New article on our FO

Talk about the Washington Football Team here. Do you bleed burgundy and gold?
PulpExposure
Pushing Paper
Pushing Paper
Posts: 4860
youtube meble na wymiar Warszawa
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2005 3:01 pm

New article on our FO

Post by PulpExposure »

How much is true, and how much is a flat out lie?

Link.

Some of the relevant portions:

With it, Cerrato ascends to a position where he can shape and determine the Redskins' immediate future, and if you don't believe me you weren't paying attention to the team's last coaching hire.

It was Cerrato who swung the votes in favor of Jim Zorn.

It was Cerrato who headed the search for the team's new public relations director, too. It was Cerrato who urged owner Daniel Snyder to avoid the free-agent frenzy. And it will be Cerrato who takes the wheel for the club's next spin around the NFL Draft.

"I have a lot more say-so," he said.

<snip>

You build through the draft," said Cerrato, "but when there's an opportunity to upgrade you have to look at trades or free agency."

<snip>

But that's where Cerrato comes in. With his advice the Redskins sat on the free-agent sidelines this year, spending early only to retain Collins. Otherwise, they let others do the spending, and that could be a good thing for the Redskins.

Of course, that all depends on how successful Cerrato is.

"If there's a lesson we learned through free agency," he said, "it's that, number one, you try to sign young guys who can play out the contracts, and, two, the guys we had success with all played for one of our coaches or someone on the staff at some time in their careers."

<snip>

He should be. For years he operated in the shadows of Snyder, Gibbs and Spurrier. Now the Redskins are carting him out to help make critical decisions, meet with the media, meet with the public and, above all, keep them competitive in Life After Joe.

"He laid down the foundation and the groundwork for the success we've had," Cerrato said of Gibbs. "We're coming off a playoff year, and we have continuity -- with most of the coaches in place -- and the new guys we've added will bring energy to the group."

The most important one, of course, is Zorn, and already he and quarterback Jason Campbell seem to be hitting it off. The two spend four days a week on the practice fields, with Campbell at the complex most of the past month, and so far, so good.

Zorn and Cerrato seem to be hitting it off, too


I hope it's true....
User avatar
riggofan
HereComesTheDiesel
HereComesTheDiesel
Posts: 9460
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2004 5:29 pm
Location: Montclair, Virginia

Post by riggofan »

Well, give Vinny credit for saying all of the right things. I'm pretty sure every Skins fan on this board would like to see him turn out to be the best GM (or whatever his position is officially) in the entire NFL.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax
"We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
frankcal20
^^^^^^^
^^^^^^^
Posts: 9017
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2004 5:52 pm
Contact:

Post by frankcal20 »

I sure would.
User avatar
PeetyPa
piglet
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 12:56 pm

Post by PeetyPa »

Me too!
GSPODS
Hog
Posts: 4716
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:20 am

Post by GSPODS »

The article claims Cerrato was behind the drafts of defensive linemen Dana Stubblefield and Bryant Young; that he found Pro Bowl linebacker Lee Woodall in the sixth round; pushed for Pro Bowl quarterback Elvis Grbac in the eighth and uncovered Pro Bowl cornerback R.W. McQuarters. Then there's that unknown receiver out of Tennessee-Chattanooga he found in the third round of the 1996 draft. Would Terrell Owens please step forward?

If Cerrato was responsible for drafting any of these players, then maybe he's better at his job than I've been giving him credit for.

There's s huge difference between saying the right things and doing the right things. While this article has an undoubtedly pro-Cerrato slant, I'm still holding recervation until both the draft and free agency are officially over. We'll see what the Redskins look like then.
frankcal20
^^^^^^^
^^^^^^^
Posts: 9017
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2004 5:52 pm
Contact:

Post by frankcal20 »

Can we find one guy with the talent level of those guys please!!!!!
SkinsFreak
Fire in the Sky
Fire in the Sky
Posts: 4730
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:31 am
Location: Surfside
Contact:

Post by SkinsFreak »

Good find, and good article. I believe it's mostly accurate. I also believe most of the criticism's thrown at Vinny have been inflated and he's been used as a scapegoat. Yeah, like the article said, he missed on Sanders, Smith, Lloyd and Arch. But I believe Sanders and Smith were mostly the works of Snyder, Lloyd was the result of Gibbs and it was Williams that wanted Arch. Maybe Vinny had some say in those signings, but I don't believe for a minute that he was solely responsible.

Critics still contend that Cerrato has been put in a position to fail, but I'd be careful there. In San Francisco he was part of a staff that drafted 16 Pro Bowlers from 1991-98, including two Rookies of the Year, and that sent 10 free-agent additions to Honolulu from 1993-98, including 1994 Defensive Player of the Year Deion Sanders.

"He didn't get the accolades in San Francisco," said one league source. "But of all the GMs who are out there, there are only a few with Super Bowl rings on their hands -- and Vinny Cerrato is one of those guys."


Hard to spin that in a negative way. So far this offseason, I think Vinny is doing a nice job. And if he was the one that swung the vote for Zorn, then kudos to Vin. There will always be someone that isn't pleased over a drafted player, but I do tend to have faith that Vinny and his staff will do just fine.
Sgraham
swine
Posts: 66
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:28 pm

Post by Sgraham »

This is crazy.


Some of the same people posting good stuff on any of these threads are the same people who have bashed Vinny Cerato over the last few years.

Pick a side and stay there. Some of you guys are true fair weather fans.

HTTR!

:roll:
El Mexican
Hog
Posts: 1061
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2005 11:57 am

Post by El Mexican »

It´s been 10 years since Snyder bought the team.

Cerrato has been in and out through that period.

Can you honestly say the team has had success with him taking important decisions?
jDub
swine
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Jan 24, 2004 6:59 pm
Location: Brooklyn, NY

We all ride the waves of a fan's emotion

Post by jDub »

Sgraham wrote:This is crazy.


Some of the same people posting good stuff on any of these threads are the same people who have bashed Vinny Cerato over the last few years.

Pick a side and stay there. Some of you guys are true fair weather fans.

HTTR!

:roll:


I hear your frustration, but I think people are entitled to change their minds in light of new information.

I have no problem saying that I wasn't a big fan of Vinny Cerrato. But things are looking up. We'll see how this unfolds.
cleg
cleg
cleg
Posts: 2649
Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2006 11:58 am
Location: Deep in the Heart of Giants Territory

Post by cleg »

Sgraham wrote:This is crazy.


Some of the same people posting good stuff on any of these threads are the same people who have bashed Vinny Cerato over the last few years.

Pick a side and stay there. Some of you guys are true fair weather fans.

HTTR!

:roll:


You are allowed to change your opinion of a situation when new or uncovred facts are disclosed. If not, why then the world would be a pretty ugly place full of uncompromising people.
Drinking the Kool-Aid again...
GSPODS
Hog
Posts: 4716
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:20 am

Post by GSPODS »

Opinion - [Origin: 1250–1300; ME < OF < L opīniōn- (s. of opīniō), deriv. of opīnārī to opine]

- a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.
- a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.
- a judgment or estimate of a person or thing with respect to character, merit, etc.

One's conclusion about something. An opinion is a belief or judgment that falls short of absolute conviction, certainty, or positive knowledge.

Opine - [Origin: 1575–85; < L opīnārī to think, deem]

- to hold or express an opinion.

I opine that anyone blindly clinging to the same opinion as though opinion were the eqivalent of scientific law, does not think, and therefore is not.

Everything can be taken away from a person except one thoughts.
Hypothesize and Theorize.
History clearly delineates the thinkers from the non-thinkers in that only the thinkers appear in history books.
"I think, therefore I am."

And, now knowing how it seems to irritate certain members, I shall go opine on Vinny Cerrato once more. And after much deliberate thought and careful consternation, perhaps I shall change my opinion yet again.
User avatar
HardDawg
Hog
Posts: 424
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:37 pm
Location: Orlando

Post by HardDawg »

I can't believe I'm saying this but I'm becoming a Vinny C fan....wow
Strength, though vital, must always be at the servitude of wisdom!
SkinsJock
08 Champ
08 Champ
Posts: 18385
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2004 10:23 pm
Location: New England

Post by SkinsJock »

Just amazing :roll: Someone who has made so many bad mistakes with his decisions with this team can now begin to be looked at differently by making almost no decisions.

Cerrato was great - was - he has had the opportunity here and now we need to get rid of him and get a decent GM - this guy needs to go.

I have said this before, when we win our next NFL Championship, even if that is in the next 3 years, it will have nothing to do with Cerrato.
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
yupchagee
#14
#14
Posts: 4536
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2006 2:50 pm
Location: Louisville KY

Post by yupchagee »

GSPODS wrote:Opinion - [Origin: 1250–1300; ME < OF < L opīniōn- (s. of opīniō), deriv. of opīnārī to opine]

- a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.
- a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.
- a judgment or estimate of a person or thing with respect to character, merit, etc.

One's conclusion about something. An opinion is a belief or judgment that falls short of absolute conviction, certainty, or positive knowledge.

Opine - [Origin: 1575–85; < L opīnārī to think, deem]

- to hold or express an opinion.

I opine that anyone blindly clinging to the same opinion as though opinion were the eqivalent of scientific law, does not think, and therefore is not.

Everything can be taken away from a person except one thoughts.
Hypothesize and Theorize.
History clearly delineates the thinkers from the non-thinkers in that only the thinkers appear in history books.
"I think, therefore I am."

And, now knowing how it seems to irritate certain members, I shall go opine on Vinny Cerrato once more. And after much deliberate thought and careful consternation, perhaps I shall change my opinion yet again.


What Descartes REALLY said was "I stink, therefore I am". French have been living by that credo ever since. :wink:
Skins fan since '55

"The constitution is not a suicide pact"- Abraham Lincoln
User avatar
SkinsHead56
Hog
Posts: 805
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2004 7:03 pm
Location: Santa Barbara,CA

Post by SkinsHead56 »

SkinsJock wrote:Just amazing :roll: Someone who has made so many bad mistakes with his decisions with this team can now begin to be looked at differently by making almost no decisions.

Cerrato was great - was - he has had the opportunity here and now we need to get rid of him and get a decent GM - this guy needs to go.

I have said this before, when we win our next NFL Championship, even if that is in the next 3 years, it will have nothing to do with Cerrato.

Well, seems that there are plenty of "experts" that disagree with you. As a matter of fact Mel Kiper stated that Vinny C. is among the very best talent scouts in the league today. That is saying something.
In memorium Sean Taylor 1983-2007 R.I.P.

Long live the Legend of "Meast".
Gnome
Hog
Posts: 215
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2006 9:15 am
Location: Peachtree City, GA

Post by Gnome »

This is the offseason all the dan/vinny critics have been calling for over the last ten years. And this is the first offseason Vinny has been in charge. I gotta give the guy props so far. We've got a long way to go to September, but half way through and Vinny's offseason strategy looks, well, really smart. Rock on, V-man!
All Hail the Maroon and Black!!!!
SkinsFreak
Fire in the Sky
Fire in the Sky
Posts: 4730
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:31 am
Location: Surfside
Contact:

Post by SkinsFreak »

SkinsHead56 wrote:Well, seems that there are plenty of "experts" that disagree with you. As a matter of fact Mel Kiper stated that Vinny C. is among the very best talent scouts in the league today. That is saying something.


I heard that as well.
GSPODS
Hog
Posts: 4716
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:20 am

Post by GSPODS »

SkinsHead56 wrote:Well, seems that there are plenty of "experts" that disagree with you. As a matter of fact Mel Kiper stated that Vinny C. is among the very best talent scouts in the league today. That is saying something.


Kiper works for ESPN, which nullifies his credibility. What does lend creedence to Cerrato's scouting abilities is the opinions of others who have the same job title and / or responsibilities. Several GM's of other teams have openly stated Cerrato is among the best at scouting when he is allowed to do his job without interference from ownership or the coaching staff.

As far as I'm concerned, the jury will be out until September 4th. I'm waiting to see the on-field product, not the on-paper product.
SkinsJock
08 Champ
08 Champ
Posts: 18385
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2004 10:23 pm
Location: New England

Post by SkinsJock »

There are a lot of fans here that know more about managing an NFL team than Kiper and a lot of the NFL media - most of those fans here know very litte - Kiper is like a lot of politicians - they say what people who are paying them want them to say.


Cerrato might be great but he should be fired for all his stupid mistakes - we would be better off with a good GM. That is not going to happen unfortunately. The real problem is that we have an owner that cannot let NFL people run his team. At present Cerrato is probably one of the few that Snyder will "work" with and the 2 of them are not doing a bad job this off-season.
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
GSPODS
Hog
Posts: 4716
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:20 am

Post by GSPODS »

SkinsJock wrote:Cerrato might be great but he should be fired for all his stupid mistakes - we would be better off with a good GM.


Question: Is it fair to claim that all of the "stupid mistakes" were made by Vinny Cerrato? As you pointed out, Dan Snyder controls the purse strings. Shouldn't Snyder be blamed for the "stupid mistakes" more than Cerrato, since Snyder is the final OK?

And, if we are going to blame Cerrato for everything that has gone wrong, doesn't that also mean we have to praise him for everything that has gone well? If we blame Cerrato for Archuleta and Lloyd and all of the mistakes, we have to praise him for all of the good decisions. Either Cerrato makes the personnel decisions or he doesn't. It's ridiculous to think that two different people are making the personnel decisions, one making all of the good ones and Cerrato making all of the bad ones. If that were the case, Cerrato would have been fired long ago. This NFL franchise is first and foremost a business. And while Snyder may know little or nothing about football, he knows far more than most about business, which is how he bought the team in the first place.

My 2 cents
Chris Luva Luva
---
---
Posts: 18887
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 1:55 pm
Location: AJT
Contact:

Post by Chris Luva Luva »

GSPODS wrote:Question: Is it fair to claim that all of the "stupid mistakes" were made by Vinny Cerrato? As you pointed out, Dan Snyder controls the purse strings. Shouldn't Snyder be blamed for the "stupid mistakes" more than Cerrato, since Snyder is the final OK?


YOu make a very valid point, one I was going to touch on this previous Fri but didn't feel like getting into.

The obscurity of the FO structure and poor PR really makes me question some things...
The road to the number 1 pick gaining speed!
GSPODS
Hog
Posts: 4716
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:20 am

Post by GSPODS »

Chris Luva Luva wrote:
GSPODS wrote:Question: Is it fair to claim that all of the "stupid mistakes" were made by Vinny Cerrato? As you pointed out, Dan Snyder controls the purse strings. Shouldn't Snyder be blamed for the "stupid mistakes" more than Cerrato, since Snyder is the final OK?


YOu make a very valid point, one I was going to touch on this previous Fri but didn't feel like getting into.

The obscurity of the FO structure and poor PR really makes me question some things...


After 2600+ posts, I was bound to make a valid point sooner or later, even if only by accident. 8-[
SkinsJock
08 Champ
08 Champ
Posts: 18385
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2004 10:23 pm
Location: New England

Post by SkinsJock »

I remember reading about Cerrato when he first arrived and thinking that he was a part of the 49er's franchise rise through acquiring talent BUT he was also partly to blame, in my opinion, for their financial crisis. I wondered how he was going to help here when we basically had an owner that might let him loose again and cause the Redskins to get into "financial difficulties" like his previous team.

We all remember the media insisting that based on a lot of their "signings" and "irresponsible player contracts", that the Redskins were "facing cap hell" - BUT it was always "down the road" and "they are going to be in tough shape" because of all the wheeling and dealing that was going on. :shock: The reality is that we never really went into the level of difficulty that was always predicted. Yes, there were some "restrictions" but never bad enough to cause us to have to release the players that so many other teams had to go through to "manage the cap" :wink:

Despite this financial "wizardry" on the part of both Cerrato and Snyder we were really just signing players that were great players but not necessarily players that made our team better - great players make your team look great on paper (and to the fans) but they do not necessarily help your team be more successful on the field.

I am critical of Cerrato in that he did not help Snyder (who needs a lot of help) acquire the right players. We just seemed to go after whoever was the best available and not necessarily the best fit available. The thinking seemed to be that the talent would make the other players better but in a lot of cases it did not and in some cases it actually hurt the team. For this he should not be here.


Now Cerrato and Snyder seem to have benefited from being around Gibbs in my view and it now looks like the coaches and players these guys are trying to add are only going to be considered based on who is already here and if the addition makes the team better. The FO seems to have evolved and now we just have to hope that Cerrato's past success in finding talented players that suit our team can come to our rescue.

While I would like to see him fired for getting us into the mess in the first place (with Snyder's help admittedly) I must also say that it might be impossible to find a GM that could work with Snyder - this might be a case of just hoping things work out in spite of these 2 bozos. We aren't going to lose Snyder so hopefully Cerrato has found himself again and can lead Snyder and Zorn in the right direction with regards to locating players that help make this team better.


I do not think we are far off the path to continued NFL success but I do think we will benefit a lot of if we can have 2 drafts of at least 7 good players, both this year and next. :wink: In order to achieve that Cerrato and his "team" had better locate some very good players that suit our team not just be great players in the NFL. Then when we find and develop this talent we need to keep it.

One other point - the year after next, there is no salary cap :shock:
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance
Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
GSPODS
Hog
Posts: 4716
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:20 am

Post by GSPODS »

There is a 100% chance there will be a new CBA before the current CBA expires in 2010. Teams are already spending $120 Million or more. An uncapped 2010 would cause NFL payrolls to double. There is no way NFL owners allow that to happen.
Post Reply