupid ideas. You don't have one single decision Danny made over Gibbs. You have nothing but ambiguous words you heard and overreacted to.

And Gibbs is a good man. If he listened to Danny, but did nothing from a football perspective that Danny suggested, he wouldn't be out there now saying Danny's a moron and he rejected every stupid idea he came up with. Gibbs would be saying...what he said...

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 4:16 pm

This FO understands that they need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of the 2012 season

This franchise needs to have a good QB - we have NOT had very good play from our QB for many, many years

we just need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of this coming season

This FO will also be working very hard to bring in a QB that can become great in the near future

This FO does NOT need to give up 4 players in the top 60 of this and next year's draft to achieve that :wink:

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 4:17 pm

SkinsJock wrote:This FO understands that they need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of the 2012 season

This franchise needs to have a good QB - we have NOT had very good play from our QB for many, many years

we just need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of this coming season

This FO will also be working very hard to bring in a QB that can become great in the near future

This FO does NOT need to give up 4 players in the top 60 of this and next year's draft to achieve that

There's a pretty good chance that Grossman or Beck will be starting on day one.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:16 pm

KazooSkinsFan wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:This FO understands that they need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of the 2012 season

This franchise needs to have a good QB - we have NOT had very good play from our QB for many, many years

we just need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of this coming season

This FO will also be working very hard to bring in a QB that can become great in the near future

This FO does NOT need to give up 4 players in the top 60 of this and next year's draft to achieve that

There's a pretty good chance that Grossman or Beck will be starting on day one.

There's a decent chance that Grossman could be starting. There is almost no chance of Beck starting. We're as likely to see Crompton starting as we are Beck.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:19 pm

Not sure if this was mentioned somewhere else, but interesting comments from Fletcher on the qb situation.

Via @LFLETCHER59: Watching Andrew Luck, thinking how good he would look in burgundy & gold

Fletcher was asked about the tweet during a recent appearance on The NFL Network's NFL Total Access and, after joking about his account being hacked, the linebacker shed some light on what he thinks the Redskins should do with their top draft pick in 2012.

"I think you have to get a quarterback for the face of the franchise for the next ten years," Fletcher told the NFL Network crew during the interview. "In order to win in this league, it's a quarterback-driven league, and they have to get one."

http://www.csnwashington.com/blog/redskins-talk/post/Did-Fletcher-call-out-Redskins-QBs?blockID=626510

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:30 pm

I'd agree that Beck has little chance of making the roster ... however, anything is possible :roll:

Grossman and Beck will be given a chance here in the next 6 months but I doubt that both make the final 53

Grossman has to have an incredible showing to be named the starter
he knows the offense but the chance of him fixing the propensity to throw the interception is really very small :wink:

Deadskins · Post by **Deadskins** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:07 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:This FO understands that they need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of the 2012 season

This franchise needs to have a good QB - we have NOT had very good play from our QB for many, many years

we just need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of this coming season

This FO will also be working very hard to bring in a QB that can become great in the near future

This FO does NOT need to give up 4 players in the top 60 of this and next year's draft to achieve that

There's a pretty good chance that Grossman or Beck will be starting on day one.

There's a decent chance that Grossman could be starting. There is almost no chance of Beck starting. We're as likely to see Crompton starting as we are Beck.

I may be the only one, but I still think Beck has potential. But to your point, Beck is under contract, and Grossman is not. I think Beck has a greater chance to be on the 2012 roster than Grossman does.

frankcal20 · Post by **frankcal20** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:29 pm

Deadskins wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:This FO understands that they need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of the 2012 season

This franchise needs to have a good QB - we have NOT had very good play from our QB for many, many years

we just need to get better play from the QB from day 1 of this coming season

This FO will also be working very hard to bring in a QB that can become great in the near future

This FO does NOT need to give up 4 players in the top 60 of this and next year's draft to achieve that :wink:

There's a pretty good chance that Grossman or Beck will be starting on day one.

There's a decent chance that Grossman could be starting. There is almost no chance of Beck starting. We're as likely to see Crompton starting as we are Beck.

I may be the only one, but I still think Beck has potential. But to your point, Beck is under contract, and Grossman is not. I think Beck has a greater chance to be on the 2012 roster than Grossman does.

Here's an alarming stats about Beck. I should note that he does have small hands too.

9 Games
67.9 QB Rating
6 career TDs (passing/rushing)
7 INTs
10 fumbles/6 lost

That is 6 tds vs 13 turnovers. I'm sorry but that shows a trend that this guy is dependable in that he'll turn the ball over in the same manner as Rex did. If Shanny & Co trust Beck then I'll take Grossman. But I'd prefer neither. Also, Grossman is a free agent so he would need to want to resign here. Something I'm not sure he's willing to do and something I don't think the Redskins are interested in doing either right now. Let's see how FA pans out and the draft. If need be, they'll resign him at the last minute if need be and if he's available.

yajexyage · Post by **yajexyage** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:15 pm

Am I the only one that liked Mark Brunell?

Kilmer72 · Post by **Kilmer72** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:21 pm

Mark was just past his prime when we got him. He was really good at one time. He did have a few good games with us.

frankcal20 · Post by **frankcal20** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:27 pm

Never will forget a few games vs Dallas back in the day.

Irn-Bru · Post by **Irn-Bru** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:21 pm

yajexyage wrote:Am I the only one that liked Mark Brunell?

I liked him. Not an allstar when we had him, but good enough to get us to the playoffs. And very good at managing a game.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:21 am

CanesSkins26 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:There's a pretty good chance that Grossman or Beck will be starting on day one.

There's a decent chance that Grossman could be starting. There is almost no chance of Beck starting. We're as likely to see Crompton starting as we are Beck.

I agree Grossman is more likely then Beck. But I don't agree Beck is not more likely then Crompton. Kyle has the history and Beck was playing at the worst time last year. If we don't re-sign Grossman and we do sign a rookie heir apparent, then I could see Beck. Though I don't think it's likely that would happen. But I wasn't including Beck because I thought it was likely, just possible and it was in response to the post which mentioned Grossman and Beck.

emoses14 · Post by **emoses14** » Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:18 am

yajexyage wrote:Am I the only one that liked Mark Brunell?

No. But he was a has been when we got him. Even his prime was mostly forgettable. Not awful, but certainly not memorable. He made about 5-10 great plays in his time here; 2 that were AMAZING.