No Luck... so... Now What?

[GoSkins]

Are there any 2012 FA QBs worthy of being our starter in 2012? I have looked at the list of FA QBs and I can't find one (besides Drew Brees) who I believe will help us. Any body have any thoughts on this?

[1niksder]

I'm not all that sold on Robert Griffin III. He reminds me of Troy Smith. And I do NOT want another "Troy Smith" type as our QB next year.

I'm not a huge fan of RGIII, but the comparison to Troy Smith doesn't really fly. My biggest issue with Griffin is the system he plays in. You watch Baylor play and he is throwing to guys that are WIDE open every time. He doesn't have to throw with any anticipation or into tight spaces (exact opposite of the NFL). I don't think that he is a product of the spread offense the way some other qb's have been, and I think that he could eventually grow into an NFL qb, but I think that he is going to have a lot of growing pains in the NFL, and the transition for guys like Barkley and Luck will be much smoother.

Here's a clip of every snap RGIII took in the OU game

Griffin is looking off safeties and corners double pumping, shifting his eyes... that's why he has WIDE open receivers. Griffin gets hit just standing in the pocket trying to go through his progressions due to a poor OL. When the pocket breaks down he for a open receiver before he takes off. He's a little erratic on his long balls but this clip shows him doing all the things most detractors say he can't do, and it's against the 5th rank team in the Nation.

[StorminMormon86]

Are there any 2012 FA QBs worthy of being our starter in 2012? I have looked at the list of FA QBs and I can't find one (besides Drew Brees) who I believe will help us. Any body have any thoughts on this?

Nope. There is not one (outside of Brees, who I don't even know if he could help us) FA QB that could start here next year. I wouldn't mind having a couple of those as backups (Matt Flynn, Alex Smith, maybe even Luke McCown) but none of those could be starters here next year.

[CanesSkins26]

I'm not all that sold on Robert Griffin III. He reminds me of Troy Smith. And I do NOT want another "Troy Smith" type as our QB next year.

I'm not a huge fan of RGIII, but the comparison to Troy Smith doesn't really fly. My biggest issue with Griffin is the system he plays in. You watch Baylor play and he is throwing to guys that are WIDE open every time. He doesn't have to throw with any anticipation or into tight spaces (exact opposite of the NFL). I don't think that he is a product of the spread offense the way some other qb's have been, and I think that he could eventually grow into an NFL qb, but I think that he is going to have a lot of growing pains in the NFL, and the transition for guys like Barkley and Luck will be much smoother.

Here's a clip of every snap RGIII took in the OU game

Griffin is looking off safeties and corners double pumping, shifting his eyes... that's why he has WIDE open receivers. Griffin gets hit just standing in the pocket trying to go through his progressions due to a poor OL. When the pocket breaks down he for a open receiver before he takes off. He's a little erratic on his long balls but this clip shows him doing all the things most detractors say he can't do, and it's against the 5th rank team in the Nation.

I don't think that RGIII is a bad player by any means. He's probably a first round talent. I just think that Luck, Barkley, and Jones (in that order) are better than he is and are more NFL ready. In my opinion, Luck and Barkley are clearly the top 2 qb's available, followed by Jones and RGIII. I'd be happy with any of the four, but my STRONG preference (given that Luck is out of reach) is to draft Matt Barkley. Along with Luck, he is about as NFL-ready as a qb can be and he has experience in a pro-style offense, is a great leader, high character, and while he doesn't have the strongest arm, he can make all of the NFL throws.

Kiper has Barkley #6 on his Big Board

Faces a tough decision. Has closed remarkably well. Accurate and showing growth year-to-year. To me, he's throwing a better ball and throws it really well on the move. Good, not great, arm. Pro-style skills are valued, even as offenses change.

McShay on Barkley (He has him # 6 also)

His status for the 2012 draft is still up in the air, but should he declare Barkley's poise, decision-making and ability to get through progressions would be enough to make him the second quarterback off the board.

[GoSkins]

So what is our plan for QBs in 2012? Most think we need to get rid of Grossman and Beck. If that's the case we start from ground zero. There really isn't a FA QB who can come in and start. Where are we getting 2 QBs from? One from the draft; and I'm not wild about a rookie QB starting. And then the other QB comes from where? I still like my Manning scenario.

[frankcal20]

GoSkins - Flynn in Green Bay will be a Free Agent this offseason. He has limited playing time but in the games he's played, he's done very well since he's been in GB. He's also been in a camp where they have shown that they can grow QBs. I would look closely at him.

[GoSkins]

OK. But his track record is limited. Is he better than Grossman? On 2nd thought don't answer. He probably is. But I think Flynn is a stretch for a team that needs a bona fide starter.

[frankcal20]

Instead of Suck for Luck, Should Teams Jump in for Packers QB Matt Flynn?

One of the most repeated phrases in this NFL season has been "Suck for Luck," as NFL fans clamor for their teams to get in position to pick Stanford quarterback Andrew Luck, who is touted as the best quarterback prospect in decades.

Related: Suck For Luck Sweepstakes, Week 9: Indianapolis Colts in Sole Possession of Top Spot

There is only one Luck, while there are many teams in need of a long-range solution at quarterback. So instead of sucking for Luck, maybe teams should jump in for Green Bay Packers backup quarterback Matt Flynn instead.

Flynn will be an unrestricted free agent at the end of the 2011 season. While he has just one start in his NFL career, that start—a Sunday-night game at the New England Patriots last year—showed he has the promise to emerge as a starting quarterback.

Flynn isn't as physically skilled as Luck, but he is a former national championship quarterback at LSU who has four years of study and experience in one of the NFL's best offenses. This makes him an intriguing prospect on the free-agent market.

Flynn was only a seventh-round pick, but he beat out second-rounder Brian Brohm, as a rookie, to be Aaron Rodgers' backup, and he has solidified that role since.

Why should teams decide to jump in for Flynn?

They Control Their Own Destiny

No matter how many games a team wins or loses, it can make a run at Flynn after the season. Picking Luck—or another quarterback prospect such as Matt Barkley, Landry Jones, or Robert Griffin III—depends on draft position and opportunity.

They Can Win Now

No team wants to lose game after game in search of a draft pick. Some fans might espouse this kind of strategy, but no NFL organization would.

Signing Flynn wouldn't require losing now. In fact, winning might be an advantage in landing Flynn, since he will have the chance to choose the situation that is best for them and his future.

They Can Use Draft Picks Elsewhere

While Luck will cost a first-round pick—or much, much more if a team trades up to get him—Flynn costs no draft picks. It's possible he will make less money than Luck, too.

A team with needs across the board might be better served to sign Flynn before the draft and then use picks elsewhere.

So Which Teams Make the Most Sense For Flynn?

The fit will likely require a West Coast offense (WCO) type of team, since that is the system Flynn has been in for four years and fits his skills best.

Here are the teams we see as the best potential fits:

Washington Redskins

The Redskins have one of the league's worst quarterback situations, and head coach Mike Shanahan cannot go into next season with Rex Grossman or John Beck anywhere close to the starting lineup. Signing a veteran makes the most sense, and Flynn fits Shanahan's West Coast system variation (more run-heavy than most WCO systems).

This is the best fit for Flynn, in this writer's opinion.

But will the Redskins be savvy enough to bank on Flynn instead of a retread such as Kyle Orton or David Garrard?

Here's an article about teams getting Flynn vs the risk of a rookie QB and where this writer thinks Flynn should go....hint - Redskins

[GoSkins]

Thanks...good article. If we go the FA route then it does seem Flynn is a good option.

[CanesSkins26]

Instead of Suck for Luck, Should Teams Jump in for Packers QB Matt Flynn?

One of the most repeated phrases in this NFL season has been "Suck for Luck," as NFL fans clamor for their teams to get in position to pick Stanford quarterback Andrew Luck, who is touted as the best quarterback prospect in decades.

Related: Suck For Luck Sweepstakes, Week 9: Indianapolis Colts in Sole Possession of Top Spot

There is only one Luck, while there are many teams in need of a long-range solution at quarterback. So instead of sucking for Luck, maybe teams should jump in for Green Bay Packers backup quarterback Matt Flynn instead.

Flynn will be an unrestricted free agent at the end of the 2011 season. While he has just one start in his NFL career, that start—a Sunday-night game at the New England Patriots last year—showed he has the promise to emerge as a starting quarterback.

Flynn isn't as physically skilled as Luck, but he is a former national championship quarterback at LSU who has four years of study and experience in one of the NFL's best offenses. This makes him an intriguing prospect on the free-agent market.

Flynn was only a seventh-round pick, but he beat out second-rounder Brian Brohm, as a rookie, to be Aaron Rodgers' backup, and he has solidified that role since.

Why should teams decide to jump in for Flynn?

They Control Their Own Destiny

No matter how many games a team wins or loses, it can make a run at Flynn after the season. Picking Luck—or another quarterback prospect such as Matt Barkley, Landry Jones, or Robert Griffin III—depends on draft position and opportunity.

They Can Win Now

No team wants to lose game after game in search of a draft pick. Some fans might espouse this kind of strategy, but no NFL organization would.

Signing Flynn wouldn't require losing now. In fact, winning might be an advantage in landing Flynn, since he will have the chance to choose the situation that is best for them and his future.

They Can Use Draft Picks Elsewhere

While Luck will cost a first-round pick—or much, much more if a team trades up to get him—Flynn costs no draft picks. It's possible he will make less money than Luck, too.

A team with needs across the board might be better served to sign Flynn before the draft and then use picks elsewhere.

So Which Teams Make the Most Sense For Flynn?

The fit will likely require a West Coast offense (WCO) type of team, since that is the system Flynn has been in for four years and fits his skills best.

Here are the teams we see as the best potential fits:

Washington Redskins

The Redskins have one of the league's worst quarterback situations, and head coach Mike Shanahan cannot go into next season with Rex Grossman or John Beck anywhere close to the starting lineup. Signing a veteran makes the most sense, and Flynn fits Shanahan's West Coast system variation (more run-heavy than most WCO systems).

This is the best fit for Flynn, in this writer's opinion.

But will the Redskins be savvy enough to bank on Flynn instead of a retread such as Kyle Orton or David Garrard?

Here's an article about teams getting Flynn vs the risk of a rookie QB and where this writer thinks Flynn should go....hint - Redskins

That analysis seems highly flawed to me. He is basing that assessment on three things primarily:

1. Flynn had a good game against the Pats. The list of qb's that have come in and played well in a limited number of games is endless and should hardly be considered as a reason to sign a player. The main problem is that there is very little game film on Flynn for teams to evaluate. It would be one thing to draft a qb in the first and then take a gamble on Flynn (which makes sense), but signing Flynn and not drafting a qb would be insanity.

2. He won a national championship at LSU. The fact is that Flynn was a game manager and nothing more at LSU, similar to McElroy at Alabama.

3. He beat out Brian Brohm for the backup job in Green Bay. Brohm was cut by the Packers after one year and is now in the UFL.

To me, signing Flynn is no different than taking a blind flier on Beck.

[SkinsJock]

Are there any 2012 FA QBs worthy of being our starter in 2012? I have looked at the list of FA QBs and I can't find one (besides Drew Brees) who I believe will help us.

you're kidding, right

a better question would be - Beck and Grossman are NOT starting QBs - what are we going to do at QB?

We will bring in a FA QB and use our 1st pick in the draft to bring in a QB

Grossman is most likely here as insurance and to help both the FA QB and prepare the rookie

The rookie will hopefully become the back up QB as soon as possible




Mike & Bruce have to do a much better job than they have with the QB position

The QB situation is CRITICAL to the Shanaplan being 'in play' here in 2013

[StorminMormon86]

I don't see Shanahan (being the stubborn man that he is) staking his reputation on Beck, only to release him after 3 games of play time. Especially after he stated Beck didn't have the benefits of OTAs because of the lockout, AND because Beck has one more year left in his contract. I see Beck over Grossman as our backup next year.

[SkinsJock]

OMG - that's just great - are you serious?

[CanesSkins26]

I don't see Shanahan (being the stubborn man that he is) staking his reputation on Beck, only to release him after 3 games of play time. Especially after he stated Beck didn't have the benefits of OTAs because of the lockout, AND because Beck has one more year left in his contract. I see Beck over Grossman as our backup next year.

I think you're wrong in this instance. The whole "staking his reputation" was just meant to give Beck some confidence. That wasn't a serious statement by Shanahan. Clearly both Kyle and Mike prefer Rex. That doesn't mean that he will be here next year and Beck wont, since Rex I think will be a FA, but I don't see how you could come to the conclusion after watching what has transpired this season that they value Beck over Rex.

[langleyparkjoe]

I don't see Shanahan (being the stubborn man that he is) staking his reputation on Beck, only to release him after 3 games of play time. Especially after he stated Beck didn't have the benefits of OTAs because of the lockout, AND because Beck has one more year left in his contract. I see Beck over Grossman as our backup next year.

You taking what Fred and Trent had huh bro?

Beck over Grossman as backup..

come on man, I'm @ work, you can't have me making outbursts like this!!!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[StorminMormon86]

OMG - that's just great - are you serious?

As a heart attack. You've said yourself our rookie will not be starting next year. That leaves us with Rex Grossman or John Beck. Grossman, a QB who played in the Superbowl, who's barely better than a guy who's played a total of 9 games.

I think you're wrong in this instance. The whole "staking his reputation" was just meant to give Beck some confidence. That wasn't a serious statement by Shanahan. Clearly both Kyle and Mike prefer Rex. That doesn't mean that he will be here next year and Beck wont, since Rex I think will be a FA, but I don't see how you could come to the conclusion after watching what has transpired this season that they value Beck over Rex.

I just get the feeling that Shanahan is going to keep Beck around for next year, but then again everything he says may all just be "coach speak".

[emoses14]

I'm not all that sold on Robert Griffin III. He reminds me of Troy Smith. And I do NOT want another "Troy Smith" type as our QB next year.

I'm not a huge fan of RGIII, but the comparison to Troy Smith doesn't really fly. My biggest issue with Griffin is the system he plays in. You watch Baylor play and he is throwing to guys that are WIDE open every time. He doesn't have to throw with any anticipation or into tight spaces (exact opposite of the NFL). I don't think that he is a product of the spread offense the way some other qb's have been, and I think that he could eventually grow into an NFL qb, but I think that he is going to have a lot of growing pains in the NFL, and the transition for guys like Barkley and Luck will be much smoother.

Here's a clip of every snap RGIII took in the OU game

Griffin is looking off safeties and corners double pumping, shifting his eyes... that's why he has WIDE open receivers. Griffin gets hit just standing in the pocket trying to go through his progressions due to a poor OL. When the pocket breaks down he for a open receiver before he takes off. He's a little erratic on his long balls but this clip shows him doing all the things most detractors say he can't do, and it's against the 5th rank team in the Nation.

I don't think that RGIII is a bad player by any means. He's probably a first round talent. I just think that Luck, Barkley, and Jones (in that order) are better than he is and are more NFL ready. In my opinion, Luck and Barkley are clearly the top 2 qb's available, followed by Jones and RGIII. I'd be happy with any of the four, but my STRONG preference (given that Luck is out of reach) is to draft Matt Barkley. Along with Luck, he is about as NFL-ready as a qb can be and he has experience in a pro-style offense, is a great leader, high character, and while he doesn't have the strongest arm, he can make all of the NFL throws.

Kiper has Barkley #6 on his Big Board

Faces a tough decision. Has closed remarkably well. Accurate and showing growth year-to-year. To me, he's throwing a better ball and throws it really well on the move. Good, not great, arm. Pro-style skills are valued, even as offenses change.

McShay on Barkley (He has him # 6 also)

His status for the 2012 draft is still up in the air, but should he declare Barkley's poise, decision-making and ability to get through progressions would be enough to make him the second quarterback off the board.

Jumping into this 1niksder/canes back and forth, I have to say that I think Luck is clearly ahead of Barkely and Griffin. But I'm not 100% convinced that Barkely is clearly better. Based on games I've watched (that oregon game in particular, god there was some beauties in that one) Barkely clearly has every damn throw/skill you want your qb to have. But, and using the youtube clip 1nik posted is a good start, Griffin, seems to have those same tangibles, if not as completely developed. More than the lack of pro set, what bothers me is the nearly complete lack of under center drop backs for Griffin. Seemingly everything is out of the shotgun. That worries me because I don't know if he has the ability to read defense while in the process of dropping back, I do know that will get examined ad nauseum between now and the draft, though. I think Jones is behind Griffin in terms of skill level. Maybe its because his receivers got hurt, but I'm fairly sure that his backups are as good if not better than what Griffin was throwing to.

I provide the following exerpt from an article about Griffin, that speaks volumes as to his intelligence, character, intangibles, etc. Link for the story will follow the exerpt. And i've not included this to disparage Barkeley, I just found this read about RGIII interesting.

"I don't want to say the wrong thing, but the first thing I heard when I got here is that there's this Baylor Bubble," Griffin tells me. "There's Baylor, and there's everybody else. I've written many papers on it, about Baylor just having to take the initiative and realizing that Waco is its city. People walking down the street, if they walk across to the other side of the highway, they might get scared because they're outside the bubble. It's getting a lot better. There are more powerful people and people a lot smarter than I am who are dealing with it every day. Still, I've done a lot of volunteering, and it's really sad, and you can only do so much."

. . .

Obviously, the local quarterback walking away with a trophy doesn't heal the rift between the townspeople of Waco and the students at Baylor. But there is something truly abnormal about Griffin; he is that rare elite athlete who seems to consider his professional sports career to be a secondary pursuit. "It's like he's been doing this a long time," Wright, his best receiver, told me, and I'm not sure if he was talking entirely about football.

Griffin graduated from high school early, finished college in three years, and will soon finish his graduate program in communications ahead of schedule. He's already planning on attending law school, regardless of what happens with the NFL. He is not naïve enough to imagine that, merely by playing football, he can alter the realities of Waco itself; he lived in a project house in New Orleans for six months when he was a kid, and his father grew up in the New Orleans projects, and he's spoken to students at several of Waco's poorest schools and understands that the problems are far too deep for any 21-year-old to fully address.4

"You can't totally change that perception [of Waco]," he says. "But you can shift the attention elsewhere."

Griffin was born in Okinawa, Japan and went to school in Copperas Cove, a small town near Fort Hood. His parents, Robert Jr. and Jacqueline, were both sergeants in the Army. He was a superior athlete at a young age, winning track meets and playing quarterback, and yet most of the major colleges in the region declined to recruit him as a passer. LSU told him that he could play receiver, unless he showed up at their camp and proved himself able to throw the ball. Texas recruited him as an "athlete," and it is hard not to at least raise the question as to whether race played a role in those assignations.

"Have I seen an African-American quarterback who wasn't athletic, who might not be the fastest guy on the field but couldn't run a little bit? Probably not," he says. "Have I seen a lot of Caucasian quarterbacks who move around a lot but don't get the label of 'dual threat'? Yeah. I mean, Aaron Rodgers moves around a lot. Jay Cutler.

"Because I was a sprinter in track, that was the biggest thing. When you have an African-American quarterback who's extremely athletic, a lot of times those coaches think, 'Well, I can go get a less athletic quarterback who might not be as explosive but can still throw the ball a little bit, and move this guy to receiver because he's got world-class speed. It's not, 'We're gonna move you to a different position because you're African-American.' It's, 'You're probably the best athlete on your team, so we need athletes at different positions.'"

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/733 ... man-winner

[frankcal20]

Interesting read. I do like the fact his parents were both in the military. Kids end up being raised very different. Not better, just different.

[SkinsJock]

... I just get the feeling that Shanahan is going to keep Beck around for next year, but then again everything he says may all just be "coach speak".

You're entitled to think that but I doubt that many here will agree with you, IF anyone

NOTHING we have seen or heard recently would AT ALL indicate that Mike & Kyle will want to keep Beck instead of Grossman

The ONLY reason Grossman is here (IF he's here) is to help the QBs that are coming in

No matter what - Beck is NOT here next year - bank it

[CanesSkins26]

Matt Kalil, USC's starting left tackle, and projected top 5 pick is reportedly staying at USC for his senior year. I don't know if this will sway Barkley, but if both of them go back USC has a pretty good chance at the national championship since there bowl ban is over after this season. Would be a pretty big blow to the qb draft class if Barkley stays at USC.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/976243-matt-kalil-staying-at-usc-will-this-convince-matt-barkley-to-stay-as-well

[frankcal20]

I totally think that Barkeley will stay now. I think it was figured that they either would stay or go.

[Red_One43]

I don't see Shanahan (being the stubborn man that he is) staking his reputation on Beck, only to release him after 3 games of play time. Especially after he stated Beck didn't have the benefits of OTAs because of the lockout, AND because Beck has one more year left in his contract. I see Beck over Grossman as our backup next year.

Stormin' you are NOT out to lunch on this one. No one knows the mind of Shanny. Maybe Adam Schefter comes close - That's why I bought the book. One thing we do know is he loves work ethic. He exaggerated when he said he stake his rep, but he loves Beck. Listen carefully to the criticisms of Gaffney after the Niner game. He made statements saying that in practice, Beck hit those plays over and over. Ever heard Shanny say, we liked what we saw in practice. I doubt that he is ready to give up on him yet. Look for Beck to be back in camp next year. Whether he sticks is another question - that depends on Beck and what other options are out there. Beck and Grossman have what few QBs out there have - knowledge of the precious O - Tell me that ain't important to the Shannies.

[Red_One43]

Instead of Suck for Luck, Should Teams Jump in for Packers QB Matt Flynn?

One of the most repeated phrases in this NFL season has been "Suck for Luck," as NFL fans clamor for their teams to get in position to pick Stanford quarterback Andrew Luck, who is touted as the best quarterback prospect in decades.

Related: Suck For Luck Sweepstakes, Week 9: Indianapolis Colts in Sole Possession of Top Spot

There is only one Luck, while there are many teams in need of a long-range solution at quarterback. So instead of sucking for Luck, maybe teams should jump in for Green Bay Packers backup quarterback Matt Flynn instead.

Flynn will be an unrestricted free agent at the end of the 2011 season. While he has just one start in his NFL career, that start—a Sunday-night game at the New England Patriots last year—showed he has the promise to emerge as a starting quarterback.

Flynn isn't as physically skilled as Luck, but he is a former national championship quarterback at LSU who has four years of study and experience in one of the NFL's best offenses. This makes him an intriguing prospect on the free-agent market.

Flynn was only a seventh-round pick, but he beat out second-rounder Brian Brohm, as a rookie, to be Aaron Rodgers' backup, and he has solidified that role since.

Why should teams decide to jump in for Flynn?

They Control Their Own Destiny

No matter how many games a team wins or loses, it can make a run at Flynn after the season. Picking Luck—or another quarterback prospect such as Matt Barkley, Landry Jones, or Robert Griffin III—depends on draft position and opportunity.

They Can Win Now

No team wants to lose game after game in search of a draft pick. Some fans might espouse this kind of strategy, but no NFL organization would.

Signing Flynn wouldn't require losing now. In fact, winning might be an advantage in landing Flynn, since he will have the chance to choose the situation that is best for them and his future.

They Can Use Draft Picks Elsewhere

While Luck will cost a first-round pick—or much, much more if a team trades up to get him—Flynn costs no draft picks. It's possible he will make less money than Luck, too.

A team with needs across the board might be better served to sign Flynn before the draft and then use picks elsewhere.

So Which Teams Make the Most Sense For Flynn?

The fit will likely require a West Coast offense (WCO) type of team, since that is the system Flynn has been in for four years and fits his skills best.

Here are the teams we see as the best potential fits:

Washington Redskins

The Redskins have one of the league's worst quarterback situations, and head coach Mike Shanahan cannot go into next season with Rex Grossman or John Beck anywhere close to the starting lineup. Signing a veteran makes the most sense, and Flynn fits Shanahan's West Coast system variation (more run-heavy than most WCO systems).

This is the best fit for Flynn, in this writer's opinion.

But will the Redskins be savvy enough to bank on Flynn instead of a retread such as Kyle Orton or David Garrard?

Here's an article about teams getting Flynn vs the risk of a rookie QB and where this writer thinks Flynn should go....hint - Redskins

With Shanny liking to "develop" QBs, I could see them looking at Flynn. We all know that Shanny looks for guys that have the athletic ability to fit his, uh Kyle's O. Accurate Arm. Preferably a big arm. Extend plays with his feet. Read defenses. Work ethic. Does Flynn fit the Shanny profile? i.e. the Next John Elway? I think we can rule Orton and Garrard out.

[frankcal20]

I actually heard a great interview with Garrard. He said that every team that needs a QB has called him. Since the surgery, he's still not able to play at full level. He had a disk that was pushing on a nerve which was a direct problem where he thought it was a hamstring. Long story short, it was a nerve the whole time. He said he'd be full go by the start of training camps coming up but in my opinion, he's not the guy for here but he could go somewhere and do something.

[StorminMormon86]

NOTHING we have seen or heard recently would AT ALL indicate that Mike & Kyle will want to keep Beck instead of Grossman

The ONLY reason Grossman is here (IF he's here) is to help the QBs that are coming in

No matter what - Beck is NOT here next year - bank it

Have you listened to both Shanny's after games/practices? Mike has said Beck got shafted thanks to the lock out, studies harder than anyone he's ever seen, blah, blah, blah. And Kyle has stated that (when Beck was starting) he kept improving on the mistakes he was making the week before, and would continue to improve. Do you hear them making "excuses" like this for Grossman weekly? I just get the impression that Shanahan is covering himself (for at least another year) by coming up with these reasons as to why Beck isn't what they thought he would be. I still stand by my original statement that I would rather have him over Grossman next year.