The Hogster wrote:I was more mad at Stephon Heyer...he looked like he was playing Patty Cake rather than engaging the guy.
The hit was low which is why it was a penalty. No they didn't have those rules in the YA tittle era, but they also didn't have 300 lb D Lineman who run in the sub 4.7 range hitting you low.
The game is much more violent now. Not that the old timers were soft, but its simple physics. Bigger, faster, stronger players create more violent collisions.
The hit wasn't 'dirty' but the guy hit him low in the pocket and it's a penalty. Can't have Qb's getting their years ended every week.
While Heyer did a weak job on that block over this game he did much better then we could have all expected. While the play gave JC a bruised knee don't judge how effective he will be by one play. Last week he had issues.....this week he seemed much more effective. Anyone else agree?
Ikester
Last edited by ike075 on Sun Aug 19, 2007 11:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Hogster wrote:I was more mad at Stephon Heyer...he looked like he was playing Patty Cake rather than engaging the guy.
The hit was low which is why it was a penalty. No they didn't have those rules in the YA tittle era, but they also didn't have 300 lb D Lineman who run in the sub 4.7 range hitting you low.
The game is much more violent now. Not that the old timers were soft, but its simple physics. Bigger, faster, stronger players create more violent collisions.
The hit wasn't 'dirty' but the guy hit him low in the pocket and it's a penalty. Can't have Qb's getting their years ended every week.
While Heyer did a week job on that block over this game he did much better then we could have all expected. While the play gave JC a bruised knee don't judge how effective he will be by one play. Last week he had issues.....this week he seemed much more effective. Anyone else agree?
Ikester
Left Tackle is possibly the most difficult position in the game. Left Tackles are not permitted to take plays off. Invariably, they face the quickest, most athletic lineman on the opposing team. They must be perfect every time. Tough job. Steep learning curve, for a rook. I'm still impressed by the performance of this undrafted free agent, who will very likely make this team... anybody know of another undrafted free agent left tackle ever making this squad? Yeah, like that would ever happen...
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
The Hogster wrote:I was more mad at Stephon Heyer...he looked like he was playing Patty Cake rather than engaging the guy.
The hit was low which is why it was a penalty. No they didn't have those rules in the YA tittle era, but they also didn't have 300 lb D Lineman who run in the sub 4.7 range hitting you low.
The game is much more violent now. Not that the old timers were soft, but its simple physics. Bigger, faster, stronger players create more violent collisions.
The hit wasn't 'dirty' but the guy hit him low in the pocket and it's a penalty. Can't have Qb's getting their years ended every week.
While Heyer did a week job on that block over this game he did much better then we could have all expected. While the play gave JC a bruised knee don't judge how effective he will be by one play. Last week he had issues.....this week he seemed much more effective. Anyone else agree?
Ikester
Left Tackle is possibly the most difficult position in the game. Left Tackles are not permitted to take plays off. Invariably, they face the quickest, most athletic lineman on the opposing team. They must be perfect every time. Tough job. Steep learning curve, for a rook. I'm still impressed by the performance of this undrafted free agent, who will very likely make this team... anybody know of another undrafted free agent left tackle ever making this squad? Yeah, like that would ever happen...
I agree...once he gets some experience, and an offseason of training to get his body in he Chris Samuels kind of condition, I think he can be stellar in the future.
Steelers have always been dirty players. Remember the Bengals vs Steelers game when that dude rolled in to Carson Palmer.
What a load... that was just a football play... Carson AND Campbell. Keisel was just trying to make a play... simple as that. Anyone who thinks otherwise, hasn't played and just doesn't know.
It's a tough game. You play it right, and someone will get hurt. Get over it.
DS is right. Were the shoe on the other foot, you'd all be whining about the penalty... AND YOU"D BE RIGHT!
Let's just be glad that JC doesn't seem severely injured. Move on.
What are you talking about dude? Carson Palmer threw the ball and kiesel Rolled into him. The ball was gone at least a full two seconds before Kiesel rolled into him.
Yeah injuries are part of the game, but when it is done purposely that is what you call dirty. Nobody whining here just stating the obvious.
Steelers have always been dirty players. Remember the Bengals vs Steelers game when that dude rolled in to Carson Palmer.
What a load... that was just a football play... Carson AND Campbell. Keisel was just trying to make a play... simple as that. Anyone who thinks otherwise, hasn't played and just doesn't know.
It's a tough game. You play it right, and someone will get hurt. Get over it.
DS is right. Were the shoe on the other foot, you'd all be whining about the penalty... AND YOU"D BE RIGHT!
Let's just be glad that JC doesn't seem severely injured. Move on.
What are you talking about dude? Carson Palmer threw the ball and kiesel Rolled into him. The ball was gone at least a full two seconds before Kiesel rolled into him.
Yeah injuries are part of the game, but when it is done purposely that is what you call dirty. Nobody whining here just stating the obvious.
As I said...
Anyone who thinks otherwise, hasn't played and just doesn't know.
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
Steelers have always been dirty players. Remember the Bengals vs Steelers game when that dude rolled in to Carson Palmer.
What a load... that was just a football play... Carson AND Campbell. Keisel was just trying to make a play... simple as that. Anyone who thinks otherwise, hasn't played and just doesn't know.
It's a tough game. You play it right, and someone will get hurt. Get over it.
DS is right. Were the shoe on the other foot, you'd all be whining about the penalty... AND YOU"D BE RIGHT!
Let's just be glad that JC doesn't seem severely injured. Move on.
What are you talking about dude? Carson Palmer threw the ball and kiesel Rolled into him. The ball was gone at least a full two seconds before Kiesel rolled into him.
Yeah injuries are part of the game, but when it is done purposely that is what you call dirty. Nobody whining here just stating the obvious.
As I said...
Anyone who thinks otherwise, hasn't played and just doesn't know.
So you say there is no dirty plays in football? Since I have actually played the game before. I know many players who have actually intended on injurying a player and succeeded at doing it. Heck Even some dirty coaches out there actually tell there players to go and take out the knee of the opposing Qb.
Anyone who doesnt think there are dirty players in football, must only have played pop warner.
As you know perfectly well, I was referring specifically to the Palmer and Campbell injuries. You want to discuss, we'll discuss. You want to distort and play games, well, that's another story, and I won't play it. What's your choice?
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
just heard cooley on Elliot in the morning and he said he expects Jason to play this weekend! That is good to here. He also said the coaches were most mad about not being able to run the ball.
As you know perfectly well, I was referring specifically to the Palmer and Campbell injuries. You want to discuss, we'll discuss. You want to distort and play games, well, that's another story, and I won't play it. What's your choice?
Ok fine. Now Campbell and Palmer incidents are two different cases.
Now I do think that the Campbell hit wasnt aimed to injure him, I do think it was late and unnecessary.
Now the Carson Palmer hit now that is a totally different story.
Kiesel was actually on the ground on his stomach while going for Palmer, Palmer already threw the ball two seconds later kiesel rolls into Palmers leg and then blows it out. Totally unecessary. I truly believe his intent was injurying Carson Palmer. For he seen that Palmer had released the ball already. What was he accomplishing by tackling the Qb without the ball?
As you know perfectly well, I was referring specifically to the Palmer and Campbell injuries. You want to discuss, we'll discuss. You want to distort and play games, well, that's another story, and I won't play it. What's your choice?
The Palmer hit definitely was not dirty. The guy got blocked into Carson and then he cried after he saw the extent of the injury. Porter had to snap the man back into reality so he could get his head back into the game.
I also don't think the play against JC was dirty. A dirty play is what the Titans DT did last year, stomping on a player with your cleats. The Steeler simply was trying to make a play and made a bad decision.
Of course since it's JC everyone want's to get up in arms about it but we should consider ourselves lucky that it's not serious.
Heck, the guy apologized to JC, it's over.
Last edited by Chris Luva Luva on Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
The guy got blocked into Carson and then he cried after he saw the extent of the injury.
Thank you! I remember seeing how upset he was following the hit. The guy was devastated. Here is a photo of him appologizing to JC after the play...
[sarcasm]Looks like your typical dirty player[/sarcasm]
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
Skinsfan55 wrote:IMO if you don't agree with the penalty, you don't understand the rules of football.
It's very clear, if a QB is in the pocket, you can't hit him low.
I agree with the rule, and I like how it protects quarterbacks who are essentially defenseless.
Oh, I understand the rule... I just don't like it, and, therefore, don't like the call... funny how the NFL somehow managed to survive through most of it's history without it, yet Sammy Baugh, YA Tittle, Johnny Unitas, Sonny Jurgensen, Roger Staubach, EVEN JOE NAMATH (of the famous incredibly gimpy knees) and on and on and on somehow managed to have complete careers...
The rule penalizes defensive players for playing football...
Hitting a guy low is not good at all. Why do you think the Denver line is always being criticized for being dirty? Well because they cut block all the time. Anybody could just run full speed and aim for a guys knee and blow it out, it is not hard to do. It is just unecessary.
All the names you have mentioned above have certainly helped the league survive. Probably half of the names you mentioned have suffered numerous injuries, hip replacements,knee replacements, concussions etc..
Long after there playing days are over which is of course the nature of the game. So the NFL has learned to put certain rules in place to help prolong the careers and health of the players.
Now the hit on Campbell and Palmer only the players who actually made the tackle can say for sure if they intended to injure. I for one stand strong on my belief that the Palmer hit was intentional and Campbell hit was questionable. Injuries are part of the game yes. Injury due to an unecessary hit well that totally sucks.
Sounds like the guy's got questionable morals. With that said, I do believe the guy was not intentionally trying to hurt JCl, rather a wreckless attempt at making a play. He stumbled and lunged while low (damn well knowing that he's going to hit low). Whether JC was injured with a bruised knee or a blown knee is really irrelavent outside of the Redskins fanbase. The guy is shady in his judgements IMO, but that doesn't make him wrong. If the league decides that he's attempting to injure people on purpose, then we can expect the league to handle it. Until then, we will just be pissed off and make crazy assumptions......
He was down on the ground, then decided to hit JC. Thats his job and what he gets paid to do. But the call was right, and I agree with the rules in this case.
The only thing that I don't like about what he did. Is when he was on the ground he never looked up to see if JC even still had the ball in hand. For all he new the ball could have been long gone, but he was still going to hit him anyway.
I still don't think even that was with intent to injure. He just really had his mind on getting a sack.
Why do you think the Denver line is always being criticized for being dirty? Well because they cut block all the time.
I'm sorry that you are unable to see the difference between a "bang-bang" football play by an aggressive defensive lineman, and a choreographed set of strategies (Denver's nasty blocking schemes) which are known to end careers.
"That's a clown question, bro" - - - - - - - - - - Bryce Harper, DC Statesman "But Oz never did give nothing to the Tin Man That he didn't, didn't already have" - - - - - - - - - - Dewey Bunnell, America
Bruised knee, day to day, real lucky. Now with that said, if Gibbs opts to sit Cambell, who starts? Vet Brunell, or Todd (I need reps with first team) Collins ? Collins has earned the nod, let's see what he can do from the 1QB spot, and pressure. We know Mark can go if needed....
"The harder I work the luckier I get"....
- Jack Kent Cook 1983
num1skinsfan wrote:Bruised knee, day to day, real lucky. Now with that said, if Gibbs opts to sit Cambell, who starts? Vet Brunell, or Todd (I need reps with first team) Collins ? Collins has earned the nod, let's see what he can do from the 1QB spot, and pressure. We know Mark can go if needed....
I remeber reading something that said JC will most likely play this weekend.
IF he is feeling fine, I see no reason why he shouldn't. It's nothing more than a glorified practice and he needs all the reps he can get. IF he is fine, there's no need to throw a diaper on the boy and shelve him for the rest of the preseason.
Chris Luva Luva wrote:I remeber reading something that said JC will most likely play this weekend.
IF he is feeling fine, I see no reason why he shouldn't. It's nothing more than a glorified practice and he needs all the reps he can get. IF he is fine, there's no need to throw a diaper on the boy and shelve him for the rest of the preseason.
I hope Palmer gets some action.
I really hope that he doesn't play. The last thing I want to see is JC dropping back to pass against the Ravens D with the way we have been picking up the blitz and considering the personnel that we have right now on the left side of oline.
Jason is moving very well, no additional swelling in the last 24 hours, walking with only a wrap on his knee. He left here today after treatment still feeling very lucky about what happened.
He figures in 5 days he'll be back to normal, but no one wants to take any chances this week and he would not want to get hit anywhere near the knee right now. He said that if he turns the knee he feels sharp pain, however, and that when he plants his foot it's not a good feeling, either.
He was feeling so good last night he planted the left leg once when walking down the steps. "Ooooooh. That one hurt. I won't do that again for a few days."
Campbell figures he will be back to practice next week, with no problems.
As for Marcus, his right arm is in a brace/contraption type thing to stabilize it. He says it still aches pretty good and he is taking anti-inflammatory drugs and some pain medication, but hopes to be off them in short order. He is still thinking he'll miss two weeks.
Another gem from the production line.
