Santana a goner?

spudstr04 · Post by **spudstr04** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:46 pm

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=6095541

The contract of Washington Redskins wide receiver Santana Moss voids this week, five days after the Super Bowl, making him an unrestricted free agent whenever there is a new collective bargaining agreement, according to a league source.

Moss restructured his contract in 2009 and included a clause that said his contract will automatically void five days after Super Bowl XLV.

The 31-year-old Moss had a career-high 93 receptions in 2010, his first season with coach Mike Shanahan. He also had fourth career 1,000-yard season (1,115) and six touchdowns.

The 10-year veteran has 593 receptions for 8,558 yards and 52 touchdowns.

SprintRightOption · Post by **SprintRightOption** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:37 pm

That depends on how much a 31 year old wide receiver is expecting to receive as a free agent. I wouldn't pay him big money just to keep him, reasonable for his age money, but not big money. At his age his speed will be decreasing and the Redskins can hopefully get a younger number one wide receiver in free agency or the Draft. I can always dream.

Hog Heaven · Post by **Hog Heaven** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:54 am

In the past we have been unable to find WRs in the draft. Malcom Kelly, Devin Thomas, Taylor Jacobs, Micheal Westbrook, Desmond Howard, Rod Gardner... all 1st or 2nd round picks who failed to meet expectations. I share your hope, but lack any optimism in our scouting department's ability to find a WR, particularly one who can step up immediately through the draft. We need to build through the draft, so lets not waste a pick on something we can't get right. Sign a FA WR so we can draft players who will contribute at other positions. We can scout OL, LBs (late round picks excluded) and DBs really well, Shannahan can find RBs, we desperately need a QB... don't draft a WR. Find one who is a FA. BTW, lets get one who can be a redzone target and block in the running game. We can stretch the field with Armstrong and Banks.

Snout · Post by **Snout** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 8:11 am

Hog Heaven wrote: We need to build through the draft, so lets not waste a pick on something we can't get right. Sign a FA WR so we can draft players who will contribute at other positions.

And don't draft a QB either IMO!

langleyparkjoe · Post by **langleyparkjoe** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:15 am

Hog Heaven wrote:In the past we have been unable to find WRs in the draft. Malcom Kelly, Devin Thomas, Taylor Jacobs, Micheal Westbrook, Desmond Howard, Rod Gardner... all 1st or 2nd round picks who failed to meet expectations. I share your hope, but lack any optimism in our scouting department's ability to find a WR, particularly one who can step up immediately through the draft. We need to build through the draft, so lets not waste a pick on something we can't get right. Sign a FA WR so we can draft players who will contribute at other positions. We can scout OL, LBs (late round picks excluded) and DBs really well, Shannahan can find RBs, we desperately need a QB... don't draft a WR. Find one who is a FA. BTW, lets get one who can be a redzone target and block in the running game. We can stretch the field with Armstrong and Banks.

..or we just keep Santana, and use the picks like you mentioned. Santana/Armstrong/Banks look good to me.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:29 am

We have so many needs and issues - we need to add players and keep those players that can be a help to this franchise going forward

I think we'll see many changes - I just hope that Mike & Bruce try to keep any and all players that can help - BEFORE we lose a player at any position we should have a plan to replace that player with another that is as good or a better fit for what we need to do on both offense and defense

IMO - Santana is a keeper

frankcal20 · Post by **frankcal20** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 1:40 pm

Me too. I think that Moss has been an asset to this team over the years. Similar to Cool

ey. If you have something that is actually working, don't change it.

markshark84 · Post by **markshark84** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 1:54 pm

frankcal20 wrote:Me too. I think that Moss has been an asset to this team over the years. Similar to ey. If you have something that is actually working, don't change it.

I agree with that, but we can't spend top $$ of him. I would only sign him to a 3 year deal. I personally think we can get 3 good years out of him, but we shouldn't waste a top pick in the draft on a WR. They rarely work out even for teams that draft well. We are one of (if not the worst) drafting team in the NFL, so we should use our picks on players that are easy to evaluate such as the OL and LB positions. Great WRs can be found late in the draft.

I love how the skins organization really thinks that building through FA works..... I believe the pack and steelers were #1 and 2 in the % of draft picks selected by their organization that were on the current year roster. Build through the draft.

frankcal20 · Post by **frankcal20** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:01 pm

The fun things is depending on how the CBA works out, there very well may be a TON of guys available on the FA market.

As for Santana, you're not going to pay him top WR money. He just doesn't have the stat's to generate that. He has the yards but also has an injury history and lack of TD's to go with that. He'll be up there in regards to $ though only because of those yardage and reception stats but I don't think we're going to see anything until the CBA is worked out.

Teams don't know what the salary cap number is going to be, roster size, etc. So just my opinion, but I don't expect anything to happen until after the CBA.

Now certain teams, like Indy may do something in the next few weeks (as speculated) with Peyton's contract. I think they may extend him for the rest of his career but Moss isn't on that level.

langleyparkjoe · Post by **langleyparkjoe** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:35 pm

Santana Moss- Redskin for life.. Unofficially he's the official "cowboy killa" and I don't want to see him play for anyone else. Its not like he's gonna cost us a whole bunch of money like Frank said.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:23 pm

I'm with Frank and Joe on this as well - he's not going to cost us a lot

no worries, Santana will be here - hopefully we have a bunch more guys that want to play the game at the same level

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:28 pm

If I had to guess, I would say that Santana is on another team next year. He's going to command interest on the free agent market and I just can't see him signing here at this stage in his career. We're not close to competing and at 31 I would think that he would to try to sign with a better team. I hope I'm wrong though.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:54 pm

You could be right Canes - I just think that if it's all about the money and he can get a little more elsewhere and he wants to do that, more power to him

I think he's here because I don't think he gets paid a lot more to go

We need to get a lot younger and we need to find guys that play well together not that are good football players - look at Green Bay last night - they lost one of their best players on both defense (Woodson) and on offense (Driver) and still were able to be successful on both offense and defence BECAUSE they played better as a team

Shanahan and Allen only need to have guys here that want to make the other players around them better by their own efforts and I think Santana Moss is one of those players

Hopefully he does not show that he's like a lot of other players who are only interested in making more money

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:56 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:If I had to guess, I would say that Santana is on another team next year. He's going to command interest on the free agent market and I just can't see him signing here at this stage in his career. We're not close to competing and at 31 I would think that he would to try to sign with a better team. I hope I'm wrong though.

There are also guys that like where they play and want to end their career there. Moss has always seemed happy here. I'm hoping that he just wants to stay. Signing with a team you don't know and who's fans don't know you that's already good to try to win a Super Bowl is way overrated and is very difficult to predict. There were quite a few teams in both conferences that were super bowl capable this year, how do you pick with any certainty? So you go to a crap shoot and dump the players and fans you spent the bulk of your career with. This does happen but a lot of players stay with their teams and ride it out too.

num1skinsfan · Post by **num1skinsfan** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 7:23 am

He's gonna want a bunch of money, cut him loose there are a bunch of better free agents out there. Moss is vastly overrated and over the past 4 years failed to show up for big games. We need less "all about me players" if we are going to build a winner....

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 8:23 am

num1skinsfan wrote:He's gonna want a bunch of money, cut him loose there are a bunch of better free agents out there. Moss is vastly overrated and over the past 4 years failed to show up for big games. We need less "all about me players" if we are going to build a winner....

I'm not sure how you cut a UFA loose. But he's been our only WR for the last several years. Why not put together what he's worth, offer it to him and tell him we want him back? What does telling him to go away accomplish?

langleyparkjoe · Post by **langleyparkjoe** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 9:03 am

KazooSkinsFan wrote:
num1skinsfan wrote:He's gonna want a bunch of money, cut him loose there are a bunch of better free agents out there. Moss is vastly overrated and over the past 4 years failed to show up for big games. We need less "all about me players" if we are going to build a winner....

I'm not sure how you cut a UFA loose. But he's been our only WR for the last several years. Why not put together what he's worth, offer it to him and tell him we want him back? What does telling him to go away accomplish?

Remember what I said about fans wanting everything Kazo? Fans want Danny to show he's changed right, and one of the biggest ways to show that is loyalty to players (something he's really never done before).. So why not keep Moss and show the public, hey if your loyal to us we'll be loyal to you.

Keep Moss, no need to use to use a draft pick on a WR. If people still feel we need another WR, get one for cheap off FA.

Moss- Skin for life

markshark84 · Post by **markshark84** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 11:34 am

SkinsJock wrote:I'm with Frank and Joe on this as well - he's not going to cost us a lot

no worries, Santana will be here - hopefully we have a bunch more guys that want to play the game at the same level

Not so sure about that. He is 31. This is basically his final NFL contract. He is going to want to get every dollar he can.

I don't see him taking any sort of pay cut to stay with the skins. This organization has really done nothing for him except provide him with mediocre to bad QBs to throw him passes.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 11:54 am

Here's my scenario - I hope they make him a decent offer based on maybe a little more than what he's worth because I think they want him to stay and then he decides to stay here after he finds out that he's not getting a lot more from some other franchise

IF Santana Moss gets a little bigger deal offered to him (and let's face it where not talking about a huge difference) AND he leaves for the money even though the deal the Redskins offered him was worth a lot of money - THEN I don't think he's the sort of player we need here anyway

We want players that are making good money (aren't they all) and have incredible desire to play and make others around them better - that's Santana Moss IMO

Even players like Haynesworth could be successful here but they just don't get it

all of these players are very talented - we only need to find and keep the players that suit what we need to do and that want to do it better than they have done before - each and every game

we do not need good players (they're all good, for crying out loud) - we need players that want to make themselves and the other players around them better, NO MATTER WHAT SYSTEM THEY ARE PLAYING IN or how much money they are making

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 12:00 pm

langleyparkjoe wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:
num1skinsfan wrote:He's gonna want a bunch of money, cut him loose there are a bunch of better free agents out there. Moss is vastly overrated and over the past 4 years failed to show up for big games. We need less "all about me players" if we are going to build a winner....

I'm not sure how you cut a UFA loose. But he's been our only WR for the last several years. Why not put together what he's worth, offer it to him and tell him we want him back? What does telling him to go away accomplish?

Remember what I said about fans wanting everything Kazo? Fans want Danny to show he's changed right, and one of the biggest ways to show that is loyalty to players (something he's really never done before).. So why not keep Moss and show the public, hey if your loyal to us we'll be loyal to you.

Keep Moss, no need to use to use a draft pick on a WR. If people still feel we need another WR, get one for cheap off FA.

Moss- Skin for life

no worries Joe - I think Moss is going to be here BUT it will not be Snyder's decision - Mike, Kyle and Bruce will make that call

markshark84 · Post by **markshark84** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 4:22 pm

SkinsJock wrote:Here's my scenario - I hope they make him a decent offer based on maybe a little more than what he's worth because I think they want him to stay and then he decides to stay here after he finds out that he's not getting a lot more from some other franchise

We want players that are making good money (aren't they all) and have incredible desire to play and make others around them better - that's Santana Moss IMO

Paying players more than they are worth is not in the best interests of the organization. I do beleive in loyalty, but we can't throw money down the toilet.

In terms of your second paragraph, that is just not how a player's mind works. Players usually play well when money is on the line -- such as in their contract year or during their rookie contract period. Once they get paid the big $$$, players have a tendency to slack off. Sure there are a ton of players that are pure competitors and play hard regardless of their contracts, but the skins have a tendency to sign players to huge deals and they get lazy.

I would like to see the skins sign hungry players (such as rookies and younger guys) that are willing to work hard and EARN the paychecks. I don't like signing players that performed for another organziation and get the benefits of that play in the form of a skins check in subsequent years.

With that said, I do believe that Santana is one of those players that plays hard regardless of the deal. The above statements are more general and not specifically geared towards SMoss.

gay4pacman · Post by **gay4pacman** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 8:21 pm

SkinsJock wrote:
langleyparkjoe wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:
num1skinsfan wrote:He's gonna want a bunch of money, cut him loose there are a bunch of better free agents out there. Moss is vastly overrated and over the past 4 years failed to show up for big games. We need less "all about me players" if we are going to build a winner....

I'm not sure how you cut a UFA loose. But he's been our only WR for the last several years. Why not put together what he's worth, offer it to him and tell him we want him back? What does telling him to go away accomplish?

Remember what I said about fans wanting everything Kazo? Fans want Danny to show he's changed right, and one of the biggest ways to show that is loyalty to players (something he's really never done before).. So why not keep Moss and show the public, hey if your loyal to us we'll be loyal to you.

Keep Moss, no need to use to use a draft pick on a WR. If people still feel we need another WR, get one for cheap off FA.

Moss- Skin for life

no worries Joe - I think Moss is going to be here BUT it will not be Snyder's decision - Mike, Kyle and Bruce will make that call

moss is far from a me first guy....he restructured his contract the last four years. Not many me first guys would do that. I dont know about him taking "less" money but I wouldnt be suprised if the deal is fair for both sides.

this guy had a great year last year with two qb's.

not sure how someone can be down on mossy after these years hes put together...especially when you are the skins #1 fan.....httr

langleyparkjoe · Post by **langleyparkjoe** » Wed Feb 09, 2011 12:24 am

Well said G4Pac

TimSkin · Post by **TimSkin** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 1:18 am

We really do need tana I mean 93 catches you can't really replace that because we need another receiver as well. If we let him go we will be looking for 2 receivers instead. He shouldn't command too much Donald Driver and Derrick Mason both signed similar contracts and DD and SM are quite similar. 3 yrs 15 mil with a 5-10 mil signing bonus with is very reasonable wouldn't you say?

yupchagee · Post by **yupchagee** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:09 am

num1skinsfan wrote:He's gonna want a bunch of money, cut him loose there are a bunch of better free agents out there. Moss is vastly overrated and over the past 4 years failed to show up for big games. We need less "all about me players" if we are going to build a winner....

93 catches, 1115 yards, 6 TD's. How many FA's are better & how much will they cost?

I say keep him.