Ultimately, It IS the owners fault

[chiefhog44]

He is in Cerrato's ear about every move, I am convinced.

Completely a WAG, nothing more. I LOVE how all of us fans KNOW how involved the Danny is yet we have nothing to base it on!

The Danny just needs to hire a real GM.

This week.

We need a GM

[Champsturf]

I'm not reading ANY of this thread. It's a stupid thread. We ALL know that the main problem is the ownership and then it falls from there. Too obvious to even be stated.

[fleetus]

He is in Cerrato's ear about every move, I am convinced.

Completely a WAG, nothing more. I LOVE how all of us fans KNOW how involved the Danny is yet we have nothing to base it on!

The Danny just needs to hire a real GM.

I think if you follow the team closely enough you learn Dan Snyder's personality. He does not seem capable to sit back and let football people make the football decisions. His finger prints are all over everything. It really isn't even a question any more.

[fleetus]

I'm not reading ANY of this thread. It's a stupid thread. We ALL know that the main problem is the ownership and then it falls from there. Too obvious to even be stated.

So stupid that you had to post your own stupid response If it is so obvious then why is almost every other thread focused on Zorn, Campbell, Blache, Cerrato, Haynesworth...? It is not obvious to everyone. I'm tired of listening to the endless blame game. This is about attitude. It is about team personality. It is about the owner and his inability to grasp the idea that cohesiveness and teamwork are undermined by his big-spending, marketing hype ways. This team needs a hard nosed coach, a savvy GM, and an owner that knows how to leave those two people alone.

[Redskin in Canada]

I'm tired of listening to the endless blame game. This is about attitude. It is about team personality. It is about the owner and his inability to grasp the idea that cohesiveness and teamwork are undermined by his big-spending, marketing hype ways. This team needs a hard nosed coach, a savvy GM, and an owner that knows how to leave those two people alone.

Amen brother. You have seen the light! Hallelujah! PTL !!!

NFL Commissioner over the microphone in Madison Square Garden, NYC:

And with the First Pick of the 2010 NFL Draft the Washington Redskins select ...

(drum roll)

... the Rooney family !!!

Commentator 1: It is a great pick. The Skins may be very well settled for a few decades to come.

Commentator 2: There could have been other contenders. Too bad the Mara family had not declared its eligibility for this year's draft.

Commentator 1: The Dallas Cowboys were desperate to trade for this pick from the Skins.

[fleetus]

From the Washington Post. Sounds right on the money-

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 04775.html

[cleg]

That's a great article but we already no this. The problem is we are powerless to do anything about it. People can talk of fan revolt but give me an example of where that has actually ever happened? People pay too much for football tickets to walk out of a game or not show up. I wish I had an answer.

[fleetus]

Well, you can continue to discuss it openly on forums like this. Most of my friends agree that they aren't interested in paying more money into the Snyder coffers after years of mismanagement, to an owner who sues his season ticket holders and tries to control things right down to tailgating at the games. So watch the games at home, don't pay for tickets, don't buy merchandise brand new and continue to voice your opinion. At the very least, maybe he will learn from this and hire a GM.

[MEZZSKIN]

That's a great article but we already no this. The problem is we are powerless to do anything about it. People can talk of fan revolt but give me an example of where that has actually ever happened? People pay too much for football tickets to walk out of a game or not show up. I wish I had an answer.

the answer is simple Dont show up!......yes you paid for tickets but lets say your taking a simple family of 3...
You still got to pay for the criminal PARKING fees, over priced FOOD, overoricedGIFTS , ETC.....

by not showing up he gets hammered In concession ..and if that dwarf (snyder)falls well behind any number he has expected for 2009 season at the concessions......HE WILL LISTEN LOUD AND CLEAR

sell the tickets for for half price ..so lets say you bought 3 tickets @ 150 a piece ..and you get back 225.....so you lost 225 bucks instead going and spending about 600-700 bucks
APROX 500 DOLLARS IN SAVINGS...and Snyder will hear your message

thats the answer!

[KazooSkinsFan]

The blame game is in itself a defeat. She should start by pointing her finger at herself that she chooses to help push the debate that way because it's the best way to help any organization continue to fail. Blame gets you nowhere.

An accurate, and productive, way to approach this would have been to assign Snyder RESPONSIBILITY for figuring out how to move forward rather then BLAME for how we got here.

Basically all the blame Snyder people are losers anyway who deserve to lose because they don't even have a clue how to win much less accomplish the task as someone writing or agreeing with this article demonstrates.

The Washington Compost sucks anyway. Sally is the itch from hell, Mike Wise is a douche bag. Tom Boswell is a nice guy three weeks, but has wicked PMS once a month, which is when he seems to chose unfortunately to write most of his Skins articles. The best regular Skins columnist is the Bears fan and I don't particularly care for him either.

[fleetus]

An accurate, and productive, way to approach this would have been to assign Snyder RESPONSIBILITY for figuring out how to move forward rather then BLAME for how we got here.

Umm, Snyder is the owner. Does he need someone to point out the fact that he is responsible for how to move forward?

You need to put the pom-poms down for a second. Continuing the revolving door of coaches and players isn't going to get it done. Next off-season Snyder will fire Zorn and let JC walk. He'll get in his little jet and fly all over the nation, sprinkling wads of cash until some veteran coach succumbs to his sales pitch and agrees to rescue the franchise. All of us fans will proclaim the solution is finally here. Once the honeymoon is over, Snyder/Cerrato will slowly and quietly undermine the new coach by micro managing the players. They'll sign some more over-priced free agents. They'll reward flash and hype rather than hard work and substance. The new coach will become frustrated, the players will get their big paychecks, we will be happily feeding the Snyder coffers and the team will once again go 9-7, 6-10, 8-8 and the coach will leave. Sound familiar? This is all due to Snyder! Period.

[MEZZSKIN]

The blame game is in itself a defeat. She should start by pointing her finger at herself that she chooses to help push the debate that way because it's the best way to help any organization continue to fail. Blame gets you nowhere.

An accurate, and productive, way to approach this would have been to assign Snyder RESPONSIBILITY for figuring out how to move forward rather then BLAME for how we got here.

Basically all the blame Snyder people are losers anyway who deserve to lose because they don't even have a clue how to win much less accomplish the task as someone writing or agreeing with this article demonstrates.

The Washington Compost sucks anyway. Sally is the itch from hell, Mike Wise is a douche bag. Tom Boswell is a nice guy three weeks, but has wicked PMS once a month, which is when he seems to chose unfortunately to write most of his Skins articles. The best regular Skins columnist is the Bears fan and I don't particularly care for him either.

I would say if someone is to agree with an article that should not qualify them a loser...But overall I agree......the words FOR THIS SEASON SHOULD BE are ACCOUNTABILITY AND RESPONSIBILITY.....

Not blame...but at the same time any good corporation, before they make substantial changes should and would do a full inventory on how did we get here type analysis .just.To better understand what needs to be fixed

and I think we all agree...it would take about 90 seconds for some bright NFL minds to say----uh step 1

LETS FIRE VINNY CERRATO

[RedskinsFreak]

I think Jenkins is the Post's worst columnist. She lives and works from New York City. She hardly ever sets foot south of the Mason-Dixon Line.

She didn't write this one well, either, but the message is the Gospel Truth. Snyder's had 10 years to learn how to win in the NFL. It's clear he's smart and was able to figure out the way to do things in his pre-Redskins ventures to make all that money.

With the Redskins, he's taken several approaches, as is his right.

It's his team, he can do what the heck he wants.

But each of those approaches has had one common entity ... Snyder's involvement.

After such a long time, you have to consider the question of Snyder's priorities. As Jenkins wrote:

"Snyder would rather be the center of power on a losing team than a peripheral figure on a winning one."

QFTFT.

I'll also bring forth a pair of Q-and-A exchanges from Wilbon's weekly Monday chat:

Arlington: Not really a question, but it strikes me that Ted Leonsis started out like Snyder, trying to win with over-the-hill veterans like Jagr. But he was smart enough to realize (around 2002-2003) that it wasn't working and he was willing to rebuild the Caps from the ground up through the draft and player development. I don't understand why Snyder can't learn from and apply that example. Football and hockey are very different sports of course, but they both have a hard salary cap and they both reward good organizations that have a constant inflow of promising young players to fill out the roster.

Wilbon: Ted did learn it quickly. Snyder hasn't. Sometimes it isn't about smarts, but personality. Does Snyder strike you as the kind of guy to say, "I was totally wrong on this, and I went and talked to people who said, 'This is something you might consider.' "? Ted is that kind of guy and you know that from the moment you meet him. Dan? Not so much.

and

Arlington: Michael is it because Synder is such a good business man the reason he thinks he knows how to run the daily operations of a NFL team?

Wilbon: I've always thought that's exactly why. "I did this, therefore, I can do that." Not necessarily. Snyder wouldn't be the first great businessman to try and apply that logic ... unsuccessfully ...

It's this second one that is most in the way of the Day of Epiphany that must arrive before this team can reach continual contender status.

He may have been able to figure out how to succeed in other business ventures, but Professional Football appears to be beyond his grasp.

He has a commendable "I'll show you ..." attitude. He's still trying to prove to the fans -- and more importantly his fellow owners -- that he'll be the one who makes this work.

But there has to be a point where you realize your efforts aren't helping. The Vulcan words of wisdom (From Star Trek 2) "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" need to take root. This team and this fanbase is not being served by this 10-year M.O. that serves the needs of the one -- The Danny.

So, I ask how one might "assign responsibility" to someone so vehemently opposed to accepting it?

[Redskin in Canada]

fleetus, dear brother, see this post made a bit before yours:

http://www.the-hogs.net/forum/viewtopic. ... ht=#469730

I would have had to apologise for plagiarism if the timing was after yours above ...

[fleetus]

fleetus, dear brother, see this post made a bit before yours:

http://www.the-hogs.net/forum/viewtopic. ... ht=#469730

I would have had to apologise for plagiarism if the timing was after yours above ...

I agree, it sounds eerily similar. great minds think alike. Also, I can't blame people for arguing that we are pessimistic, that we are playing the blame game, because they just want to root for their team no matter what. Right now, those people are painfully biding their time, defending Snyder, Cerrato, Zorn, JC and all while waiting for some shred of good news and hope to hang their hat on. I don't blame those people, they are part of what makes Redskins fans the best in the league.

BUT! Snyder has been banking on these fans good support for too long.

Quote:
Arlington: Michael is it because Synder is such a good business man the reason he thinks he knows how to run the daily operations of a NFL team?

Wilbon: I've always thought that's exactly why. "I did this, therefore, I can do that." Not necessarily. Snyder wouldn't be the first great businessman to try and apply that logic ... unsuccessfully ...

Here's the thing many people miss about Snyder. He IS successful with the Redskins because of his business expertise. The Redskins are biggest money making franchise in football! HE HAS SUCCEEDED! And when we fans get upset enough to make noise about the lack of football success, he will just re-package, hire some big names, spin a tail about how he has learned his lesson and we will be right back spending our hard earned dollars to fuel his jet for another 3 years.

[DEHog]

Here's the thing many people miss about Snyder. He IS successful with the Redskins because of his business expertise. The Redskins are biggest money making franchise in football! HE HAS SUCCEEDED!

I keep seeing this…what is it (specifically) that Dan Snyder has done to be considered a great (business wise) NFL owner? He brought one of the best products (Redskins) in one of the best brands (NFL) in the world?? He paid 800 million and Skins are now worth 1.5 B…what did he do to make them go up in value?? (My house has double in Value since I brought it does that make me a great businessman!!) The fan base was here long before him, it use to take decades to get tickets now is take years. He gets hundreds of million from TV…did he negotiate that? The cap is set. I’m sorry I just don’t see what he has done, business wise, I think the Skins would be were they are with almost any owner and a good argument could be made that they’d be even more profitable had they won. What would this franchise look like (business wise) had Joe Gibbs not come back??? Please someone educate me!!

[MEZZSKIN]

Here's the thing many people miss about Snyder. He IS successful with the Redskins because of his business expertise. The Redskins are biggest money making franchise in football! HE HAS SUCCEEDED!

I keep seeing this…what is it (specifically) that Dan Snyder has done to be considered a great (business wise) NFL owner? He brought one of the best products (Redskins) in one of the best brands (NFL) in the world?? He paid 800 million and Skins are now worth 1.5 B…what did he do to make them go up in value?? (My house has double in Value since I brought it does that make me a great businessman!!) The fan base was here long before him, it use to take decades to get tickets now is take years. He gets hundreds of million from TV…did he negotiate that? The cap is set. I’m sorry I just don’t see what he has done, business wise, I think the Skins would be were they are with almost any owner and a good argument could be made that they’d be even more profitable had they won. What would this franchise look like (business wise) had Joe Gibbs not come back??? Please someone educate me!!

I agree DEHOG....actually didnt he buy the team when FEDEX was already being built via the Cookes....and the land was already paid for for..He bought a debt free stadium!!!...
and in 5 years or so he paid off whatever debt it took to purchase the taem from the Cookes

In reality...Redskins are were they are(financially)...DUE TO JACK KENT COOKE
Fedex was JKC'S vision and its Fedex that MAKES VALUE OF THE SKINS WHAT IT IS TODAY.

Hes just been the riding the horse..so to speak

[RedskinsFreak]

I'll never buy into the notion that some people who get into sports ownership have some #1 agenda other than "win games and championships".

That's the only criteria by which they should be judged.

And, there's always this. Snyder may be making a lot of money now, but it's squadoosh when compared to what lies at the end of the "win the Super Bowl" rainbow.

Winning on the field is the greatest revenue source imaginable.

He just needs to step back and let someone else fill his coffers for him.

[PulpExposure]

I agree DEHOG....actually didnt he buy the team when FEDEX was already being built via the Cookes....and the land was already paid for for..He bought a debt free stadium!!!...
and in 5 years or so he paid off whatever debt it took to purchase the taem from the Cookes

Do you understand how impressive it is to pay off the debt he accumulated in five years?

In reality...Redskins are were they are(financially)...DUE TO JACK KENT COOKE
Fedex was JKC'S vision and its Fedex that MAKES VALUE OF THE SKINS WHAT IT IS TODAY.

Hes just been the riding the horse..so to speak

If that was true, than the Redskins would have been worth 1.5 billion when Snyder bought them. A commodity, be it a pear, apple, or football team, is worth exactly what the market would bear.

Snyder has doubled the value of the team since he bought it. I don't care what industry you are in, a 100% ROI on a nearly billion dollar purchase is incredibly impressive.

By any quantifiable measurement you want, Snyder is a great businessman. He's also a mediocre NFL owner.

[fleetus]

Here's the thing many people miss about Snyder. He IS successful with the Redskins because of his business expertise. The Redskins are biggest money making franchise in football! HE HAS SUCCEEDED!

I keep seeing this…what is it (specifically) that Dan Snyder has done to be considered a great (business wise) NFL owner?

It really doesn't matter. The point is, Sports media and fans talk about Snyder and his lack of success. They wonder, why doesn't Snyder realize that he is doing things all wrong, that his very unique management structure and style has failed and he should look at how teams like the Steelers and PAtriots constantly succeed. The problem is, they are all assuming that a billionaire, who's main talent has always been making a huge profit, is going to consider it a failure when he is making more money than all other 32 teams. I'm not saying Snyder doesn't want to win. I am saying, why should he give up the FUN of playing owner and GM to win a few more games when he is wildly successful in the profit margin? He can have his cake and eat it to. And you and I are footing the bill.

[Countertrey]

You know, BossHog has something to say on this in his latest blog, right here... Redskin Fallacies and Misconceptions

Good stuff... check it out!

[DEHog]

Snyder has doubled the value of the team since he bought it. I don't care what industry you are in, a 100% ROI on a nearly billion dollar purchase is incredibly impressive.

Outside of buying the Skins what did HE do?? Would he have done the same (with the same record) in places like Detroit, Cincy, Miami Jacksonville??

Has I said my house is up 100% does that make me a great business man??

[MEZZSKIN]

I agree DEHOG....actually didnt he buy the team when FEDEX was already being built via the Cookes....and the land was already paid for for..He bought a debt free stadium!!!...
and in 5 years or so he paid off whatever debt it took to purchase the taem from the Cookes

Do you understand how impressive it is to pay off the debt he accumulated in five years?

In reality...Redskins are were they are(financially)...DUE TO JACK KENT COOKE
Fedex was JKC'S vision and its Fedex that MAKES VALUE OF THE SKINS WHAT IT IS TODAY.

Hes just been the riding the horse..so to speak

If that was true, than the Redskins would have been worth 1.5 billion when Snyder bought them. A commodity, be it a pear, apple, or football team, is worth exactly what the market would bear.

Snyder has doubled the value of the team since he bought it. I don't care what industry you are in, a 100% ROI on a nearly billion dollar purchase is incredibly impressive.

By any quantifiable measurement you want, Snyder is a great businessman. He's also a mediocre NFL owner.

Most big Market NFL Franchises have appreciated in similar ways
50 percent plus in those 10 years
Snyder fell into great timing and he negiotated a great price...But the stadium was THERE ALREADY..
There's an old Stock Market saying

NEVER CONFUSE GENIUS FOR A BULL MARKET

NFL has been in a historic Bull Market--so take from it what u want

[fleetus]

Snyder has doubled the value of the team since he bought it. I don't care what industry you are in, a 100% ROI on a nearly billion dollar purchase is incredibly impressive.

Outside of buying the Skins what did HE do?? Would he have done the same (with the same record) in places like Detroit, Cincy, Miami Jacksonville??

Has I said my house is up 100% does that make me a great business man??

It is irrelevant. The point is, he isn't too worried about giving up control and hiring a GM and staying out of the free agency and draft. He is raking in the money. Sure it would be nice to win a super bowl, but a 9-7 or 10-6 season every few years is enough to keep the fans coming back and keep him in the drivers seat where he has the most fun.

[skinsfan#33]

You know, BossHog has something to say on this in his latest blog, right here... Redskin Fallacies and Misconceptions

Good stuff... check it out!

What a bunch of drivel. He states a whole bunch of oppions as fact and then begs us "try to understand that it is difficult to point to any one news source" even though he has apparently swallowed the "media" vie of the Skins hook, line and sinker!

All I have to say, if you hate the Danny then good, but at least know why. Don't go on reports from unnamed sources and venom spewed by the talking heads. Try to form a clear thought process based solely on facts, not things that are thought to be true.

No one can say the Danny pick all of the players there are only a few people on Earth that know. The Danny, Vinny, current coaches and former coaches.

Please people think for yourselves, don't swallow the bait.

Hey he did leave off a top five tallent, ey!