Defesive Problems

redskins56 · Post by **redskins56** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:21 am

I don't want to make excuses for the horiffic first-half of the season that the Redskins are having. They've looked bad. Really bad, and I think everyone on this board would agree with that.

I do however want to gage what my fellow hogs.net advocates think the problem is.

Do you think it's personell? (Archuletta's inability to cover, bad fit for secondary. No reliable DE who can rush passer.)

Or are you like me and think that a lot of the problem is that the Skins have been bitten by injuries, and because they spend so much on starters, they have no depth. Losing Proleau was huge, losing Clemens as your best pass-rushing LB this summer was also a detriment. Shawn Springs has been out all season, Salve'a hasn't been healthy since week one, and both Griffin and Daniels have missed time as well.

When you have no depth and you are forced to play your bench guys, thats a problem. The bottom line is that this past weekend the Redskins had 5th and 6th round rookies starting side by side at DT.

There was a play in the game when Vernon Fox, Reed Doughty, Anthony Montgomery, and Ryan Boschetti were allon the field together at once. This team has no depth (namely on defense), and when you have no depth and you have injuries, your going to lose more games than you win.

Thoughts?

ii7-V7 · Post by **ii7-V7** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:20 pm

Its a head scratcher! I'm not sure how this happened. I think it is an accumulation of several factors.

The things that I've been wondering about are; Is this an aging Defense? and Did the light training camp, and uncompetitive pre-season hurt us? Injuries to "Core" guys. Too many new faces?

I noticed that the TB Bucs were the number one D last year and they are stinking it up just like us. We were the number 9 defense last year and now we are in the low 20's. What do the two teams have in common? Aging starters on Defense. The TB Defense is old....just like our starters! Not having quality depth is a part of this.

Is this it? Who knows?

Losing guys (particularly in the secondary) that knew the scheme is a big part of it too. Walt Harris, P. Prileaou (sp.?), Ryan Clark, etc. These guys were not our stars but they knew the scheme and where to be. guess what they either aren't here or are injured. Shawn Springs injury is huge as well as it pushes Wright and Rumph upward on the depth chart when they really weren't experienced enough in our scheme. Losing Arrington, Pierce, Smoot, etc. doesn't help either. Though only Pierce looks like he would have been worth the contract he was given somewhere else.

oneman56 · Post by **oneman56** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 1:44 pm

Defensive team speed, we are too slow. If you look at the top defenses in the league they are fast and aggressive, especially at linebacker. I like Lemar Marshall alot but he seems to be a step slow at middle linebacker and Warrick Holdman is killing us. I see teams run left on us all day long, Andre Carter seems slow too. I think we need a serious upgrade of faster playmakers and I think although LaVar hasn't been the same his speed is the reason are defense improved with his return last year. Then we need some young depth at cornerback, although I don't know where we are going to address these issues without draft picks. I don't see any teams in the league giving up young fast athletic defensive players through free agency (our draft). We can gripe about injuries all we want and this is part of the problem, but the bigger issue is personnel.

ClintonHill · Post by **ClintonHill** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 3:18 pm

What has shocked me this year is the poor tackling. We made Travis Henry look like Earl Campbell. In '04 and '05 we didn't have the best talent out there all the time but we were always funadmentally sound. This year it's like we've regressed.

I put part of that on Gregg. When teams don't tackle well I hold the coach responsible.

roybus14 · Post by **roybus14** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 6:06 pm

ClintonHill wrote:What has shocked me this year is the poor tackling. We made Travis Henry look like Earl Campbell. In '04 and '05 we didn't have the best talent out there all the time but we were always funadmentally sound. This year it's like we've regressed.

I put part of that on Gregg. When teams don't tackle well I hold the coach responsible.

C-Hill,

Is that Clinton Hills in Brooklyn. Washington Ave. and Myrtle with the famous Kam Kau chinese joint on the corner, Pratt Institute, brownstones, etc...???

I agree that the problem is with Gregg Williams which leads one to believe that his arrogance that his system is a "plug and play" system is why the look so bad this year. It just boggles my mind why we let the "homegrown" defensive talent walk because of money and then sign some-else's bums for more money.

Skins Fan in Indy · Post by **Skins Fan in Indy** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 8:02 pm

What happened to the Skins teams that I use to know. A bunch of not so big names playing together and being all on the same page. I guess since I moved to Indy a few years ago I can really appreacite what the Skins use to have.

I hope they play consistant and play together. I told everyone here in Colts country to watch out for the Skins after Gibbs second year back at the helm of the ship.

Is there a light at the end of the tunnel or are the Skins going to be the next New York Yankees???

Montana Redskin · Post by **Montana Redskin** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 8:37 pm

No comparisons to the Yankees, none at all.
Difference? Yankees win, win, win, get to post-season, win a few, win w/o stars (sheffield, matsui), win with mediocre pitching..go to playoffs like 12 years straight, win 4-5 titles in last 10 years.
They spend $$ and at least win during the season.

We suck, have a horrible record (except 10-6 with a playoff win, and 10-6 isn't great) and don't make playoffs year in and year out with big $ players. We never take the next step, except last year's Portis/Defense 5 game run to playoffs.

and I despise the Yankees, so not sticking up for them here!

Go Skins....man, this season sucks.

redskins56 · Post by **redskins56** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:01 pm

Montana Redskin wrote:No comparisons to the Yankees, none at all.
Difference? Yankees win, win, win, get to post-season, win a few, win w/o stars (sheffield, matsui), win with mediocre pitching..go to playoffs like 12 years straight, win 4-5 titles in last 10 years.
They spend $$ and at least win during the season.

We suck, have a horrible record (except 10-6 with a playoff win, and 10-6 isn't great) and don't make playoffs year in and year out with big $ players. We never take the next step, except last year's Portis/Defense 5 game run to playoffs.

and I despise the Yankees, so not sticking up for them here!

Go Skins....man, this season sucks.

You missed the biggest of all of the reasons why that comparison wasn't any good.

Unlike the Yankees, the Redskins have a salary cap equal to that of their opponents. They have bigger names like the Yankees do, but they still have the same cap.

JPFair · Post by **JPFair** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:58 pm

I had to laugh at todays Redskins.com news. The headline said "Rogers out for Sundays game vs The Colts. Underneat that it said "Redskins have "several options" at CB".

Exactly what "options" do we have? Wright? Rumph? I wouldn't exactly call that "several options". They make it sound like we have depth at the position or something.

oneman56 · Post by **oneman56** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:07 pm

JPFair wrote:I had to laugh at todays Redskins.com news. The headline said "Rogers out for Sundays game vs The Colts. Underneat that it said "Redskins have "several options" at CB".

Exactly what "options" do we have? Wright? Rumph? I wouldn't exactly call that "several options". They make it sound like we have depth at the position or something.

I saw that and laughed as well, I guess they are options, just not viable ones.

ClintonHill · Post by **ClintonHill** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:39 pm

roybus14 wrote:Is that Clinton Hills in Brooklyn. Washington Ave. and Myrtle with the famous Kam Kau chinese joint on the corner, Pratt Institute, brownstones, etc...???

the one and only!

It just boggles my mind why we let the "homegrown" defensive talent walk because of money and then sign some-else's bums for more money.

This is the part that hurts so much. We let Pierce walk because we didn't want to overpay him by like 50 cents but then we'll pay Adam Archuletta about 100x what he's worth.

I didn't realize until recently what a problem our LBs have become. I mean, Marcus is awesome. But Marshall and especially Holdman have been garbage. I read today that Marshall is playing hurt this year? I didn't know that, but still, no excuse.

Our LBs need work. I patiently await the arrival of Rocky. I know he's a rookie but can he really be that much worse than Holdman?

roybus14 · Post by **roybus14** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 5:20 pm

ClintonHill wrote:
roybus14 wrote:Is that Clinton Hills in Brooklyn. Washington Ave. and Myrtle with the famous Kam Kau chinese joint on the corner, Pratt Institute, brownstones, etc...???

the one and only!

It just boggles my mind why we let the "homegrown" defensive talent walk because of money and then sign some-else's bums for more money.

This is the part that hurts so much. We let Pierce walk because we didn't want to overpay him by like 50 cents but then we'll pay Adam Archuletta about 100x what he's worth.

I didn't realize until recently what a problem our LBs have become. I mean, Marcus is awesome. But Marshall and especially Holdman have been garbage. I read today that Marshall is playing hurt this year? I didn't know that, but still, no excuse.

Our LBs need work. I patiently await the arrival of Rocky. I know he's a rookie but can he really be that much worse than Holdman?

This is just one example of the arrogance of Gregg Williams in thinking that his defense is a "plug and play" defense. What they failed to realize is that while guys like Pierce, Ryan Clark, Smoot, etc. were learning to play within that scheme, they were also growing as players to be pretty good because they knew that system and were naturally improving. Now you have guys playing hurt and guys that just aren't good enough to play. Shouldn't it have dawned on them by now that Warrick Holdman and Carlos Rogers just can't play.

Another thing too, CH: They pump these guys with so much information during the week, I wonder how much are focused on the fundamentals of tackling?

Also, FedEx (Custom Critical) me a Roti from the carib-bean spot next to the Bodega that's on the corner of Wash. Ave. and Myrtle across from Kam Kau, if it's still there.... Peace....

ClintonHill · Post by **ClintonHill** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:40 am

roybus14 wrote:Also, FedEx (Custom Critical) me a Roti from the carib-bean spot next to the Bodega that's on the corner of Wash. Ave. and Myrtle across from Kam Kau, if it's still there.... Peace....

Sadly not there anymore but there are about 100 others that have sprouted up along Myrtle

mastdark81 · Post by **mastdark81** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:02 pm

Also I believe Gregg Williams has to switch up also and try new schemes. When he first introduced his defense to the NFC it worked wonders but after a few teams was successful against it I don't think he counteracted very well when others copied the offense's success.

I mean look at the Buddy Ryans 46 defense...it withered away because teams started to master it..but when it was fresh it won a Super Bowl (Bears). Sames goes for offense strategies (Gibbs)

This is a league you have to constantly play chess and win and improve. The lack of improvement in the schemes has exposed the real talent of this defense.

Only way to fix it is change the schemes or improve the personnel. Unfortunately the D can improve but with the injuries, attitude, and lack of leadership it will not be as successful as in the past this year.

I wouldn't mind if the Skins surprised the Colts with a 3-4 alignment :idea:

this week. How much worse can we be?