Snyder's greed

[Redskin in Canada]

Beyond that, I have the feeling that the Haynesworth to the Skins hype is all a smokescreen to divert attention from the FO's real targets. My suspicion is that this is Danny using his rep to play the press and other teams....

Oh man ...

I know there are some posts we wish we never had made. This has to be one of them.

Read my signature CT. Read it again and again ...

[KazooSkinsFan]

Beyond that, I have the feeling that the Haynesworth to the Skins hype is all a smokescreen to divert attention from the FO's real targets. My suspicion is that this is Danny using his rep to play the press and other teams....

Oh man ...

I know there are some posts we wish we never had made. This has to be one of them.

Read my signature CT. Read it again and again ...

I get the "failure" and "incompetence." I think they are exaggerated since we have done OK and made the playoffs a couple times the last few years and we did start 6-2 last year with injuries and our lack of consistency in having an O system (which hopefully we changed) burning us. We also had the #4 D, which doesn't scream inept. Then again, given the limited results they're not a banner of efficiency and it's a judgment call.

But I don't get the "greed." Where does that come in?

[broomboy]

Beyond that, I have the feeling that the Haynesworth to the Skins hype is all a smokescreen to divert attention from the FO's real targets. My suspicion is that this is Danny using his rep to play the press and other teams....

Oh man ...

I know there are some posts we wish we never had made. This has to be one of them.

Read my signature CT. Read it again and again ...

I get the "failure" and "incompetence." I think they are exaggerated since we have done OK and made the playoffs a couple times the last few years and we did start 6-2 last year with injuries and our lack of consistency in having an O system (which hopefully we changed) burning us. We also had the #4 D, which doesn't scream inept. Then again, given the limited results they're not a banner of efficiency and it's a judgment call.

But I don't get the "greed." Where does that come in?

Mabye hes talking about the rediculous prices he charges for beer and food and parking and such?

[Countertrey]

Beyond that, I have the feeling that the Haynesworth to the Skins hype is all a smokescreen to divert attention from the FO's real targets. My suspicion is that this is Danny using his rep to play the press and other teams....

Oh man ...

I know there are some posts we wish we never had made. This has to be one of them.

Read my signature CT. Read it again and again ...

So I was wrong. It doesn't mean that I'm a Danny sycophant. Check the rest of my posts.

I know you love to take'em out of context, though, so knock yourself out.

[tcwest10]

RiC...you're going to have to man up and admit that they did good this year in FA. Nobody over 30 yet.
Danny's "greed" is our gain this year.

[redskins14ru]

Beyond that, I have the feeling that the Haynesworth to the Skins hype is all a smokescreen to divert attention from the FO's real targets. My suspicion is that this is Danny using his rep to play the press and other teams....

Oh man ...

I know there are some posts we wish we never had made. This has to be one of them.

Read my signature CT. Read it again and again ...

i hope so too.... nice signuture i like it. the skins will have there team and win espn today reluctantly offered them the next best team to beat in the nfc behind the giants reluctanty.

[Redskin in Canada]

Mabye hes talking about the rediculous prices hecharges for beer and food and parking and such?

"such" as precious water bottles, "authentic" jerseys, obstructed view seats, scalping their own parking permits, and fired long-term personnel to "save money" who must be either laughing or fuming over the salary offered to Fat Albert.

Want more?

[Redskin in Canada]

So I was wrong. It doesn't mean that I'm a Danny sycophant. Check the rest of my posts.

I know you love to take'em out of context, though, so knock yourself out.

Maybe you misunderstand me. It is not about being right or wrong about Fat Albert. It is about ANY notion that the Danny would do anything different than what he has been and he will always be: a marketing man.

And it works every time! It will bring fans back to the Stadium even if you and I KNOW that the way to build up a team is NOT with a TOP HEAVY team, i.e., a few super expensive players who often put the entire season at risk when they fall injured.

But my main point is not that this move is unwise from a salary cap and overall improvement of the Team. My point is that any notion about any growth or maturity by the Danny is COMPLETELY UNFOUNDED.

This acquisition is first and foremost a marketing ploy to bring back fans with a big and most expensive name. It is a touch genius as amerketing ploy. It just prevents the OVERALL improvement of the Team at other positions.

But there is always next season, and the next after that, and the next, and ... the Danny will NEVER stop being a MARKETING MAN.

[Redskin in Canada]

RiC...you're going to have to man up and admit that they did good this year in FA. Nobody over 30 yet.

With the salary cap implications of this contract to Fat Albert, there will be hardly any room to hire ANYBODY else under or over 30. So, yeah! It is been good so far.

[redskins14ru]

you mean signing the same kicker was good and think that the defense is good, looks like dockary is the godsend for the O so far this offseason and with the rookie right tackel gig that vinny and Dan got going the skins could maybe get suisam just a hair closer.... in a perfect world the defense is looking marvelous but the pen and teller type performance is of the two front office gurus can be misconstrued as good or bad so I for one will man up and wait for the regular season to start...I really can not wait untill august to see the preseason and pray for no injuries for all of these 28 and older wonders. my personal opinion truthfully is that the offense and production wiegh more heavily on the experiance and tutuledge of one JIM ZORN who appearently seemed only only one step away and a few catches away from keepin the defense on the sidelines and scoring more points in 2008 so I will believe that is why the offense is staying back and for example on that side of the ball, on the offense sticking with the same recievers and backs.... just my thoughts..here HAIIL TO THE REDSKINS

[redskins14ru]

maybe vinny and zorn met and drew up some trick plays for us all to watch instead of signing say an aging marvin harrison, who knows, best so far I have heard no word of raising fed ex beer prices thats good!!!

[SkinsFreak]

With the salary cap implications of this contract to Fat Albert, there will be hardly any room to hire ANYBODY else under or over 30. So, yeah! It is been good so far.

When you say they won't be able to "hire" anybody else, did you mean SIGN more free agents?

John Clayton reported there were 6 other teams bidding on Haynesworth, including the Giants, and ALL were offering the same $100M contract with about $40M guaranteed. So it's not like Snyder threw out some ridiculously inflated contract well above market value, like he's done in the past with AA, for example.

The Giants already have a stout defensive line. Could you imagine having to face their d-line WITH Haynesworth twice a year?

At least they're filling holes by addressing specific needs. Just about every half-intelligent Redskins fan and EVERY expert analyst in the industry pinned the interior of our d-line as a weakness. So, point of fact, we did need to address the DT position. If DT wasn't a glaring need, then I'd agree that Snyder trying to hook the biggest fish in free agency was about marketing and trying to make a splash. But it was a huge hole and needed to be addressed. And they're still addressing the other needs, like signing Hall and beefing up the o-line with Dockery.

Just so I'm clear, are you suggesting that the team should never sign free agents, especially big name free agents? I don't agree with the philosophy of trading away draft picks, but are three 2nd day draft picks going to produce starters and fill all our holes?

And about the money, he's only going to account for about $6.5 against the cap this year. So there can still be other moves made. And as Chris Mortensen accurately points out, AH will never get $100M anyway.

League sources told ESPN's Chris Mortensen that a $29 million "poison pill" in the fifth year of Haynesworth's contract effectively makes it a four-year deal worth $48 million. The Redskins would owe Haynesworth a lump sum of $29 million in salary and bonuses in 2013, the fifth year of the deal. It is unlikely the team will pay the full commitment of $100 million over seven years unless the contract is re-negotiated.

As for the Bucs, yeah, they traded away everyone and fans here in Florida are pissed they didn't get Haynesworth. Clayton said Tampa had the exact same deal on the table but AH simply chose the Skins.

[KazooSkinsFan]

Mabye hes talking about the rediculous prices hecharges for beer and food and parking and such?

"such" as precious water bottles, "authentic" jerseys, obstructed view seats, scalping their own parking permits, and fired long-term personnel to "save money" who must be either laughing or fuming over the salary offered to Fat Albert.

Want more?

How much should he charge for those? Isn't it a business? The guy paid hundreds of millions to buy the team and has as we know a 127 million annual payroll just for players he plays endless cap games to exceed every year. Why is it "greedy" not to turn around and give it away? I would say greed is expecting something of value without paying for it, not charging for something of value, but maybe that's just me.

Seriously, RIC, I'm asking because I don't understand. No surprise you and I think differently, and I really am trying to understand. It seems to me that charging for the product is normal business. How do you determine when someone is being "greedy?" How do you, RIC, determine the "fair" price to charge for a product that isn't "greedy?" To me "fair" is set by the market. How is it set to you since you're saying market pricing is "greed?" Other then charity, do you give your stuff away for what people want to pay or do you charge what you can? Do you earn as much as you can in your job or do you just accept whatever your employer wants to pay? How are you NOT greedy while Dan the Man is?

[SkinsJock]

I am not against what Snyder is doing per se but everyone should realize that with the costs being incurred by these teams the NFL is getting closer and closer to a pay per view sport - already the Giants are charging incredible amounts for seats in that new stadium and the fans are going to find that they cannot afford a ticket soon with what these teams are going to be charging for a seat to cover their expenses

Snyder can now raise the prices again and just make the case that he's doing the best he can to make the team better and he needs more money to cover that

I am glad that we addressed some areas of concern but the fans have to understand that in the end Snyder (and all the other owners) are going to keep increasing prices because thay are going to need to make more money.

This game is going to be very expensive to go and see in the very near future.

[SkinsJock]

I think there is a difference in making a huge amount of money as an NFL owner and wanting to make a decent profit off the team - that to me is just plain greedy and that defines Snyder and a bunch of other owners.

All RiC is implying (at least I think) is that a big reason Snyder does what he does is not for the team per se and not to just make a decent profit but to try and make a huge amount of money and he wants that to be paid for by us the fans.

[KazooSkinsFan]

I think there is a difference in making a huge amount of money as an NFL owner and wanting to make a decent profit off the team - that to me is just plain greedy and that defines Snyder and a bunch of other owners.

All RiC is implying (at least I think) is that a big reason Snyder does what he does is not for the team per se and not to just make a decent profit but to try and make a huge amount of money and he wants that to be paid for by us the fans.

You're still using the terms "decent" and "huge." I don't know what those mean. I mean I know what they mean as words, but what I mean is how do you tell the difference? When does one become the other? Who decides? And still, why is it greedy to charge what the market will bear and it's not greedy to just want to pay less for the stuff you want?

The Skins are high end. I like to go to baseball games. I often go to minor league games because it's cheaper. I live in the Triangle of North Carolina and we have a good one here, the Durham Bulls. But they aren't pro and when I'm travelling, I like to go to major league games. I pay more at major league games, I get better quality baseball. Snyder whether you like his judgment or not goes and gets a 100 million dollar player. Minor league teams don't do that. Shouldn't the FANS chose what they want to pay and chose the TEAM and the LEAGUE that delivers on that? Why is Snyder "greedy" when he forks over the bucks and asks for those who want to pay for the best product and then complain about the cost?

Is Lexus "greedy" for selling cars above Fords when people want a Lexus for a Ford price? If Snyder doesn't offer the product, his customers will go to cheaper teams. By what right to the customers complain he's charging too much when they want the premium product? I pay like 350 a year to watch every Skins game on HDTV. I could buy season tickets to a semi-pro team. I love the Skins and I want them. I choose if I want to pay it or not, and I do. I don't get saying I'll pay it but they're greedy because I don't want to.

[PulpExposure]

RiC...you're going to have to man up and admit that they did good this year in FA. Nobody over 30 yet.

With the salary cap implications of this contract to Fat Albert, there will be hardly any room to hire ANYBODY else under or over 30. So, yeah! It is been good so far.

Let's see. The Skins got the top DT (and top free agent), a very good corner, and a good guard in Free Agency. All under 30.

While they didn't get a tackle, they do still have the draft.

How has this not worked out? And I don't get teams that don't spend to the salary cap every year. Tampa Bay has 60 million in cap room, and very well may go into the season with 50 million in space.

How does having 50 million unspent under the cap help their team at all?

[KazooSkinsFan]

RiC...you're going to have to man up and admit that they did good this year in FA. Nobody over 30 yet.

With the salary cap implications of this contract to Fat Albert, there will be hardly any room to hire ANYBODY else under or over 30. So, yeah! It is been good so far.

Let's see. The Skins got the top DT (and top free agent), a very good corner, and a good guard in Free Agency. All under 30.

While they didn't get a tackle, they do still have the draft.

How has this not worked out? And I don't get teams that don't spend to the salary cap every year. Tampa Bay has 60 million in cap room, and very well may go into the season with 50 million in space.

How does having 50 million unspent under the cap help their team at all?

Oh please, facts. What a LAME arguing technique. You're scraping bottom...

[Redskin in Canada]

At least they're filling holes by addressing specific needs. Just about every half-intelligent Redskins fan and EVERY expert analyst in the industry pinned the interior of our d-line as a weakness. So, point of fact, we did need to address the DT position. If DT wasn't a glaring need, then I'd agree that Snyder trying to hook the biggest fish in free agency was about marketing and trying to make a splash. But it was a huge hole and needed to be addressed. And they're still addressing the other needs, like signing Hall and beefing up the o-line with Dockery.

a) It is not about filling needs but the price at a single position at the expense of others which more than one poster has criticised about this deal.
b) I am not a half-intelligent Refskins fan or an expert. But I have been posting on this Board for YEARS arguing in favour of DOMINANT DL and OL. It did not need to be made with the highest price tag on a SINGLE player.
c) If that had not been a successful MARKETING ploy, it would not be occupying so much space in this board, expert's analyses and tv time. He is a terrible owner but a GREAT marketer.

So, now that ALL of our needs are taken care of, there is no excuse , Right? We are Superbowl bound. Again.

Just so I'm clear, are you suggesting that the team should never sign free agents, especially big name free agents? I don't agree with the philosophy of trading away draft picks, but are three 2nd day draft picks going to produce starters and fill all our holes?

I said I was not a half-intelligent fan. But please do not patronise me with these stupid statements. In the end, it does not matter what the Front Office does, there is always an excuse to say "they tried their best"

Superbowl bound indeed.

[Redskin in Canada]

How much should he charge for those? Isn't it a business?

Interesting proposition, and from the RIGHT poster to make the statement !!!

This is it! You see, for the owner and fans like you this is only a BUSINESS. As a consequence of that premise, there is no way to argue the fundamental principles of business and marketing.

Under that premise, the only rules that apply are offer and demand. The price can escalate as high as the market will stand. The only guide for a measure of success is PROFIT.

Well, this is an interesting proposition. If this is the case and the Skins are only a BUSINESS to the owner -and- some of the fans, this is ALREADY one of the most successful sports franchises in the ENTIRE WORLD.

There. I wrote it. Why do I feel that I wrote the BIGGEST FALACY in my time in this board???

Under THAT premise, it does not matter that no championships of any kind have been won. No Superbowls, no Conference Championships, Not even a Division Championship under the Danny.

Under THAT premise, it does not matter that good heartfelt fans are being provided a disappointment after disappointment year after year and they are even being driven out of their seats and replaced with anonymous courtesy corporate seats.

But ULTIMATELY you might be right. It is the rules of business: a poor product for exorbitant prices which may awake the fans and corporations to step away from this product.

In the meantime, marketing and packaging of the snake oil du jour are all good. Some fans are still buying, media has its news, and the poor Redskin following have another year to endure as the owner of their team will never allow a TRUE NFL expert to put togeher a winning team on the field.

I concede. You are right.

[Redskin in Canada]

How does having 50 million unspent under the cap help their team at all?

Conversely, How does having managed to top up the cap EVERY year help the Skins?

Hint: Perhaps because it is REALLY not about buying a championship but having the wisdom to make the RIGHT mix of personnel from top to bottom for the RIGHT money? Just a thought.

[KazooSkinsFan]

In the meantime, marketing and packaging of the snake oil du jour are all good. Some fans are still buying, media has its news, and the poor Redskin following have another year to endure as the owner of their team will never allow a TRUE NFL expert to put togeher a winning team on the field.

I concede. You are right.

Sarcasm aside, there are all sorts of products. Staples, luxury items. Some quality matters, some price matters. What you're looking for is always different. The Skins are "entertainment." Some industries are cut throat and success of one comes at the expense of another, others can attract new customers. The Skins are "entertainment." There are 32 teams and in each year the "average" team will be 8-8. The success of one comes at the expense of another ON the field, though as a market they can grow together. Even the Detroit Lions aren't going out of business.

So, what does your rant have to do with anything? The test is if customers are willing to PAY for what he's offering. If you're not, don't. You totally have that choice. Even though every year it's painful forking over $350 to see every Skins game in HDTV, I am so much more happy then all the years I saw them like 4 times a year since I haven't lived in the DC area most of the last 15 years. I don't get how you're saying it's not like any other form of business. Why should people be willing to pay $50 for a seat others are willing to pay $200 for? Why should you be able to buy a jersey for $30 the rest of the market will pay $100 for? I still don't see how any of this makes him "greedy."

Why do you want to pay less for things that the Danny's selling? So you KEEP your money. Why should YOU be able to keep your money by paying LESS then the market says it's worth and it's DANNY who's "greedy" for not giving it to you below it's value? It's just not Danny I see being greedy.

[Irn-Bru]

Kaz, if someone is free to act then they are free to act greedily, yes? I don't see a problem with making a moral assessment of Snyder—and concluding that he's greedy—even if it is his business or there happen to be people willing to pay for what he's offering. These aren't mutually exclusive ideas. . .

[Bob 0119]

Don't feed the trolls Kaz...

[SkinsFreak]

It's the conclusion of greed that being questioned. It is simply unfounded and uniformed to assert that the prices Snyder charges for tickets, concessions and merchandise are higher than anyone else in the industry or significantly over market value.

And further, how is it greed when you re-invest the profits of your business back into the business. If you merely pocketed the money, like many other sports franchise owners do, then I'd agree it's about greed. How is spending $180M of your profits (this year) by securing the best components available on the market, in an effort to provide a better product, considered greed? Wouldn't it be greed if he just kept the money and didn't invest it back into the team?

The history of trading away draft picks, signing past their prime - former big name free agents and paying top dollar for marginal players are valid areas of criticism which I agree with. Paying top dollar for aging players that can't produce anymore has proven not to be successful. But I honestly don't agree with this notion of greed and that he's solely in it for the money.