'AJ Green vs. Julio Jones'

DFlo · Post by **DFlo** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:16 pm

Little blog entry that might interest you Skins fans with your need for a WR at the 10th overall pick

http://www.footballdraftnotebook.com/Displayp?page=Blog

skinsfan#33 · Post by **skinsfan#33** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:10 pm

Only If they're available in the 2nd round.

I know that won't happen, do I hope we don't get either, because that would mean we passed up a player of need in a more valuable position.

We definitely need a WR, but you just can't justify wasting a top ten pick with as many holes as the Skins have!

Of all we needed was a wr than I would say you could consider drafting ind if those guys, but you can't even have them on your 1st round board if you need every position except TE.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:01 pm

skinsfan#33 wrote:Only If they're available in the 2nd round.

I know that won't happen, do I hope we don't get either, because that would mean we passed up a player of need in a more valuable position.

We definitely need a WR, but you just can't justify wasting a top ten pick with as many holes as the Skins have!

Of all we needed was a wr than I would say you could consider drafting ind if those guys, but you can't even have them on your 1st round board if you need every position except TE.

So your idea is to pass on the superior player, even though it is a position of need, to draft a less talented player because you think they play a position that you consider to be more important. What you've got their is a recipe for building a mediocre football team.

VetSkinsFan · Post by **VetSkinsFan** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:43 pm

If Jones is there @ 10 and we can get him, we better get him. I think he's going to be a special player.

skinsfan#33 · Post by **skinsfan#33** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:05 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:
skinsfan#33 wrote:Only If they're available in the 2nd round.

I know that won't happen, do I hope we don't get either, because that would mean we passed up a player of need in a more valuable position.

We definitely need a WR, but you just can't justify wasting a top ten pick with as many holes as the Skins have!

Of all we needed was a wr than I would say you could consider drafting ind if those guys, but you can't even have them on your 1st round board if you need every position except TE.

So your idea is to pass on the superior player, even though it is a position of need, to draft a less talented player because you think they play a position that you consider to be more important. What you've got their is a recipe for building a mediocre football team.

That is exactly what I'm saying.

Drafting a wr at ten when you have gaping holes all over the roster is just a dumb idea.

Yes, if a wr is rated higher or more talented I'm still drafting the more valuable position. At that spot on the draft you aren't talking much of a difference in talent from one player to the next, unless your scouts just have it wrong.

I'm taking a good qb or probowl RT or OG over a future HoF wr any day. I'm taking a borderline probowl de or nt over PB wr. Heck I'd take a center at 10 over a wr if they both are rated the same, even though you never take a C that high (if that isn't the dumbest idea in football - a great C impacts a team way more than a great wr)

Build from the inside out! Don't buy fancy wheels when you have beat up Pinto to put them on. A

USAFSkinFan · Post by **USAFSkinFan** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:37 pm

There just isn't a top 10 offensive lineman in this draft... There's probably a couple if we move down 5-10 spots, but if we pick at 10 it's got to be a playmaker at WR (Jones, Green), QB (Newton, Gabbert, I like Mallet but not at 10), CB(Peterson, Amukamara), or OLB (Miller, Quinn). By the way, if those guys are gone, I'd still take Nick Fairley or Mark Ingram over an O-lineman at #10...

skinsfan#33 · Post by **skinsfan#33** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:50 pm

VetSkinsFan wrote:If Jones is there @ 10 and we can get him, we better get him. I think he's going to be a special player.

This might be true, but without a QB or an OL he means nothing. Just ask Arizona hours much their great wr helps them. Or Detroit how much Johnson helps them (Suh helped them more last year than CJ had his entire time there.

I don't care of Jones turns to be Rice, Monk, or Charlie Taylor he would be the wrong pick for us!

I know some people won't agree with that and that is OK.

ICEMAN · Post by **ICEMAN** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:14 pm

Jones over Green all day!

gay4pacman · Post by **gay4pacman** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:26 pm

Green please. Jones has the dropsies. Dropsies don't get better when you get in the NFL....they get worse.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:17 pm

gay4pacman wrote:Green please. Jones has the dropsies. Dropsies don't get better when you get in the NFL....they get worse.

Roddy White for the Falcons got better. It can happen.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:02 am

skinsfan#33 wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:
skinsfan#33 wrote:Only If they're available in the 2nd round.

I know that won't happen, do I hope we don't get either, because that would mean we passed up a player of need in a more valuable position.

We definitely need a WR, but you just can't justify wasting a top ten pick with as many holes as the Skins have!

Of all we needed was a wr than I would say you could consider drafting ind if those guys, but you can't even have them on your 1st round board if you need every position except TE.

So your idea is to pass on the superior player, even though it is a position of need, to draft a less talented player because you think they play a position that you consider to be more important. What you've got their is a recipe for building a mediocre football team.

That is exactly what I'm saying.

Drafting a wr at ten when you have gaping holes all over the roster is just a dumb idea.

Yes, if a wr is rated higher or more talented I'm still drafting the more valuable position. At that spot on the draft you aren't talking much of a difference in talent from one player to the next, unless your scouts just have it wrong.

I'm taking a good qb or probowl RT or OG over a future HoF wr any day. I'm taking a borderline probowl de or nt over PB wr. Heck I'd take a center at 10 over a wr if they both are rated the same, even though you never take a C that high (if that isn't the dumbest idea in football - a great C impacts a team way more than a great wr)

Build from the inside out! Don't buy fancy wheels when you have beat up Pinto to put them on. A

Thank god you aren't running the Redskins. What you're advocating is a recipe for disaster. Passing over a more talented player at a position of need over a less talented player at a different position of need when you have as many holes as we do is absurd.

brad7686 · Post by **brad7686** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:53 am

To be quite frank the O-linemen in this draft are pathetic. It is by far the worst class I can remember. Although if they wanted to go D-line over WR thats their call because there are some good ones in this draft. I don't really see how you can knock drafting one of the WR's, but at the same time the odds are that one or possibly both of them won't be special. But you can't really base your drafting on that. It's a conundrum.

ICEMAN · Post by **ICEMAN** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:46 am

gay4pacman wrote:Green please. Jones has the dropsies. Dropsies don't get better when you get in the NFL....they get worse.

Have you ever heard of a guy by name of Jerry Rice? His first year in the league, dropping balls is all he did.

My point again...Julio Jones!!!

brad7686 · Post by **brad7686** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:43 am

Personally I'd be knocking down Sidney Rice's door, and a guard they can afford, and draft defense the first few rounds. But that's me.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:02 am

If Julio is still on the board at #10, he is our best chance for a trade for more draft choices. If we can get the deal we want, trade the #1, even if it means passing on Julio. If we can't trade, take Julio. We need a WR that can support the run and catch the hitch passes and break them for TD's. I don't just look as Julio as a wide out, he gives an extra dimension to the run.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:01 pm

brad7686 wrote:To be quite frank the O-linemen in this draft are pathetic. It is by far the worst class I can remember. Although if they wanted to go D-line over WR thats their call because there are some good ones in this draft. I don't really see how you can knock drafting one of the WR's, but at the same time the odds are that one or possibly both of them won't be special. But you can't really base your drafting on that. It's a conundrum.

Agreed about the oline. This is why I find it laughable that some people on here just spout off "draft oline" without having a clue as to who is available.

The problem we are going to face on draft day is that Fairley, Dareus, Miller, Peterson, Bowers, and Amukamara are all likely going to be gone by the time that we draft. Gabbert, Newton, and Green will also likely be gone. If the scouting reports are to be believed, those nine players, along with Jones, are the "elite" level players in this draft. So if the top of the draft plays out as expected, we'd either be left to draft Julio Jones or reach on a defensive player such as Quinn, Liuget, or Jordan. In that scenario I take Jones without hesitation.

brad7686 · Post by **brad7686** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:30 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:
brad7686 wrote:To be quite frank the O-linemen in this draft are pathetic. It is by far the worst class I can remember. Although if they wanted to go D-line over WR thats their call because there are some good ones in this draft. I don't really see how you can knock drafting one of the WR's, but at the same time the odds are that one or possibly both of them won't be special. But you can't really base your drafting on that. It's a conundrum.

Agreed about the oline. This is why I find it laughable that some people on here just spout off "draft oline" without having a clue as to who is available.

The problem we are going to face on draft day is that Fairley, Dareus, Miller, Peterson, Bowers, and Amukamara are all likely going to be gone by the time that we draft. Gabbert, Newton, and Green will also likely be gone. If the scouting reports are to be believed, those nine players, along with Jones, are the "elite" level players in this draft. So if the top of the draft plays out as expected, we'd either be left to draft Julio Jones or reach on a defensive player such as Quinn, Liuget, or Jordan. In that scenario I take Jones without hesitation.

Yea as of right now I'd guess we take either Jones, Watt, or Quinn if we stay put. I guess a corner is an option but I don't want to draft one and I don't really like Amukamara that much, I think he's overrated.

VetSkinsFan · Post by **VetSkinsFan** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:56 pm

skinsfan#33 wrote:
VetSkinsFan wrote:If Jones is there @ 10 and we can get him, we better get him. I think he's going to be a special player.

This might be true, but without a QB or an OL he means nothing. Just ask Arizona hours much their great wr helps them. Or Detroit how much Johnson helps them (Suh helped them more last year than CJ had his entire time there.

I don't care of Jones turns to be Rice, Monk, or Charlie Taylor he would be the wrong pick for us!

I know some people won't agree with that and that is OK.

It's not static, and anyone who discounts Megatron in Detriot usually pays for it.

Additionally, I don't think you pass on that special player. I think that Jones is a special player.

<general statement>
Some of you people make it out to be that we had the worst team in football with no hope in the next decade. Stop being so god damn negative!!! We're year two in a total overhaul of a team culture AND both offensive and defnsive systems. It takes time, but when you get that special piece, you pick it up. A talent like Jones will make our offense better simply by being there (provided he's not a bust, of course, which is a gamble with any player). You don't pass on elite talent when you have it in your grasp.

HTTR

riggofan · Post by **riggofan** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:18 pm

Right on.

Its really hard to imagine the Skins drafting a WR with all of the other needs on the team. But I think at that ten spot, you gotta grab the most can't miss guy you can get. We have so few draft picks, we can't afford any first round busts.

If Julio Jones is the best player available to us at #10 and we can't trade down, then I'm okay with the pick.

emoses14 · Post by **emoses14** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:22 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:
skinsfan#33 wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:
skinsfan#33 wrote:Only If they're available in the 2nd round.

I know that won't happen, do I hope we don't get either, because that would mean we passed up a player of need in a more valuable position.

We definitely need a WR, but you just can't justify wasting a top ten pick with as many holes as the Skins have!

Of all we needed was a wr than I would say you could consider drafting ind if those guys, but you can't even have them on your 1st round board if you need every position except TE.

So your idea is to pass on the superior player, even though it is a position of need, to draft a less talented player because you think they play a position that you consider to be more important. What you've got their is a recipe for building a mediocre football team.

That is exactly what I'm saying.

Drafting a wr at ten when you have gaping holes all over the roster is just a dumb idea.

Yes, if a wr is rated higher or more talented I'm still drafting the more valuable position. At that spot on the draft you aren't talking much of a difference in talent from one player to the next, unless your scouts just have it wrong.

I'm taking a good qb or probowl RT or OG over a future HoF wr any day. I'm taking a borderline probowl de or nt over PB wr. Heck I'd take a center at 10 over a wr if they both are rated the same, even though you never take a C that high (if that isn't the dumbest idea in football - a great C impacts a team way more than a great wr)

Build from the inside out! Don't buy fancy wheels when you have beat up Pinto to put them on. A

Thank god you aren't running the Redskins. What you're advocating is a recipe for disaster. Passing over a more talented player at a position of need over a less talented player at a different position of need when you have as many holes as we do is absurd.

Julio Jones is not Michael Westbrook, Desmond F$#!@ing Howard, Devin Thomas, Antwan Randle El, James Thrash, Albert Connel, henry Ellard, etc. If this guy is available at #10 and no one wants to give us another 2nd round pick and a 3rd (or something in that neighborhood) Mike Shannahan is going to laugh his booty off as he makes the pick. Its a no brainer especially in the even that Canes is right and all of these guys:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

The problem we are going to face on draft day is that Fairley, Dareus, Miller, Peterson, Bowers, and Amukamara are all likely going to be gone by the time that we draft. Gabbert, Newton, and Green will also likely be gone. If the scouting reports are to be believed, those nine players, along with Jones, are the "elite" level players in this draft. So if the top of the draft plays out as expected, we'd either be left to draft Julio Jones or reach on a defensive player such as Quinn, Liuget, or Jordan. In that scenario I take Jones without hesitation.

are gone. If Shannahan doesn't take him at that pick in that scenario, he's got some 'splainin to do!

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:38 pm

For the first time in years, I would be comfortable drafting either of those receivers in the first round... there is something about them that says they will be special.

Trust me... ordinarily I am just not willing to see a WR in the top 10... but these guys are special.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:31 pm

I agree with those that think that if there's a player available at the # 10 spot that looks like being a really special NFL player then you take that player - no doubt - hell it doesn't matter when you pick up a player that turns out to be very special - you will always be very glad he's on your team

all of these kids have incredible talent - you cannot have enough really great players especially ones that make the other really talented players around them better

I think that Green and Jones are both going to be really great NFL players but I also would be very surprised if 1 or both are there when we pick at 10

I think we are going through such a lot of change right now that we just need to get the guys that we think are highly motivated to be coached and have a great desire to contribute to the franchise

we have a couple more drafts (hopefully 2011 and 2012) and a lot more additions to make to this roster before I think we'll start to see some consistently good football being played in B&G

This FO and coaching staff did not exactly have a great begining and they better get their asses in gear here quickly

gay4pacman · Post by **gay4pacman** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:42 pm

ICEMAN wrote:
gay4pacman wrote:Green please. Jones has the dropsies. Dropsies don't get better when you get in the NFL....they get worse.

Have you ever heard of a guy by name of Jerry Rice? His first year in the league, dropping balls is all he did.

My point again...Julio Jones!!!

exceptions to the rule. There are 1000's of guys whose bad hands held them back from doing anything in the league, or making the league for that matter. Not saying J. Jones is one of those guys, but....i am not willing to take that chance. Green is a lot safer pick and the draft will show that.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:50 pm

I don't care how many balls he drops - IF the guy is a future HOF player and he's there when you pick - you take him - END OF STORY
we all understand that NOBODY is guaranteed to be a future HOF player
the point was made that you don't take a HOF player JUST BECAUSE he's not filling a position of need :shock:

Green or Jones look like being really great players and I doubt that either is available - if either is, we might find a trade partner

we have a lot of needs and this FO better start finding players that can execute the offense and defense or they will not be here for much longer with this stupid owner

DarthMonk · Post by **DarthMonk** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:32 pm

It appears Julio Jones has a decent chance of being available at #10. Green less likely. Both? No way.

I say pick Julio Jones.

I've said it once and I'll say it again:

Here's the best example I ever heard - from the book America's Game - Page 337:

The 1979 draft found the Dallas Cowboys preparing for the beginning of a new era, with Roger Staubach nearing the end of his career. His understudy Danny White, who'd come over after the demise of the WFL, was the heir apparent, and the young Glenn Carano, an unpolished but physically gifted thrower form the University of Nevada-Las Vegas was seen as a potential diamond in the rough. In the 3rd round, as the Cowboys' selection came up, Tom Landry looked at the Cowboys' master list, and did something he had rarely done in his 19 years of drafting. Instead of taking the top player on the Cowboys' chart, he went "against the board" and selected not the highest-rated player but the next-highest-ranked one, a rangy tight end named Doug Cosbie, who would go on to enjoy a productive career and provide further evidence that the Cowboys were able to find a diamond in the rough.

On the next selection, the 82nd, San Francisco chose the very player who had been on the top of the Cowboys' board, the player Dallas had passed on because, in Landry's words, "We don't really need another quarterback."

His name was Joe Montana.

Thank God they blew that one!

I'll go so far as to say ALWAYS TAKE TALENT OVER NEED IN THE DRAFT. AMASS ALL THE YOUNG TALENT YOU CAN. YOUR SO-CALLED NEEDS CAN BE FILLED BY GUYS WHO WANT TO COME PLAY WITH YOUR TALENT.

This is especially true for the 'Skins since we have SO MANY HOLES TO FILL.

DarthMonk (call me Vinny if you want - good philosophy horribly implemented by him)