have any of you seen this... horrifying!

[RedskinjXd]

not sure if this belongs in this section... i am sure it will be moved. but is a story about a redskins cheerleader. i thought it was a joke at first, but i have found nothing to prove it to be untrue. it is really, really sad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGT0r-udstQ

[frankcal20]

Dude - that's terrible.

[Irn-Bru]

You are right that this belongs in the Lounge. Moving there.

And yes, this story is mortifying. So tragic.

[RedskinTexan]

What a tragic story. Sad!

[RayNAustin]

Yes this is horrific ... I ran across this story of city-data forum under health and wellness.

And I've posted a lot of information warning of these flu vaccines and the dangers on that board ... several threads were abruptly closed ... a poll was taken "will you take the flu vaccine" 67% said NO and they closed the poll after only about 60 or so voted.

I haven't brought this subject up here because such topics in my experience have been ridiculed. But, I do feel I've been remiss in not doing so ... so here goes ...

Many facts, if they were universally disseminated by the media would cause the majority not to take these flu vaccines or any others:

1) the flu vaccines are virtually useless for several reasons. None the least of which involves the fact that flu viruses mutate rapidly, and if there is not a match between the circulating virus and the virus that the manufacturer's chose months in advance (a guess) the vaccine is useless. Moreover, those who are most vulnerable to flu infection (those with weak immune systems) don't produce the antibody response to the vaccine, and are consequently left unprotected while assuming the risks of side effects. Conversely, those with strong immune systems capable of producing the antibody response are also capable of defeating flu infection, so they don't need it. And, there is a long list of caveats regarding the fact that you can still catch the flu even if vaccinated.

2) FluMist H1N1 attenuated live virus nasal vaccine manufacturer MedImmune states in their own product documentation that they really don't even know how immunity works regarding influenza ... "Mechanisms conferring protection against influenza infection after the administration of FluMist vaccine are not fully understood. Likewise, natural immunity to wild type influenza infection has not been completely elucidated.

3) Baxter Pharmaceutical last December shipped seasonal flu H3N2 vaccine to several European countries that were contaminated with the very deadly H5N1 avian flu virus. It was discovered in the Czech Republic before being administered to the population when health officials there tested the vaccine on ferrets, all of which died. Experts in the field note that protocols under level 3 bio security could not have allowed this type of contamination accidentally. Just not possible. Many believe this was an attempt by Baxter to create a pandemic of H5N1 which is not easily transmitted to humans on its own, by mixing it with the very easily transmitted H3N2 virus. Yet, Baxter, whether criminally negligent or worse, is now involved with the World Health Organization for producing H1N1 swine flu vaccines.

4) The complete lack of care within the vaccine industry in general is nothing short of chilling. As an example, Maurice Hilleman, former chief virologist for Merck Pharmaceutical is credited with creating more vaccines than any other man in the world. He's touted in a book labeled "The Man That Saved You Life", calling on his work with the polio vaccine as well as a dozen others. What is not highlighted is the damning information that he (self admitted in an audio interview) was responsible for importing into the US the AIDS virus via infected African Green monkeys, which brought on an inconceivable roar of laughter from those around the conference table ... with comments like "What Merck won't do to create a vacine hahahah". Later in the discussion Hilleman told of his discovery of the SV40 cancer virus that he found in the polio vaccines from Merck that was created before he arrived, noting that the test animals all developed cancer tumors. These vaccines were in trial testing in Russia, and he said that the US might do well in the Olympics with all of the Russians weighed down with tumors ... and another chilling roar of laughter erupted.

Heres the link to listen for yourself:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=327_1195303011

After review of this information, you'd have to be out of your mind to trust these ghouls with your health and well being.

If this isn't the most dramatic example of sociopathic lack of human values, I don't know what could be. Pure evil, and certainly not to be trusted.

[VetSkinsFan]

I'm not arguing against you, but don't we trust a lot of people with our livelyhoods? Pesticides, treatments, medicines; they're all out of our control and usually above our intellect level. Additionally, most studies that are done are done under an agenda by the entity who funds it. Tobacco companies aren't trying to do studies that prove, theyir product causes cancer; in fact, they're trying to either disprove an already present theory against their products or something else to support their agenda.

Ultimately, it's what the individual feels safe with. Ignorance usually flocks with the general consensus. My advice is do the research and make the call that you feel comfortable with. After all, you have to live with the results of your decisions just as the tragic results of this young lady does. Hindsight is always 20/20.

[cvillehog]

Not trying to jump into a heated debate here, but Wired recently had a cover feature on fears over vaccines titled An Epidemic of Fear: How Panicked Parents Skipping Shots Endangers Us All

Excerpt:

In May, The New England Journal of Medicine laid the blame for clusters of disease outbreaks throughout the US squarely at the feet of declining vaccination rates, while nonprofit health care provider Kaiser Permanente reported that unvaccinated children were 23 times more likely to get pertussis, a highly contagious bacterial disease that causes violent coughing and is potentially lethal to infants. In the June issue of the journal Pediatrics, Jason Glanz, an epidemiologist at Kaiser’s Institute for Health Research, revealed that the number of reported pertussis cases jumped from 1,000 in 1976 to 26,000 in 2004. A disease that vaccines made rare, in other words, is making a comeback. “This study helps dispel one of the commonly held beliefs among vaccine-refusing parents: that their children are not at risk for vaccine-preventable diseases,” Glanz says.

The bottom line seems to be that refusing vaccines isn't a way to eliminate a risk, it simply trades one risk for another. For the poor girl mentioned above, she had a terrible reaction to the vaccine, but you (or your infant) may catch a fatal or debilitating disease because of a skipped vaccine.

Just as it's important to know the risks of vaccines, it's important to know the risks of skipping vaccines.

[Irn-Bru]

Just as it's important to know the risks of vaccines, it's important to know the risks of skipping vaccines.

I agree, although that call always lies with the individuals concerned. Wired's talk of skipped vaccines "endangering us all" has its seedy side:

You can’t minimize your individual risk unless your herd, your friends and neighbors, also buy in.

(Aside: which, of course, is true for everything in life. I'm not 100% safe on the road from other drivers unless they all stay off the road, either.)

Also, their implicit endorsement of Paul Offit is chilling. He says:

When it comes to mandating vaccinations, Offit says, Fisher is right about him: He is an adamant supporter.

“I believe in mandates," [he says], "I do.”

Like some other Wired recommendations when it comes to public policy, their views on vaccination can be creepy in its implications, and at its worst downright bigoted. I'm glad creeps like Offit don't have absolute power over other people's bodies . . . yet.

[KazooSkinsFan]

I agree, although that call always lies with the individuals concerned

Dude, the freaking INDIVIDUAL! Are you kidding? That's so passe. Get with the new millennium and stop being such a knuckle dragger. The individual. Now I've heard everything.

[RayNAustin]

Not trying to jump into a heated debate here, but Wired recently had a cover feature on fears over vaccines titled An Epidemic of Fear: How Panicked Parents Skipping Shots Endangers Us All

Excerpt:

In May, The New England Journal of Medicine laid the blame for clusters of disease outbreaks throughout the US squarely at the feet of declining vaccination rates, while nonprofit health care provider Kaiser Permanente reported that unvaccinated children were 23 times more likely to get pertussis, a highly contagious bacterial disease that causes violent coughing and is potentially lethal to infants. In the June issue of the journal Pediatrics, Jason Glanz, an epidemiologist at Kaiser’s Institute for Health Research, revealed that the number of reported pertussis cases jumped from 1,000 in 1976 to 26,000 in 2004. A disease that vaccines made rare, in other words, is making a comeback. “This study helps dispel one of the commonly held beliefs among vaccine-refusing parents: that their children are not at risk for vaccine-preventable diseases,” Glanz says.

The bottom line seems to be that refusing vaccines isn't a way to eliminate a risk, it simply trades one risk for another. For the poor girl mentioned above, she had a terrible reaction to the vaccine, but you (or your infant) may catch a fatal or debilitating disease because of a skipped vaccine.

Just as it's important to know the risks of vaccines, it's important to know the risks of skipping vaccines.

The except you posted is the foundation for perhaps the greatest lie ever accepted as the truth. I can't even begin to address it except to say that it is the exact, and complete opposite of the truth.

The entire field of immunology has been an unadvertised historic failure, and an affront to mankind. It's value perceived by an unwitting public has been built upon lies, ignorance, and blind trust. We've been taught to trust what we are told, and we do so without questioning.

But a careful look at the history of vaccines paint a much different picture than the one accepted as the truth today. That truth being that contrary to all of the alleged value and benefits, there is not a shred of pure, unbiased evidence to support any benefit from vaccines whatsoever, other than the massive financial benefits to the medical establishment. In every case throughout the long and insidious history, mass vaccination programs, including mandatory ones have been forced to terminate due to the massive damage to health inflicted by them. Yet the lies keep recycling as if those things never happened. Populations that were vaccinated against any particular disease (pick one) have experienced greater spread and larger death tolls from that disease than in the populations that were not vaccinated. Every time.

So, the risk-benefit argument only applies when there are actual benefits to measure. In the case of vaccines ... you take the risk, and the pharmaceutical companies reap the only benefits.

And whenever challenged, the vaccine proponents always cite the the great and victorious Polio vaccine that eradicated that dreadful disease, and even fewer challenge that worn out lie. The fact is, Polio had declined by over 70% prior to the development of the vaccine. But even more telling is that in measuring the rate of that 70% decline, and then measuring the subsequent rate of decline after widespread use of the Polio vaccine, that rate slowed, indicating that if anything, the vaccine actually prolonged the life of the disease by a couple of decades.

But the value and effectiveness of vaccines have been so drummed into our minds fro childhood onward, most cannot even entertain the possibility that they cause a great deal of harm without a shred of value. Their value has been nothing more than a lie told so often and for so long, that it has become the accepted truth.

Your response proves this. And you are not alone.

[Countertrey]

Many facts, if they were universally disseminated by the media would cause the majority not to take these flu vaccines or any others:

1) the flu vaccines are virtually useless for several reasons. None the least of which involves the fact that flu viruses mutate rapidly,

Untrue. Hyperbole aside, even with mutation, the vaccine usually offers some protection, and can moderate the course of the infection.

and if there is not a match between the circulating virus and the virus that the manufacturer's chose months in advance (a guess) the vaccine is useless.

Partly True... though the "guess", as you call it, is based on prevalence of certain viral strains in host populations. That's the reason the seasonal vaccine is "trivalent"... there's an excellent chance, generally validated by the flu season, that one or more of them are correct.

Moreover, those who are most vulnerable to flu infection (those with weak immune systems) don't produce the antibody response to the vaccine, and are consequently left unprotected while assuming the risks of side effects. Conversely, those with strong immune systems capable of producing the antibody response are also capable of defeating flu infection, so they don't need it. And, there is a long list of caveats regarding the fact that you can still catch the flu even if vaccinated.

I'm sure there's a point in here somewhere... the fact is FAR more people suffer debilitating long term consequences or death from the flu than from the vaccine annually. This woman's suffering is a tragedy for her. Others will receive the vaccine and be protected. Many who do not get the vaccine will die, or suffer other long term consequences. As many as the government expects? Probably not. The tragedy is, the government has probably panicked and over reacted. They will squander public confidence in declarations of national emergencies, and will not react appropriately in the future. In a "Spanish flu" type of epidemic, that will be a disaster. The villain here is an international governmental panic that gained it's own momentum, and took over reason... The vaccine is not the villain. In a real killer flu pandemic, it would save millions. This does not appear to be a killer flu.

2) FluMist H1N1 attenuated live virus nasal vaccine manufacturer MedImmune states in their own product documentation that they really don't even know how immunity works regarding influenza ... "Mechanisms conferring protection against influenza infection after the administration of FluMist vaccine are not fully understood. Likewise, natural immunity to wild type influenza infection has not been completely elucidated.

Now, here is an interesting straw man. Let's see... we still don't understand the mechanism that permits Aspirin and Tylenol to allieviate pain and fever. There are literally thousands of effective phamacotherapeutic agents that we don't understand the mechanism of action for... yet, they work. Guess we should just abandon all of them. We also don't understand the mechanisms that confer immunity offered by even the smallpox vaccine... good thing we didn't abandon that one based on this. There would still be millions of deaths from smallpox, instead of.... zero.

3) Baxter Pharmaceutical last December shipped seasonal flu H3N2 vaccine to several European countries that were contaminated with the very deadly H5N1 avian flu virus. It was discovered in the Czech Republic before being administered to the population when health officials there tested the vaccine on ferrets, all of which died. Experts in the field note that protocols under level 3 bio security could not have allowed this type of contamination accidentally. Just not possible. Many believe this was an attempt by Baxter to create a pandemic of H5N1 which is not easily transmitted to humans on its own, by mixing it with the very easily transmitted H3N2 virus. Yet, Baxter, whether criminally negligent or worse, is now involved with the World Health Organization for producing H1N1 swine flu vaccines.

Have you actually seen the source for this "allegation"?
Are you serious???? By the way, this woman also claims that the 1917/1918 Spanish Flu pandemic was the result of US soldiers getting vaccinated for the flu. I'll let you think about the implications of that.


4) The complete lack of care within the vaccine industry in general is nothing short of chilling. As an example, Maurice Hilleman, former chief virologist for Merck Pharmaceutical is credited with creating more vaccines than any other man in the world. He's touted in a book labeled "The Man That Saved You Life", calling on his work with the polio vaccine as well as a dozen others. What is not highlighted is the damning information that he (self admitted in an audio interview) was responsible for importing into the US the AIDS virus via infected African Green monkeys, which brought on an inconceivable roar of laughter from those around the conference table ... with comments like "What Merck won't do to create a vacine hahahah". Later in the discussion Hilleman told of his discovery of the SV40 cancer virus that he found in the polio vaccines from Merck that was created before he arrived, noting that the test animals all developed cancer tumors. These vaccines were in trial testing in Russia, and he said that the US might do well in the Olympics with all of the Russians weighed down with tumors ... and another chilling roar of laughter erupted. [/quote]

Care to source this one?



I'll get mine as soon as it's available.

Again, this woman's horrible misfortune should not be an opportunity for conspiracy theorists to spread their pap.

Has the government over reacted to this? Probably. In so doing, they will undermine the confidence of individuals, who will in the future see no reason to react when there is a real threat. THAT is the crime here... not the vaccine.

[RayNAustin]

Partly True... though the "guess", as you call it, is based on prevalence of certain viral strains in host populations. That's the reason the seasonal vaccine is "trivalent"... there's an excellent chance, generally validated by the flu season, that one or more of them are correct.

Darn, didn't realize you were a doctor too? Look Doctor, you nor anyone else can even cite proof that any vaccine works, but I've already explained why that is. As for the guess .... that's exactly what it is and it's just as likely to be wrong as it is right. But you'll never know that because when it's not a match, they still pump it into the sheeple even though it's worthless, and they SAY NOTHING.

I'm sure there's a point in here somewhere... the fact is FAR more people suffer debilitating long term consequences or death from the flu than from the vaccine annually. This woman's suffering is a tragedy for her. Others will receive the vaccine and be protected.

Yes, the point is obvious, but apparently I need to spell it out even more clearly for you. Weak immune systems are INCAPABLE of producing sufficient antibody reaction to the vaccine, which is the supposed mechanism of protection. These are the very same people that are at high risk for becoming infected, and suffering the most significant complications. THE VACCINE DOESN'T WORK FOR THEM.

Strong immune systems capable of producing antibody production sufficient to protect them from infection (if that mechanism actually works like they THINK it does) DON'T NEED THE VACCINE because their immune system is working like it is supposed to and will protect them from infection or from serious events subsequent to infection, with worst case being that they are ill for a couple or three days.

Many who do not get the vaccine will die, or suffer other long term consequences.

Total NONSENSE. There have been years where vaccination rates were dramatically reduced due to shortage of of vaccine and the death rate remained UNCHANGED, proving that the claims of vaccines saving lives are totally false.

BTW, do you even know how they measure flu death rates in the first place? They take the entire death rate from all possible complications that could be associated with influenza infection during the period classified as the flu season (such as pneumonia) whether it was actually diagnosed as caused by the flu or not. And there are many other causes for pneumonia. In fact there are over 200 pathogens that exhibit flu like symptom that can lead to pneumonia as well as secondary post operative infections from general surgery that occur all year long. In addition, the ratio death rate suggested for any flu is a totally manufactured number because they have NO IDEA HOW MANY PEOPLE GET THE FLU. They take only the confirmed cases, most of which are serious cases requiring hospitalization, and measure the number who survive versus those who do not. The vast majority of cases of the flu go completely unreported .. commonly dealt with by staying at home, taking tylenol, and sweating it out for a couple of days, just as it has been done for generations. So it's a complete FARCE any % figure cited by the fear mongers that want to sell their vaccines.

As many as the government expects? Probably not. The tragedy is, the government has probably panicked and over reacted. They will squander public confidence in declarations of national emergencies, and will not react appropriately in the future. In a "Spanish flu" type of epidemic, that will be a disaster. The villain here is an international governmental panic that gained it's own momentum, and took over reason... The vaccine is not the villain. In a real killer flu pandemic, it would save millions. This does not appear to be a killer flu.

The tragedy is that there are such a large segment of the population that buys into the fear mongering and willingly line up like sheep to be injected with poison that has no benefit whatsoever except to line pockets of the medical establishment. And the villain is a multinational consortium of pharmaceutical corporations who OWN the medical establishment as well as the crooked politicians that pass laws protecting them from civil damages for the harm that their "SAFE" vaccines might inflict.

Now, here is an interesting straw man. Let's see... we still don't understand the mechanism that permits Aspirin and Tylenol to allieviate pain and fever. There are literally thousands of effective phamacotherapeutic agents that we don't understand the mechanism of action for... yet, they work. Guess we should just abandon all of them. We also don't understand the mechanisms that confer immunity offered by even the smallpox vaccine... good thing we didn't abandon that one based on this. There would still be millions of deaths from smallpox, instead of.... zero.

What total, ridiculous, absurd crap. There is nothing in this blathering nonsense that's true or accurate.

Here ... read about the history of smallpox vaccination. I can't even convey what a total fairy tale the entire smallpox vaccine history is.

http://www.thedoctorwithin.com/smallpox ... o-Life.php

Have you actually seen the source for this "allegation"?
Are you serious???? By the way, this woman also claims that the 1917/1918 Spanish Flu pandemic was the result of US soldiers getting vaccinated for the flu. I'll let you think about the implications of that.

I've thought about it for a nanosecond, and the answer is that your response to this is a complete fraud and a diversion. You take a demonstrably proven fact, find a source that you think you can claim is questionable, associate a completely irrelevant issue to that source to discredit it, and discount the entire story without addressing it. And this intellectual dishonesty is a frequent tactic, typical of a BS artist.

The Czech Republic health authorities reported their findings. It was confirmed H5N1 strain mixed with H3N2 manufactured by Baxter, shipped by Baxter and destined for public distribution in several European countries. Baxter admits it happened,though they claim it was accidental. The only question up for debate is how such an "accident" could possibly occur in a Bio level 3 environment. Experts in the field of microbiology universally consider such an accident impossible.

Care to source this one?

How about from the horse's mouth? Not a story ... not a transcript, but actual words from Maurice Hilleman himself admitting (with much laughter) how he inadvertently introduced the AIDS virus to the US via African green monkeys. And how he discovered cancer viruses in the vaccines on the shelf at Merck.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=327_1195303011

I'll get mine as soon as it's available.

I'm ashamed to say that this knowledge is somewhat pleasing to me.

Again, this woman's horrible misfortune should not be an opportunity for conspiracy theorists to spread their pap.

Your compassion is only exceeded by your inability to accept new information, or recognize well meaning, actual compassion for fellow human beings. None of what I've posted here is conspiracy theory. It's conspiracy fact. If you can't handle the truth, that's your problem. What is not needed is another source of regurgitated commercial propaganda.

Has the government over reacted to this? Probably. In so doing, they will undermine the confidence of individuals, who will in the future see no reason to react when there is a real threat. THAT is the crime here... not the vaccine.

I've got news for you .. the only ones who have confidence in the government or the vaccine makers are brain dead. The crime here is how eager some members of the sheep are to assume the role of the sheep herder, making his job much, much easier.

I find such types extremely distasteful on so many levels.

[Countertrey]

I am not a doctor. However, unlike you, I actually know something of this topic.

As an Army Nurse, I ran many deployment immunization clinics. I have personally administered immunizations to well over 20,000 soldiers in my career, most of those receiving multiple agents. I suppose that would make me a mass murderer in your eyes. The problem is, none of my patients died. I sleep perfectly well at night.

I have also spent large amounts of time providing health care in areas of the world where diseases that no one in the US gets (because of immunization) are endemic.

I have seen first hand what happens when there is no rubella vaccination. You are clearly too young to remember the thousands of children born deaf or otherwise impaired because their mom was exposed to and caught German Measles while she was pregnant. That still happens elsewhere. Oh, sorry... just government propaganda.

I grew up in the 50's, when there was finally an effective vaccine for Polio. Polio is very rare here, now... not so in other countries. I'm sure that was just some kind of magical coincidence.

You've never seen Diptheria, which, in years past, would annually kill thousands during the winter. You've never seen kids die of Pertusis. And, the odds are, you've never had a friend die the agonizing spastic death of Tetanus.

I'd love to vaccinate you, too, someday. I'll throw in a bonus gamma globulin, if you'd like. It's not actually a vaccine, but, if done right, it can sure leave a sore spot for a day or two.

It's just a shame that there is no vaccine to prevent ignorance. Your repetitive use of strawmen and circular logic is just amusing, as well as "fact" from fringe fanatics.

There is a new, cost effective vaccine for Cholera on the very near horizon... that will be another scourge to soon disappear... but, once again, this is probably just another well timed trick. You will soon be able to weep for humanity once again, as another killer of hundreds of thousands a year heads to existence only in history.

[cvillehog]

I am not a doctor. However, unlike you, I actually know something of this topic.

As an Army Nurse, I ran many deployment immunization clinics. I have personally administered immunizations to well over 20,000 soldiers in my career, most of those receiving multiple agents. I suppose that would make me a mass murderer in your eyes. The problem is, none of my patients died. I sleep perfectly well at night.

I have also spent large amounts of time providing health care in areas of the world where diseases that no one in the US gets (because of immunization) are endemic.

I have seen first hand what happens when there is no rubella vaccination. You are clearly too young to remember the thousands of children born deaf or otherwise impaired because their mom was exposed to and caught German Measles while she was pregnant. That still happens elsewhere. Oh, sorry... just government propaganda.

I grew up in the 50's, when there was finally an effective vaccine for Polio. Polio is very rare here, now... not so in other countries. I'm sure that was just some kind of magical coincidence.

You've never seen Diptheria, which, in years past, would annually kill thousands during the winter. You've never seen kids die of Pertusis. And, the odds are, you've never had a friend die the agonizing spastic death of Tetanus.

I'd love to vaccinate you, too, someday. I'll throw in a bonus gamma globulin, if you'd like. It's not actually a vaccine, but, if done right, it can sure leave a sore spot for a day or two.

It's just a shame that there is no vaccine to prevent ignorance. Your repetitive use of strawmen and circular logic is just amusing, as well as "fact" from fringe fanatics.

There is a new, cost effective vaccine for Cholera on the very near horizon... that will be another scourge to soon disappear... but, once again, this is probably just another well timed trick. You will soon be able to weep for humanity once again, as another killer of hundreds of thousands a year heads to existence only in history.

Thank you for making nearly every point that needed to be made, even though I fear it will fall on deaf ears.

It's a real shame that people conflate problems with the flu vaccines (such as they are) with other, extremely necessary vaccines.

[Countertrey]

NP, civillehog... I understand completely what you say.

[Countertrey]

NP, civillehog... I understand completely what you say.

[UK Skins Fan]

Well, you guys are clearly arguing over a topic that I know nothing about. So I'm only left to wonder one thing:


















Is there any way we can pin all this on Jason Campbell?

[RayNAustin]

I am not a doctor. However, unlike you, I actually know something of this topic.

As an Army Nurse, I ran many deployment immunization clinics. I have personally administered immunizations to well over 20,000 soldiers in my career, most of those receiving multiple agents. I suppose that would make me a mass murderer in your eyes. The problem is, none of my patients died. I sleep perfectly well at night.

You are so far removed from reality on this, it's like arguing with a flat earther. You THINK you know something of this topic, but you don't have a single clue. Not one iota.

But let me ask you this .. of those 20,000 vaccinations, would any of them have included undisclosed experimental anthrax vaccines laced with the adjuvant "squalene" given to gulf war vets in the 1990 time frame? Surely, as well learned as you are, you must be aware of the fact that hundreds of thousands of gulf war vets (1 in 4 out of 640,000) are sick and dying from autoimmune and neurological disorders? Or is that just a conspiracy theory too ... ?

Well here's the scoop, in case you are a little behind the times. The DOD, after denying the existence of gulf war illness for two decades, has finally admitted that there is indeed a mysterious gulf war illness after all. Now, they say that it's a combination of chemical/biological agent exposure coupled with pesticides used in the gulf war arena. But this too is a blatant fabrication coming from a group of proven liars, because service men and women that were never even deployed are suffering the same fate, proving that it wasn't chem/bio exposure within the theatre of operations.

You see, its just not at all kosher to implicate any vaccine as causing harm, especially on such a wide scale. Much better to blame Saddam, and his chemical weapons destroyed at Kamacia as the most likely culprit of this terrible disease. It certainly wouldn't be desirable to admit to injecting such a harmful experimental agent into the troops and causing this catastrophe. (one might lose some sleep at night ... fearing prosecution) But that's exactly what happened ... the true culprit was the experimental anthrax vaccine laced with the adjuvant "squalene".

This adjuvant, for those unfamiliar, is an oil that is found elsewhere in the body, as well as in food sources consumed, and is perfectly harmless when consumed. However, when injected, it's purpose is to invoke a hyper immune response, assisting antibody production. Unfortunately, as has been clinically analyzed, the antibody reaction to this foreign substance in the blood is causing an autoimmune response, attacking other areas of the body which squalene is naturally found, manifesting in a host of autoimmune and neurological disorders of dramatic magnitude.

Here is an excerpt from: http://www.whale.to/v/squalene.html

GULF WAR CORRELATION
In science, a correlation does not prove causation. A correlation, however, is grounds to investigate causation, which has led to some troubling data.

After the first Gulf War, many U.S. and British military personnel said they became sick after receiving anthrax immunizations. Scientists at Tulane University Medical School developed an assay showing a correlation between illness and antibodies to squalene. Although this data did not prove conclusively that Gulf War troops were injected with squalene, the data indicated that injection was the only way to develop these antibodies; the implication being that troops had been injected with a squalene-based adjuvant. This coincided with the fact that at the time, U.S. Army scientists had developed several new and theoretically improved anthrax vaccines that provided more immunity than the licensed vaccine; and did so in less time and with fewer shots. All these new anthrax vaccines contained squalene. I interviewed dozens of Gulf War veterans whose mysterious undiagnosable illnesses were later diagnosed by civilian physicians as autoimmune. Of the sick Gulf War veterans tested by Tulane's scientists, 95% had antibodies to squalene. Tulane's data showed another correlation, and this one concerned them even more. Veterans who never deployed to the Gulf had developed chronic and debilitating illnesses too - 100% of sick,non-deployed veterans tested by Tulane had anti-squalene antibodies. When Tulane tested healthy veterans, they found that 0% had the antibodies; that's zero percent.


Here is another link to educate yourself:

http://www.nitrf.org/gulf.html

I have also spent large amounts of time providing health care in areas of the world where diseases that no one in the US gets (because of immunization) are endemic.

I have seen first hand what happens when there is no rubella vaccination. You are clearly too young to remember the thousands of children born deaf or otherwise impaired because their mom was exposed to and caught German Measles while she was pregnant. That still happens elsewhere. Oh, sorry... just government propaganda.

Providing health care? Is that what you call it? If these savior vaccines were indeed the answer as you claim, then those endemic diseases would have also been eradicated given the activities of WHO and their unending mass vaccination programs worldwide. These programs have been ongoing for decades ... DECADES .. and the result? Worsening disease and dying third world societies. No, areas with endemic disease is due to the deplorable living conditions of the affected peoples, with horrific sanitation issues, unclean water supplies, and malnutrition. Most don't even have electricity, and therefore no refrigeration. These are the conditions that allowed such disease to ravage merry old England and it's bout with the plague and other disease. England, like many other developed countries no longer suffer such disease because of the improvements that still remain out of reach for "developing" countries. Vaccines HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

Want to know what vaccines actually do? I'LL TELL YOU WHAT THE DO. In Africa, over 50% of the population across the entire continent is now infected with HIV. Oh, yeah ... one of them screwed a monkey, and the rest is history, blah, blah, blah. No, they were infected with contaminated vaccines grown in infected monkey kidney cells, and distributed by those caring UN folks of the World Health Organization, which just so happens to be the premier fear monger in the whole "WHO Flu" scam on the world.

I grew up in the 50's, when there was finally an effective vaccine for Polio. Polio is very rare here, now... not so in other countries. I'm sure that was just some kind of magical coincidence.

Yes indeed .. I was waiting for this. You didn't grow up in the 50's ... you may have been alive then, but as far as I can tell, you still haven't grown up. I too am a child of the 50's .. and unlike you, I am still to this day a student of the 21st century, still learning and not hopelessly trapped in past conditioning or drowning in dogma.

As for the Polio vaccine .. yet another example of dogma. How do you even breath? Look, Nurse Trey, Polio was well on its way to oblivion long before the vaccine was even invented. OK? The Polio rate had already declined by over 70% prior to vaccine development. And the well established rate of decline actually slowed down at the moment the vaccine was introduced and widely distributed, which suggests that the vaccine did nothing other than prolong the life of the disease. What's more, from the 50's onward, the only cases of Polio in the US has been attributed to the vaccine itself. Again, the means by which Polio was eradicated was through improvements in sanitation, hygiene, clean water, refrigeration and improved nutrition ... NOT THE VACCINE. And once again, those living conditions haven't significantly improved over the past 50 years in the poor underdeveloped countries still suffering widespread disease in spite of the well documented international efforts to vaccinate these populations.

You've never seen Diptheria, which, in years past, would annually kill thousands during the winter. You've never seen kids die of Pertusis. And, the odds are, you've never had a friend die the agonizing spastic death of Tetanus.

Yes that would be true ... the odds are that not 1 in a thousand doctors have ever even seen a case of tetanus in their entire careers, and their only reference comes from medical journals. Now I have not analyzed much data on tetanus or the vaccine, so I'll defer on the point of whether the tetanus vaccine is responsible for the rarity of tetanus infection or not. All I do know is that adverse reactions to the vaccine exceed the incidence of the disease itself.

As for Whooping cough, I do know that the data shows that death from infection is extremely rare, and generally involves infants with other complications. Pertussis is a very treatable disease, but also is a disease that questions the efficacy of the vaccine. In 2004 the number of reported cases of Whooping cough was the highest on record since 1959, in spite of the fact that it has been a primary component in childhood vaccination schedules under the DTAP, and the incidence of disease is still increasing year to year in spite of the increases in vaccination coverage. Just another of those medical dichotomies ... aye?

I'd love to vaccinate you, too, someday. I'll throw in a bonus gamma globulin, if you'd like. It's not actually a vaccine, but, if done right, it can sure leave a sore spot for a day or two.

I'd love for you to try, but you'd have to convince my friends Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson, first.

It's just a shame that there is no vaccine to prevent ignorance. Your repetitive use of strawmen and circular logic is just amusing, as well as "fact" from fringe fanatics.

Oh, but there is ... it's called H1N1 vaccine laced with squalene. It's gonna cure ignorance and stupidity all in one fell swoop. But let me make clear here that I was just being facetious before about being pleased you'll take the poison. I don't wish such ills on anyone ... even you.

What I will say is this ... of any disease for which vaccines are routinely used to prevent, NONE OF THEM remotely approach the death rate of another dreadfully disturbing health threat facing this country. You wanna know what kills 783,000 people annually in the United States of America? Medical mistakes. 783,000 people die each year of medical incompetence, which just so happens to take the number one spot over Heart Disease, Cancer, and all of the rest.

Now, you go and chew on that for a while.

[Countertrey]

If you'd like to start another thread, Ray, I'd be happy to respond. We are done hijacking this one.

[cvillehog]

A Pox on You
My son has cancer. He can't go into day care because of unvaccinated children.
By Stephanie Tatel
Posted Tuesday, Oct. 20, 2009, at 12:06 PM ET


Current public opinion about childhood vaccinations sometimes seems to be influenced less by science and more by Jenny McCarthy. But here's something that rarely gets discussed: the threat posed by the nonvaccinated to children who are immunosuppressed. Last year, while searching for child care for our 2-and-a-half-year-old son, my husband and I thought we had we found the perfect arrangement: an experienced home day care provider whose house was an inviting den of toddler industriousness. Under her magical hand, children drifted calmly and happily from the bubble station to the fairy garden to the bunnies and the trucks, an orchestrated preschool utopia. But when I asked: "Are any of the children here unvaccinated?" the hope of my son's perfect day care experience burnt to a little crisp. As it turned out, one child had a philosophical or religious exemption—a convenient, cover-all exemption that many doctors grant, no questions asked, when a parent requests one. (I still do not understand how the state can allow one to attribute his or her fear of vaccines and their unproven dangers to religion or philosophy. But that's a question for another day.)


Ordinarily I wouldn't question others' parenting choices. But the problem is literally one of live or don't live. While that parent chose not to vaccinate her child for what she likely considers well-founded reasons, she is putting other children at risk. In this instance, the child at risk was my son. He has leukemia.

Read the rest here

[langleyparkjoe]

OMG that's horrible!!!

[RayNAustin]

A Pox on You
My son has cancer. He can't go into day care because of unvaccinated children.
By Stephanie Tatel
Posted Tuesday, Oct. 20, 2009, at 12:06 PM ET


Current public opinion about childhood vaccinations sometimes seems to be influenced less by science and more by Jenny McCarthy. But here's something that rarely gets discussed: the threat posed by the nonvaccinated to children who are immunosuppressed. Last year, while searching for child care for our 2-and-a-half-year-old son, my husband and I thought we had we found the perfect arrangement: an experienced home day care provider whose house was an inviting den of toddler industriousness. Under her magical hand, children drifted calmly and happily from the bubble station to the fairy garden to the bunnies and the trucks, an orchestrated preschool utopia. But when I asked: "Are any of the children here unvaccinated?" the hope of my son's perfect day care experience burnt to a little crisp. As it turned out, one child had a philosophical or religious exemption—a convenient, cover-all exemption that many doctors grant, no questions asked, when a parent requests one. (I still do not understand how the state can allow one to attribute his or her fear of vaccines and their unproven dangers to religion or philosophy. But that's a question for another day.)


Ordinarily I wouldn't question others' parenting choices. But the problem is literally one of live or don't live. While that parent chose not to vaccinate her child for what she likely considers well-founded reasons, she is putting other children at risk. In this instance, the child at risk was my son. He has leukemia.

Read the rest here

That is a horrible story ... but is being used to convince people that authoritarian rule is somehow justifiable. What's just as horrible is the likelihood that the leukemia the child came down with might easily have come from one of the several leukemia viruses which contaminate many vaccines. Proof of this was already posted .... Maurice Hilleman, former Chief virologist of Merck, the man credited with developing more vaccines than any other man in the history of medicine, admitted on audio that there are cancer viruses, leukemia viruses that he found in vaccines on Merck Pharmaceutical shelves.

[Countertrey]