I've got something to say, so listen up...

JPFair · Post by **JPFair** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 9:54 am

The Redskins may make the playoffs this year, and they may not. But, let me say this to both the believers and the non-believers: Don't EVER, EVER, EVER, write Joe Gibbs off!!

All you have to do is look at his record over his career for the month of December!!

Please, don't EVER write him off! He'll have the final say in this whole thing!! Mark my words!!!!

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 10:17 am

I just have one thing to say about Joe Gibbs... and I don't care what any of you fools have to say... ... ... Gibbs can spit with the best of em'. :lol:

Gotta love the man. John Madden said it best... when it comes to big games, wouldn't want any other coach other than Gibbs.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 10:24 am

There are non-believers here? No way! :lowblow:

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink :lol:

Some just do not recognize the obvious and some are just never going to see the light.

HAIL

VetSkinsFan · Post by **VetSkinsFan** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:13 pm

John Madden also said he's trade CB for CP one for one...... I don't think many here support that theory...... ](*,)

welch · Post by **welch** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 4:30 pm

JPF said

The Redskins may make the playoffs this year, and they may not. But, let me say this to both the believers and the non-believers: Don't EVER, EVER, EVER, write Joe Gibbs off!!

All you have to do is look at his record over his career for the month of December!!

Please, don't EVER write him off! He'll have the final say in this whole thing!! Mark my words!!!!

Repeated for emphasis.

Greatest coaches since 1950:

- Paul Brown

- Vince Lombardi

- Joe Gibbs

(in no order)

Close, but but quite:

- Jim Lee Howell (trained Lombardi and Landry, but also Allie Sherman)

- Bill Walsh (Brown did it all twenty years earlier...does anyone think the Walsh '49ers could have stood up to Otto Graham, Marion Motley, and Paul Bown's teams???)

- Don Shula: gets credit for winning championships with both the Colts and Dolhins...but subtract Unitas and Griese and???

*

Gibbs' record in December:

1981:

Dec 6 W 15-13 vs Philadelphia Eagles
Dec 13 W 38-14 vs Baltimore Colts
Dec 20 W 30-7 at Los Angeles Rams

1982:

Dec 5 L 24-10 vs Dallas Cowboys
Dec 12 W 12-7 at St. Louis Cardinals
Dec 19 W 15-14 vs New York Giants
Dec 26 W 27-10 at New Orleans Saints
Jan 2 W 28-0 vs St. Louis Cardinals (added to strike season)

1983:

Dec 4 W 37-21 vs Atlanta Falcons
Dec 11 W 31-10 at Dallas Cowboys
Dec 17 W 31-22 vs New York Giants

1984:

Dec 9 W 30-28 at Dallas Cowboys
Dec 16 W 29-27 vs St. Louis Cardinals

1985:

Dec 1 L 35-8 vs San Francisco 49ers
Dec 8 W 17-12 at Philadelphia Eagles
Dec 15 W 27-24 vs Cincinnati Bengals
Dec 21 W 27-16 at St. Louis Cardinals

1986:

Dec 7 L 24-14 vs New York Giants
Dec 13 L 31-30 at Denver Broncos
Dec 21 W 21-14 at Philadelphia Eagles

1987:

Dec 6 W 34-17 at St. Louis Cardinals
Dec 13 W 24-20 vs Dallas Cowboys
Dec 20 L 23-21 at Miami Dolphins
Dec 26 W 27-24 at Minnesota Vikings (OT)

1988:

Dec 4 W 20-19 at Philadelphia Eagles
Dec 11 L 24-17 vs Dallas Cowboys
Dec 17 L 20-17 at Cincinnati Bengals (OT)

1989:

Dec 3 W 29-10 at Phoenix Cardinals
Dec 10 W 26-21 vs San Diego Chargers
Dec 17 W 31-30 at Atlanta Falcons
Dec 23 W 29-0 at Seattle Seahawks

1990:

Dec 2 W 42-20 vs Miami Dolphins
Dec 9 W 10-9 vs Chicago Bears
Dec 15 W 25-10 at New England Patriots
Dec 22 L 35-28 at Indianapolis Colts
Dec 30 W 29-14 vs Buffalo Bills

1991:

Dec 1 W 27-6 at Los Angeles Rams
Dec 8 W 20-14 at Phoenix Cardinals
Dec 15 W 34-17 vs New York Giants
Dec 22 L 24-22 at Philadelphia Eagles

1992:

Dec 6 W 28-10 at New York Giants
Dec 13 W 20-17 vs Dallas Cowboys
Dec 20 L 17-13 at Philadelphia Eagles
Dec 26 L 21-20 vs Los Angeles Raiders

****

2004:

Dec 5 W 31-7 vs New York Giants
Dec 12 L 17-14 vs Philadelphia Eagles
Dec 18 W 26-16 at San Francisco 49ers
Dec 26 L 13-10 at Dallas Cowboys
Jan 2 W 21-18 vs Minnesota Vikings {extending season}

2005:

Dec 4 W 24-9 at St. Louis Rams
Dec 11 W 17-13 at Arizona Cardinals
Dec 18 W 35-7 vs Dallas Cowboys
Dec 24 W 35-20 vs New York Giants
Jan 1 W 31-20 at Philadelphia Eagles

2006:

Dec 3 L 24-14 vs Atlanta Falcons
Dec 10 L 21-19 vs Philadelphia Eagles
Dec 17 W 16-10 at New Orleans Saints
Dec 24 L 37-31 at St. Louis Rams (OT)
Dec 30 L 34-28 vs New York Giants

Quick and dirty totals:

- Won: 42

- Lost: 17

Please...someone else total the scoring!

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 4:40 pm

The BEST tribute to the inspiration provided by Joe was quoted by the PLATERS themselves during the interviews aired in the game last night.

They LOVE playing their guts for the man. It is an honour to stand with you brothers

skinsRin · Post by **skinsRin** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 4:47 pm

1422-1041

welch · Post by **welch** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 5:02 pm

To emphasize RiC, what was it Antoine Andle-El said? No other coach...none.

Deadskins · Post by **Deadskins** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 5:49 pm

JC's first starts accounted for that one 2006 aberration. The graphic they showed last night didn't take that into account.

welch · Post by **welch** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 7:51 pm

JC's first starts accounted for that one 2006 aberration. The graphic they showed last night didn't take that into account.

I know. I didnt want anyone to think we were bending the stats. It also shows that Gibbs will take loses...forget his record and his so-called legacy...to train the young QB who will lead the Skins in the future.

Integrity.

OK...(since I've found a spare keyboard and wheee I can add some old-time perspective), about twenty years ago I was explaining the Redskins world to Dan, my son.

This is the time, I said, when a sports figure really should be a hero...look at Joe Gibbs. See what he does. If you want a sports model, forget Darryl Strawberry and think about Joe Gibbs. He's a hero.

tribeofjudah · Post by **tribeofjudah** » Tue Dec 25, 2007 12:06 am

VetSkinsFan wrote:John Madden also said he's trade CB for CP one for one...... I don't think many here support that theory......

I think what Madden meant was........that he also would have made that C. Bailey trade for C. Portis.... just like the Skins did, if he (Madden) was coach here in DC.... that's how I took it.....

HEROHAMO · Post by **HEROHAMO** » Tue Dec 25, 2007 7:28 am

VetSkinsFan wrote:John Madden also said he's trade CB for CP one for one...... I don't think many here support that theory......

I think an all star Rb is worth a shutdown corner.

Here is the thing though. We gave up a draft pick and CB for Portis. It was not straight up. That is what had the Skins nation wondering.

welch · Post by **welch** » Tue Dec 25, 2007 6:33 pm

I think Clinton Portis is twice the player that Bailey was.

Did Bailey ever make anyone forget Darrell Green?

Smoot and Springs look pretty good. Add a third CB, and Rogers might grow into that third guy, and what's the big deal about Bailey?

Oh..."grow into"...Darrell Green got beat a lot during his first three or four years. He learned the positioned, learned not to rely only on his comeback speed, and then QB's threw away from him.

Skill.

VetSkinsFan · Post by **VetSkinsFan** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 8:38 am

I wasn't around to watch Bailey play( wasn't in the area, kinda busy with OIF/deployments/ect) so I never had the benefit of watching him play. I do recall that the majority here said that they wanted to keep Bailey over getting CP. He did say that he would trade away Bailey for Portis, to clarify. The people I've talked to that were around for the CB era have said that he is the reason Smoot did as well as he did the 1st time around; b/c QBs didn't want to throw to his side of the field, giving Smoot more opportunities....

welch · Post by **welch** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:12 pm

I wasn't around to watch Bailey play( wasn't in the area, kinda busy with OIF/deployments/ect) so I never had the benefit of watching him play. I do recall that the majority here said that they wanted to keep Bailey over getting CP. He did say that he would trade away Bailey for Portis, to clarify. The people I've talked to that were around for the CB era have said that he is the reason Smoot did as well as he did the 1st time around; b/c QBs didn't want to throw to his side of the field, giving Smoot more opportunities....

It takes a longer perspective. Green was -- probably still could be -- twice the player that Bailey was. Green and AJ Johnson were better than Bailey and Smoot. Green and Barry Wilburn (and Brian Davis as third CB) were better than Bailey and anybody. Going farther back, Pat Fischer and Mike Bass made QB's afraid to throw.

Bailey was good, but not in a class with Green, Fischer, or Mike Bass.

How do I know? I watched them all.

(If anybody wants to "play stats", then go count the Redskin wins.)

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:31 pm

Going farther back, Pat Fischer and Mike Bass made QB's afraid to throw.

I think it's more accurate to say that Pat Fischer and Mike Bass made Receivers afraid to catch... because it WAS going to HURT...

I do recall that the majority here said that they wanted to keep Bailey over getting CP.

To say that most wanted to keep Bailey ignores the fact that he was a free agent, and WAS leaving... that was pretty clear. It was a matter of making a trade, and getting something... or not making a trade, and ending up with nothing... I think we ended up doing ok...

Deadskins · Post by **Deadskins** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:36 pm

Countertrey wrote:
Going farther back, Pat Fischer and Mike Bass made QB's afraid to throw.

I think it's more accurate to say that Pat Fischer and Mike Bass made Receivers afraid to catch... because it WAS going to HURT...

Beyond that, to say that most wanted to keep Bailey ignores the fact that he was a free agent, and WAS leaving... he had made that clear. It was a matter of getting as much as possible in that light.

Exactly!

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:55 pm

Countertrey wrote:[To say that most wanted to keep Bailey ignores the fact that he was a free agent, and WAS leaving... that was pretty clear. It was a matter of making a trade, and getting something... or not making a trade, and ending up with nothing... I think we ended up doing ok...

nnskinsfan · Post by **nnskinsfan** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 9:47 pm

He has done a good job of holding things together under dire circumstances so I'm glad he's still the coach. In fact, I hope he gets an extension even though I've been upset at the play (and play-calling) at times this year. With a lot of other coaches, the season would have completely unraveled (imo).

welch · Post by **welch** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 10:47 pm

I think it's more accurate to say that Pat Fischer and Mike Bass made Receivers afraid to catch... because it WAS going to HURT...

Yes...to be more precise about it. Although Bass had a knack for floating to interceptions at important times. Ahhh, to see Plaxico Burress touch a ball near Pat Fischer...

Champsturf · Post by **Champsturf** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 11:46 pm

Seeing that this thread has gotten a bit off topic, I'll chime in. Obviously I WAS a bigtime Bailey guy. I was leary of the trade, especially giving a pick. Straight up, I was good with it. Anyway...after having Portis here, I couldn't be happier that Bailey got the boot and we got Portis. What a man! I'm not even referring to his running either...that kid can BLOCK!

I also know that Bailey was NOT of the Green Caliber. He was good, but no D.G. Apparently, I just picked a bad unsername. So I then had NC43 throw in the pick of S. Taylor, my new favorite player. R.I.P HTTR

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:47 pm

Ahhh, to see Plaxico Burress touch a ball near Pat Fischer...

Harold Charmichael had a thing or two to say about that... as I recall, it was not among his favorite situations... :twisted:

When Fischer hit you, it left a mark...