J. cambell

[frankcal20]

I can't believe this thread is still going.

[KazooSkinsFan]

I don't think it was a comfortable situation for Gibbs to witness how a career backup came in and played circles around his hand selected, first round "Franchise QB"

This alternate universe you wish to inhabit is simply not what the rest of the world experienced

Yes, "I" live in the alternate universe where you don't know more then HOF coaches, they actually squirm at the realization you have more football knowledge in your little finger then they have in their entire body. You have the magical power of constant revisionism, how can they compete with that?

I'm curious though, since I live in the fantasy world where TC isn't just better then JC, how is it as I keep pointing out that JC is and has been a starter in the NFL and TC isn't and never was other then when he came in for injuries? Even if you're the football genius you claim, since every NFL coach's assessment is mine, how is it that my world is the alternate one? Yours may be the superior one, but sorry Ray, yours is the alternate...

[KazooSkinsFan]

Two things to point out here:

1. JC was ready to come back in 2007, but Gibbs stayed with Collins.

2. Collins success in 2007 most likely had to do with his extreme knowledge of Al Saunders system, so the 2008 pick of JC as the starter could very well have been a fair evaluation of their readiness after training camp and the pre-season.

If I remember right JC could have played but wasn't 100%. But regardless when you're winning you hesitate to make a change at quarterback. But as you pointed out when they went to camp, once again JC won out. Over TC, not Favre.

I like Collins and I'm really more yanking Ray's chain by criticizing him. He is a Wolverine, I'm in no way against him. He was certainly a more predictable option then JC, but he was a mediocre option. JC had more upside and more downside. If TC was the best option we were screwed, he wasn't going take us very far. JC has the skills, but unfortunately while he may think faster then average people it's too slow for the NFL. That has been established. But the answer is neither of them. MS called it right. But we all knew that. Ray just thinks he's the only one who did. And NFL QB's don't grow on trees, Ray ignores that and thinks just criticism of the obvious is some sort of insight.

[langleyparkjoe]

I can't believe this thread is still going.

..cause JC is a good guy and has a good heart.

[frankcal20]

Isn't he the best QB in the NFL too? I like the guy - he is the things you mentioned and I do think he has all the physical tools to be a very good NFL QB. I think with all the changes of coaching, etc he's lacking the mental part of the game. And it doesn't surprise me that Oakland was where he went b/c for some reason, they don't quite understand that everyone is very talented physically - it's the teams who have the physically and mentally talented teams who do well. I think Danny is understanding that more now.

[brad7686]

I'm still of the opinion that if you have a decent o-line he will win you games. We never did, so he was never going to be good enough here.

[frankcal20]

I agree with that too Brad. I don't care who you put back there. You'll need some resemblant of protection.

[VetSkinsFan]

I'm still of the opinion that if you have a decent o-line he will win you games. We never did, so he was never going to be good enough here.

[RayNAustin]

Two things to point out here:

1. JC was ready to come back in 2007, but Gibbs stayed with Collins.

2. Collins success in 2007 most likely had to do with his extreme knowledge of Al Saunders system, so the 2008 pick of JC as the starter could very well have been a fair evaluation of their readiness after training camp and the pre-season.

If I remember right JC could have played but wasn't 100%. But regardless when you're winning you hesitate to make a change at quarterback. But as you pointed out when they went to camp, once again JC won out. Over TC, not Favre.

I like Collins and I'm really more yanking Ray's chain by criticizing him.

Is that what they call it these days? A "Chain"?

I hate to keep busting your bubbles, but you don't have access to my chain.

He is a Wolverine, I'm in no way against him. He was certainly a more predictable option then JC, but he was a mediocre option. JC had more upside and more downside. If TC was the best option we were screwed, he wasn't going take us very far. JC has the skills, but unfortunately while he may think faster then average people it's too slow for the NFL. That has been established. But the answer is neither of them. MS called it right. But we all knew that. Ray just thinks he's the only one who did. And NFL QB's don't grow on trees, Ray ignores that and thinks just criticism of the obvious is some sort of insight.

Ray thinks Kaz likes to re-write history ... that's what Ray thinks ... I should know because I are him.

[KazooSkinsFan]

Ray thinks Kaz likes to re-write history ... that's what Ray thinks ... I should know because I are him.

I agree you don't "re-write" history Ray, you just see it through your own "unique" view. You hate the Redskins and everyone who plays for them. If you'd actually taken a liking to a Redskin you'd actually deserve credit for that. But that you stamp your feet and demand credit for running down a Redskin? It's your standard position. A broken clock is right twice a day, but no, the clock doesn't get credit for that.

A late first round pick ended up being mediocre, genius you are there Ray. It's just too funny. Even funnier then that anyone who didn't hate JC's guts from the first time they laid eyes on him means they'd pegged him for the HOF. Even funnier then when challenged to produced the "hundreds" of quotes you claimed you could come up with from JC's wenches (all of us but you) you came up with about 3. And it didn't phase you even for a second. I actually admired that. Your observations are dubious, but gosh darn it you are committed to them...

[cleg]

I look forward to watching J. Campbell play today against the Titans. I think he will have a year and would not be surprised if the Raiders in up in the playoff hunt.

[SkinsJock]

I look forward to watching J. Campbell play today against the Titans. I think he will have a year and would not be surprised if the Raiders are in the playoff hunt.

I could not find a smiley face here but I know that you're really kidding, right?

I mean, you cannot possibly think that, can you?


ANYWAY - I'm watching that game on a split screen and this guy is not taking that team to the playoffs - at least not this year - with a few top 5 picks in the draft in the next few years, which is where they'll be picking, maybe - just not this year, with this QB

[RayNAustin]

I look forward to watching J. Campbell play today against the Titans. I think he will have a year and would not be surprised if the Raiders in up in the playoff hunt.

I'm Watching now ... and it looks like vintage Jason Campbell to me ... 2-3 fumbles ... sliding 2 yards short of a first down ... missing reads ... and basically discombobulated.

But ... it's probably just the online.

[RayNAustin]

Ray thinks Kaz likes to re-write history ... that's what Ray thinks ... I should know because I are him.

You hate the Redskins and everyone who plays for them. If you'd actually taken a liking to a Redskin you'd actually deserve credit for that. But that you stamp your feet and demand credit for running down a Redskin?

No ... just more BS from you ... you really should just try to make some sense. Pointing out FACTS is not running down a Redskin .... and thankfully, he's no longer a Redskin .... a move only 3 years late.

A late first round pick ended up being mediocre, genius you are there Ray. It's just too funny. Even funnier then that anyone who didn't hate JC's guts from the first time they laid eyes on him means they'd pegged him for the HOF.

Wrong again ... I didn't hate Campbell ... I hated the kool-aide drinking excuse making that blamed everything but Campbell for his own inadequacy as an NFL QB. And you were certainly a part of that in spite of your protestations to the contrary ... and ... so was Campbell, who never took ownership for his own failings.

Even funnier then when challenged to produced the "hundreds" of quotes you claimed you could come up with from JC's wenches (all of us but you) you came up with about 3. And it didn't phase you even for a second. I actually admired that. Your observations are dubious, but gosh darn it you are committed to them...

I produced examples that you said didn't exist ... I could have posted many more ... but the point was made with the three. I stopped because, as I thoroughly expected, you started to play word games like "No .. I said ABC .. not XZY" ... typical, and expected.

My observations were spot on ... from day one ... and if you tune in to the Raiders game today ... you'll see Campbell doing EXACTLY the same things he's always done ... which I too predicted ... in spite of the kool-aide those "experts" in Oakland have been drinking throughout the preseason.

Yep, Kaz .... when it comes to Campbell, I've been right all along ... and your wiseguy remarks don't change a thing.

Like always though ... you'll not let facts get in the way of your opinions and straw man arguments.

[KazooSkinsFan]

My observations were spot on ... from day one ...

Agreed...I addressed that...the broken clock...

You running down a Redskin isn't an insight Ray. You hating the Redskins less then you hate other teams doesn't make you a fan. The 3 posts you came up with didn't establish your point you could come up with the hundred you claimed you could. And your claim I was his wench wasn't any of the posts you came up with

You do dance nicely though. Not really, I'm just being nice

[markshark84]

I'm still of the opinion that if you have a decent o-line he will win you games. We never did, so he was never going to be good enough here.

Nothing against Brad or Frank (and I do mean that), but I just don't really understand why people still believe in this type of thought when it comes to JC. JC is the type of QB that will really NEVER EVER have a decent OL because of the type of QB he is. He takes too much time in the pocket, he cannot manuver within the pocket, and it takes him too long to read the defenses and make his delivery.

A perfect example of this is happening in OAK this year. In 52 pass attempts, JC has been sacked 6 times. In his 15 attempts against STL, he is sacked twice. Then, when Gradkowski comes in at half and drops back 22 times, he doesn't get sacked once -- and 10 of his 11 passes went to WRs; they weren't dump offs, like many of JCs.

JC makes OLs appear worse. This year JC is sacked on over 10% of his drop backs --- compared to about 5% for OAK last season.

Saying that "JC will be good behind a good OL" is one of those "safe" statements that can never be proven -- mainly because of the fact that JC is so slow to make reads and deliveries that the greatest OL couldn't adequately protect him (hence, all OLs appear bad when protecting JC). It's one of those safe statements that ultimately can never be proven......and thus you can never be wrong........

[SkinsJock]

Campbell took so long that you could time his release with a sun dial AND he had no real idea of reading defenses

apart from the fact that his passing ability both long and short left a lot to be desired he wasn't a bad passer either

all in all Campbell is a good QB but he's not going to ever win many games no matter who they surround him with