Is Jansen deteriorating? (Offensive line discussion also)

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 9:04 am

I'm asking for your opinion on this. I listen to the Riggo show faithfully on my way home from work and he mentioned that he thinks Jansen's ability could be starting to decline... Of course this was in the wake of the 1st preseason game... I took that game as a fluke but then I saw this excerpt in the Post today and it made me wonder a bit more.

The left side needs additional help from tight ends, taking them away from other routes and protections, and some coaches were also surprised by how often Jansen required a tight end stationed next to him to help with pass blocking last season.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/08/13/AR2007081301105.html

Some posters pay more attention to the line play than others, can anyone confirm that Jansen was getting extra help last season?

We have some big question marks at offensive line right now. Will Samuels heal up fine? How will Wade handle the transition? Will Randy keep his health and whats up with Janesen?

Disclaimer*
No the sky isn't falling, this is just a discussion. :roll:

If you don't like that I took an excerpt from the Post, please provide us all with acceptable media that we can read. :roll:

Nobody is knocking Jansen, it's just a discussion. :roll:

BernieSki · Post by **BernieSki** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 9:39 am

That is the problem with giving away so many of our draft picks over the last few years, we have no young players to mold into replacements. Jansen is starting to get a few miles on him and we have not done a very good job of lining up young players to step in.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 9:45 am

And thus the tone for this thread is set. LOL.

I'm not really focused on getting into a FO debate. I want to know if you or anyone else think there is any merit to Riggo's opinion or truth to the Post's claim?

Mursilis · Post by **Mursilis** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 9:54 am

Chris Luva Luva wrote:And thus the tone for this thread is set. LOL.

I'm not really focused on getting into a FO debate. I want to know if you or anyone else think there is any merit to Riggo's opinion or truth to the Post's claim?

I can't say I've watched Jansen specifically, but our O-line overall was one of our few strong points last season. Seems like he's still a quality starter in this league.

BnGhog · Post by **BnGhog** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:00 am

I have serious memory loss my friend. I can't remeber that much...........

But i'll tell you this.... If Janson was getting beat a lot, I would remember that... I can't tell you if he had tight end help....
But how often do we use two tighends?? :hmm:

ey's our main guy and at least half the time he's route running.....

Im not so sure Janson getting beat in preseason wasn't due to lack of hitting in camp.. IMO when your job is blocking, you need practice at really blocking, not this "hut, hit, stop" mess we see them do. In other words, I think he's rusty, along with all the other guys. We should see them improve with the rest of preseason.

IMO, we need one of these guys to improve the moral a bit. In an interview with Todd Wade last night on comcast. He really seemed down.... That can't help any. I mean he really wants to improve, but he didn't seem just disappointed in the performance, he seemed depressed about it.

everydayAskinsday · Post by **everydayAskinsday** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:06 am

I dont know what to make of it.. it does worry me a bit after watching the 1st preseason game but the fact that it was just the 1st game doesnt have me freaking out

I didnt really notice the TE being brought into help him out last year but I wasnt looking for it either so if someone who pays closer attention to that could fill us in thatd be great..

I do feel that our line is getting to the point where we need to start focusing some earlier draft picks on it say at tackle and guard .. and our Dline as well..

JansenFan · Post by **JansenFan** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:00 am

I guess I don't remember Jansen getting beat badly in the preseason game. Granted, I was watching Wade and Heyer to see how they did. I thought they both played well, considering it was their first professional game at their respective positions. Wade seemed to get out of his stance quickly and be able to move laterally when necessary. Heyer seemed to block decently in one-on-one situations. The Titans did a good job taking advantage of his inexperience and the lack of a running back to help pick up the corner blitzes. He needs to learn to recognize and keep his man engaged while trying to chip the guy coming off the edge, but in the regular season, CP picks up those guys 10 times out of 10.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:12 am

According to some quotes from Bugel during an ES interview...

- Jansen got beat cus he stepped on Randy's foot. They ran that blitz 3 times and it got thru once on the said occurrence.

- Bugel stated that we got beat on technical break downs.

- He also said that the line didn't match Tennessee's intensity. :lol:

to self.

- He said that Pucillo is starting in Wades place next week due to his injury. Todd isn't not the definite starter...

I personally think we need to resign the guard we just released, I thought he was doing pretty decent according to reports. Maybe I was mistaken.

VetSkinsFan · Post by **VetSkinsFan** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:26 am

I think the fact that we have 2 unproven next to each other in the O line is the issue. That whole side will be picked on if it stands pat. When Samuels comes back from his injury, it will shore up a lot of the issue.

HanburgerHelper · Post by **HanburgerHelper** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:37 am

Jansen is still one of the only bright spots. Just tripped on Randy Thomas's foot. The left side is a mess now that Samuels is out and Dockery is gone and was not replaced. I think we ought to look for FA help ASAP and maybe Kili Lefotu. I think OL and DL should be the focus of upcoming drafts and free agent signings. This line never completely jelled in my opinion, even with the rushing stats last year. Change is needed.

The Hogster · Post by **The Hogster** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:39 am

Chris Luva Luva wrote:According to some quotes from Bugel during an ES interview...

- Jansen got beat cus he stepped on Randy's foot. They ran that blitz 3 times and it got thru once on the said occurrence.

- Bugel stated that we got beat on technical break downs.

- He also said that the line didn't match Tennessee's intensity. to self.

- He said that Pucillo is starting in Wades place next week due to his injury. Todd isn't not the definite starter...

I personally think we need to resign the guard we just released, I thought he was doing pretty decent according to reports. Maybe I was mistaken.

I love how Buges speaks the truth point blank. I actually texted one of my friends during the game how Jansen was looking bad. He was getting pushed back several times. Defenders were beneath his shoulder pads and it seemed like he was a little overwhelmed more often than he should have been.

I've thought he had been getting overpowered more and more over the last two years. At first I dismissed it because he had the thumb problem, and was recovering from the achilless. Then when he was healthy, I figured that he was in the spotlight because we had a lefty QB...and your most athletic tackle (Samuels) usually protects the QB's blind side...but with Brunell, Jansen had that task, and he is not a pure Left Tackle.

The other night it looked like he's rusty. i hope he shakes it off.

trey53 · Post by **trey53** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:51 am

Agreed. Excuses should not be so plentiful for such a talented and experienced right tackle. Jansen is better than that. I personally think that he will shake off the rust and bounce back into form.

everydayAskinsday · Post by **everydayAskinsday** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:32 pm

hopefully all this talk in the media and so on will motivate him to shut everyone up.. I certainly hope so

skinsfan#33 · Post by **skinsfan#33** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 2:10 pm

You should have heard the Sports Junkies bashing Jansen and the line yesterday AM. They were all saying that we don't have any lineman that play anywhere near probowl level.

I think that is utter horse hockey! Raybach and Thomas are as good as any in the league. There may only be 1 or 2 better in the NFC. Jansen will never make the probowl, but has had years when he should have and is still playing well. Samuals isn't a PB LT anymore, but isn't far from it.

People tend to over eact after a bad performance.

Hooligan · Post by **Hooligan** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 2:11 pm

On Wade, playing with a rookie next to him can't be helping him learn his position any. I think his learning process will speed up once Samuels is back there next to him, helping him get his act together. Chris is one of the best at his position. He'll always be where he's supposed to be and Wade can adjust his own play accordingly.

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 4:45 pm

Chris, I think it's a valid question and deserves discussion.

I hope Jansen steps up and plays well this year. Last year, it was said by some of our defensive guys that they feared Wade at LT more than Jansen. I was under the impression that was due to fact that Jansen was still recovering from the Achilles injury. We'll see, I think this year will tell the tale. I like Jansen and I'm pulling for him.

PulpExposure · Post by **PulpExposure** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 6:14 pm

skinsfan#33 wrote:Samuals isn't a PB LT anymore, but isn't far from it.

He's gotten that much worse since February, eh? :wink:

HailSkins94 · Post by **HailSkins94** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 6:42 pm

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that he will be fine this year.

John Manfreda · Post by **John Manfreda** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:07 am

Jansan is the least of my worries. I would say no

ChocolateMilk · Post by **ChocolateMilk** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:22 am

Jansen has always been a solid RT for the redskins. But he isnt getting any younger. i didnt really see anything that made me worry about jansen. the only thing on the line that worried me was the left side. but hopefully with samuels back that'll improve. but like everyone else said. i'd like the team to invest some draft picks to improve the depth of the line and to get people to eventually replace Janses, Thomas, and Rabach. because if i'm not mistaken. they are all at least 32

num1skinsfan · Post by **num1skinsfan** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:33 am

I am a Jansen fan, don't get me wrong. But he did have a off year last year. This year, he looked initially like he was back to form and definately a leader in the locker room. He did not have his best night against the Titans, but lets hope he's rounding into form. A good benchmark is preseason game 3, let's give him till then... "Jury still out"...

skinsfan#33 · Post by **skinsfan#33** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:18 pm

PulpExposure wrote:
skinsfan#33 wrote:Samuals isn't a PB LT anymore, but isn't far from it.

He's gotten that much worse since February, eh?

I know you're joking, so I'll respond for those that don't think you were.

Samuals didn't have a PB season last year I don't care where he went last February. Just like Roy Williams has "earned" a PB appearance. Or Sean Taylor last year (he should have gone the year before and his rookie season, but not last year!)

PulpExposure · Post by **PulpExposure** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:45 pm

skinsfan#33 wrote:
PulpExposure wrote:
skinsfan#33 wrote:Samuals isn't a PB LT anymore, but isn't far from it.

He's gotten that much worse since February, eh?

I know you're joking, so I'll respond for those that don't think you were.

Samuals didn't have a PB season last year I don't care where he went last February. Just like Roy Williams has "earned" a PB appearance. Or Sean Taylor last year (he should have gone the year before and his rookie season, but not last year!)

I do have to ask this, Skinsfan. People are complaining about the offensive line, and don't really realize how good a year they had last year.

4th in the NFL in rushing, 3rd in sacks allowed (19, best was 15).

There's really not a whole lot of room for improvement there. I actually thought Samuels had a pretty damn good year (he deserved the PB more than in a few past seasons imho). Am I way off base here?

Irn-Bru · Post by **Irn-Bru** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 4:25 pm

PulpExposure wrote:I do have to ask this, Skinsfan. People are complaining about the offensive line, and don't really realize how good a year they had last year.

4th in the NFL in rushing, 3rd in sacks allowed (19, best was 15).

There's really not a whole lot of room for improvement there. I actually thought Samuels had a pretty damn good year (he deserved the PB more than in a few past seasons imho). Am I way off base here?

I agree with your assessment, and as far as age goes for Jansen and Sammuels, I don't think that this past offseason was a "straw that broke the camel's back", so to speak.

While some nagging injuries have beset our WRs, Portis, and the o-line, it looks like Jansen and Rabach are going into this season healthier than they were for all of last year. Thomas is having some difficulty with his knee, but at this time last year he was still coming back from a broken leg. Sammuel's injury was a strain, not too serious, and if he's talking about playing in the last pre-season game then I definitely wouldn't worry about him for week 1 and beyond.

The one :?:

in my mind is left guard, where Wade was not only struggling but now has an injury. I know that the transition has been difficult, but his slow progress is now making me a bit nervous.

Outside of that concern, though, PulpExposure, I agree with you: the o-line was one of the bright spots in last year's miserable season, and they definitely weren't overrated, excepting perhaps Dockery when free agency rolled around.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 4:54 pm

I do have to ask this, Skinsfan. People are complaining about the offensive line, and don't really realize how good a year they had last year.

4th in the NFL in rushing, 3rd in sacks allowed (19, best was 15).

There's really not a whole lot of room for improvement there. I actually thought Samuels had a pretty damn good year (he deserved the PB more than in a few past seasons imho). Am I way off base here?

I agree with your assessment that the offensive line has a very good year last season. I'm not at all concerned with Thomas, Rabach, or Samuels as I see them as among the best at their positions in the NFL. However, I thought that Jansen was the weakest link on the offensive line last season, especially in pass protection, and through one preseason game (yes it's only 1 game and a lot can change but it's all that we have to go on at this point), it appears that his struggles are continuing. While Jansen has been a very solid run blocking tackle, I think that he has been overrated by many fans over the last few seasons because I think that he is average (at best) in pass protection, especially against speed rushers.

Left guard is clearly a question mark right now also, as Wade is injured and not even practicing and he is the one that has the most to learn at this point and struggled more than any other lineman during the Titans game. If Wade doesn't get his act together left guard could be a serious weak link for the entire season.