The Mark Brunell has to go thread

[JansenFan]

By the way, does anyone else feel like MB for us is about the exact equivalent of Brad Johnson backing up for the Pukes?

I do at this point in their careers. Although, most of the people I argued with in 2000 that pined for Jeff George and helped drive BJ out of town now think he's light years ahead of Brunell. At least this is the first time in recent memory that the back-up quarterback isn't more popular than the starter.

[num1skinsfan]

Agreed, Brunell's starter days are past him, but he's a solid backup, with game experience. With his restucturing he is not hurting the club as bad as 2005 & 2006 salary wise. He knows the offense, and like it or not the players like his leadership. Case and point, if Cambell goes down against Miami you don't want TODD COLLINS starting for us against the Eagles in Philly on Monday Night Football do you. He is our best option right now so let's go with it.... and work on a QB next draft or free agency.... we have bigger problems to address than backup QB...

[aswas71788]

From what I saw of the gaem, none of the quarterbacks earned any praise. Unfortunately, they are what we have, like it or not.

[skinsfan#33]

I'm sure everyone here knows how I feal about MB. Keep him or cut him the sallary cap hit is about the same! I truely believe the team will let him go after this season, so next year's cap hit would be the same. If we keep him he takes up a roster spot and right now I don't know if his abilities warrant keeping him on the roster. So this all comes down to who Gibbs feels more comfortable with and I'm sure everyone knows who that is. So it doesn't matter that I think he is a waste of a roster spot, because Gibbs thinks otherwise.

For everyone that says Palmer will be on the practice squad that means the Skins have to cut him at some point. While he is on the practice squad, any team in the league can sign him off of the practice squad. They just have to put him on their active rosterr the following week and I think that means he would have to be their #2 QB, because the #3 guy is technically inactive (but I'm not sure about that). So keeping both MB and TC means cutting Palmer.

The "first string O-line" play was not that bad Saturday and I'm sure the team will be fine at O-line. I thought Heyer played OK. The first sack/fumble wasn't his fault. He blocked his guy. The DB wasn't accounted for and that is either the fault of the center or QB and since Campbell took the responsibility I'll go with that. The second one was on Jansen and I don't expect him to give up many sacks in the season. The rest were after the starters left. Also, Gibbs and Saunders would have had a back or TE helping out the tackles had that been a real game. I didn't break it down play by play, but my impression was when the team did go max protect, Campbell had a good amount of time.

[BnGhog]

think he's light years ahead of Brunell.

Yeah, Brad's better at this point, Johnson did pass for 225 yrds and a TD against us in the first game of the season last year before we had all those injuries on the D.

Do I think Collins played better, Yes.
That proves nothing to me, he was playing a third string D.......I know, I know,,"Collins is third string and its even, third string against third string".. But really most of third stringers are rookies, and are in a new system, Collins has the upper hand against almost any third stringers.

Should Collins be the #2???

I dunno, I think he might've needed to take a #2...

I do however, think if we switch the two, for at least one preseason game, we might be able to tell more or, at least Boonell's timeouts would be in the fourth quarter then

[BnGhog]

The second one was on Jansen and I don't expect him to give up many sacks in the season.

I replayed it, and replayed it on my DVR after the game, and Im tell you guys it was ey.. Jansen was having a hard time, but if it was Jansen then why was he hit from behind. Thats why ey was there to pick up the ball, because he was chasing his man to Campbell and was right there when the ball droped...

Of course, i was replaying this drunk at 3am. But thats what I saw. Im going to watch again tonight when I get home and see.

[UK Skins Fan]

How can this even be called "The Mark Brunell has to go thread", when we've had the same thread countless times in the last three years? Move along people - he's not going anywhere. And even if he did go, people would still be moaning about whoever replaced him.

[HitDoctor]

I Vote for putting Brunell out to pasture.

[crazyhorse1]

Err, there's a lot of tension/sarcasm going on here...
Here's what I think:

JC looked ok, but obviously missed Samuels and needs to be more aware of incoming defenders.

Brunell looked like his normal self - but why does he insist on calling timeouts all the time?

Collins looked good enough against a group of defenders that probably won't see the field this season.

All in all, Brunell needs to go sooner than later, but considering our other options, I'd still rather see MB come in as a backup in a real game than anyone else at this point.

By the way, does anyone else feel like MB for us is about the exact equivalent of Brad Johnson backing up for the Pukes?

In response to the latter: absolutely not. Johnson is far better than Brunell.

[crazyhorse1]

Agreed, Brunell's starter days are past him, but he's a solid backup, with game experience. With his restucturing he is not hurting the club as bad as 2005 & 2006 salary wise. He knows the offense, and like it or not the players like his leadership. Case and point, if Cambell goes down against Miami you don't want TODD COLLINS starting for us against the Eagles in Philly on Monday Night Football do you. He is our best option right now so let's go with it.... and work on a QB next draft or free agency.... we have bigger problems to address than backup QB...

I have no idea why they would like his leadership and why you think they do.
Even if you took a survey they'd do too smart to say they don't like his leadership. Just isn't done, unless your name is T. Owens.
P.S. If Campbell goes down, I'd want Collins to go in. At least our opponents wouldn't put eight men in the box and he might hit the blatantly open guy if everything is going perfectly. With MB we don't move the ball. Period.

[crazyhorse1]

I'm sure everyone here knows how I feal about MB. Keep him or cut him the sallary cap hit is about the same! I truely believe the team will let him go after this season, so next year's cap hit would be the same. If we keep him he takes up a roster spot and right now I don't know if his abilities warrant keeping him on the roster. So this all comes down to who Gibbs feels more comfortable with and I'm sure everyone knows who that is. So it doesn't matter that I think he is a waste of a roster spot, because Gibbs thinks otherwise.

For everyone that says Palmer will be on the practice squad that means the Skins have to cut him at some point. While he is on the practice squad, any team in the league can sign him off of the practice squad. They just have to put him on their active rosterr the following week and I think that means he would have to be their #2 QB, because the #3 guy is technically inactive (but I'm not sure about that). So keeping both MB and TC means cutting Palmer.


Great insights. Thanks.

The "first string O-line" play was not that bad Saturday and I'm sure the team will be fine at O-line. I thought Heyer played OK. The first sack/fumble wasn't his fault. He blocked his guy. The DB wasn't accounted for and that is either the fault of the center or QB and since Campbell took the responsibility I'll go with that. The second one was on Jansen and I don't expect him to give up many sacks in the season. The rest were after the starters left. Also, Gibbs and Saunders would have had a back or TE helping out the tackles had that been a real game. I didn't break it down play by play, but my impression was when the team did go max protect, Campbell had a good amount of time.

[SkinsFreak]

Ok, I've waited a few days to comment on the play of Brunell so I could give it some thought and not just fly off with some tongue and cheek remarks.

I'll start by saying that I have been a huge critic of Brunell as a starter, but a big supporter of him as a back-up; mainly do to his experience, current knowledge of Saunders playbook and the benefit Campbell receives from working with a seasoned vet.

That said, I was extremely disappointed by what I saw from Brunell on Saturday night.

I can deal with an errant throw from time to time. I can even deal with an unnecessary time-out once in a while. But from what I saw from Brunell, I can't deal with.

1. Extremely poor decision making.
2. Very late with almost every throw.
3. While performing poorly, laughing, joking and cutting it up on the sideline and with the other team.

Those things really bother me. Yes, I know it was only the first preseason game and doesn't mean much, but I would expect a little more professionalism from a veteran.

***And here is the thing that really bothered me... throwing the ball away or out of bounds in a preseason game.

Mark, what the hell were you thinking?

I can understand Campbell and the first team doing that, but not from the back-up QB in a preseason game with 2nd, 3rd and 4th string receivers in the game.

Mark, at least give the receivers a chance!

Maybe it would have required a tight throw and maybe the receiver would've had to make a spectacular catch for the play to be successful.

Well... AT LEAST GIVE THEM A CHANCE! IT'S PRESEASON!

If I was a receiver trying to move up the depth chart or trying to earn a spot on the roster, and the back-up QB was throwing the ball away and not even giving me a chance... well, I'd be pissed about it. I'd even get in Mark's grill about it. Make the throw and simply give the receiver a chance to make a catch and showcase their abilities. That's what preseason is for.



Now, I know there are cap implications and know Mark will remain here this year because of it. I was just really disappointed by his poor decision making and what I thought was a lack of effort.

Also, I don't think anyone in this thread was arguing for Collins to become the starter. But, he did look better than Brunell in both the scrimmage and the Titans game and maybe Collins deserves to be ranked higher than Brunell at this point. No one knows Saunders playbook better than Collins, and in my opinion, his current playability and system knowledge ranks him ahead of Brunell.

[MEZZSKIN]

wow the sarcasm is flying....whew..ok I do agree with bosshog...forget cap space logic..i truly dont need to argue nor win that point(i probably cant anyway) because it doesnt change the fact that Brunell is a scrub ..

Look guys i bleed burgundy and gold and it pains me to see us employ such garbage...heres my point in a nutshell Joe Gibbs was quoted sometime in his first regime or maybe year 1 of the second as saying " the two most important players on your football team are your starting QB and your backup QB" I believe that ..I truly do....and its disgrace that our second most important player on our team is Mark Brunell....

Lets give TC a chance to be our back up.....guys this a huge decision for us dont downplay it
I truly hope TC keeps it up and forces Gibbs hand
and as always
GODSPEED JC

[Countertrey]

wow the sarcasm is flying

Indeed. There seems to be a wealth of talent in that area here.

[John Manfreda]

Todd Collins is better than Brunell maybe he wasn't in the past but times change and he is now. I think Todd should be the NO.2 and would like to cut Brunell but if we can't do to the cap, Collins should be no.2 and Brunell no.3. Collins is simply a better player say what u want but he is still better than Brunell.

[steve09ru]

you dont need Joe Montana to get to the SB this day in age..IE: Rex Grossman....We just need to get better as a team to support JC

then Brunell would be fine right? you totally contradicted yourself....i think we have more problems then worrying about a guy who isn't starting and who will hurt our cap more than help if we let him go

[sch1977]

Look, if we were talking about MB as a starter, then yes we are in trouble. But he is our BACKUP. TC is not better than Brunell just because he had a decent preseason game against the THIRD string Titans defense. I believe MB's experience on the field is our best bet if something happens to JC. There are no viable replacements in the FA market, and our time and resources are better spent elsewhere.

[REDEEMEDSKIN]

Todd Collins is better than Brunell maybe he wasn't in the past but times change and he is now. I think Todd should be the NO.2 and would like to cut Brunell but if we can't do to the cap, Collins should be no.2 and Brunell no.3. Collins is simply a better player say what u want but he is still better than Brunell.

All of you calling for Brunell's head ought to reconsider your position based on the above evidence.

I mean, if your posts say the same things that a Manfreda post does, wouldn't you at least consider that you're jumping off the deep end a bit too soon?.

[Gibbs' Hog]

Todd Collins is better than Brunell maybe he wasn't in the past but times change and he is now. I think Todd should be the NO.2 and would like to cut Brunell but if we can't do to the cap, Collins should be no.2 and Brunell no.3. Collins is simply a better player say what u want but he is still better than Brunell.

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

You're getting this from one preseason game?

I'll be the first to admit that I'm sick of seeing Boonell chuck the ball away and call frivolous timeouts, but when did Collins simply become better than Brunell? It's not like we have any real game tape to back that claim up...

[Countertrey]

Todd Collins is better than Brunell maybe he wasn't in the past but times change and he is now. I think Todd should be the NO.2 and would like to cut Brunell but if we can't do to the cap, Collins should be no.2 and Brunell no.3. Collins is simply a better player say what u want but he is still better than Brunell.

Lock the thread. The Oracle has spoken. Collins has been annointed.

[CanesSkins26]

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

You're getting this from one preseason game?

I'll be the first to admit that I'm sick of seeing Boonell chuck the ball away and call frivolous timeouts, but when did Collins simply become better than Brunell? It's not like we have any real game tape to back that claim up... Eh?

Collins isn't a very good qb, but at this point he is a better option than Brunell as a #2. Based on last season, Brunell's shoulder injury, and his performance thus far in the preseason, it appears that Brunell is washed up and isn't able to physically do the things that a qb must be able to do. Sure Collins played well against a weak 3rd string defense but I doubt that Brunell would have done that well if he was in the game. It's hard to be effective against any defense (first, second, or third string) if your arm is so shot that you cant throw the ball more than 5 yards past the line of scrimmage.

[Gibbs4Life]

Those of you who still defend brunell either didn't see the game in TN or we're soo stoned you can't remember how awful he was. Bottom line if #8 gets in the starting role at any point for us this year pack it in.

[Fios]

Those of you who still defend brunell either didn't see the game in TN or we're soo stoned you can't remember how awful he was. Bottom line if #8 gets in the starting role at any point for us this year pack it in.

Must be nice to be so certain

[John Manfreda]

Todd Collins is better than Brunell maybe he wasn't in the past but times change and he is now. I think Todd should be the NO.2 and would like to cut Brunell but if we can't do to the cap, Collins should be no.2 and Brunell no.3. Collins is simply a better player say what u want but he is still better than Brunell.

All of you calling for Brunell's head ought to reconsider your position based on the above evidence.

I mean, if your posts say the same things that a Manfreda post does, wouldn't you at least consider that you're jumping off the deep end a bit too soon?.

I am just saying that if we can't cut him because of the cap he should be no.3 The guy can't throw the ball for ten yds. for gosh sakes. He is experienced but who cares about experience when u can't throw the ball. I think Collins should be ahead of Brunell on the depth chart.

[John Manfreda]

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

You're getting this from one preseason game?

I'll be the first to admit that I'm sick of seeing Boonell chuck the ball away and call frivolous timeouts, but when did Collins simply become better than Brunell? It's not like we have any real game tape to back that claim up... Eh?

Collins isn't a very good qb, but at this point he is a better option than Brunell as a #2. Based on last season, Brunell's shoulder injury, and his performance thus far in the preseason, it appears that Brunell is washed up and isn't able to physically do the things that a qb must be able to do. Sure Collins played well against a weak 3rd string defense but I doubt that Brunell would have done that well if he was in the game. It's hard to be effective against any defense (first, second, or third string) if your arm is so shot that you cant throw the ball more than 5 yards past the line of scrimmage.

Exactly