Haynesworth already becoming a problem?

[CanesSkins26]

Haynsworth & Landry are naturally agreessive players. Blache didn't want them to play agressively. That was the problem.

Not buying that excuse with Landry. The guy can't even tackle properly. He has been a big bust so far.

[fleetus]

Jesus, the man's taking it in to his own hands to get a trainer to give him 1vs1 attention. The same guy who got him to his peak performance. How is this an issue. As WaPo was quoted, the team is not upset (which probably includes Shanahan it's safe to assume). If you don't like the dude, that's fine, but don't attempt (poorly) to twist details to your agenda.

You're the only one bringing emotion to your irrational argument. Can spot it a mile away. Shanahan stated day one that he wanted 100% participation. Has Shanahan retracted that? Do you think he is fine with no shows by the highest paid player on the team in the very first series of workouts? Keep drinking that kool-aid.

It may all workout in the end, there is always that possibility. I hope so because Haynesworth is the most talented player on the team and could be the difference between a solid defense and a nasty, dominant defense. But there is no disguising the reality of the situation and it ain't a good sign for things to come when your highest paid player puts more priority on his personal trainer than his new Head Coach.

Hey, if I'm wrong, come back here in September and say so.

[VetSkinsFan]

Jesus, the man's taking it in to his own hands to get a trainer to give him 1vs1 attention. The same guy who got him to his peak performance. How is this an issue. As WaPo was quoted, the team is not upset (which probably includes Shanahan it's safe to assume). If you don't like the dude, that's fine, but don't attempt (poorly) to twist details to your agenda.

You're the only one bringing emotion to your irrational argument. Can spot it a mile away. Shanahan stated day one that he wanted 100% participation. Has Shanahan retracted that? Do you think he is fine with no shows by the highest paid player on the team in the very first series of workouts? Keep drinking that kool-aid.

It may all workout in the end, there is always that possibility. I hope so because Haynesworth is the most talented player on the team and could be the difference between a solid defense and a nasty, dominant defense. But there is no disguising the reality of the situation and it ain't a good sign for things to come when your highest paid player puts more priority on his personal trainer than his new Head Coach.

Hey, if I'm wrong, come back here in September and say so.

Okay, so if I'm drink on Kool Aid, then you must be able to show me where Shanahan is upset with Haynesworth and his workout regimen. I mean, if I'm so irrational and emotional, there must be TONS of links out there to support how I'm off my rocker here. Go ahead, buddy, hook me up.

[fleetus]

Jesus, the man's taking it in to his own hands to get a trainer to give him 1vs1 attention. The same guy who got him to his peak performance. How is this an issue. As WaPo was quoted, the team is not upset (which probably includes Shanahan it's safe to assume). If you don't like the dude, that's fine, but don't attempt (poorly) to twist details to your agenda.

You're the only one bringing emotion to your irrational argument. Can spot it a mile away. Shanahan stated day one that he wanted 100% participation. Has Shanahan retracted that? Do you think he is fine with no shows by the highest paid player on the team in the very first series of workouts? Keep drinking that kool-aid.

It may all workout in the end, there is always that possibility. I hope so because Haynesworth is the most talented player on the team and could be the difference between a solid defense and a nasty, dominant defense. But there is no disguising the reality of the situation and it ain't a good sign for things to come when your highest paid player puts more priority on his personal trainer than his new Head Coach.

Hey, if I'm wrong, come back here in September and say so.

Okay, so if I'm drink on Kool Aid, then you must be able to show me where Shanahan is upset with Haynesworth and his workout regimen. I mean, if I'm so irrational and emotional, there must be TONS of links out there to support how I'm off my rocker here. Go ahead, buddy, hook me up.

No, the irrational part was comments of me twisting details to fit my argument. The details, very clearly, are Shanahan setting a new tone of discipline for this team. Stating to everyone very clearly that he expects all players to participate in the offseason workouts. 100% participation. I can't understand why you would need to wait for the media to tell you what the story is. But hey, we all have opinions, I have no personal problem with yours.

Is it possible Shanahan had a talk with Haynesworth and decided his absence was a good idea after all? It's possible, but not likely. When a new Sheriff comes to town and says everyone will work together as a team, no exceptions, then I tend to believe he isn't going to happily excuse his highest paid player two months later. I say, strike one on Haynesworth. (maybe even strike two) Only time will tell how this plays out.

[VetSkinsFan]

Multiple reports say that Haynesworth had his regimen in place before the arival of the new regime. AND NONE of them have illustrated or even hinted that Shanahan is the least bit upset abotu Haynesworth's absence. The reports DO note that Haynesworth even showed and participated in the first day activities. Nowhere does anything I've read support what you've said.

And it's natural to omit details that don't support your agenda/pov/idea/however else you want to label it. I'm not holding that against you.

But please, don't go on 'well, you know it's true' when you can't prove jack. Put your quotes where your mouth is...

[fleetus]

Okay, no problem. I'm not arguing the report that he is working out with a trainer who supposedly can get Haynesworth into the best shape. I'm not arguing that the workouts are not mandatory. I'm just pointing out (what i thought was obvious) that if you consider several things:

1. how out of shape Haynesworth was at the start of camp last season
2. consider that Haynesworth is reportedly has concerns about switching to a Haslett's 3-4.
3. consider the defense is likely to be learning some of Haslett's 3-4 scheme during these workouts and that Haynesworth has never played DE in a 3-4.
4. Consider that Shanahan expects to instill some discipline and team work and has already called out Portis (the other problem child) about his off season conditioning and participation in team workouts.

Me thinks there is potential for a conflict here. No more, no less. Hopefully it all blows over.

[VetSkinsFan]

Okay, no problem. I'm not arguing the report that he is working out with a trainer who supposedly can get Haynesworth into the best shape. I'm not arguing that the workouts are not mandatory. I'm just pointing out (what i thought was obvious) that if you consider several things:

1. how out of shape Haynesworth was at the start of camp last season
2. consider that Haynesworth is reportedly has concerns about switching to a Haslett's 3-4.
3. consider the defense is likely to be learning some of Haslett's 3-4 scheme during these workouts and that Haynesworth has never played DE in a 3-4.
4. Consider that Shanahan expects to instill some discipline and team work and has already called out Portis (the other problem child) about his off season conditioning and participation in team workouts.

Me thinks there is potential for a conflict here. No more, no less. Hopefully it all blows over.

1- I agree that he was out of shape last year. That's why I pointed out the fact that he's working out with the same personal trainer from the height of his career. I'm taking that for him addressing his need on his own. Your point is understood.
2 - Correct again, but that was at the very end of last season and nothing has been said since, really, on his concern. I've read that he's spoken with Haslett and that he's, for the time being at least, content with what conversion he and Haslett had so far.
3 - Good point, but this is just voluntary workout. This could be a point for concern, but if we've not heard anyone voice any concerns about it thus far, I'm going to take it in good faith that it's been addressed privately by Haslett and Big Al.
4 - These 'callouts' happened when questioned early when Shanahan has come on. Since there's no recent news about either 'problem child,' I'm taking that (in good faith again, I can't help being positive since I have no insider knowledge) these situations have been handled verbaly and the proof will be in their work ethics.

I can understand that there's potential for conflict. I have concerns, as well, but I don't see the point in dwelling on something that there's no support for. I could dwell on Big Al's comments in Dec (this is now late march). I could dwell on CP's pre-season attitude. Until those situations rear their ugly heads again, I'm going to have faith in the coaches that they've squashed those demons. After all, the show's not being run by a QB coach; Shanahan has a little more cred than Zorn.

[vwoodzpusha]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/22/haynesworth-explains-his-decision-not-to-participate-in-offseason-workouts/

Seems like Haynesworth isnt happy to me....

[VetSkinsFan]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/22/haynesworth-explains-his-decision-not-to-participate-in-offseason-workouts/

Seems like Haynesworth isnt happy to me....

I agree that he sounds less than pleased, but he's not making a stink about it yet. The thing that relates to this convo teh most is that the off-season training last year was a joke, so he's working out on his own. And while Shanhan doesn't like it, he can accept it. Still don't see currently where Big Al's causing problems.

[SkinsJock]

just my 2 cents - I just think some people (both here and in the media) are looking into any and all 'reports' about Haynesworth in a negative manner - I understand that there were concerns about his conditioning last year but even that was distorted in my opinion - this is one very large guy and his conditioning is monitored by both himself and the coaches - he has to be rotated in and out

I am not concerned about Haynesworth continuing to be a dominant defensive player and while I initially was concerned about his contarct, once I found out what the contract was in actuality, I feel we got a great defensive player for a very good price

I look forward to him playing for some coaches that will use him and some other players here better

[CanesSkins26]

"Last year, I worked out with the Redskins, and the year that we had and all that stuff wasn't great, by any means," Haynesworth said. "I'm getting back to basics, what got me to be one of the top defensive players in the NFL, and that's what I plan on doing."

Haynesworth said that new coach Mike Shanahan doesn't agree with the approach, but that Shanahan said he respects Haynesworth for being candid about it. Haynesworth also was very complimentary of the ability to approach and talk to Shanahan.

But the relationship is strained, for now. Haynesworth isn't happy with the switch to a 3-4, but he acknowledges that there's nothing he can do about it, given that he's under contract in D.C. "Whatever they ask me to do, that's what I'm gonna do," he said, with what seemed to be more than a hint of resignation in his voice.

Haynesworth also suggested that if he knew in early 2009 what he knows now, he possibly would have signed with a different team. He pointed to having "too many chiefs" in D.C., and while he stopped short of saying that owner Daniel Snyder is too involved, Haynesworth pointed out that Titans owner Bud Adams rarely was in the facility during Haynesworth's seven seasons in Tennessee.

[fleetus]

"Last year, I worked out with the Redskins, and the year that we had and all that stuff wasn't great, by any means," Haynesworth said. "I'm getting back to basics, what got me to be one of the top defensive players in the NFL, and that's what I plan on doing."

Haynesworth said that new coach Mike Shanahan doesn't agree with the approach, but that Shanahan said he respects Haynesworth for being candid about it. Haynesworth also was very complimentary of the ability to approach and talk to Shanahan.

But the relationship is strained, for now. Haynesworth isn't happy with the switch to a 3-4, but he acknowledges that there's nothing he can do about it, given that he's under contract in D.C. "Whatever they ask me to do, that's what I'm gonna do," he said, with what seemed to be more than a hint of resignation in his voice.

Haynesworth also suggested that if he knew in early 2009 what he knows now, he possibly would have signed with a different team. He pointed to having "too many chiefs" in D.C., and while he stopped short of saying that owner Daniel Snyder is too involved, Haynesworth pointed out that Titans owner Bud Adams rarely was in the facility during Haynesworth's seven seasons in Tennessee.

Like I said when I started this thread, it looks like Haynesworth is becoming a problem. I don't care who you are, if you don't want to be here, you are not going to give 100%. Then if you're talking about a guy who has never played more than about 12 games and 60-70% of the snaps in those games, it is hard to see him playing all out for the Skins this year.

[SkinsJock]

Like I've maintained since this misguided thread started - there is a lot of misguided worry about Haynesworth being presented by both the very biased anti-Redskins media and some fans here who just want to see the bad in almost everything about this franchise

Haynesworth is ours and he's fortunately staying here - we are lucky to have him and many teams are very envious

now, what else is there to really worry about this off season

[fleetus]

Like I've maintained since this misguided thread started - there is a lot of misguided worry about Haynesworth being presented by both the very biased anti-Redskins media and some fans here who just want to see the bad in almost everything about this franchise

Haynesworth is ours and he's fortunately staying here - we are lucky to have him and many teams are very envious

now, what else is there to really worry about this off season

yeah...

[Manchester_Redskin]

Did he have to 'take a knee' after the effort of saying all of that?

if Shanahan and Allen had been in charge last year then I doubt Haynesworth would be here now and we would have been a year closer to being competetive again.

As it is we are lucky to have him/stuck with him (depending on your point of view) and the FO have to sort out the allmighty mess caused by snyder and vinny watisname having buried their heads in the sand during the last offseason in the belief that the OL was not a problem.

To my mind, if you are paying a guy 40mil guaranteed then you should at least try and get your money's worth by using him to his best ability. Its a bit like signing Dan Marino and moving to a run-oriented Offense.

[VetSkinsFan]

"Last year, I worked out with the Redskins, and the year that we had and all that stuff wasn't great, by any means," Haynesworth said. "I'm getting back to basics, what got me to be one of the top defensive players in the NFL, and that's what I plan on doing."

Haynesworth said that new coach Mike Shanahan doesn't agree with the approach, but that Shanahan said he respects Haynesworth for being candid about it. Haynesworth also was very complimentary of the ability to approach and talk to Shanahan.

But the relationship is strained, for now. Haynesworth isn't happy with the switch to a 3-4, but he acknowledges that there's nothing he can do about it, given that he's under contract in D.C. "Whatever they ask me to do, that's what I'm gonna do," he said, with what seemed to be more than a hint of resignation in his voice.

Haynesworth also suggested that if he knew in early 2009 what he knows now, he possibly would have signed with a different team. He pointed to having "too many chiefs" in D.C., and while he stopped short of saying that owner Daniel Snyder is too involved, Haynesworth pointed out that Titans owner Bud Adams rarely was in the facility during Haynesworth's seven seasons in Tennessee.

Like I said when I started this thread, it looks like Haynesworth is becoming a problem. I don't care who you are, if you don't want to be here, you are not going to give 100%. Then if you're talking about a guy who has never played more than about 12 games and 60-70% of the snaps in those games, it is hard to see him playing all out for the Skins this year.

As recent as today, he's not even requesting a trade. He's said he'll do what is asked of him. He's working out with the same ppl that got him to the pro bowl. He and Shanahan/Haslett have had convo and none of them have shown anything negative towards him or his workout regimen that was established BEFORE the current administration was in place.

Where is that problem besides you not liking Haynesworth?

[SkinsJock]

As recent as today, he's not even requesting a trade. He's said he'll do what is asked of him. He's working out with the same ppl that got him to the pro bowl. He and Shanahan/Haslett have had convo and none of them have shown anything negative towards him or his workout regimen that was established BEFORE the current administration was in place.

Where is that a problem?

I agree Vet - I just heard Haynesworth on tape from a recent interview (ESPN 980) and he voiced concern that he felt he might not be suited to the NT position BUT at the same time he clearly said that he was going to be fine with doing whatever the coaches wanted him to do

He sounded like he was looking forward to being a part of this defense - this interview sounded positive to me


this guy is a force defensively and I think that both Shanahan and Haslett are looking forward to having him be a part of this franchise - I think that Haynesworth is doing what he thinks will help him be as good as he can be and it sounds to me like he's doing it with a positive attitude

[CanesSkins26]

He and Shanahan/Haslett have had convo and none of them have shown anything negative towards him or his workout regimen that was established BEFORE the current administration was in place.

Not exactly...

Haynesworth said that new coach Mike Shanahan doesn't agree with the approach, but that Shanahan said he respects Haynesworth for being candid about it.

Clearly Shanahan isn't happy that Haynesworth isn't working out with the team. Now, is it a big deal? No. But it's pretty obvious that there is some tension between Big Al and the team. As long as it doesn't turn from being something small (which it is now) to something big there is no real problem, but to pretend that everything is 100 percent cool is ignoring the obvious.

[PulpExposure]

He and Shanahan/Haslett have had convo and none of them have shown anything negative towards him or his workout regimen that was established BEFORE the current administration was in place.

Not exactly...

Haynesworth said that new coach Mike Shanahan doesn't agree with the approach, but that Shanahan said he respects Haynesworth for being candid about it.

Clearly Shanahan isn't happy that Haynesworth isn't working out with the team. Now, is it a big deal? No. But it's pretty obvious that there is some tension between Big Al and the team. As long as it doesn't turn from being something small (which it is now) to something big there is no real problem, but to pretend that everything is 100 percent cool is ignoring the obvious.

I actually understand Haynesworth's position on this. He came to DC with assurances that he'd be allowed to play DT in a 4-3, as a penetrator. Then last year, he played different role than what he was told he would play. And now he's switching to a different position in a different defense.

I'd be pissed, too. I mean, he had other options, where he presumably would have been allowed to play the position as he wanted to. There's some amount of you having to be a good soldier, but imho if you can't trust the organization you work for to keep their word, you do have a right to be pissed off about it. And at this time, he's actually pretty mild in expressing his disappointment so far.

[TeeterSalad]

I dont think Big Al intended on playing on a squad that would only win 4 games in 2009 and that probably stings a little too. Winning and being a solid team would probably change his mind about the 3-4, at least a little.

[CanesSkins26]

He and Shanahan/Haslett have had convo and none of them have shown anything negative towards him or his workout regimen that was established BEFORE the current administration was in place.

Not exactly...

Haynesworth said that new coach Mike Shanahan doesn't agree with the approach, but that Shanahan said he respects Haynesworth for being candid about it.

Clearly Shanahan isn't happy that Haynesworth isn't working out with the team. Now, is it a big deal? No. But it's pretty obvious that there is some tension between Big Al and the team. As long as it doesn't turn from being something small (which it is now) to something big there is no real problem, but to pretend that everything is 100 percent cool is ignoring the obvious.

I actually understand Haynesworth's position on this. He came to DC with assurances that he'd be allowed to play DT in a 4-3, as a penetrator. Then last year, he played different role than what he was told he would play. And now he's switching to a different position in a different defense.

I'd be pissed, too. I mean, he had other options, where he presumably would have been allowed to play the position as he wanted to. There's some amount of you having to be a good soldier, but imho if you can't trust the organization you work for to keep their word, you do have a right to be pissed off about it. And at this time, he's actually pretty mild in expressing his disappointment so far.

Agree 100%.

[TeeterSalad]

Lavar tears into Big Al here....

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/03/lavar_arrington_slams_albert_h.html

[fleetus]

"Last year, I worked out with the Redskins, and the year that we had and all that stuff wasn't great, by any means," Haynesworth said. "I'm getting back to basics, what got me to be one of the top defensive players in the NFL, and that's what I plan on doing."

Haynesworth said that new coach Mike Shanahan doesn't agree with the approach, but that Shanahan said he respects Haynesworth for being candid about it. Haynesworth also was very complimentary of the ability to approach and talk to Shanahan.

But the relationship is strained, for now. Haynesworth isn't happy with the switch to a 3-4, but he acknowledges that there's nothing he can do about it, given that he's under contract in D.C. "Whatever they ask me to do, that's what I'm gonna do," he said, with what seemed to be more than a hint of resignation in his voice.

Haynesworth also suggested that if he knew in early 2009 what he knows now, he possibly would have signed with a different team. He pointed to having "too many chiefs" in D.C., and while he stopped short of saying that owner Daniel Snyder is too involved, Haynesworth pointed out that Titans owner Bud Adams rarely was in the facility during Haynesworth's seven seasons in Tennessee.

Like I said when I started this thread, it looks like Haynesworth is becoming a problem. I don't care who you are, if you don't want to be here, you are not going to give 100%. Then if you're talking about a guy who has never played more than about 12 games and 60-70% of the snaps in those games, it is hard to see him playing all out for the Skins this year.

As recent as today, he's not even requesting a trade. He's said he'll do what is asked of him. He's working out with the same ppl that got him to the pro bowl. He and Shanahan/Haslett have had convo and none of them have shown anything negative towards him or his workout regimen that was established BEFORE the current administration was in place.

Where is that problem besides you not liking Haynesworth?

Never said I didn't like Haynesworth. I don't like some things haynesworth has done. Big difference. if Haynesworth comes to camp in tip top shape and plays his butt off, I will like Haynesworth. But based on things he has said and done, I don't predict he will do his job to the level he is paying paid. That makes him a liability to the Redskins.

I also think the term "penetrator" is being over-used. Haynesworth is a 330 lbs DT. Even in a 4-3 his job has always been to be an immoveable object against the run plus a good pocket collapser against the pass. Yes, he is very agile for his size and is definitely an asset against the pass as a pass rusher. But he is not Dwight Freeney (even Freeney is expected to use strength and positioning against the run much of the time). I am sure Jeff Fisher expected Haynesworth to control the line of scrimmage on as many downs as he asked him to get into the backfield (probably more). If all he did was try to penetrate, every Center and Guard in the league would simply steer him away from the running play like a matador. Haynesworth knows how to stand up a lineman to clog the line of scrimmage. He may not want to play a two gap NT all the time, sure. But DE in the 3-4 will be almost identical to 4-3 DT and he is not going to be somehow losing his ability to rush the passer in the 3-4. People need to understand this and get past it.

[vwoodzpusha]

Lavar tears into Big Al here....

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/03/lavar_arrington_slams_albert_h.html

Wow...Lavar doesnt hold back....

He has some good points tho...

[broomboy]

Lavar tears into Big Al here....

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/03/lavar_arrington_slams_albert_h.html

Wow...Lavar doesnt hold back....

He has some good points tho...

May have some points in there but it's sandwiched between a whole lot of temper tantrum.