Who's laughing now?

[Dishgeek]

I dunno if y'all remember, but before last season ESPN was running an ad for their fantasy football where their draft nudnik said something like "I believe that out of the two receivers called 'Moss' Santana is the best." It was supposed to be funny, 'cause it was so ridiculous. Let's look at how things turned out:

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/12576
http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/235234

Who's laughing now, bitch?

[JonC56]

uhhhh, I love Moss, Santana but I will take Moss, Randy over him any day. Removing heart(thinking with your heart) from the equation, I think it is pretty clear that randy is the better reciever.

[Justice Hog]

uhhhh, I love Moss, Santana but I will take Moss, Randy over him any day. Removing heart(thinking with your heart) from the equation, I think it is pretty clear that randy is the better reciever.

Randy may be more 'physical' but I honestly think Santana is the better receiver. When it comes to WR, speed kills...and Santana, I believe, is faster than Randy.

[elchalje]

Word from the Giants rookie camp is that a guy named Sinorice Moss may be faster, quicker, and more of a threat than either of the other Moss guys. Of course, it helps to be blended with Plax, Amani, and the Shock Man. Oh yeah, Tiki might be out there too.

[hkHog]

uhhhh, I love Moss, Santana but I will take Moss, Randy over him any day. Removing heart(thinking with your heart) from the equation, I think it is pretty clear that randy is the better reciever.

Look at the stats though. Randy has only had two years with more catches than Santana and only one with more recieving yards. Santana plays hard on EVERY play and isn't afraid to run block either. Santana also has a far superior attitude in general. I would much rather take Santana.

[JonC56]

I love the production we got from santana. Justice hog, 40 time and football speed 2 different things. Jerry rice proved that considering he ran a 4.4 40. I personally think that there are very few people who have the talent of randy moss, terrel owens being the only active player comprable. There is no doubt that randy has some character flaws were santana does not.

First off, randy has only missed 3 games due to injury in his 8 year career. Santana had a great season last year, but randy has had 4 seasons with superior statistics, and has topped santana's max td's in a season 6 times.

If Joe gibbs could get through to him, and get him on board with the Redskin team concept, that would be a scary combination. Santana had a great year, but randy could arguably be one of the most talented recievers of all time.

[This_Heat]

Word from the Giants rookie camp is that a guy named Sinorice Moss may be faster, quicker, and more of a threat than either of the other Moss guys.

Of course, until he proves himself, this is nothing more than speculation. Although I think he has a good chance to break out considering the attention teams will have to place on the other offensive weapons the giants have.

[Break]

40 time and football speed 2 different things. Jerry rice proved that considering he ran a 4.4 40.

Actually, most all sources say that he ran a 4.6 40 at the combine. Which proves your point even more. 40 times are extremely overrated.

[yupchagee]

40 time and football speed 2 different things. Jerry rice proved that considering he ran a 4.4 40.

Actually, most all sources say that he ran a 4.6 40 at the combine. Which proves your point even more. 40 times are extremely overrated.

4.4 would be a very fast time, 4.6 sounds more likely. I agree that 40 times are over emphasized. How often does a play involve running 40 yds in a straight line? Only when the receiver has gotten past the defense & it's a foot race. I think the 2o yd shuttle & 3 cone are better indicators of football speed. That's 1 reason why I like Simon. His 40 was 4.7 but his 3 cone was 6.66, I think it was 2nd fastest at the combine to Ty Hill's 6.65.

[JonC56]

40 time and football speed 2 different things. Jerry rice proved that considering he ran a 4.4 40.

Actually, most all sources say that he ran a 4.6 40 at the combine. Which proves your point even more. 40 times are extremely overrated.

4.4 would be a very fast time, 4.6 sounds more likely. I agree that 40 times are over emphasized. How often does a play involve running 40 yds in a straight line? Only when the receiver has gotten past the defense & it's a foot race. I think the 2o yd shuttle & 3 cone are better indicators of football speed. That's 1 reason why I like Simon. His 40 was 4.7 but his 3 cone was 6.66, I think it was 2nd fastest at the combine to Ty Hill's 6.65.

For a reciever, 4.4 is atcually considered on the slow side. But, thank you for emphasizing my point.

[John Manfreda]

Based on carrer stats Randy.
Based on last year Santana.

Santana has not had the carrer Randy has had so you can't say he is better.

[Redskin in Canada]

but I will take Moss, Randy over him any day.

Santana is not a high maintenance guy in the locker room or the field but, most importantly, he does not QUIT on his team. Character is as important an indicator as physical skills are.

[DCGloryYears828791]

Word from the Giants rookie camp is that a guy named Sinorice Moss may be faster, quicker, and more of a threat than either of the other Moss guys. Of course, it helps to be blended with Plax, Amani, and the Shock Man. Oh yeah, Tiki might be out there too.

Games Yards AVG LNG TD
Randy Moss
634 10147 16.0 82 98

Santana Moss
235 3899 16.6 78 28

Sinorice Moss
0 0 0 0 0


Come back and tell us how he compares after he plays in his first couple years. Did you know that Heath Shuler MAY have been the best quarterback to come out of Tennessee until Peyton...........

[PulpExposure]

Word from the Giants rookie camp is that a guy named Sinorice Moss may be faster, quicker, and more of a threat than either of the other Moss guys.

Of course, Sinorice did basically nothing in college, whereas both Randy and Santana were dominant in college.
Likewise, I could be more of a threat than either Randy Moss or Santana Moss, for all you know.

[JonC56]

but I will take Moss, Randy over him any day.

Santana is not a high maintenance guy in the locker room or the field but, most importantly, he does not QUIT on his team. Character is as important an indicator as physical skills are.

I agree completely, but I think that Gibbs could instill the qualities you say he lacks. Anyone who puts up numbers like him in the NFl works hard, period. He does have character flaws, but saying that he quits on his team is a strech. True he walked off the field in the last couple of seconds of the skins game, but anyone who puts up that kind of production isnt a quitter.

We all know that randy has the talent, and I think gibbs could sure up his attitude. I would gamble on randy in a skins uniform with gibbs as the coach over santana anyday.

[Redskin in Canada]

We all know that randy has the talent, and I think gibbs could sure up his attitude. I would gamble on randy in a skins uniform with gibbs as the coach over santana anyday.

Some people do not want to be managed. Some people will not allow anybody to help them.

There are several instances of extremely gifted athletes, such as TO, Lavar and R. Moss, that could and would be fantastic -IF- they ever allowed anybody to help them.

But nobody can help them because they will not let anybody do it. There is one common denominator among these players: Each of them feels that he is BIGGER than the whole TEAM.

Players like those may have great numbers but they will never be members of a GREAT TEAM. They will not allow it by definition.

Take a lesson from the past: It is better to have the body and soul of a player that wants to put his team ahead, than the great talent of any one player who puts himself ahead of the team.

[JonC56]

We all know that randy has the talent, and I think gibbs could sure up his attitude. I would gamble on randy in a skins uniform with gibbs as the coach over santana anyday.

Some people do not want to be managed. Some people will not allow anybody to help them.

There are several instances of extremely gifted athletes, such as TO, Lavar and R. Moss, that could and would be fantastic -IF- they ever allowed anybody to help them.

But nobody can help them because they will not let anybody do it. There is one common denominator among these players: Each of them feels that he is BIGGER than the whole TEAM.

Players like those may have great numbers but they will never be members of a GREAT TEAM. They will not allow it by definition.

Take a lesson from the past: It is better to have the body and soul of a player that wants to put his team ahead, than the great talent of any one player who puts himself ahead of the team.

Well lets look at the past year. Randy was used horribly. Collins never threw the guy the ball in the second half of the season. Moss never complained and maintained a low profile all year. So with that being said, I would be willing to gamble on him, especially with a guy like gibbs coaching your team.

Although, I would pass on TO, he's a little to much of a gamble for my blood.

One question, you would say that catching the most touchdowns in the league (98) since he enterd not being fantastic?

Also owens and moss have been head and shoulders above the rest of the NFl recievers with exception of harrison in production in the last 8 years. Arrington was never considered the best at his position and has been injured for the majurity of his career.

[yupchagee]

I also prefer Santana. Character does count, just look at this yrs draft. A player can have great #'s but be such a negative influence that the net effect is negative. That's why Marcus Vick went undrafted.

[JonC56]

I also prefer Santana. Character does count, just look at this yrs draft. A player can have great #'s but be such a negative influence that the net effect is negative. That's why Marcus Vick went undrafted.

If marcus vick played football like owens or moss he would have a job in the NFL. The fact is he just isnt that good.

The net effective for owens and moss cant be that negative considered they are two of the highest paid players in the league.

[Redskin in Canada]

Randy was used horribly...

Every prima donna player will make precisely that argument. It is not THEM, it is the TEAM's fault that they did not do good.

[yupchagee]

TO couldn't have been that positive in Philly, they cut him. We'll see how things go in Dallas. I hope he melts down.

[JonC56]

Randy was used horribly...

Every prima donna player will make precisely that argument. It is not THEM, it is the TEAM's fault that they did not do good.

Well my point was that he didnt say that, I did, Reread my post. He didnt complain all season. At the raiders game last year Moss was consistently open and collins was not thorwing him the ball. I never once saw him show any outward frustration nor did he once say anything public all year.

Here's the reality of this thread. Santana moss had a great season as a redskin. Lets say we got randy instead of santana and he put up his usual production. Because we love the redskins we would have a emotional attachement to randy. It's the reason why when ever a player leaves the team they get consistently bashed, even if the leave in a classy way like champ. Kind of like how the talk of art monk not in the hall will bring up such emotion. If art played for the oilers we wouldnt be so emotional about the whole thing.

With that said I would take a shot on a player like Randy Moss, only with a coach like gibbs over santana. And with that being said I will still rock my santana moss probowl and away jersey with pride at the majority of the games next year.

[JonC56]

TO couldn't have been that positive in Philly, they cut him. We'll see how things go in Dallas. I hope he melts down.

They also traded for him and they went to a super bowl. But it's good to know a redskin fan dosen't want a cowboy reciever to have a productive year.

Ill do you one better, I hope they cut him in training camp and he goes to play for the CFL.

[Dishgeek]

An aging star with a large and fragile ego who demands a zillion bucks, or a young, talented, under-used and under-hyped football player?

That's the difference between the Redkins before Gibbs II and the Redkins now.

[JonC56]

IF you were reffering to owens I agree completely.

Randy moss is 28, Santana Moss is 26. Randy's issues were generally more just immuturity, unlike owens where it is purely related to his belief he is underpaid.