We may have interest in Calvin Johnson?

[SkinsFreak]

1) Why would Tampa POSSIBLY take Lloyd?

Well, I was just thinking (probably why I hit golf balls for a living) that for Tampa, if they wanted a guard or a tackle, but still needed a receiver, they could get Lloyd, a decent receiver, and an o-lineman with our 6th pick. It was just an idea that I'm sure won't happen. But I like to dream, ok?

[SeanTaylorJr.]

Now, don't kill the messenger. Johnson was on Cold Pizza this morning and they just finished talking about him on NFL Live. Michael Smith seems to think that the Buc's have numerous young wide-outs currently on the roster, including Michael Clayton, and will pass on CJ. He thinks they will target an offensive guard or tackle.

He was subsequently asked where would be the best fit for CJ. Smith said that the Skins would be the perfect fit for CJ. He went on to say, something like..."Could you imagine... Campbell, with Portis and Betts behind him, throwing to Moss, ey and Calvin Johnson??? That offense would be unstoppable!" Smith thinks the Skins will land CJ.

I know we need d-line help, but I'd take Johnson in a split second if he fell to #6. I'd even consider giving the Buc's our 6th pick and Lloyd for their 4th pick, to draft Johnson. I honestly think he is well worth it and will pay huge dividends to whoever gets him. I truly believe that because I watched the kid play. He is a far better talent than Edwards, Williams, Rogers and others that some of you have pointed out to be busts and as a reason not to draft Johnson.

I wholeheartedly agree, CJ is a difference maker.

To say flat out that WR aren't difference makers is a joke. Anyone notice the STATISTICAL and WINNING effect TO had in the non crazy year with the eagles, and Mcnabb, also Stallworth too.

I would take him like that if he were there, he puts up on the field (what matters) and in the workouts, a once a decade talent

WOULD PEOPLE PLEASE STOP MENTIONING MIKE WILLIAMS AS A WR BUST!!!!!!!! DOES NO ONE REMEMBER HE SAT OUT AN ENTIRE YEAR AFTER SC, THATS LIKE 3 OFFSEASONS BACK TO BACK TO BACK; GEEZ I WONDER IF IT WOULD BE CHALLENGE TO PLAY AT A HIGHER LEVEL AFTER THAT, LET ALONE FOR A TEAM WITH NO QB AND NO OLINE. AND HE HAS SHOWN SOME PROGRESS BUT PLEASE SHOW A LITTLE PATIENCE BECAUSE OF HIS CIRCUMSTANCES.

[fleetus]

The only way the Skins end up with CJ is if we trade up to get him, PERIOD. Many temas have him rated their #1 player on the draft board. He will not slip past #4. Also, if CJ slipped all the way to #4 and for some completely irrational reason Tampa didn't want to draft him, they would be extremely dumb to not field offers to trade down since CJ will bring lots of interest if he does slip. I bet someone will trade with Detroit and use the #2 on CJ, IMO.

[SkinsJock]

..I would take him ... if he were there, he puts up on the field (what matters) and in the workouts, a once in a decade talent.

I think what most are saying is that we hope he is regarded as potentially the best WR ever to play in the NFL because if he is that highly regarded and I think he could be then we will get a lot in return
Johnson is only 1 future HOF player and he will never win a Super Bowl by himself BUT if we can get 3 or 4 future HOF players for him and go to 3 or 4 Super Bowls, I will personally be at Canton when he goes in to say "thank you" for helping build a dynasty in DC

[fleetus]

I see Atlanta taking the extra 2nd round picks they got from Houston (for Schaub) and the #8 overall pick to move up to #2 with Detroit to draft CJ. Georgia Tech player gets to stay home and play for the falcons with Vick as his QB. A match made in heaven. Detoit would get exactly what they wanted as well.

[SeanTaylorJr.]

I see Atlanta taking the extra 2nd round picks they got from Houston (for Schaub) and the #8 overall pick to move up to #2 with Detroit to draft CJ. Georgia Tech player gets to stay home and play for the falcons with Vick as his QB. A match made in heaven. Detoit would get exactly what they wanted as well.

ya that definetely is possibility for the falcons, if anyone would trade up they could be the best canidate with that extra draft pick, however, they are like us, they've gotten underperforming wr's and their need is @ DL

[skinsfan#33]

I see Atlanta taking the extra 2nd round picks they got from Houston (for Schaub) and the #8 overall pick to move up to #2 with Detroit to draft CJ. Georgia Tech player gets to stay home and play for the falcons with Vick as his QB. A match made in heaven. Detoit would get exactly what they wanted as well.

Value wise Detroit would be looking for the #8, BOTH of Atlanta's 2nd round picks, AND Atlanta's 3rd! There is no way Detroit moves back to #8 for a second round pick!

That is a lot to give up for a guy that will only touch the ball at most 10 times a game! Atlanta needs a WR in thw worst way and that would be the "worst way".

WR are just not worth a top ten pick, let alone the #8 pick, two 2nd rounders, and a 3rd! Even if he ends upbeing the next Jerry Rice, that would be a bad trade.

[Cappster]

I see Atlanta taking the extra 2nd round picks they got from Houston (for Schaub) and the #8 overall pick to move up to #2 with Detroit to draft CJ. Georgia Tech player gets to stay home and play for the falcons with Vick as his QB. A match made in heaven. Detoit would get exactly what they wanted as well.

Value wise Detroit would be looking for the #8, BOTH of Atlanta's 2nd round picks, AND Atlanta's 3rd! There is no way Detroit moves back to #8 for a second round pick!

That is a lot to give up for a guy that will only touch the ball at most 10 times a game! Atlanta needs a WR in thw worst way and that would be the "worst way".

WR are just not worth a top ten pick, let alone the #8 pick, two 2nd rounders, and a 3rd! Even if he ends upbeing the next Jerry Rice, that would be a bad trade.

I would make that trade if the player I was trading for was the second coming of Jerry Rice.

[fleetus]

I see Atlanta taking the extra 2nd round picks they got from Houston (for Schaub) and the #8 overall pick to move up to #2 with Detroit to draft CJ. Georgia Tech player gets to stay home and play for the falcons with Vick as his QB. A match made in heaven. Detoit would get exactly what they wanted as well.

Value wise Detroit would be looking for the #8, BOTH of Atlanta's 2nd round picks, AND Atlanta's 3rd! There is no way Detroit moves back to #8 for a second round pick!

That is a lot to give up for a guy that will only touch the ball at most 10 times a game! Atlanta needs a WR in thw worst way and that would be the "worst way".

WR are just not worth a top ten pick, let alone the #8 pick, two 2nd rounders, and a 3rd! Even if he ends upbeing the next Jerry Rice, that would be a bad trade.

I agree that WR's aren't my top priority either, but some of them are definitely worth top 10 picks. It's pretty near-sighted to say WR's aren't worth that much, IMO. These guys open up the running game by forcing the safeties backwards. They score, they make bunches of first downs. As a real world example, in 2006 only two RB's, Larry Johnson and LT had more first downs than the following WR's: Harrison, Wayne, Holt, Chad Johnson. Are you saying that moving the chains isn't important enough to a football team to use a top 10 pick? All of those guys I just mentioned had OVER 66 first downs for their teams last year. Naw, WR's are every bit as important a part of a team as the O-line, QB, LB's etc.

[fleetus]

I see Atlanta taking the extra 2nd round picks they got from Houston (for Schaub) and the #8 overall pick to move up to #2 with Detroit to draft CJ. Georgia Tech player gets to stay home and play for the falcons with Vick as his QB. A match made in heaven. Detoit would get exactly what they wanted as well.

Value wise Detroit would be looking for the #8, BOTH of Atlanta's 2nd round picks, AND Atlanta's 3rd! There is no way Detroit moves back to #8 for a second round pick!

That is a lot to give up for a guy that will only touch the ball at most 10 times a game! Atlanta needs a WR in thw worst way and that would be the "worst way".

WR are just not worth a top ten pick, let alone the #8 pick, two 2nd rounders, and a 3rd! Even if he ends upbeing the next Jerry Rice, that would be a bad trade.

Umm, I did say the extra 2nd round pickS. You quoted me on it. PickS, meaning plural. Evidently Detroit doesn't want Quinn at #2. They would be lambasted by their fans if they chose another WR, since they've totally whiffed on 2 out of the last 3 top 10 WR's they've picked (Mike Williams and Charles Rogers). Persoanlly I think they need to draft Joe Thomas and be done with it, but they have advertised they want to trade down. Sooo, Atlanta, with their new offensive-minded head coach, who is all lovey-dovey with Vick right now, is probably begging to move up for CJ. Just a prediction, no more, no less.

If you follow the draft pick value chart, the #2 for the #8 + #40 calculates a value of 1823 vs. 2179. So the added 2nd rounder would definitely be enough ammo.

[SkinsJock]

Most would agree that Johnson is going to be a great WR and he could even be the best WR ever and that is just what we need! We need a bunch of teams to believe that he is the best ever especially if he is miraculously available at # 6 - that would truly show that some teams are worse at picking players than we have been.

1 super WR with our QB who is just starting his career with what looks like a decent group around him is going to make our offense better BUT a vastly improved defense from all the quality players we will get by making the right decisions here in the next few months will translate into a vastly better team than having the worlds' best ever WR playing with a good offense and a D that still rates in the high 20s.

We all understand the fantasy football fanatics and even have an owner that used to behave like that - we need to get better defensively and offensively not just with 1 great WR but by starting on our D this year and then building through the draft and FA in future years.

If you really think that we will have a better chance at success over the years with the best WR ever than we will with a good solid team offensively and defensively, you might want to go make a lot of money and play NFL owner like someone else did and see how good you do

We do not need to do much on offense this year IMO we really need to get our D back in gear with all the players we can this year especially if he falls to # 6 and because everyone thinks Johnson is such a great WR and everyone else needs him.

He'd be exciting here but we have a better chance of being a better team without him and improving that D. If you want him then pick him in your fantasy league and leave the real game and draft picks to those who know what they are doing - well, hopefully.

[SkinsJock]

Our interest in Calvin Johnson is purely due to what he is worth in other players not for just 1 guy.

there is a snowball's chance in hell that he will be there at 6

[skinsfan#33]

I see Atlanta taking the extra 2nd round picks they got from Houston (for Schaub) and the #8 overall pick to move up to #2 with Detroit to draft CJ. Georgia Tech player gets to stay home and play for the falcons with Vick as his QB. A match made in heaven. Detoit would get exactly what they wanted as well.

Value wise Detroit would be looking for the #8, BOTH of Atlanta's 2nd round picks, AND Atlanta's 3rd! There is no way Detroit moves back to #8 for a second round pick!

That is a lot to give up for a guy that will only touch the ball at most 10 times a game! Atlanta needs a WR in thw worst way and that would be the "worst way".

WR are just not worth a top ten pick, let alone the #8 pick, two 2nd rounders, and a 3rd! Even if he ends upbeing the next Jerry Rice, that would be a bad trade.

Umm, I did say the extra 2nd round pickS. You quoted me on it. PickS, meaning plural. Evidently Detroit doesn't want Quinn at #2. They would be lambasted by their fans if they chose another WR, since they've totally whiffed on 2 out of the last 3 top 10 WR's they've picked (Mike Williams and Charles Rogers). Persoanlly I think they need to draft Joe Thomas and be done with it, but they have advertised they want to trade down. Sooo, Atlanta, with their new offensive-minded head coach, who is all lovey-dovey with Vick right now, is probably begging to move up for CJ. Just a prediction, no more, no less.

If you follow the draft pick value chart, the #2 for the #8 + #40 calculates a value of 1823 vs. 2179. So the added 2nd rounder would definitely be enough ammo.

We are using diferent "draft value chart".

I'll show you mine http://www.theredzone.org/2006/draft/draftvaluechart.asp
If you show me yours.

The chart I have shows the #2 pick worth 2600 and the #8 worth 1400. If you add that plus the #40 you get 1900 + the #42 = 2380 + the #74 = 2600. If Atlanta was to offer the 2008 2nd rounder that they got instead of the #42 pick Detroit would come up on the short end, because future year picks are generally "worth" one round less in "draft value". This means that it is worth somewhere between 265 to 116 points, because you don't know wher huston will finish. (it safe to say that they won't do very good)

[fleetus]

I see Atlanta taking the extra 2nd round picks they got from Houston (for Schaub) and the #8 overall pick to move up to #2 with Detroit to draft CJ. Georgia Tech player gets to stay home and play for the falcons with Vick as his QB. A match made in heaven. Detoit would get exactly what they wanted as well.

Value wise Detroit would be looking for the #8, BOTH of Atlanta's 2nd round picks, AND Atlanta's 3rd! There is no way Detroit moves back to #8 for a second round pick!

That is a lot to give up for a guy that will only touch the ball at most 10 times a game! Atlanta needs a WR in thw worst way and that would be the "worst way".

WR are just not worth a top ten pick, let alone the #8 pick, two 2nd rounders, and a 3rd! Even if he ends upbeing the next Jerry Rice, that would be a bad trade.

Umm, I did say the extra 2nd round pickS. You quoted me on it. PickS, meaning plural. Evidently Detroit doesn't want Quinn at #2. They would be lambasted by their fans if they chose another WR, since they've totally whiffed on 2 out of the last 3 top 10 WR's they've picked (Mike Williams and Charles Rogers). Persoanlly I think they need to draft Joe Thomas and be done with it, but they have advertised they want to trade down. Sooo, Atlanta, with their new offensive-minded head coach, who is all lovey-dovey with Vick right now, is probably begging to move up for CJ. Just a prediction, no more, no less.

If you follow the draft pick value chart, the #2 for the #8 + #40 calculates a value of 1823 vs. 2179. So the added 2nd rounder would definitely be enough ammo.

We are using diferent "draft value chart".

I'll show you mine http://www.theredzone.org/2006/draft/draftvaluechart.asp
If you show me yours.

The chart I have shows the #2 pick worth 2600 and the #8 worth 1400. If you add that plus the #40 you get 1900 + the #42 = 2380 + the #74 = 2600. If Atlanta was to offer the 2008 2nd rounder that they got instead of the #42 pick Detroit would come up on the short end, because future year picks are generally "worth" one round less in "draft value". This means that it is worth somewhere between 265 to 116 points, because you don't know wher huston will finish. (it safe to say that they won't do very good)

Yeah, you're right. I had two different charts. I use the redzone one also. The one I used yesterday was a Fantasy Football draft pick calculator. Not quite the same values!

Anyway, point is, Atlanta now has the ammo it needs to move up to get CJ, which is my prediction. Bottom line is, there is no reason for us to speculate CJ's worth at #6 because there is no way in hell he falls past #4, as I've stated before.

[skinsfan#33]

[list=]
Year Sel# Player Impact
1982 11 Anthony Hancock ?
1982 13 Lindsay Scott ?
1982 19 Perry Tuttle ?
1982 20 Mike Quick B
1983 18 Willie Gault ?
1984 1 Irving Fryar B+
1984 4 Kenny Jackson ?
1984 17 Clyde Duncan ?
1984 23 Louis Lipps C
1985 10 Al Toon B
1985 13 Eddie Brown ?
1985 16 Jerry Rice HOF
1985 23 Jessie Hester ?
1986 18 Mike Sherrard ?
1986 21 Tim McGee ?
1987 20 Haywood Jeffires ?
1987 27 Ricky Nattiel ?
1987 28 Mark Ingram B
1988 6 Tim Brown B+
1988 7 Sterling Sharpe A
1988 11 Michael Irvin A
1988 15 Anthony Miller ?
1988 20 Aaron Cox ?
1988 27 Wendell Davis ?
1989 13 Eric Metcalf RB
1989 16 Hart Lee Dykes ?
1989 22 Andre Rison B
1989 27 Shawn Collins ?
1991 10 Herman Moore B+
1991 12 Alvin Harper C
1991 13 Mike Pritchard ?
1991 23 Randal Hill ?
1992 4 Desmond Howard F
1993 7 Curtis Conway C
1993 16 Sean Dawkins C
1993 25 O.J. McDuffie B
1994 17 Charles Johnson ?
1994 21 Johnnie Morton C
1994 24 Thomas Lewis ?
1994 29 Derrick Alexander C
1995 4 Michael Westbrook D
1995 8 Joey Galloway C
1995 10 J.J. Stokes F
1996 1 Keyshawn Johnson B+
1996 7 Terry Glenn B
1996 18 Eddie Kennison C
1996 19 Marvin Harrison HOF
1996 24 Eric Moulds B
1997 7 Ike Hilliard C+
1997 15 Yatil Green ?
1997 16 Reidel Anthony F
1997 27 Rae Carruth F
1998 16 Kevin Dyson B
1998 21 Randy Moss B
1998 30 Marcus Nash ?
1999 6 Torry Holt HOF
1999 8 David Boston B+
1999 13 Troy Edwards D
2000 4 Peter Warrick D
2000 8 Plaxico Burress C+
2000 10 Travis Taylor D
2000 21 Sylvester Morris F
2001 8 David Terrell F-
2001 9 Koren Robinson F
2001 15 Rod Gardner D
2001 16 Santana Moss B+
2001 25 Freddie Mitchell F
2001 30 Reggie Wayne A
2002 13 Donte' Stallworth B
2002 19 Ashley Lelie C-
2002 20 Javon Walker B
2003 2 Charles Rogers F
2003 3 Andre Johnson A
2003 17 Bryant Johnson ?
2004 3 Larry Fitzgerald A
2004 7 Roy Williams B
2004 9 Reggie Williams ?
2004 13 Lee Evans C+
2004 15 Michael Clayton C+
2004 29 Michael Jenkins C
2004 31 Rashaun Woods ?
2005 3 Braylon Edwards C+
2005 7 Troy Williamson D
2005 10 Mike Williams F
2005 21 Matt Jones C+
2005 22 Mark Clayton C
2005 27 Roddy White ?
2006 25 Santonio Holmes C[/list]


Above are all of the WRs drafted since 1982 in the first round. A total of 88 (87 if you subtract Eric Metcaft. I have graded them (just my opinion) on how much of an impact they had on a team. I would say if the guy didn't get a B or better than he was a bust for a first round pick.

For the guys I just couldn't remember I gave them a ?. Some of the more recent guys are still a work in progress and I might rate them differently in five years.

I only had 3 guys with HOF type careers and no Irvin wasn't one of them (just my opinion remember) 3 or 4 out of 87 isn't too good < 5%. There were 26 guys I ranked B or better, which comes out to < 30%. So there was about a 70% flop rate for 1st round WR.

Anyone see why I have reservations about CJ.

[fleetus]

Nice work. However, you could make the same argument for every position in football. The draft is very inexact. 1st round picks:

think they are good enough before they ever play a snap, (and thus suck)
can't handle all the $millions at age 21-22
don't fit their new teams scheme well
get injured early
can't handle the pressure from media and fans
can't handle the pressure of living up to 1st round expectations

Look at David Carr, Tim Couch, H. Schuler, R. Leaf, Ramsey, J. George etc. I know I'm missing another dozen dreadful QB's selected early. You gonna say QB's aren't worth 1st round selections either? It's a crapshoot. Our team simply has to do better homework than the other teams, regardless of position.

Here's a link to Kipers All-Time Biggest 1st round busts (not many WR's on there)
http://espn.go.com/melkiper/s/2001/0406/1168617.html

[skinsfan#33]

Nice work. However, you could make the same argument for every position in football. The draft is very inexact. 1st round picks:

think they are good enough before they ever play a snap, (and thus suck)
can't handle all the $millions at age 21-22
don't fit their new teams scheme well
get injured early
can't handle the pressure from media and fans
can't handle the pressure of living up to 1st round expectations

Look at David Carr, Tim Couch, H. Schuler, R. Leaf, Ramsey, J. George etc. I know I'm missing another dozen dreadful QB's selected early. You gonna say QB's aren't worth 1st round selections either? It's a crapshoot. Our team simply has to do better homework than the other teams, regardless of position.



Here's a link to Kipers All-Time Biggest 1st round busts (not many WR's on there)
http://espn.go.com/melkiper/s/2001/0406/1168617.html

You go right ahead and make the arguement for other positions!

Yes QBs are almost as risky as WR, but the reward is much greater with QBs. Take two 49ers for example. Montana (not a 1st rounder by the way) is hailed by many, but not all as the best QB of all time and Rice is hailed almost universally as the best WR to ever play. Montana won two SB without Rice and would have won ATLEAST one more without him. Rice won three SB with Montana and Young and would not have won a single one without them or with the tallent the Skins had at QB during his time in San Fran.

The risk with WRs is just as great as with QBs, yet the reward is not even in the same neighborhood.

No one has ever won a SB because they had the best WR in the NFL on their team, but most SB winning teams had QBs that turned in the best or one of the best performance in the league the year they won the SB.

The Ravens won their only SB, mostly because of Ray Lewis. Say that for a WR!

The Patriots proved that WR mean nothing if you want to win a championship. Dallas and the Stealers won 10 SB and all of them were because of their defense and RBs. You might be able to make the arguement for the Stealers in SB X were Swann had his huge game, but he only scored once and it was on a perfect pass by Bradshaw.

Pick whoever you think the best WR in the NFL is now, would he help the Skins more than Julious Peppers. I rest my case!

[SkinsJock]

This is still a team game - a better team will most often win - that being said the team with the better defense will win most games.

Last year both QBs were 1st round draft picks but really the Colts won because their defense did a better job than the Bears. Even if Grossman had his best day as a QB, Manning would still have found a way to win because the Bears D in that game could not match up. The Colts D played well enough that Manning just had to stick to the game plan and the Bears were cooked with only 1 RB.

Right now we are looking at an emerging QB with a very good/great RB combo and a decent group of WRs plus a very experienced line - I really believe we are OK there and just need some depth. We do not need to be the greatest on offense (be nice, but pointless) we need to get our defense to be back where it was in 2004 & 2005 and maybe even better!

We need to get very fast and much younger in the next 2 years. I would love to see Fletcher help as MLB BUT also (with Washington) be a mentor to guys like McIntosh and help get our younger guys ready to take over. We need to have a defense that we can be proud od again - A great Washington offense will be all well and good but a defense that keeps giving a good offensive group opportunities and limits the opponents offense will result in a lot more wins.

[Gibbs4Life]

I'll never forgive blloyd for dropping a sure td that happened to be Jason Campbell's first nfl reg season pass. The guy way way underachieved last year, hoping he steps his game up.

[John Manfreda]

He's supposedly considered the best player in the draft. Even though we don't need him some people say that you don't always draft your need, you take the best person available.

1. I'm a fan of getting a dlinmen.
2. I'm in favor of trading down.
3. I'm not ethused about it but I wouldnt be mad if we took Calvin, imo we need a big WR. I dont think now is the time and Lloyd;s leaping ability can fill that need for now.

I agree. I have been enjoying the fact that us Redskin fans may have a reason to watch the entire draft next year, and if we move up this year in the draft, you know that will mean we gave away picks for next year. Seeing their interest does scare me a little bit, but like you also said, he would be the big receiver we need, with speed to go with his large frame.

And by some weird stroke of "luck" he may be available at the 6th spot, so they'll need to know what he can do depending on what they need to do. Everyone is interested in this kid but I doubt we really want him.

He won't be available at the 6th pick I willing to bet 1000 bucks on that.

[SkinsFreak]

Guys, I have a theory here...

1) We have heard Gibbs say that moving up is apparently easier than moving down.

2) We've heard that the Lions were after Springs during the trade talks for Bly.

3) The Lions have yet to sign any replacements for Bly.

4) We have now added Smoot and Macklin.

5) We've heard that the entire staff showed up at the Georgia Tech pro-day.


I'm just sayin'...

Interesting observation.

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/nflinsid ... g_ser.html

Gibbs Says Redskins Having Serious Trade Discussions About Moving Up In Draft
PHOENIX, Ariz.--Washington Redskins Coach Joe Gibbs said here today that nothing is "imminent" in a proposed trade with the Chicago Bears for linebacker Lance Briggs, and indicated that the Redskins also are giving serious consideration to trading up in the first-round order in next month's NFL draft.

Gibbs said the Redskins have spoken to two teams about trading up in the draft order. He said the Redskins have a "couple players" in mind if they land a top-five selection, and hinted that one of them might be Georgia Tech wide receiver Calvin Johnson.

"I think everybody here would like to have him," Gibbs said.

A real possibility.

[SkinsJock]

I would not mind getting Johnson but it better not involve any picks from next year. NONE

This year we all know that we need to get much better on D and this offense has to just be as good as they can be with who we have now!

Getting the future best ever WR will just make the offense a little better this year and much better next year when Campbell is a really good NFL QB.
BUT this offense will also be much better next year with who we have now and the players we will add next year.

The defense needs help now and next year they also need to get younger and quicker

this means we are not taking Johnson this year - we do not need him.

[SkinsFreak]

This is not specific to SkinsJock, but meant in general.

We all know we want help on our d-line. We've all discussed our needs on defense a thousand times. We can sit here all day long and think up a zillion reasons why we don't need CJ, as we've already done.

But I'd love to hear some possible trade scenarios regarding this one and how it might work, if they were going to do something like this... an argument in favor of this trade. What would be some "war room" like discussions in favor of this trade? Would it include Springs or some other offer? It's always prudent to evaluate all possibilities from every angle. So for the sake of discussion, let's ponder this one... you know... just for fun.

[jazzskins]

The Ravens won their only SB, mostly because of Ray Lewis. Say that for a WR!

Huh? I watched that game.....it looked to me like they won because of the Front Four!

[skinsfan#33]

This is not specific to SkinsJock, but meant in general.

We all know we want help on our d-line. We've all discussed our needs on defense a thousand times. We can sit here all day long and think up a zillion reasons why we don't need CJ, as we've already done.

But I'd love to hear some possible trade scenarios regarding this one and how it might work, if they were going to do something like this... an argument in favor of this trade. What would be some "war room" like discussions in favor of this trade? Would it include Springs or some other offer? It's always prudent to evaluate all possibilities from every angle. So for the sake of discussion, let's ponder this one... you know... just for fun.

How about trading Springs to Detroit for their 2nd round pick. Trade down to 8-11 and pick up a third. With the first we take a DT or DE and with the second we take a guard /safety / or DT/DE whomever is rated the highest and with the third we draft what we didn't take in rounds 1 or 2. Man 3 first day draft choices would be better than any WR.