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SprintRightOption wrote:During the first half of the game the camera caught a shot of Kyle Shanahan with a WTF expression when the team lined up on offense in the I formation that was without a doubt a " That's not the play I called what are you Doing?" There does seem to be a lack of communication as to what is being called on the sidelines and what is being called in the huddle.

I wonder if DMac is getting the calls wrong because he doesn't know the terminology or the the playbook, or if he is just switching the calls to what he considers to be a better play.
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chiefhog44 wrote:Are you guys serious? Did you watch the game? Please give me examples of how his playcalling was suspect. I want specifics. Not just he should have called more bootlegs or whatever. And keep in mind the injury to Torain which left us with a undrafted rookie RB who has no concept of picking up blocking assignments (as evidenced on almost every blitz that he was in the game for). I expect this from some of you, but others, I thought more of your smarts

More bootlegs is a valid request, though. So are more screen passes and draws. Anything that slows down the defenses rush and tendency to blitz every down would be a good thing when the O-line is getting hammered the way they were.
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Post by 1niksder »

Deadskins wrote:
SprintRightOption wrote:During the first half of the game the camera caught a shot of Kyle Shanahan with a WTF expression when the team lined up on offense in the I formation that was without a doubt a " That's not the play I called what are you Doing?" There does seem to be a lack of communication as to what is being called on the sidelines and what is being called in the huddle.

I wonder if DMac is getting the calls wrong because he doesn't know the terminology or the the playbook, or if he is just switching the calls to what he considers to be a better play.


Read his lips, I got "Who's idea's that?"..... "Who is that inside?"..... or maybe "What the hell is that?"
But I'm not a lip reader
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TincoSkin wrote:mcnabb was benched by shanny after kyle complained to shanny that mcnabb wasnt running the plays called. he needed to ask daddy to sit mcnabb so kyle can keep face and make his presence felt as a leadership figure, as a coach.

I dont think it had anything to do with mcnabbs numbers or his health or ability to do the job i think this whole thing is a mini feud between mcnabb and kyle.

That's the vibe I'm getting as well.
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Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:Are you guys serious? Did you watch the game? Please give me examples of how his playcalling was suspect. I want specifics. Not just he should have called more bootlegs or whatever. And keep in mind the injury to Torain which left us with a undrafted rookie RB who has no concept of picking up blocking assignments (as evidenced on almost every blitz that he was in the game for). I expect this from some of you, but others, I thought more of your smarts

More bootlegs is a valid request, though. So are more screen passes and draws. Anything that slows down the defenses rush and tendency to blitz every down would be a good thing when the O-line is getting hammered the way they were.


Alright thanks, but he WAS running draws, and he moved McNabb into shotgun in 12 packages which should give him pretty good protection, and the ability to see the field faster. They were playing in a 12 package the entire first half. 21 package in the second as Torain was out. When he went out the entire game plan changed and in my opinion, it's when the game was over. You can't run an offense without a rushing threat AND are getting blown up on the line with no back to understand the blitz pickup. Unfortunately, as you well know by watching the game, the Lions took the outside away by rushing the ends to the sweep spot and forcing McNabb to step up...which he did and ran into Suh. It was a well called game. Just not a good enough team to get it done and a key injury to boot.
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chiefhog44 wrote:
RayNAustin wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:Vet, before he starts going down another rabbit hole, he originally stated the following...

RayNAustin wrote: Because according to the coaches .. McNabb is lazy, out of shape, and not very smart.


The coaches never said any of that and I want to know why Ray continues to exagerate. Getting "out of shape" from being pulled due to cardio issues is the closest and will conceed that if you want, but to get lazy and not very smart from ANYWHERE but thin air, is a blatent attempt to fullfill some sort of agenda and I think Ray has to defend that notion because I'm calling him out on it.


I'm your huckleberry. Just because you can't read between the lines doesn't mean the rest of the world suffers such a problem.



Ohhhh, ok. Now I understand. Didn't realize the rest of the world takes what someone says and twists it around to their liking. My fault.

RayNAustin wrote: I have just wasted five minutes of your life reading my posts with my twisting of facts and exagerations to attain my ultimate goal of bashing a team trying to make a rise and you just called me out on it


You are correct. I couldn't have said it better myself. Is this what you mean by reading between the lines???

Seems to me it's you Chief, who is twisting the Shanahan's words (which keep twisting themselves :shock: ) to suit your beliefs, not Ray. McNabb's benching obviously did not come about for any of the reasons they have given so far, and their ever shifting and backtracking excuses (Oh, what my dad really meant was...) are just muddling the situation. They need to just own up to the real reason, which in my opinion is that Kyle doesn't think DM is running the offense the way he is calling it. Whether DM is doing it on purpose, or just doesn't get it, I'm not sure on, but it's pretty obvious that there is a disconnect between the OC and the the QB on the plays being called from the sidelines and what is being run on the field.
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CanesSkins26 wrote:A guy like Adams isn't going to sign with a team like the Skins, who have starters at both spots, to be a backup when they are coming off of a 4-12 season when he has a chance to start for a team that can compete for a championship.

You've said this twice now so I have to comment. Adams couldn't have known beforehand that the Steelers would come calling, and I think he would have welcomed a chance to play in the NFC East against the former team that didn't value him any more. He was on the market for quite a while before Pittsburg snatched him up, and they certainly wouldn't have told him, "you are only a backup if you sign with us." I'm sure they would have let him "compete" for the starting job. All that being said, I didn't want us to sign him, but I think your logic is flawed.
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1niksder wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
SprintRightOption wrote:During the first half of the game the camera caught a shot of Kyle Shanahan with a WTF expression when the team lined up on offense in the I formation that was without a doubt a " That's not the play I called what are you Doing?" There does seem to be a lack of communication as to what is being called on the sidelines and what is being called in the huddle.

I wonder if DMac is getting the calls wrong because he doesn't know the terminology or the the playbook, or if he is just switching the calls to what he considers to be a better play.


Read his lips, I got "Who's idea's that?"..... "Who is that inside?"..... or maybe "What the hell is that?"
But I'm not a lip reader
:x

Still doesn't tell me if DM is making the changes on purpose or not.
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chiefhog44 wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:Are you guys serious? Did you watch the game? Please give me examples of how his playcalling was suspect. I want specifics. Not just he should have called more bootlegs or whatever. And keep in mind the injury to Torain which left us with a undrafted rookie RB who has no concept of picking up blocking assignments (as evidenced on almost every blitz that he was in the game for). I expect this from some of you, but others, I thought more of your smarts

More bootlegs is a valid request, though. So are more screen passes and draws. Anything that slows down the defenses rush and tendency to blitz every down would be a good thing when the O-line is getting hammered the way they were.


Alright thanks, but he WAS running draws, and he moved McNabb into shotgun in 12 packages which should give him pretty good protection, and the ability to see the field faster. They were playing in a 12 package the entire first half. 21 package in the second as Torain was out. When he went out the entire game plan changed and in my opinion, it's when the game was over. You can't run an offense without a rushing threat AND are getting blown up on the line with no back to understand the blitz pickup. Unfortunately, as you well know by watching the game, the Lions took the outside away by rushing the ends to the sweep spot and forcing McNabb to step up...which he did and ran into Suh. It was a well called game. Just not a good enough team to get it done and a key injury to boot.

I'm not saying Kyle didn't call a good game, or do those things to try and help a struggling line out. Just that calling for more bootlegs, draws, and screens isn't necessarily an uneducated request.
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Post by CanesSkins26 »

Deadskins wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:A guy like Adams isn't going to sign with a team like the Skins, who have starters at both spots, to be a backup when they are coming off of a 4-12 season when he has a chance to start for a team that can compete for a championship.

You've said this twice now so I have to comment. Adams couldn't have known beforehand that the Steelers would come calling, and I think he would have welcomed a chance to play in the NFC East against the former team that didn't value him any more. He was on the market for quite a while before Pittsburg snatched him up, and they certainly wouldn't have told him, "you are only a backup if you sign with us." I'm sure they would have let him "compete" for the starting job. All that being said, I didn't want us to sign him, but I think your logic is flawed.


Adams was doing what a lot of veteran players do at the end of their careers...wait until a competitive team loses a starter and then sign with them. Adams signed with the Steelers AFTER their starting RT was lost for the season. He went there because there was the possibility of earning a starting job. That situation didn't exist with the Skins.
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Post by Deadskins »

CanesSkins26 wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:A guy like Adams isn't going to sign with a team like the Skins, who have starters at both spots, to be a backup when they are coming off of a 4-12 season when he has a chance to start for a team that can compete for a championship.

You've said this twice now so I have to comment. Adams couldn't have known beforehand that the Steelers would come calling, and I think he would have welcomed a chance to play in the NFC East against the former team that didn't value him any more. He was on the market for quite a while before Pittsburg snatched him up, and they certainly wouldn't have told him, "you are only a backup if you sign with us." I'm sure they would have let him "compete" for the starting job. All that being said, I didn't want us to sign him, but I think your logic is flawed.


Adams was doing what a lot of veteran players do at the end of their careers...wait until a competitive team loses a starter and then sign with them. Adams signed with the Steelers AFTER their starting RT was lost for the season. He went there because there was the possibility of earning a starting job. That situation didn't exist with the Skins.

It wasn't like he was turning down offers from other teams because he didn't think they were winners. :roll:
He played for the first team that made him an offer, nothing more. And like I said, he would have competed for the starting job here.
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Post by Paralis »

The best part of this argument is that neither Adams nor Faneca had ever played in west coast offense or a primarily zone scheme. So essentially, people are arguing (although most aren't going as far as Ray in saying that Snyder should be making the football decisions) that the Skins should have gone after more big-name free agents, on the downsides of their careers, who don't match our systems at all.

Because that's worked so well in the past, right? Hey, it's working great under center right now!
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Paralis wrote:The best part of this argument is that neither Adams nor Faneca had ever played in west coast offense or a primarily zone scheme. So essentially, people are arguing (although most aren't going as far as Ray in saying that Snyder should be making the football decisions) that the Skins should have gone after more big-name free agents, on the downsides of their careers, who don't match our systems at all.

Because that's worked so well in the past, right? Hey, it's working great under center right now!

I think Ray is the only one arguing that we should have taken Flozell. I was just arguing against Canes' logic as to why Adams wouldn't have signed with us to begin with. And I said in my previous post that I wouldn't have signed him either.
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Post by 1niksder »

Deadskins wrote:
Paralis wrote:The best part of this argument is that neither Adams nor Faneca had ever played in west coast offense or a primarily zone scheme. So essentially, people are arguing (although most aren't going as far as Ray in saying that Snyder should be making the football decisions) that the Skins should have gone after more big-name free agents, on the downsides of their careers, who don't match our systems at all.

Because that's worked so well in the past, right? Hey, it's working great under center right now!

I think Ray is the only one arguing that we should have taken Flozell. I was just arguing against Canes' logic as to why Adams wouldn't have signed with us to begin with. And I said in my previous post that I wouldn't have signed him either.


The Skins brought him in for a look over but that was it. The word at the time was he did prefer a starting job and made it clear he only would sign a 2 or 3 year deal.
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Post by RayNAustin »

CanesSkins26 wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:A guy like Adams isn't going to sign with a team like the Skins, who have starters at both spots, to be a backup when they are coming off of a 4-12 season when he has a chance to start for a team that can compete for a championship.

You've said this twice now so I have to comment. Adams couldn't have known beforehand that the Steelers would come calling, and I think he would have welcomed a chance to play in the NFC East against the former team that didn't value him any more. He was on the market for quite a while before Pittsburg snatched him up, and they certainly wouldn't have told him, "you are only a backup if you sign with us." I'm sure they would have let him "compete" for the starting job. All that being said, I didn't want us to sign him, but I think your logic is flawed.


Adams was doing what a lot of veteran players do at the end of their careers...wait until a competitive team loses a starter and then sign with them. Adams signed with the Steelers AFTER their starting RT was lost for the season. He went there because there was the possibility of earning a starting job. That situation didn't exist with the Skins.


That's not true ... when Adams was released April 2, neither the draft or the signing of Brown had taken place ... the Redskins needed both Left and Right Tackles. And even though they probably had already decided on Williams with the first pick, relying solely on an untested rookie at the most critical position on the line without a viable alternative is not very smart.

And, Faneca was released because of the draft, and we needed guards as much then as we do now.
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Post by chiefhog44 »

Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:
RayNAustin wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:Vet, before he starts going down another rabbit hole, he originally stated the following...

RayNAustin wrote: Because according to the coaches .. McNabb is lazy, out of shape, and not very smart.


The coaches never said any of that and I want to know why Ray continues to exagerate. Getting "out of shape" from being pulled due to cardio issues is the closest and will conceed that if you want, but to get lazy and not very smart from ANYWHERE but thin air, is a blatent attempt to fullfill some sort of agenda and I think Ray has to defend that notion because I'm calling him out on it.


I'm your huckleberry. Just because you can't read between the lines doesn't mean the rest of the world suffers such a problem.



Ohhhh, ok. Now I understand. Didn't realize the rest of the world takes what someone says and twists it around to their liking. My fault.

RayNAustin wrote: I have just wasted five minutes of your life reading my posts with my twisting of facts and exagerations to attain my ultimate goal of bashing a team trying to make a rise and you just called me out on it


You are correct. I couldn't have said it better myself. Is this what you mean by reading between the lines???

Seems to me it's you Chief, who is twisting the Shanahan's words (which keep twisting themselves :shock: ) to suit your beliefs, not Ray. .


You make zero sense here. Where have I twisted shannahan's words. I'm not the one saying anything but asking for the reasoning for Ray accusing Shannahan of calling Donovan being lazy, stupid and out of shape.
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Post by chiefhog44 »

Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:Are you guys serious? Did you watch the game? Please give me examples of how his playcalling was suspect. I want specifics. Not just he should have called more bootlegs or whatever. And keep in mind the injury to Torain which left us with a undrafted rookie RB who has no concept of picking up blocking assignments (as evidenced on almost every blitz that he was in the game for). I expect this from some of you, but others, I thought more of your smarts

More bootlegs is a valid request, though. So are more screen passes and draws. Anything that slows down the defenses rush and tendency to blitz every down would be a good thing when the O-line is getting hammered the way they were.


Alright thanks, but he WAS running draws, and he moved McNabb into shotgun in 12 packages which should give him pretty good protection, and the ability to see the field faster. They were playing in a 12 package the entire first half. 21 package in the second as Torain was out. When he went out the entire game plan changed and in my opinion, it's when the game was over. You can't run an offense without a rushing threat AND are getting blown up on the line with no back to understand the blitz pickup. Unfortunately, as you well know by watching the game, the Lions took the outside away by rushing the ends to the sweep spot and forcing McNabb to step up...which he did and ran into Suh. It was a well called game. Just not a good enough team to get it done and a key injury to boot.

I'm not saying Kyle didn't call a good game, or do those things to try and help a struggling line out. Just that calling for more bootlegs, draws, and screens isn't necessarily an uneducated request.


It is if you don't realize that they were taking the bootleg away and that we were running draws...
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Post by RayNAustin »

chiefhog44 wrote:Ray,

I think the plan from this management team is to build a team based on smart, team first guys that don't require huge salaries. I'm not convinced that they want a quick turnaround. I think they are building a team to compete in 2-3 years and on. Mike was not in favor of Kyle coming on board he said because it's going to take a LONG time to turn this franchise around, and Kyle had a very good thing going on in Houston. The only evidence of a quick turnaround is bringing in Donovan, which in my mind, is more of a stop gap and someone to teach our next QB (hopefully next draft), than a QB that's going to win it all for us this year or next.


Every time Bruce Allen was asked, his answer was no .. this is not a 2-3 rebuilding .. we intended to win now. And CLEARLY, by trading two picks for McNabb, that is the proof behind that claim. You don't trade for a QB who might only have 2-3 years left in him, to sit and wait.


chiefhog44 wrote:You keep bringing up Haynesworth, but Shannahan inherited him. He has already said that the contract for Haynesworth would never have happened under his watch, so he's going to continue to break Haynesworth down until he plays his way...and to be quite honest, it is starting to pay dividends. The guy is playing out of mind, and certainly better than last year when coaches just let him do anything he wanted, and the guy would fake injured every play because he was tired. You have to admit that right?


Last year, Haynesworth made the entire line play better, with Carter racking up a bunch of sacks along with Orakpo. Was his conditioning an issue? Absolutely .. but he came to camp this year 30 lbs lighter ... so I don't think Shanahan gets the credit for that.

And yes, he inherited Haynesworth, along with the rest of the team ... and his "breaking down" Haynesworth was pretty obvious ... and what I have a problem with. I think this rubbing Haynesworth's nose in the dirt was counter productive to the team's best interests, especially when not activating him in a couple of key games that he could have been used situationally (even if his cardio wasn't up to Shanahan standards)

I also think the McNabb handling highlights an inflexibility in Shanahan's overall approach toward his players ... and it doesn't take much of that to create problems in the locker room ... which ... I understand is a concern right now.

Not many players really cared much about Haynesworth's issues early on, but some of them began feeling as though Shanahan was going too far toward the end. McNabb, on the other hand, has been embraced by this team as a leader whom they trust to get the job done. Disrespecting him the way the two Shanahan's have done is way off base ... and has really caused a stir amongst the players.

chiefhog44 wrote:As for Moss, he has major talent, and would certainly be an upgrade, but he's just not a Redskin. Meaning they are trying to change the culture here and rid the team over overpaid, underpreforming me first guys. They would rather see if this undrafted WR Armstrong can continue making plays and develop. I love that. It's what most fans were clammering for since Danny took over as owner. We are developing talent. Banks, Armstrong, Moore, Torain, Lichtenstiger, and hopefully Perry are examples of that.


I'm not sure there is a such thing as "Not a Redskin". In that sense, Haynesworth is not a Redskin, but he's a valuable asset on the field.

And there is no comparison between Armstrong and Randy Moss ... none. I like Armstrong ... and he's a surprise ... but he isn't even in the same solar system as Moss. Tell me how you can make such a crazy comparison? Randy Moss played lights out for the Pats, and according to them ... no problems with him in the locker room. Being primarily a vertical threat ... he would be a perfect fit with McNabb's long ball arm. An almost ideal fit. If the Redskins were 2-6 ... no, don't sign him. But at 4-4, with a defense that is beginning to get the scheme ... and an offense that just needs to get it going ... I consider it a missed opportunity.


chiefhog44 wrote:As for Fanica, the guy is now a journeyman. He's not part of any teams long term plan, and that's why they didn't sign him. We're not going to fill that position until next year anyway, so why pay an arm and a leg for a player like that this year.


Because 2.5 M is not an arm and a leg .... having McNabb lose an arm and a leg from poor protection is what is going to be costly.

chiefhog44 wrote:As for Admas, the guy would have been out of the league had the Steelers OT not ruptured his tendon. The guy is getting crushed in Pittsburgh. I watch each game (wife is a Steelers fan). He gave up 1 sack and 4 preasures in their last game, more than twice any other lineman. Why would I want that?


For the same reason that you aren't a coach for the Steelers ... who believe he's playing very well, as was included in the link to the article I posted earlier.


chiefhog44 wrote:Bottom line, is that I think this will be a longer term plan than you think. As I have been saying, I think they brought Donovan in this year to learn the offense so he can start teaching next year. This year, they started fixing the line, and instituted a new scheme on defense. Next year, I bet they bring in a QB and trade or let go many on the defense that do not fit the scheme like Carter and Haynesworth (trade) and Rocky, Daniels, and Carlos (cut) They will only be able to overhaul only so much next year as well. And then the third offseason, is when they are targeting making a run. This team was loaded with crap thanks to Vinny, and it's going to take years for us to purge. Everyone last year said, blow the whole thing up. Well they blew up the entire staff, management and they blew up 1/3rd of the team. Next year will be another 1/3rd, and the next year will be another 1/3rd.


Again, you don't trade for a QB like McNabb to be a tutor and wet nurse to a Rookie QB prospect. He's here to win a Championship, and I tell you, this 3 year plan of yours is ALL WET. You cannot reconcile that approach with trading picks for older players as the Redskins did this past off season. WE DON"T HAVE THE PICKS. And there might not even be a season next year.

So, how are you going to address your o-line and your QB without the picks ? McNabb, so long as Shanahan doesn't destroy the relationship, should be able to fill the role of the franchise QB for the next 3 years, allowing the Redskins to address the other team needs. But the way it's going, that plan could be put in jeopardy by insulting and disrespecting the man. It's a very poor approach being taken.

chiefhog44 wrote:Feel free to make a mid year evaluation, I think people are getting frustrated with you because it's more like a mid-season bashing than an evaluation, and since this will be a multi year fix, that means we have to listen to your bashing for that much longer. It get's old.


What may be the problem you have is me pointing out in painful detail why you are wrong ...

And I'm not bashing the team ... I'm bashing a BRAND NEW COACH and his Boy, who has the ENTIRE FOOTBALL WORLD scratching their freaking heads, wondering WTF he is thinking.

You act as if a majority actually believe what YOU ARE SAYING .... you, my friend, it is you that is on "Homer" Island ... not me. My opinion comes from what I see, which is simply confirmed by the fact that the rest of the football world at large agrees.

Sorry if that frustrates you ... that is one of the hazards of being right, while the rest of the world is wrong.
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Post by chiefhog44 »

Ray, I guess your right about everything. I'm on board with you from here on out. You wore me out. Misery likes company though, right? Just let me know when you want me to pull out my reality Eore attitude :wink:
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Post by 1niksder »

Deadskins wrote:
1niksder wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
SprintRightOption wrote:During the first half of the game the camera caught a shot of Kyle Shanahan with a WTF expression when the team lined up on offense in the I formation that was without a doubt a " That's not the play I called what are you Doing?" There does seem to be a lack of communication as to what is being called on the sidelines and what is being called in the huddle.

I wonder if DMac is getting the calls wrong because he doesn't know the terminology or the the playbook, or if he is just switching the calls to what he considers to be a better play.


Read his lips, I got "Who's idea's that?"..... "Who is that inside?"..... or maybe "What the hell is that?"
But I'm not a lip reader
:x

Still doesn't tell me if DM is making the changes on purpose or not.


I still don't know what he said :?
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Post by roybus14 »

The blunder that was this past week and some change is so obvious that people should take it for what it is. Shanahan and his son messed up bad!!!

It's so bad that people have thrown out the nepotism thing. Really?? This how bad Shanahan has made it.

Then all of the decisions:

-- Haynesworth

-- Devin Thomas - why is Galloway here??? What is he doing on the field that Devin couldn't or didn't do?? Devin could run a fly pattern.

-- Dockery - nobody knows why this dude is in street clothes. Lichenstieger got gashed over and over again by Detroit while Dockery watched in street clothes.

-- McNabb - benching him and not saying anything about the offensive line. Dude was hit on just about every down; a five step drop was more like two and "RUN!!"

-- Revolving door at week eight at RT. Heyer is not a starter and you can't build continuity with a revolving door.

-- Goes into the Detroit game with only two RBs. Then Torrain hurts a hammy and he's down to one.

-- Bringing in Haslett to strip down a top 10 4-3 and turn it into a 31st ranked 3-4. Yes, they tops in takeaways this year; yes DHall has alot of picks; yes Landry is playing out of his mind; yes they've gotten to the QB. But why fix something that not's broken?? Imagine how much better this defense could be with another year under their belt in the 4-3. Had he stayed with the 4-3, he takes the excuses away from Albert and gives the team leverage if Albert still decided to pull his crap.

-- Bringing in Johnson and Parker when guys like Thomas Jones and others were sitting out there.

-- Lack of adjustments to the problems on the offensive line and offensive period.

I'm just sayin'......
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Post by Deadskins »

chiefhog44 wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:
RayNAustin wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:Vet, before he starts going down another rabbit hole, he originally stated the following...

RayNAustin wrote: Because according to the coaches .. McNabb is lazy, out of shape, and not very smart.


The coaches never said any of that and I want to know why Ray continues to exagerate. Getting "out of shape" from being pulled due to cardio issues is the closest and will conceed that if you want, but to get lazy and not very smart from ANYWHERE but thin air, is a blatent attempt to fullfill some sort of agenda and I think Ray has to defend that notion because I'm calling him out on it.


I'm your huckleberry. Just because you can't read between the lines doesn't mean the rest of the world suffers such a problem.



Ohhhh, ok. Now I understand. Didn't realize the rest of the world takes what someone says and twists it around to their liking. My fault.

RayNAustin wrote: I have just wasted five minutes of your life reading my posts with my twisting of facts and exagerations to attain my ultimate goal of bashing a team trying to make a rise and you just called me out on it


You are correct. I couldn't have said it better myself. Is this what you mean by reading between the lines???

Seems to me it's you Chief, who is twisting the Shanahan's words (which keep twisting themselves :shock: ) to suit your beliefs, not Ray. .


You make zero sense here. Where have I twisted shannahan's words. I'm not the one saying anything but asking for the reasoning for Ray accusing Shannahan of calling Donovan being lazy, stupid and out of shape.

Ray already laid it out pretty clearly. Obviously Shanahan didn't use those exact words, but the message behind their ever shifting excuses was very clear. I actually don't think they believe he's lazy or out of shape or even injured to the point he can't be effective. I won't comment on the stupid part until, I can determine if DM is changing Kyle's plays on purpose or not. But I believe Kyle thinks he's either stupid or disobedient, and that's the real reason they pulled him. I'm just not sure which it is.
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Post by Zoneblitz »

[quote="roybus14"]The blunder that was this past week and some change is so obvious that people should take it for what it is. Shanahan and his son messed up bad!!!

It's so bad that people have thrown out the nepotism thing. Really?? This how bad Shanahan has made it.

Then all of the decisions:

-- Haynesworth

-- Devin Thomas - why is Galloway here??? What is he doing on the field that Devin couldn't or didn't do?? Devin could run a fly pattern.

-- Dockery - nobody knows why this dude is in street clothes. Lichenstieger got gashed over and over again by Detroit while Dockery watched in street clothes.

-- McNabb - benching him and not saying anything about the offensive line. Dude was hit on just about every down; a five step drop was more like two and "RUN!!"

-- Revolving door at week eight at RT. Heyer is not a starter and you can't build continuity with a revolving door.

-- Goes into the Detroit game with only two RBs. Then Torrain hurts a hammy and he's down to one.

-- Bringing in Haslett to strip down a top 10 4-3 and turn it into a 31st ranked 3-4. Yes, they tops in takeaways this year; yes DHall has alot of picks; yes Landry is playing out of his mind; yes they've gotten to the QB. But why fix something that not's broken?? Imagine how much better this defense could be with another year under their belt in the 4-3. Had he stayed with the 4-3, he takes the excuses away from Albert and gives the team leverage if Albert still decided to pull his crap.

-- Bringing in Johnson and Parker when guys like Thomas Jones and others were sitting out there.

-- Lack of adjustments to the problems on the offensive line and offensive period.

I'm just sayin'......[/quote]


Man I agree with everything here. The 3-4 defense is developed so that you can disguise your zone blitzes. This requires cover corners to be able to cover receivers all over the field. I think we have the talent, but I don't think the players have bought in. Not just Haynesworth, but all of the defense. The 3-4 means you must trust your corners and safeties. That is why Troy Polamalu is such a beast. Landry has the skills but Kareem and Reed are not there yet. d Line must also get a push on almost every play Orakpo does get that push, but that is about it.
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Post by chiefhog44 »

Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:
RayNAustin wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:Vet, before he starts going down another rabbit hole, he originally stated the following...

RayNAustin wrote: Because according to the coaches .. McNabb is lazy, out of shape, and not very smart.


The coaches never said any of that and I want to know why Ray continues to exagerate. Getting "out of shape" from being pulled due to cardio issues is the closest and will conceed that if you want, but to get lazy and not very smart from ANYWHERE but thin air, is a blatent attempt to fullfill some sort of agenda and I think Ray has to defend that notion because I'm calling him out on it.


I'm your huckleberry. Just because you can't read between the lines doesn't mean the rest of the world suffers such a problem.



Ohhhh, ok. Now I understand. Didn't realize the rest of the world takes what someone says and twists it around to their liking. My fault.

RayNAustin wrote: I have just wasted five minutes of your life reading my posts with my twisting of facts and exagerations to attain my ultimate goal of bashing a team trying to make a rise and you just called me out on it


You are correct. I couldn't have said it better myself. Is this what you mean by reading between the lines???

Seems to me it's you Chief, who is twisting the Shanahan's words (which keep twisting themselves :shock: ) to suit your beliefs, not Ray. .


You make zero sense here. Where have I twisted shannahan's words. I'm not the one saying anything but asking for the reasoning for Ray accusing Shannahan of calling Donovan being lazy, stupid and out of shape.

Ray already laid it out pretty clearly. Obviously Shanahan didn't use those exact words, but the message behind their ever shifting excuses was very clear. I actually don't think they believe he's lazy or out of shape or even injured to the point he can't be effective. I won't comment on the stupid part until, I can determine if DM is changing Kyle's plays on purpose or not. But I believe Kyle thinks he's either stupid or disobedient, and that's the real reason they pulled him. I'm just not sure which it is.


No, I called Ray out. Ray hasn't called me out for twisting anything around. Tell me why you are calling me out. Seems you just want to butt in. I have not said anything about the situation Deadskins. Please enlighten me.
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Post by Deadskins »

chiefhog44 wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:
RayNAustin wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:Vet, before he starts going down another rabbit hole, he originally stated the following...

RayNAustin wrote: Because according to the coaches .. McNabb is lazy, out of shape, and not very smart.


The coaches never said any of that and I want to know why Ray continues to exagerate. Getting "out of shape" from being pulled due to cardio issues is the closest and will conceed that if you want, but to get lazy and not very smart from ANYWHERE but thin air, is a blatent attempt to fullfill some sort of agenda and I think Ray has to defend that notion because I'm calling him out on it.


I'm your huckleberry. Just because you can't read between the lines doesn't mean the rest of the world suffers such a problem.



Ohhhh, ok. Now I understand. Didn't realize the rest of the world takes what someone says and twists it around to their liking. My fault.

RayNAustin wrote: I have just wasted five minutes of your life reading my posts with my twisting of facts and exagerations to attain my ultimate goal of bashing a team trying to make a rise and you just called me out on it


You are correct. I couldn't have said it better myself. Is this what you mean by reading between the lines???

Seems to me it's you Chief, who is twisting the Shanahan's words (which keep twisting themselves :shock: ) to suit your beliefs, not Ray. .


You make zero sense here. Where have I twisted shannahan's words. I'm not the one saying anything but asking for the reasoning for Ray accusing Shannahan of calling Donovan being lazy, stupid and out of shape.

Ray already laid it out pretty clearly. Obviously Shanahan didn't use those exact words, but the message behind their ever shifting excuses was very clear. I actually don't think they believe he's lazy or out of shape or even injured to the point he can't be effective. I won't comment on the stupid part until, I can determine if DM is changing Kyle's plays on purpose or not. But I believe Kyle thinks he's either stupid or disobedient, and that's the real reason they pulled him. I'm just not sure which it is.


No, I called Ray out. Ray hasn't called me out for twisting anything around. Tell me why you are calling me out. Seems you just want to butt in. I have not said anything about the situation Deadskins. Please enlighten me.

So, I'm not allowed to comment on an ongoing discussion? A couple of pages back you were trying to explain Kyle's explanation of Mike's explanation of Mike's first explanation of why he pulled DM. It just seemed to me Ray was getting more to the heart of it than you.
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