Post Game Discussion: Skins/Giants

[redskins14ru]

the skins have been looking at brennan for such along time, he was in hawaii doing well. be it in a confrence that was thin a db and defense. I think it may have been Chris luva luva that dropped in a post about brennan along time ago, way back in like 2004 he even added some game film,I only read then..... there is a reporter in washington she came from Japan, I can't remember her name but she my have also done some type of a story on Brennan. If needed colt my have the ability to step in and lead thats what qbs do... that last post was stellar the cheerleaders are soooo great. they will be a game time fav next year here in san diego!!

[Deadskins]

I've been a big fan of JC for a long time (Ray N Austin and I have gotten into a lot on this subject), but I am slowly starting to think that JC just doesn't have what it takes to by anything more than an average NFL qb. I'm not totally giving up on him, but I think that this offseason we should consider drafting a qb. This year's draft is going to be one of the best for qb's in a while and it'll be possible to get a 2nd round qb talent in the 3rd or 4th round.

GASP!!!! I must be seeing things.

On a side note, you want to give JC three years, but you won't consider giving Colt a couple of games?

Given what little we saw of him in pre-season, it looked like he was pretty quick to pick up enough of the playbook to show he's capable. We should at least give him an opportunity somewhere along the way. I think he was the big sleeper pick of the draft.

I'm sure you saw more than Zorn did, Ray.

[Fios]

I've been a big fan of JC for a long time (Ray N Austin and I have gotten into a lot on this subject), but I am slowly starting to think that JC just doesn't have what it takes to by anything more than an average NFL qb. I'm not totally giving up on him, but I think that this offseason we should consider drafting a qb. This year's draft is going to be one of the best for qb's in a while and it'll be possible to get a 2nd round qb talent in the 3rd or 4th round.

GASP!!!! I must be seeing things.

On a side note, you want to give JC three years, but you won't consider giving Colt a couple of games?

Given what little we saw of him in pre-season, it looked like he was pretty quick to pick up enough of the playbook to show he's capable. We should at least give him an opportunity somewhere along the way. I think he was the big sleeper pick of the draft.

I'm sure you saw more than Zorn did, Ray.

And all of the NFL GMs and scouts who passed on him in the draft

[CanesSkins26]

You mean Colt Brennan? That guy is a joke.

Based on what? Dude, c'mon man.

Watching him play in college. He put up huge numbers in a gimmick offense playing awful competition. The few times that he played against good teams he looked terrible (see the Georgia bowl game his senior year). The guy barely even took a snap from under center (was in shotgun the vast majority of the time in college) during his time at Hawaii. Even if he even becomes a serviceable player the guy is a long term project. Add in his character concerns and imo this isn't a guy that will amount to much as an NFL player.

[Redskin in Canada]

When the Redskins fans are negative, they remind me of ...

Mmmmmmmmmmm....

NFC East fans!

http://www.the-hogs.net/forum/viewtopic. ... heerleader

[VetSkinsFan]

You mean Colt Brennan? That guy is a joke.

Based on what? Dude, c'mon man.

Watching him play in college. He put up huge numbers in a gimmick offense playing awful competition. The few times that he played against good teams he looked terrible (see the Georgia bowl game his senior year). The guy barely even took a snap from under center (was in shotgun the vast majority of the time in college) during his time at Hawaii. Even if he even becomes a serviceable player the guy is a long term project. Add in his character concerns and imo this isn't a guy that will amount to much as an NFL player.

So one bad game makes him not worthy? I mean, Brady lost the SuperBowl.. does that make a bad QB?

Noone said the R&S would be successful here. The intagnibles he has can bridge the gap between college and this level, or they could not. He did make things happen when he got the chance. Yes, he played vs PS squad players, but on his side of the ball was likewise talent, so it was STILL on an even field. What ever happened to be innocent until proven guilty? In some peoples' eyes, he's already a bust without even getting on the field.

Character concerns? Wasn't that his freshman year? If what I did at that age was held against me still, I'd be in a lot of trouble. I mean, was it YOUR sister he violated? Since getting here, I haven't heard ONE BAD THING about him. I could care less what he did 5 years ago.

[Chris Luva Luva]

If Malcom Kelly drops another pass next week, I will call him Carlos Kelly until I forget to continue to do so.

[VetSkinsFan]

If Malcom Kelly drops another pass next week, I will call him Carlos Kelly until I forget to continue to do so.

Hey, Rogers has much seniority on Kelly, give him a chance at least.

[SkinsFreak]

You mean Colt Brennan? That guy is a joke.

Based on what? Dude, c'mon man.

Watching him play in college. He put up huge numbers in a gimmick offense playing awful competition. The few times that he played against good teams he looked terrible (see the Georgia bowl game his senior year). The guy barely even took a snap from under center (was in shotgun the vast majority of the time in college) during his time at Hawaii. Even if he even becomes a serviceable player the guy is a long term project. Add in his character concerns and imo this isn't a guy that will amount to much as an NFL player.

Junk, absolute junk.

Yes, Colt played a lot of shotgun, so I guess he can't take two steps forward and take a direct snap from a center is what you're saying. Is that right? Please, give me a break. Taking a direct snap is the first thing any football player learns how to do. A baby must learn to walk before he can run. But if someone spends more time skipping, I guess he won't remember how to walk, right?

The system Colt played in is irrelevant as to why Zorn drafted him. Colt holds 31 NCAA records. Sure, the system he played in accounted for helping Colt earn many of those records. But it was his passing efficiency (159.85) and his 70.1 completion percentage that made him attractive to Zorn. It doesn't matter what system you're playing in or the strength of the defense you're playing, because once you drop back to throw, it's all on the QB to execute and deliver the ball. Colt can make the throws and that's what's relevant. Like Zorn said, it's all about "can you hit what you're throwing at".

[redskins14ru]

I hope the skins run alot this week end! run left run right run to the end zone at night vs the ravens!!!!
Really, 31 records impressive at any college. I see the point in wanting someone that has experienced success. with the current system being ZORNS SYSTEM the turn overs are down and JC seems to be working it out for himself in his first year. The QB position at washington is a big deal.

[PulpExposure]

You mean Colt Brennan? That guy is a joke.

Based on what? Dude, c'mon man.

Watching him play in college. He put up huge numbers in a gimmick offense playing awful competition. The few times that he played against good teams he looked terrible (see the Georgia bowl game his senior year). The guy barely even took a snap from under center (was in shotgun the vast majority of the time in college) during his time at Hawaii. Even if he even becomes a serviceable player the guy is a long term project. Add in his character concerns and imo this isn't a guy that will amount to much as an NFL player.

Junk, absolute junk.

Yes, Colt played a lot of shotgun, so I guess he can't take two steps forward and take a direct snap from a center is what you're saying. Is that right? Please, give me a break. Taking a direct snap is the first thing any football player learns how to do. A baby must learn to walk before he can run. But if someone spends more time skipping, I guess he won't remember how to walk, right?

The system Colt played in is irrelevant as to why Zorn drafted him. Colt holds 31 NCAA records. Sure, the system he played in accounted for helping Colt earn many of those records. But it was his passing efficiency (159.85) and his 70.1 completion percentage that made him attractive to Zorn. It doesn't matter what system you're playing in or the strength of the defense you're playing, because once you drop back to throw, it's all on the QB to execute and deliver the ball. Colt can make the throws and that's what's relevant. Like Zorn said, it's all about "can you hit what you're throwing at".

SF, you want to be careful with the whole college stats argument. I think Colt will be fine as an NFL QB, but I wouldn't go with your argument. The NFL landscape is littered with the wrecked careers of so many college QBs who racked up serious stats due to gimmicky offenses.

For example, Danny Wuerffel held the career QB efficiency rating record (163.56), and had a single-season record of 178.4 rating. David Klingler held the season TD record (until Brennan broke it), and Ty Detmer held the career TD record (until Brennan broke it).

Hell, most damning about the stats argument is that Timmy Chang (Colt's predecessor at Hawaii) still holds the most passing yards career, and only had 14 less career TDs than Brennan. He had very close numbers to Brennan...and see how well it's translated into NFL success for him (he's in the CFL...).

Seriously, if you look at the NCAA record book for individual stats, there are virtually no QBs listed as record holders there who have succeeded in the NFL.

The "he had awesome stats in college" argument is just not historically a good predictor for NFL success.

[SkinsFreak]

You mean Colt Brennan? That guy is a joke.

Based on what? Dude, c'mon man.

Watching him play in college. He put up huge numbers in a gimmick offense playing awful competition. The few times that he played against good teams he looked terrible (see the Georgia bowl game his senior year). The guy barely even took a snap from under center (was in shotgun the vast majority of the time in college) during his time at Hawaii. Even if he even becomes a serviceable player the guy is a long term project. Add in his character concerns and imo this isn't a guy that will amount to much as an NFL player.

Junk, absolute junk.

Yes, Colt played a lot of shotgun, so I guess he can't take two steps forward and take a direct snap from a center is what you're saying. Is that right? Please, give me a break. Taking a direct snap is the first thing any football player learns how to do. A baby must learn to walk before he can run. But if someone spends more time skipping, I guess he won't remember how to walk, right?

The system Colt played in is irrelevant as to why Zorn drafted him. Colt holds 31 NCAA records. Sure, the system he played in accounted for helping Colt earn many of those records. But it was his passing efficiency (159.85) and his 70.1 completion percentage that made him attractive to Zorn. It doesn't matter what system you're playing in or the strength of the defense you're playing, because once you drop back to throw, it's all on the QB to execute and deliver the ball. Colt can make the throws and that's what's relevant. Like Zorn said, it's all about "can you hit what you're throwing at".

SF, you want to be careful with the whole college stats argument. I think Colt will be fine as an NFL QB, but I wouldn't go with your argument. The NFL landscape is littered with the wrecked careers of so many college QBs who racked up serious stats due to gimmicky offenses.

For example, Danny Wuerffel held the career QB efficiency rating record (163.56), and had a single-season record of 178.4 rating. David Klingler held the season TD record (until Brennan broke it), and Ty Detmer held the career TD record (until Brennan broke it).

Hell, most damning about the stats argument is that Timmy Chang (Colt's predecessor at Hawaii) still holds the most passing yards career, and only had 14 less career TDs than Brennan. He had very close numbers to Brennan...and see how well it's translated into NFL success for him (he's in the CFL...).

Seriously, if you look at the NCAA record book for individual stats, there are virtually no QBs listed as record holders there who have succeeded in the NFL.

The "he had awesome stats in college" argument is just not historically a good predictor for NFL success.

The only stat that meant anything to Zorn, as he previously mentioned, was the 70.1 completion percentage, meaning Colt was able to get the ball on target more than 70% of the time, and that doesn't even account for dropped or blocked passes. The other 31 records are not the issue and not the intent of my argument. Zorn said he was concerned with "can you hit what you're throwing at". The passing efficiency number I posted was merely meant as a supportive indicator. I only posted 2 stats, the one Zorn mentioned and one supportive stat. Other than that, I, nor Zorn, really don't care about the other stats.

[PulpExposure]

The only stat that meant anything to Zorn, as he previously mentioned, was the 70.1 completion percentage, meaning Colt was able to get the ball on target more than 70% of the time, and that doesn't even account for dropped or blocked passes. The other 31 records are not the issue and not the intent of my argument. Zorn said he was concerned with "can you hit what you're throwing at". The passing efficiency number I posted was merely meant as a supportive indicator. I only posted 2 stats, the one Zorn mentioned and one supportive stat. Other than that, I, nor Zorn, really don't care about the other stats.

Just FYI You do know that Jason Campbell had a very similar (69.6) completion percentage his senior year, right? As you know, completion % is dependant upon the system as much as the QB, as it's hyperinflated in a short passing attack, and will be low in a downfield passing attack. A QB who throws 3 times to get 10 yards can have a 100% completion percentage (chucking 3.3 yard passes) or 33% completion percentage (1 pass for 10 yards), but they're equally effective (or ineffective...). Imho, it's completely overrated as a QB stat.

You should have a high completion percentage in a system like Brennan played in, which flooded the field with receivers running short and middle patterns (note, Jones revamped the system from when Timmy Chang played, as Chang threw deep a whole lot more).

[SkinsFreak]

but they're equally effective (or ineffective...). Imho, it's completely overrated as a QB stat.

Again, just going off the reasons Zorn stated for drafting Colt, and that has to do with accuracy. I don't much care about the stats and records, even though they're numerous. Colt can throw the ball, and that's what's relevant.

[markshark84]

You mean Colt Brennan? That guy is a joke.

Based on what? Dude, c'mon man.

Watching him play in college. He put up huge numbers in a gimmick offense playing awful competition. The few times that he played against good teams he looked terrible (see the Georgia bowl game his senior year). The guy barely even took a snap from under center (was in shotgun the vast majority of the time in college) during his time at Hawaii. Even if he even becomes a serviceable player the guy is a long term project. Add in his character concerns and imo this isn't a guy that will amount to much as an NFL player.

The fact that a guy played against sub-par competition has no relevence to their NFL abilities. If that were true, I guess guys like Flacco, Werner, Garrard, Romo, Delhomme, and Rothlesberger should have never even showed up to the NFL.

I'll also say that if Colt had done nothing in the pre-season, this wouldn't even be discussed. But, he did. He performed well. His performance made me wonder what he could do against first string guys. He seemed to work under center just fine in the preseason. And the fact is that Colt has intangibles that Jason doesn't possess. He has leadership, morale, and vocal qualities Jason has yet to show. Guys can (and would want to) get behind Colt.

I'd rather try something new over what we have now. It's a step back to take two steps forward.

[Hoss]

Time to move on to the Ravens.