Why Iffy will beat out Matt Bowen for the strong Safety spot

Hog lover · Post by **Hog lover** » Fri May 14, 2004 12:05 pm

These are the following reasons I believe Iffy will beat out Bowen for the strong safety spot.

1. He's more athletic and faster.
2. Makes better plays on the ball, ( i think if we look back on last season he was the most consistent player we had in the secondary.
3. His ability to make plays on the ball; interceptions, break-ups
4. More aggressive
5. Makes open field tackles better

I can recall a few games when Bowen was out of position or simply missed the tackle, ex. Cowboys game, Buc's game, and Buffalo,

Note: The reason i believe Matt Bowen has a real opportunity to start is the fact we just signed him to a nice contract last year.

BringThePain! · Post by **BringThePain!** » Fri May 14, 2004 12:26 pm

Hog lover wrote:These are the following reasons I believe Iffy will beat out Bowen for the strong safety spot.

1. He's more athletic and faster.

Coming into the NFL Bowen ran a 4.47 40 time. Ohalete ran 4.60

Hog lover wrote:2. Makes better plays on the ball, ( i think if we look back on last season he was the most consistent player we had in the secondary.
3. His ability to make plays on the ball; interceptions, break-ups

I can't say anybody in our secondary was consistent last year... but as for INT Bowen and Iffy both had 3

Hog lover wrote:4. More aggressive

Bowen had 2 Forced Fumbles, Iffy had 0 .... you have to be pretty aggresive to force fumbles...

Hog lover wrote:5. Makes open field tackles better

I can recall a few games when Bowen was out of position or simply missed the tackle, ex. Cowboys game, Buc's game, and Buffalo,

May have been out of position, but that could have been do to poor coaching/ no D-line help.... Plus I believe that Bowens & Iffy's natural position are both Strong Saftey... but Bowen being the better athlete they moved him to Free-Safety....

Hog lover wrote:Note: The reason i believe Matt Bowen has a real opportunity to start is the fact we just signed him to a nice contract last year.

Note: The reason I think so many people root for Iffy over Bowen to start is A)He's been a redskin longer and has worked his way up from the bottom, everybody likes an underdog.... and B) He's got a cool name... now that might sound like a non-factor, but psycologically it's true....

If you put those factors aside, you can see that thru better coaching, Bowen has more upside then Iffy.... Although I'm glad Iffy is staying with the team.... because he provides quality depth....

JDC · Post by **JDC** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:08 pm

Bring the Pain is right, I don't know why so many people assume Iffy is faster.

oafusp · Post by **oafusp** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:17 pm

wowzers! BTP just broke it down...kinda ripped your point apart.

nice try though!

Iffy is a good Safety, Bowen is a potentially very good safey, and Sean Taylor is potentially a GREAT safety.

I remember more than once Iffy and Bowen got caught out of position last year, and in the Miami game Bowen took the worst running lane to the ball and missed big time. Remember, Bowen has only been here for 1 season and it was a season under a ROOKIE D-Coordinator with a very suspect D-Line that opened the flood gates causing the safeties to get bull rushed every play....they had a lot on their plate last season.

Now, Williams will have a more organized defense and the players will not step foot on the field unless they know where they are supposed to be at any given time.

As for the ROOKIE D-Coordinator, he is back at coaching the linebackers w/ guru Marvin Lewis...and in time may get another shot at running an entire D again.

BossHog · Post by **BossHog** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:33 pm

Bring the Pain... :rock:

Nicely stated, and in my opinion, absolutely correct.

vpar2 · Post by **vpar2** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:37 pm

The thing I remember best about Bowen was that he had 11 solo tackles against the Falcons in the playoffs 2 years ago. Green Bsy lost the game, but he performs well under pressure and has the potential, in a good scheme, to put up big numbers.

BossHog · Post by **BossHog** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:39 pm

vpar2... welcome to the board. Please check the rules in the Welcome Wagon forum... no links are allowed in signatures... yours has been removed.

I look forward to talkin' Redskins with you!!!

HTTR

vpar2 · Post by **vpar2** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:46 pm

Im sorry about that link. Is a url okay? Thanks for the welcome.

Wysocki · Post by **Wysocki** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:49 pm

Iffy will start - on special teams...and he will be a valuable backup at either safety position.

BringThePain! · Post by **BringThePain!** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:51 pm

Thanks guys.... this subject has been debated so much... I've got it down to a science

PS - Hog Lover & vpar2: Welcome to the board!

ii7-V7 · Post by **ii7-V7** » Fri May 14, 2004 2:08 pm

BringThePain! wrote:Thanks guys.... this subject has been debated so much... I've got it down to a science

PS - Hog Lover & vpar2: Welcome to the board!

Hey give credit where credits' due! :wink:

Chad

BringThePain! · Post by **BringThePain!** » Fri May 14, 2004 2:14 pm

chaddukes wrote:
BringThePain! wrote:Thanks guys.... this subject has been debated so much... I've got it down to a science

PS - Hog Lover & vpar2: Welcome to the board!

Hey give credit where credits' due!

Chad

Yeah.... chaddukes and I debated this in a post a while back.... he thought Iffy was faster, then he found the stats on there 40 times... so those are owed to him... Thanks,Dukes!

Hog lover · Post by **Hog lover** » Fri May 14, 2004 2:17 pm

Hey guys, i know you'll may favor Bowen but to be honest i think Iffy is best suited for the spot.Football speed is alot different then track speed. I like both of the guys but i guess we will find out come game 1.

BringThePain! · Post by **BringThePain!** » Fri May 14, 2004 2:27 pm

Your right.... football speed is different than track speed... that means there both probably slower on the field than there times indicate.... But Bowen is known to make hard hits, and he doesn't seem like the type of guy to take a play off.... He goes in there looking to make an impact whether he's making the tackle or whiffing on it.... You can't go into those at half-speed or you'll get killed....

either way.... I didn't see either one of them chasing anybody down from behind.... but I don't think that the organization would have waited so long to sign Iffy if they thought he was going to be there starter.... but your right, will see in a couple of month's

Skeletor · Post by **Skeletor** » Fri May 14, 2004 2:30 pm

I would take comments about safeties being out of position with a grain of salt. It is virtually impossible to evaluate whether a safety was in position from a fan's perspective.

For one, you don't know what his assignment on that play was. He may have had the assignment to cover another part of the field, or up in run support. So then when you see the receiver catch a pass and a safety try to chase him down, you can't assume, well, that guy was out of position. If you don't know the scheme and coverage calls, how can you evaluate.

Secondly, even if you did know, you could only be able to tell from a birds eye view (like they show on NFL Matchup!). Most of us see only a portion of the game on TV because of camera angles. It's definately not enough to evaulate players.

And lastly, we fans tend to focus on the result. If a player makes a play we think he did well. That's not always the case. For example: last year, Jesse Armstead in the Atlanta game, decided to drop his assignment and go for the quarterback at a critical point in the game. He tackled the QB for a safety, helping the Skins to win that game. Great right? Well, he was out of position and not playing the scheme. Later in the season, Trotter tried the same thing against Carolina, who threw a swing pass to Stephen Davis that went for a big gain and lost us that game. In both cases, fans had no idea who was or was not in the proper position until the players and coaches revealed it.

For me, I'll put my trust in Gregg Williams to evaluate who is the better safety Iffy or Matt.

ace phoenix · Post by **ace phoenix** » Fri May 14, 2004 2:58 pm

At least we can have a debate about which safety will be better and get to start....
Last year we were just hoping that we had a safety that deserved to be in the NFL....Either way we are in much better shape than last year, and whoever doesn't start will provide adequate depth.
I personally still like bowen for that shot on Candidate in last years training camp. I can still see it today, with Spurrier stumbling over why he didn't like it.
So my vote is to Bowen...

John Manfreda · Post by **John Manfreda** » Fri May 14, 2004 2:58 pm

If Iffy is so much faster and athletic how come he didn't play free and move Matt to strong were it is his natural spot. Get your facts right than argue. "Matt Bowen has the edge because of his speed and tackling ability" Washington post writer.

Redskins4Life · Post by **Redskins4Life** » Fri May 14, 2004 3:38 pm

Bowen does not have 4.47 speed. Show me a link right now... And if for some reason he ran that in college, he definitely does not run it anymore. And if he still does then he never goes 100% because Iffy plays much faster on the gridiron than Bowen does. And as for Bowen's tackling ability, from what I've seen Ohalete is a more consistent tackler. Bowen is a harder hitter, but he also is out of position a lot trying to make the big hit which isn't good. Overall from what I saw last season, Ohalete is a much better safety...

BringThePain! · Post by **BringThePain!** » Fri May 14, 2004 3:59 pm

Redskins4Life wrote:Bowen does not have 4.47 speed. Show me a link right now...

Here's your link:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dy ... ge=printer

Here's the quote:

Bowen has come this far because of a blue-collar work ethic, but the Redskins coaches didn't realize Bowen's passion until seeing it firsthand. Despite his big raise, Bowen has kept the mentality of a low draft pick. ("He's one of those guys," Catavolos said, "who lives and breathes football 24 hours a day.") Bowen is almost always one of the last players to leave Redskins Park. On Tuesday, in addition to his writing gig, Bowen religiously visits the training facility to study film. During meetings for defensive backs, Bowen is known for asking detailed questions about the game plan. "He keeps you on your toes as a coach," Catavolos said. "You can say he's like an investigative reporter."

An instinctive and aggressive safety, Bowen isn't spectacular in any area but is solid in just about every facet, with a nice blend of savvy, size and speed (4.4 in the 40-yard dash). If there is any flaw, it's Bowen's one-on-one defense. "He really doesn't have any weaknesses," said cornerback Champ Bailey. "He's got good speed. He's got good range. And he can hit."

Now....

Iffy plays much faster on the gridiron than Bowen does. And as for Bowen's tackling ability, from what I've seen Ohalete is a more consistent tackler. Bowen is a harder hitter, but he also is out of position a lot trying to make the big hit which isn't good. Overall from what I saw last season, Ohalete is a much better safety...

Now you show me a link for the above

Or should we take your word for it??

biznitchn · Post by **biznitchn** » Fri May 14, 2004 8:07 pm

Greg Williams is the perfect fit for our team i believe both players will see playing time as the coach will be using a veriaty of packages but whoever plays more will be decided by him :rock:

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Fri May 14, 2004 9:21 pm

Ah, yes. But Bowen makes his tackles, and hits harder.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Fri May 14, 2004 9:33 pm

Bowen has come this far because of a blue-collar work ethic, but the Redskins coaches[b/] didn't realize Bowen's passion until seeing it firsthand. Despite his big raise, Bowen has kept the mentality of a low draft pick. ("He's one of those guys," Catavolos said, "who lives and breathes football 24 hours a day.") Bowen is almost always one of the last players to leave Redskins Park. On Tuesday, in addition to his writing gig, Bowen religiously visits the training facility to study film. During meetings for defensive backs, Bowen is known for asking detailed questions about the game plan. "He keeps you on your toes as a coach," Catavolos said. "You can say he's like an investigative reporter."

An instinctive and aggressive safety, Bowen isn't spectacular in any area but is solid in just about every facet, with a nice blend of savvy, size and speed (4.4 in the 40-yard dash). If there is any flaw, it's Bowen's one-on-one defense. "He really doesn't have any weaknesses," said cornerback Champ Bailey. "He's got good speed. He's got good range. And he can hit."

Maybe Im spiteful but I believe nothing those coaches from last year said. If they said the sky is blue I'd have to second guess them, lol. I personally think Ohalete is a better player but thats just from my long term memory. I think Ohalete is faster.

Bowen does not have 4.47 speed. Show me a link right now...

Do they clock your speed with pads or no pads?
Iffy may be slower without pads but he may be faster with pads on. I know that sounds weird but it is true, pads really affects peoples speed.

IMO Iffy plays faster. Bowen looks really slow in comparision.

Redskins4Life · Post by **Redskins4Life** » Fri May 14, 2004 9:45 pm

Great post Chris Luva Luva. I think if Bowen runs a 4.47, it's without pads because Iffy Ohalete is a much faster player, at least in games. And like Chris said, I wouldn't believe a word those coaches said last year.

BringThePain! · Post by **BringThePain!** » Fri May 14, 2004 10:05 pm

Pads might slow you down.... but there not making you run faster..... neither one of them play faster than the other because neither one where chasing down anybody from behind.... so we should just throw the "who's faster?" factor out the window....

Plus not only the coaches said it .... but the almighty Bailey said it too.....

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Fri May 14, 2004 10:21 pm

Plus not only the coaches said it .... but the almighty Bailey said it too.....

Yea, Lavar and all of them aren't being listened to either. All we heard last year "we have a great coach, he gives us freedom"....lol. :lol:

Pads might slow you down.... but there not making you run faster.

Wut Im saying is. These are random #'s just to explain my point.

Without pads
Bowen 4.47
Iffy 4.9

With Pads
Bowen 5.5
Iffy 5.0

The pads aren't making Iffy faster, they just slow him down less than Bowen.

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Why Iffy will beat out Matt Bowen for the strong Safety spot

Why Iffy will beat out Matt Bowen for the strong Safety spot

Re: Why Iffy will beat out Matt Bowen for the strong Safety

skeletor is right