Should the benefit of the doubt for JC should last until:

[SkinsFreak]

The old and tired adage, "HC knows best" is as tired and old as the original "father lnows best" TV series. We know from experience how that has worked out in the Snyder tenure.

Really? So because of Snyder, our head coach is in no position to have the best vantage point? Oh... okay. Let me get this straight... because Snyder was the one who hired a HoF coach in Gibbs and a former NFL quarterback/QB coach in Zorn... since Snyder did the hiring, that means the coaches expertises were nullified. Got it.

Other than the Patriots, who suddenly found out this past year that Cassel was pretty good and he had some success, most likely due to the playoff and championship caliber team and coaching staff already in place around him, name the NFL teams that have multiple studs at QB.

[Champsturf]

Other than the Patriots, who suddenly found out this past year that Cassel was pretty good and he had some success, most likely due to the playoff and championship level team and coaching staff already in place around him, name the NFL teams that have multiple studs at QB.

Multiple?!? I'd like to see the Redskins have just one. If they ever get one, let me know.

[SkinsJock]

.. Other than the Patriots, who suddenly found out this past year that Cassel was pretty good and he had some success, most likely due to the playoff and championship caliber team and coaching staff already in place around him, name the NFL teams that have multiple studs at QB.

I have no problem with only having 1 really good QB and I have no problem with giving Campbell all the help we can - he gives us the best chance to win at this time and given our current situation - it is what it is

My concern is only that I do not believe that Campbell is going to make it and I'm not convinced that we have a potential great QB in Brennan. In my opinion we need to start looking at who is going to be our starting QB in 2011 because I do not have the faith that you do that Campbell is going to be that good.

if we apply the old adage "you have to dance with who you brought to the dance...." then I can tell you, if the party is going to continue to be this much fun then we all know we are in a lot worse shape than if we start to look around for a new dance partner.

I'll tell you something else - it would be a lot more fun if we start to 'dance' with someone that knows how to score no matter what music they're playing.

[Deadskins]

At that point what you have is twice as hard to deal with. Not only have you wasted all of your preseason time with a guy who isn't going to play through the year, but you've also now got to try to quickly get this other person up to speed midway through the season. Doing things like that on the fly hardly ever turns out well, in any endeavor.

It does happen, though; Bledsoe went down, and Brady came in.

[CanesSkins26]

Other than the Patriots, who suddenly found out this past year that Cassel was pretty good and he had some success, most likely due to the playoff and championship level team and coaching staff already in place around him, name the NFL teams that have multiple studs at QB.

Nobody in this thread has said that other NFL teams have multiple studs at qb. That is simply not realistic. However, it doesn't make sense to put all of your eggs in one basket like we are doing with JC. Essentially at this point we have JC, a first rounder that hasn't lived up to his draft position, a career backup, and a 6th round project. Sure Brennan could eventually turn into a solid NFL player but the consensus around him when he was drafted was that he was a project player than needs to be developed. I highly doubt that one training camp and one season as 3rd string qb has developed him to the point where he could come in and start if JC continues to play the way that he has. Other NFL teams hedge their bets when there is uncertainty at the qb position and the Skins need to do the same. The Packers, for example, didn't know what they would have with Rodgers so they spent two draft picks on qbs in last year's draft, taking Brian Brohm and Matt Flynn. It would be nice if the Skins had the luxury of drafting a qb in the 2nd or 3rd round this year, but with only four draft picks we cant.

[SkinsFreak]

However, it doesn't make sense to put all of your eggs in one basket like we are doing with JC.

Not sure what you mean by putting all your eggs in one basket with JC. Every team in the league emphasizes one QB with several back-ups, as the Skins do. And all starting QB's get the vast majority of reps in practice, as it should be. I'll quote BigRedskinDaddy, as I totally agree with his perspective...

"Let me rephrase: there is no Plan B, as you put it, because that is a strategy planned and based on the premise that JC will fail. We DO have backup QB's, however -- just like all the other teams do. Today, if we were to scroll through each individual team and it's current signal-caller situation, I would be very surprised if more than 2 or 3 have anything like a "Plan B." Nor should they.

A contingency like that takes time to prepare, time to develop, and time out of both the staff and the featured players' practice schedules. Time is a scarce and valuable commodity once OTA's and TC come around. It doesn't make sense to divide that time, and also divide attention/concentration/preparation, in order to have some sort of protocol with which to bench JC. That's a lot like a self-fulfilling prophecy as I see it. By having the plan you in effect create the reason for the plan in the first place. "

Essentially at this point we have JC, a first rounder, a career backup, and a 6th round project.

That's right, and an almost ideal range of experience and depth at that position. A 1st round starter, a solid and experienced back-up and a rookie to groom for the future. That ain't bad and I'd bet many teams would like that package. But in several other threads, some have argued that Collins or Colt should be starting over JC. I don't agree with it, but it's been said here many times.

The Packers, for example, didn't know what they would have with Rodgers so they spent two draft picks on qbs in last year's draft, taking Brian Brohm and Matt Flynn. It would be nice if the Skins had the luxury of drafting a qb in the 2nd or 3rd round this year, but with only four draft picks we cant.

Now we're starting to make sense. It would be nice to draft another QB, especially since I'm not betting on Collins being here for long. But with only four picks and a much greater need at other positions, it's not logical to draft a QB this year. Further, this will be the year we will find out several things... if JC is the guy or if Colt can step up and show he's learned enough to take the reins. You can't give up on those two specifically before you know what you got.

There will be a far better class of QB's coming out next year, so if neither JC or Colt can sell Zorn with their talent, I'd be inclined to draft a QB next year. It would be foolish to give up on JC now and Zorn and the paid professionals know it. That's why Zorn has already said JC is the guy going forward and there's little chance Colt will unseat him at this point.

[Redskin in Canada]

To sum up, in answer to your last post -- no, there is no Plan B.
And if there is a god in heaven, there won't be this year, or the next...or the one after that.

I FINALLY got it.

How stupid of me and my posts. How can I be SO retarded?

It is VERY simple: There is no Plan B because we all are going to kneel and pray together and beg for DIVINE INTERVENTION this year, or the next ... or the one after that!!!

And then people ask why do we have to have a new head coach with yet another offensive system.

Interesting how well have Skins fans been psychologically conditioned over the last decade to hope for the best and -NOT- prepare for the worst, just like the Front Office.

[Redskin in Canada]

And then, Colt MIGHT work out. He MIGHT. I do ot know about you guys but I NEVER gamble. And in the remote chance that I did, I would not play more money on a riskier hand than the one I already have.

But IF you were going to make that bet, wouldn't you at least like to look at your cards?

It would be SILLY not to do so. So, how about REALLY trying to find out what the kid Colt has in his hands?

Oh! I forgot! It is a self-fulfilling prophecy: If we have a look at another QB JC's fragile ego and self-confidence will go to shambles because we would be creating a QB controversy...

It would be actually funny if it was not really pathetic.

[BigRedskinDaddy]

...Interesting how well have Skins fans been psychologically conditioned over the last decade to hope for the best and -NOT- prepare for the worst, just like the Front Office.

Facetiousness will get you nowhere, my friend. You are arguing in extremes; EITHER we plan for JC's complete and total collapse this season by doing something teams just don't do and have never done (for good reason) OR we just throw up our hands and leave it to fate or divine providence.

Is there no middle ground where we can perhaps come to some agreement? I'll go halfway if you will -

As far as our psychological conditioning is concerned, that's easy: I DO always hope for the best, but I NEVER have to prepare for the worst. That stuff always happens all on its own.

[Redskin in Canada]

Other than the Patriots, who suddenly found out this past year that Cassel was pretty good and he had some success, most likely due to the playoff and championship caliber team and coaching staff already in place around him, name the NFL teams that have multiple studs at QB.

Why would an injury to a Pats QB ends up REPEATEDLY producing a really good one who can actually START, and according to most none of the Skins QBs have too much of a prospect to be able to start with enough success to become FRANCHISE players?

It must be our bad luck. Maybe if we change the uniforms all will work out well

[Redskin in Canada]

You are arguing in extremes; EITHER we plan for JC's complete and total collapse this season by doing something teams just don't do and have never done (for good reason) OR we just throw up our hands and leave it to fate or divine providence.

No, JC does not need to be an utter failure to avoid reaching any success as a Team. All he has to do is play the next season like the last and the Team will end up in a similar position and out of the playoffs. Mediocrity pays according to you.

Is there no middle ground where we can perhaps come to some agreement? I'll go halfway if you will -

The middle ground, according to this thread, is the time willing to be given by fans to JC before they lose hope completely. Some have had it already. They need no further evidence. Most are willing to give them a few games during the regular season but not beyond half season. And yet the last of the lot of you are willing to bet the entire season on JC.

If it mattered in anyway to compromise, I would. The compromise is already reflected in the Poll. Most people are not willing to give him the whole season and most people do not want him out before the regular season. That is the compromise in this board regardless of where individual posters might find themselves. I feel that the Poll is wise.

As far as our psychological conditioning is concerned, that's easy: I DO always hope for the best, but I NEVER have to prepare for the worst. That stuff always happens all on its own.

No, it does not happen "all on its own". Battles are not won "all on their own". All failures and successes in life do not happen "all on their own".

They are the result of hard work and preparation for success by their leaders. Nothing beats planning and preparation in diplomacy, war and sports. Nothing.

[HEROHAMO]

JC started out well. Then stunk it up the rest of the way. In fact I could argue he was the worst QB in the second half of the season.

One more half season is all I am willing to give him. If it goes 0-6 in the first half then it is over!

If I were JC I would be looking over my shoulder, peeping in the rear view because Colt is coming for ya sucka!

[SkinsFreak]

The middle ground, according to this thread, is the time willing to be given by fans to JC before they lose hope completely. Some have had it already. They need no further evidence. Most are willing to give them a few games during the regular season but not beyond half season. And yet the last of the lot of you are willing to bet the entire season on JC.

It ain't about how many games the "fans" are willing to give. That is the coaches call, and they're in the best position to make that call.

Look, JC is most likely the starter going into next season. What good is it doing to keep hacking on the guy? What's the purpose? What do you and a few others wish to accomplish? Are you going to clue Zorn in on something he doesn't already know? Why is it that your opinions are superior to those who are actually PAID to coach and play the game? Do you know things about football and QB's that they don't?

So, what are the fans going to do? Are you sending your "pole" over to Vinny and Snyder? I mean, if the PAID PROFESSIONALS think JC is worth keeping and worthy of the starting role for longer than you'd like, are you taking the ball and going home? Are you going to pout, stomp your feet and cry in the corner? Are you going to sell your season tickets and become a fan of another team? Are you going to try and boycott the games and try to get other fans to hate the team too? Why can't some of us offer support for our starting QB? Is that not allowed?

Seriously, is there any sense of perspective that tells you that perhaps the teams struggles down the stretch weren't entirely JC's fault and perhaps the coaches recognize that? If Joe Gibbs and Zorn like him and play him, why is it that you think that's not acceptable? I mean really, do you have more insight than they do? If the coaches think we're good with JC, Collins and Colt, why is that not good enough for you?

If Zorn and the team think JC is our best option and gives us the best chance to win, why do you think you can predict the future and claim they're wrong? If an injury happens to JC, why do you think Todd can't step in and have any success, like he's done before? Why do you think Colt is doomed to failure and he's not worthy of a plan B scenario? Have you seen Colt or Todd play since last preseason? I know Todd and Colt don't play for 3 hours on a Sunday afternoon during the season, but what do you think they're doing the rest of the week?

Listen, I understand folks have opinions, but I just don't understand why some think they know more than the paid industry professionals, or why some ENDLESSLY bash the team they claim they love. I don't agree with everything my family does and my daughters certainly make mistakes from time to time, but I always support them and I don't walk around bashing them at every chance I get.

I can't speak for others, but for me, I'm simply putting my faith in the coaches and I believe they are best suited to make those choices. Look, I don't know if JC is going to be successful or not, but if the coaches think he might, I support that. I understand this is a game and not every player acquisition is going to pan out, for any team. It's simply part of the game. Just because a player doesn't work out for a team, doesn't mean the coach, the FO and the owner are idiots. Future success of players cannot be accurately forecasted. You win some, you lose some, it's just part of the game.

[Champsturf]

The middle ground, according to this thread, is the time willing to be given by fans to JC before they lose hope completely. Some have had it already. They need no further evidence. Most are willing to give them a few games during the regular season but not beyond half season. And yet the last of the lot of you are willing to bet the entire season on JC.

It ain't about how many games the "fans" are willing to give. That is the coaches call, and they're in the best position to make that call.

Look, JC is most likely the starter going into next season. What good is it doing to keep hacking on the guy? What's the purpose? What do you and a few others wish to accomplish? Are you going to clue Zorn in on something he doesn't already know? Why is it that your opinions are superior to those who are actually PAID to coach and play the game? Do you know things about football and QB's that they don't?

So, what are the fans going to do? Are you sending your "pole" over to Vinny and Snyder? I mean, if the PAID PROFESSIONALS think JC is worth keeping and worthy of the starting role for longer than you'd like, are you taking the ball and going home? Are you going to pout, stomp your feet and cry in the corner? Are you going to sell your season tickets and become a fan of another team? Are you going to try and boycott the games and try to get other fans to hate the team too? Why can't some of us offer support for our starting QB? Is that not allowed?

Seriously, is there any sense of perspective that tells you that perhaps the teams struggles down the stretch weren't entirely JC's fault and perhaps the coaches recognize that? If Joe Gibbs and Zorn like him and play him, why is it that you think that's not acceptable? I mean really, do you have more insight than they do? If the coaches think we're good with JC, Collins and Colt, why is that not good enough for you?

If Zorn and the team think JC is our best option and gives us the best chance to win, why do you think you can predict the future and claim they're wrong? If an injury happens to JC, why do you think Todd can't step in and have any success, like he's done before? Why do you think Colt is doomed to failure and he's not worthy of a plan B scenario? Have you seen Colt or Todd play since last preseason? I know Todd and Colt don't play for 3 hours on a Sunday afternoon during the season, but what do you think they're doing the rest of the week?

Listen, I understand folks have opinions, but I just don't understand why some think they know more than the paid industry professionals, or why some ENDLESSLY bash the team they claim they love. I don't agree with everything my family does and my daughters certainly make mistakes from time to time, but I always support them and I don't walk around bashing them at every chance I get.

I can't speak for others, but for me, I'm simply putting my faith in the coaches and I believe they are best suited to make those choices. Look, I don't know if JC is going to be successful or not, but if the coaches think he might, I support that. I understand this is a game and not every player acquisition is going to pan out, for any team. It's simply part of the game. Just because a player doesn't work out for a team, doesn't mean the coach, the FO and the owner are idiots. Future success of players cannot be accurately forecasted. You win some, you lose some, it's just part of the game.

Well, since I don't see Zorn or anyone from Redskins Park logging in and voting, my guess is that the FANS is what this thread is all about: their opinion as to how long Campbell should be allowed to stink up the joint. Somebody's high horse is just a little too much for me.

I don't think RiC is claiming to know more than the paid prefessionals, nor do I, but he's giving his opinion. Frankly, I think it's better to do that than just sit back and keep on saying that if it's good enough for Zorn, it's good enough for me. Blind loyalty sucks. There's nothing wrong with not having the same perspective as others. Actually, haven't you ever heard of having another set of eyes on a problem? Sometimes others easily see what you can't.

[SkinsFreak]

Actually, haven't you ever heard of having another set of eyes on a problem? Sometimes others easily see what you can't.

Perfect, and that's just the point. Are you sitting in on film study? Do you have full comprehension of Zorn's system and can accurately determine from the film study who failed at what assignments? Are you on the practice fields every day watching the 3 QB's compete side-by-side? Are you involved in the private offseason meetings where they might be discussing a so-called plan B?

If you can answer "yes" to any of those questions, then I'll buy what you're selling. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to.

[Redskin in Canada]

Actually, haven't you ever heard of having another set of eyes on a problem? Sometimes others easily see what you can't.

Perfect, and that's just the point. Are you sitting in on film study? Do you have full comprehension of Zorn's system and can accurately determine from the film study who failed at what assignments? Are you on the practice fields every day watching the 3 QB's compete side-by-side? Are you involved in the private offseason meetings where they might be discussing a so-called plan B?

If you can answer "yes" to any of those questions, then I'll buy what you're selling. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to.

Actually, Champsturf, you and I DO NOT NEED to seat on any meetings, or to have an insider's knowlege of what is going on in Zorn's head.

ALL we need to see are the RESULTS. All the ideas, plans and thoughts mean nothing. The proof is in the putting. We are what the record shows we are: the Team with the WORST record in the competitive NFC East.

By the way, I always thought that CLL's statement "Master of the Obvious" was a bit out of place at times. You earned it with your post in this thread man:

It ain't about how many games the "fans" are willing to give. That is the coaches call, and they're in the best position to make that call.

A true touch of genius.

Do not worry, JC will not be unseated by this Poll. His play will make that decision for him.

[Deadskins]

The proof is in the putting.

That depends if you are putting it in the pudding.

[BigRedskinDaddy]

...Listen, I understand folks have opinions, but I just don't understand why some think they know more than the paid industry professionals, or why some ENDLESSLY bash the team they claim they love...

I can't speak for others, but for me, I'm simply putting my faith in the coaches and I believe they are best suited to make those choices. Look, I don't know if JC is going to be successful or not, but if the coaches think he might, I support that. I understand this is a game and not every player acquisition is going to pan out, for any team. It's simply part of the game. Just because a player doesn't work out for a team, doesn't mean the coach, the FO and the owner are idiots. Future success of players cannot be accurately forecasted. You win some, you lose some, it's just part of the game.

I don't understand it either, SF. I don't think you or I are blind homers either. We just happen to love this team with an intense passion, and bottom line is, at the end of the day, whether they suck or rock...that passion will always be there.

The coaching staff has the say -- we fans do not. Sure, we have our opinions, and this is one of the places to voice them. Like you, I don't know whether JC is going to get it done...but I hope he does. I also have my doubts about Zorn...but I hope he is the coach we need.

"In the spring, hope springs eternal."

-are those flowers I see starting to bloom?

[SkinsFreak]

...Listen, I understand folks have opinions, but I just don't understand why some think they know more than the paid industry professionals, or why some ENDLESSLY bash the team they claim they love...

I can't speak for others, but for me, I'm simply putting my faith in the coaches and I believe they are best suited to make those choices. Look, I don't know if JC is going to be successful or not, but if the coaches think he might, I support that. I understand this is a game and not every player acquisition is going to pan out, for any team. It's simply part of the game. Just because a player doesn't work out for a team, doesn't mean the coach, the FO and the owner are idiots. Future success of players cannot be accurately forecasted. You win some, you lose some, it's just part of the game.

I don't understand it either, SF. I don't think you or I are blind homers either. We just happen to love this team with an intense passion, and bottom line is, at the end of the day, whether they suck or rock...that passion will always be there.

The coaching staff has the say -- we fans do not. Sure, we have our opinions, and this is one of the places to voice them. Like you, I don't know whether JC is going to get it done...but I hope he does. I also have my doubts about Zorn...but I hope he is the coach we need.

"In the spring, hope springs eternal."

-are those flowers I see starting to bloom?

Yeah, I don't know either. It's this eternal and chronic pessimism that I don't get. They constantly say the owner is an ignorant fool, the front office and scouting staff are stupid, the coach is an idiot and the starting QB sucks. Well, it must really suck for them, but misery does love company.

They endlessly say our team needs to develop our own players, but then want to bench and cut the same players. They act as if they're fed up with the free agent signings and big name trades by the owner, but then beg for Hanyesworth, Boldin and Gross. It's just hypocritical and self serving.

I think Zorn came in with a plan. I don't believe it's any stretch of the imagination to think Zorn decided to use his first season as a gauge to see what he's got to work with. He was forced to use what was given to him, and salaries and internal politics are a far greater realism than some comprehend. Changes are coming, we've heard as much after the coaches meetings a few weeks ago. I just don't think it's going to be at QB.

The coaches have a plan and know what they're doing. All I've said is that I support them and their plans. There's obviously no guarantee their plan will win a Super Bowl, but chronic pessimism and endless bashing is not the way I choose to support my team.

[SkinsFreak]

Actually, Champsturf, you and I DO NOT NEED to seat on any meetings, or to have an insider's knowlege of what is going on in Zorn's head.

ALL we need to see are the RESULTS. All the ideas, plans and thoughts mean nothing. The proof is in the putting. We are what the record shows we are: the Team with the WORST record in the competitive NFC East.

I disagree... unless you have ESP or some kind of sixth sense. Otherwise, the conclusions from the recent coaches meetings tell us there are far greater concerns than the QB position. Those evaluations were made from film and system review. The conclusions from the "results" were that there were greater concerns with the o-line. A teams record is not always indicative of a QB's level of play, just ask the Packers, it's a team sport.

In a press conference at Redskins Park on Wednesday, executive vice president of football operations Vinny Cerrato put a wrap on the 2008 season, saying that “everything” would be scrutinized with an eye toward improvement in 2009.

Cerrato said that team officials, including scouts and athletic trainers, will convene in mid-January to present their evaluations of the current roster.

Said Cerrato of the process: “We all sit in a room and talk about every player and what he needs to do to get better. Is there anything medical-wise [concerning a player]? So everybody will have a chance to evaluate and we’ll decide what we need to do with each player.”

"Our pro scouts have been evaluating each NFL team throughout the year and the [pending] free agents,” he said. “We give the free agent list to the coaches and we give them their books on free agents [in mid-January]. They’ll have a couple of weeks to grade and evaluate their free agents. Then we sit down as a group and watch them all.

"Last year we were not active, but we will always look at free agency, trades and the draft to acquire [players]. Any way that you can acquire players, we will look at and see what is in our best interest. Last year, we weren’t active because there wasn’t much [available]."

Jason Campbell is expected to enter the 2009 season as the Redskins’ starting quarterback.

Beyond that?

“I think what you do is you go year to year and you have to evaluate everything,” vice president of football operations Vinny Cerrato said on Wednesday.

Said Cerrato: “Is Jason where he wants to be? No. Does he still have a high ceiling? Absolutely. So he’s still making a lot of progress.”

Cerrato said that, in general, deciding the quarterback position long-term is the most important decision for a franchise.

“It’s the most important position on a football team,” he said. “You can’t win without one.”

And once the quarterback position is decided, many other personnel decisions start to fall into place.

“It makes everything easier,” Cerrato said.

[langleyparkjoe]

I'm gonna stick with my Billenium and Deagle on this one; 2nd year of system so give him the full year. If by the end of the season he looks like crap and since his contract will be up, the organization will be able to move on w/out looking like bad guys. At least by than we'll be able to have Colt step up and see what he can do. I do agree with the other poster, Colt isn't ready yet.. however I think Todd still has something in the tank.

[VetSkinsFan]

I'm gonna stick with my Billenium and Deagle on this one; 2nd year of system so give him the full year. If by the end of the season he looks like crap and since his contract will be up, the organization will be able to move on w/out looking like bad guys. At least by than we'll be able to have Colt step up and see what he can do. I do agree with the other poster, Colt isn't ready yet.. however I think Todd still has something in the tank.

Todd has never established himself as a starter. He's a back up who rode an emotional high and a stout defense. I'd rather bank on Colt's development than Collin's prowess as a starter. There's a reason he's a career back up, why is that so tough to comprehend?

[langleyparkjoe]

Hey I'm all for giving Colt a try, he put up super great numbers in college but don't you agree that he's still a little too wild with the few plays we've seen? If JC craps out the end of the season I'm all for giving Colt a try but I did say let JC play the whole season. As for Todd he only seemed to have one bad game if my memory is right, costly game though it was he still looks better than Colt. (from the very very very few x's I've seen Colt in preseason vs nfl)

[VetSkinsFan]

Hey I'm all for giving Colt a try, he put up super great numbers in college but don't you agree that he's still a little too wild with the few plays we've seen? If JC craps out the end of the season I'm all for giving Colt a try but I did say let JC play the whole season. As for Todd he only seemed to have one bad game if my memory is right, costly game though it was he still looks better than Colt. (from the very very very few x's I've seen Colt in preseason vs nfl)

Colt has had NO NFL experience to compare to. As for a gunslinger in a run-N-shoot offense, that's how he made his money. I say the kid looked too good in pre-season to totally not consider him.

[Redskin in Canada]

They constantly say the owner is an ignorant fool, the front office and scouting staff are stupid, the coach is an idiot and the starting QB sucks. Well, it must really suck for them, but misery does love company.

Let's make clear and straight:

Yes, I feel that the owner is not and will never be an NFL expert.

Yes, I feel that the Front office has shown profound incompetence, greed and failure during their tenure.

The scouting staff may or may not be that great. The fact is that the talent discovery from young inexpensive players is better in other teams.

The head coach is NOT an idiot. In fact, we want him to suvcceed and receive enough time to show what he can do.

The QB does not suck. He simply has not been and probably will not be the franchise QB who may carry this team to success. The coin is in the air but the whole point of this thread is that the make or break time is approaching more rapidly than some of you seem to suggest.

That's all. There are no "loyal homers" and "disloyal fans". There are just different perspectives that are debatable more often than not. But the RECORD is the RECORD and the best of intentions and the greener pastures come every spring can do NOTHING to change the fact that the Skins under the ownership of the current owner have been often the laughingstock of teh NFL. He is, together with Jerry Jones, the owners everybody in the NFL love to hate.

Happy now?

I thought so. I don't care.