Tebow's Our Future Leader Get Used To It

[VetSkinsFan]

Looks like Tebow has a new delivery and the scouts are impressed with what they seen on Floridas pro day.

Now if only someone could teach him how to read a defense, he'd be set!

Thats pretty funny mr sarcastic.

I am not saying the Skins should draft him or make him high on the priority list. I just think he will turn out to be a good player. That being said I wouldnt cry about the Skins drafting him either.

Besides how do you come to such a conclusion of Tebow not being able to read a defense? The guy had 50 tds in one season. How in the world can he not read a defense.

When a man scores 50 Tds in one season you think you would give him the benefit of the doubt.

42% of those touchdowns that year were rushes. And that year he had a 3:5 rush:pass ratio. I see the odds stacked against him in the NFL as a QB. He won't be that successful as a rushing QB.

[Countertrey]

Looks like Tebow has a new delivery and the scouts are impressed with what they seen on Floridas pro day.

Now if only someone could teach him how to read a defense, he'd be set!

Thats pretty funny mr sarcastic.

I am not saying the Skins should draft him or make him high on the priority list. I just think he will turn out to be a good player. That being said I wouldnt cry about the Skins drafting him either.

I don't see anyone disputing that. A young man with his level of discipline, determination, raw talent, and leadership, will ultimately succeed, baring some disaster.

The problem is, he is very raw. He is a multiyear project. The Redskins CANNOT afford to tie up a high pick with a multiyear project.

If he is availible later in the draft, sure. I doubt that he makes it to the 4th round, much less later.

We will not be using our 2nd round pick on Tebow. Looking at him in an individual workout has a purpose, though... it will make other teams that are interested in him more nervous, and help to move him up the draft board. This will increase the chance that a player that we would like at #37 is there. (our "interest" in a certain QB last year may have helped to keep Orakpo on the board last year... bonus!)

[BigRedskinDaddy]

All this quasi-serious talk about us drafting Tebow w/our FIRST RD PICK (or any of our picks, for that matter) makes me think I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue...

[Countertrey]

Welcome to the Bizarro Universe.


Where the glue is better than cheap... it's free!

And certain people want to trade down for 3 picks, and then to use all of them on Tebow.

[BigRedskinDaddy]

Welcome to the Bizarro Universe.


Where the glue is better than cheap... it's free!

And certain people want to trade down for 3 picks, and then to use all of them on Tebow.

- as if we could get him for just 3 picks...now THAT'S crazy.

[Gibbs4Life]

And certain people want to trade down for 3 picks, and then to use all of them on Tebow.

At the end of the day as long as we get our man

[Manchester_Redskin]

I think Holmgrem sums it up quite well...

The Plain Dealer reported that Browns president Mike Holmgren has reservations about Tebow’s new throwing motion. Holmgren believes he may go back to his old motion when he’s under pressure.

"I just think in the heat of battle guys will usually revert," said Holmgren, who attended Tebow’s pro day earlier this week. "I think, and I told him this, that he was so thinking about his mechanics that at times it looked a little robotic."

Here is the link

Its all well and good Tebow demonstrating his new action in the comfort zone of a work out, quite another when he is about to pummeled into the middle of next week by a couple of maraurding linemen.

[CanesSkins26]

I think Holmgrem sums it up quite well...

The Plain Dealer reported that Browns president Mike Holmgren has reservations about Tebow’s new throwing motion. Holmgren believes he may go back to his old motion when he’s under pressure.

"I just think in the heat of battle guys will usually revert," said Holmgren, who attended Tebow’s pro day earlier this week. "I think, and I told him this, that he was so thinking about his mechanics that at times it looked a little robotic."

Here is the link

Its all well and good Tebow demonstrating his new action in the comfort zone of a work out, quite another when he is about to pummeled into the middle of next week by a couple of maraurding linemen.

Great point by Holmgren. The motion, as much of a problem as it is, isn't even Tebow's biggest problem, which is reading defenses and running an offense. The offense that UF ran with Tebow under Mullen (before he left) and Meyer was nothing close to an NFL offense. It was designed to let Tebow run and to get the ball into the hands of playmaker like Harvin. There wasn't a lot of down field passing and not a lot of complex reads for Tebow to make. In those games where Tebow's running game was shut down or UF got down and had to play catch up, Tebow struggled when the offense became a pass-first offense and just didn't look at all comfortable having to stay in the pocket and make reads.

[Chris Luva Luva]

I think Holmgrem sums it up quite well...

The Plain Dealer reported that Browns president Mike Holmgren has reservations about Tebow’s new throwing motion. Holmgren believes he may go back to his old motion when he’s under pressure.

"I just think in the heat of battle guys will usually revert," said Holmgren, who attended Tebow’s pro day earlier this week. "I think, and I told him this, that he was so thinking about his mechanics that at times it looked a little robotic."

Here is the link

Its all well and good Tebow demonstrating his new action in the comfort zone of a work out, quite another when he is about to pummeled into the middle of next week by a couple of maraurding linemen.

Great point by Holmgren. The motion, as much of a problem as it is, isn't even Tebow's biggest problem, which is reading defenses and running an offense. The offense that UF ran with Tebow under Mullen (before he left) and Meyer was nothing close to an NFL offense. It was designed to let Tebow run and to get the ball into the hands of playmaker like Harvin. There wasn't a lot of down field passing and not a lot of complex reads for Tebow to make. In those games where Tebow's running game was shut down or UF got down and had to play catch up, Tebow struggled when the offense became a pass-first offense and just didn't look at all comfortable having to stay in the pocket and make reads.

For a team not looking to start him for 1-2 years, he'd be a decent project I guess. He brings some extra to the table but he def doesn't have all primary things as of yet.

[Countertrey]

I think Holmgrem sums it up quite well...

The Plain Dealer reported that Browns president Mike Holmgren has reservations about Tebow’s new throwing motion. Holmgren believes he may go back to his old motion when he’s under pressure.

"I just think in the heat of battle guys will usually revert," said Holmgren, who attended Tebow’s pro day earlier this week. "I think, and I told him this, that he was so thinking about his mechanics that at times it looked a little robotic."

Here is the link

Its all well and good Tebow demonstrating his new action in the comfort zone of a work out, quite another when he is about to pummeled into the middle of next week by a couple of maraurding linemen.

Great point by Holmgren. The motion, as much of a problem as it is, isn't even Tebow's biggest problem, which is reading defenses and running an offense. The offense that UF ran with Tebow under Mullen (before he left) and Meyer was nothing close to an NFL offense. It was designed to let Tebow run and to get the ball into the hands of playmaker like Harvin. There wasn't a lot of down field passing and not a lot of complex reads for Tebow to make. In those games where Tebow's running game was shut down or UF got down and had to play catch up, Tebow struggled when the offense became a pass-first offense and just didn't look at all comfortable having to stay in the pocket and make reads.

Y'all know where I stand on Tebow, and what I am about to say does not change that.

I think Holmgren is wrong. New muscle motor patterns can be made permanent.

There is no muscle activity more complicated than speech. When I was very young, I had a significant speech impediment. Working with a very good speech therapist, over many months, that was corrected. I can remember being very conscious of how I formed words... it was mechanical, "robotic". However, over many months, it became completely automatic, to the point that I could no longer duplicate my impediment, no matter how hard I tried. No matter how stressed, I did not revert.

The point is, trained muscle memory becomes permanent after enough repetitions. If Tebow wants to be a quarterback, and can find a team that is willing to wait for him while he trains up, he will, I believe, be a very good one. He clearly has the discipline to make himself be true to his mechanics work, until he is no longer robotic, and he no longer risks slipping back into his old mechanics when the world around him falls apart.

The Redskins, IMO, are not a team that can afford to wait. Tebow will not be a Redskin, not because he can't do it... but because he can't do it quickly enough.

[PulpExposure]

I think Holmgren is wrong. New muscle motor patterns can be made permanent.

There is no muscle activity more complicated than speech. When I was very young, I had a significant speech impediment. Working with a very good speech therapist, over many months, that was corrected.

Differences here are that you were very young (and you know how quickly children can learn), and Tebow's been using this throwing motion for probably a decade. That's a lot of unlearning.

Does it mean it's impossible? No. But when you have to fix someone's throwing motion, AND teach them how to read a defense...that's a lot. Even for demigod Tim Tebow.

[Countertrey]

I think Holmgren is wrong. New muscle motor patterns can be made permanent.

There is no muscle activity more complicated than speech. When I was very young, I had a significant speech impediment. Working with a very good speech therapist, over many months, that was corrected.

Differences here are that you were very young (and you know how quickly children can learn), and Tebow's been using this throwing motion for probably a decade. That's a lot of unlearning.

Does it mean it's impossible? No. But when you have to fix someone's throwing motion, AND teach them how to read a defense...that's a lot. Even for demigod Tim Tebow.

When I say "very young", I mean about 10/11. Not a great deal of advantage over an adult.

He needn't "unlearn" anything. It's a matter of replacing an old pattern... not of "unlearning"... and it is a finite pattern. Essentially a single group of muscle movements, repeated ad infinitum. Because it is limited in its breadth, it is not as difficult as you suspect...

If you, as an adult, have to learn to speak a single sentence in Spanish to perfection (actually a more complex motor task than throwing a ball), you would be able to do this without a lot of difficulty... over a few months... all you need is persistence, a coachable attitude, and a good coach.

Teaching the throwing motion, and learning to read NFL defenses are two entirely different tasks... the latter being far more cerebral than the former, which is little more than repetition under direct coaching. Tebow probably has the persistence and discipline to do both... but considering that no one is likely to ask him to win a game for several years, that's not really a big deal, is it?

My opinion is that Holmgren is wrong. That hasn't changed.

[PulpExposure]

I think Holmgren is wrong. New muscle motor patterns can be made permanent.

There is no muscle activity more complicated than speech. When I was very young, I had a significant speech impediment. Working with a very good speech therapist, over many months, that was corrected.

Differences here are that you were very young (and you know how quickly children can learn), and Tebow's been using this throwing motion for probably a decade. That's a lot of unlearning.

Does it mean it's impossible? No. But when you have to fix someone's throwing motion, AND teach them how to read a defense...that's a lot. Even for demigod Tim Tebow.

When I say "very young", I mean about 10/11. Not a great deal of advantage over an adult.

He needn't "unlearn" anything. It's a matter of replacing an old pattern... not of "unlearning"... and it is a finite pattern. Essentially a single group of muscle movements, repeated ad infinitum. Because it is limited in its breadth, it is not as difficult as you suspect...

If you, as an adult, have to learn to speak a single sentence in Spanish to perfection (actually a more complex motor task than throwing a ball), you would be able to do this without a lot of difficulty... over a few months... all you need is persistence, a coachable attitude, and a good coach.

I'd say that throwing a football is a wee bit harder than memorizing one phrase in a language we're familiar with. In the former, you're throwing the ball under pressure, to different spots on the field, with varying degrees of lift and velocity.

In the other, it's just memorization. Hollywood actors/actresses can replicate accents fairly well, and do it in no time, and there are legions of such people (especially think of the English/Australian actors who mimic "American" accents to near perfection).

I can't think of many successful NFL QBs who have rebuilt their throwing motion, however. Maybe that's just my ignorance, but I seriously cannot think of any?

Just FYI on that throwing session:

For all the positives, though, there were still some negatives and glimpses of his old delivery. We counted four times when Tebow clearly went back to his old windmill motion and dropped the ball near his hip when winding up to throw. Two of those instances came late in the session when he was tiring, the other two when he was trying to put some extra heat on intermediate throws.

Or:

The early results were good, as Tebow shortened his delivery and showed good velocity on short routes. As the workout continued, Tebow's flaws began to surface as he now has a pause in his throwing motion and when he rolled out, his arm would drop just as it did before. Tebow struggled as the day went on with accuracy throwing outs as his receivers had to wait or come back for the football and rarely did an out hit a receiver on the numbers. In summation, Tebow looked better throwing the football than he did in Mobile, but as one NFL scout told me, "If he didn't wear an orange Florida helmet he'd be a sixth- or seventh-round pick."

As soon as he got tired/couldn't concentrate, he reverted to his old delivery. That's not exactly comforting, since he was throwing in a controlled environment, with zero pass rush pressure on him.

[BigRedskinDaddy]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, come what may this draft: anyone who goes higher than 3rd round on TT, OR drafts him as anything other than a TE/H-back/FB. is an idiot...period.

No ifs, ands or buts.

That said, however...I've been wrong before.

[Gibbs4Life]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft10/n ... id=5037036

Bill Belichick had a private dinner w/TT, I doubt he's afraid to take him late in round 1. If we pass on a qb @4 we could miss out on Tebow at #37

[KazooSkinsFan]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft10/news/story?id=5037036

Bill Belichick had a private dinner w/TT, I doubt he's afraid to take him late in round 1. If we pass on a qb @4 we could miss out on Tebow at #37

I sleep with a revolver in the night stand. If that happens, I'll just end it right there...

[SkinsJock]

IF we cannot get Bradford then we should get as many offensive linemen as we can

we do not need a project QB - we need a great QB

[SkinsJock]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft10/news/story?id=5037036

Bill Belichick had a private dinner w/TT, I doubt he's afraid to take him late in round 1. If we pass on a qb @4 we could miss out on Tebow at #37

I sleep with a revolver in the night stand. If that happens, I'll just end it right there...

I'd be done too but that ain't happening

[djactionman]

Guys like Bellicheck can do whatever they want.


And I like Tebow, he seems like a great kid, I wish him all the best. But, he really does need some refining. After the Senior Bowl I have a lot of questions about him, he will need to learn a lot of things. He's not going to be able to pull of the same stuff at the NFL level. He can't just take up and pick up the first down with his feet as easily as he is used to, but the threat will allow him to throw more and with confidence. He needs to be able to go through his progressions and read defenses to succeed.
One thing though that I will give:
He appears to be a VERY coachable and sharp guy with football. Shanny can get this guy to succeed. There are plenty of coaches that know similar things and wouldn't be afraid to take him.
There are many teams that can pull that trigger and not look back, only takes one. I don't think he's going to fall out of the second round like people might say. People will trade up for him with the fear that they won't be able to wait.

[djactionman]

Guys like Bellicheck can do whatever they want.


And I like Tebow, he seems like a great kid, I wish him all the best. But, he really does need some refining. After the Senior Bowl I have a lot of questions about him, he will need to learn a lot of things. He's not going to be able to pull of the same stuff at the NFL level. He can't just take up and pick up the first down with his feet as easily as he is used to, but the threat will allow him to throw more and with confidence. He needs to be able to go through his progressions and read defenses to succeed.
One thing though that I will give:
He appears to be a VERY coachable and sharp guy with football. Shanny can get this guy to succeed. There are plenty of coaches that know similar things and wouldn't be afraid to take him.
There are many teams that can pull that trigger and not look back, only takes one. I don't think he's going to fall out of the second round like people might say. People will trade up for him with the fear that they won't be able to wait.

[Countertrey]

Guys like Bellicheck can do whatever they want.

This is absolutely true. The teams that are most likely to take a chance on Tebow are those that are already wealthy. They can afford the luxury of working with a project QB over an extended period of time. They also have spare picks they can waste, and plenty of overall talent in the hopper already.

[Gibbs4Life]

La Canfora said on Total Access today that the Patriots and the Seahawks could be looking to cut in front of us at 37 to take TT.

[andyjens89]

La Canfora said on Total Access today that the Patriots and the Seahawks could be looking to cut in front of us at 37 to take TT.

Hopefully they will trade WITH us

[fleetus]

No, Patriots have plenty of extra picks, as always, so they have more flexibility to move wherever they need to. Plus, you don't trade with a team in order to take a player that team wants also.

Every QB coming out of college needs ALOT of work to become a good NFL QB. This is what makes Tebow so intriguing. He knows he has to work hard to achieve greatness and we all know he will work like a dog until he gets it done. You look at some of these QB's coming out of college (J. Russel, Leinert etc) and they think they are stars before ever going to training camp. The number one attribute I would look for in a QB is work ethic. It is what has made Peyton Manning a star.

[langleyparkjoe]

Work ethic? Well Tebow definitely has that for sure