Setting the record straight on Campbell

Skeletor · Post by **Skeletor** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 4:29 pm

I have now seen two references suggested the Redskins traded two number one draft picks to get Jason Campbell. What is up with these so-called football experts? Is it that hard to do a little research?

2. Jason Campbell, WSH: Ignore the spin job in Washington: Campbell is their quarterback of the near future. No team, even one as scrambled as the Redskins, invests two first-round picks in a player unless he's going to lead the franchise. Patrick Ramsey will have to win right away to keep his job all season. Considering Joe Gibbs's history with quarterbacks, Campbell is a nice dynasty league pick.
http://msn.foxsports.com/fantasy/story/3682508

SkinsHead56 · Post by **SkinsHead56** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 4:44 pm

Skeletor wrote: Considering Joe Gibbs's history with quarterbacks, Campbell is a nice dynasty league pick.
http://msn.foxsports.com/fantasy/story/3682508

What year? Next year? Considering Gibbs history with QBs he lets the young guy sit on the bench and learn from a seasoned vet, then sticks with the QB through thick & thin.

SKINZ_DOMIN8 · Post by **SKINZ_DOMIN8** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 5:02 pm

Yes, next year. And furthermore, Ramsey is in no way any "seasoned vet." He is more like a wounded chicken.

Ramsey is 80% gone after this upcoming season and then Gibbs can put in HIS choice.

SkinsLaVar · Post by **SkinsLaVar** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 6:22 pm

poor ramsey

Skin Diesel · Post by **Skin Diesel** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 6:46 pm

Skeletor wrote:I have now seen two references suggested the Redskins traded two number one draft picks to get Jason Campbell. What is up with these so-called football experts? Is it that hard to do a little research?

2. Jason Campbell, WSH: Ignore the spin job in Washington: Campbell is their quarterback of the near future. No team, even one as scrambled as the Redskins, invests two first-round picks in a player unless he's going to lead the franchise. Patrick Ramsey will have to win right away to keep his job all season. Considering Joe Gibbs's history with quarterbacks, Campbell is a nice dynasty league pick.
http://msn.foxsports.com/fantasy/story/3682508

The "expert" is saying that the Skins "invested" two first round picks. This is correct; they invested this year's pick when they selected Campbell, as well as next year's, which they traded in order to select him. Selecting a player is the same as investing the pick on the player.

thecoach · Post by **thecoach** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 6:47 pm

Campbell will probably sit the first and second year of his career (be a student like most Gibbs quarterbacks). While Ramsey excells in his second year in Gibbs Gibbs system. Infact, he's perfect for it. Please remember Ramsey has had to learn two drastically different systems and return to his natural self after suffering from a terrible case of shell shock after his second season. He is strong, accurate and tough. The best qualities a quarterback can have. Its amazing how so many people forget what he did at Tulane and how he fared in Steve Spurriers screwed up system (some quarterbacks might have died).This year his protection will be better, as well as the running game. I would bet money on him having a great year baring injury.

thecoach

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 6:57 pm

Skeletor wrote:I have now seen two references suggested the Redskins traded two number one draft picks to get Jason Campbell. What is up with these so-called football experts? Is it that hard to do a little research?

2. Jason Campbell, WSH: Ignore the spin job in Washington: Campbell is their quarterback of the near future. No team, even one as scrambled as the Redskins, invests two first-round picks in a player unless he's going to lead the franchise. Patrick Ramsey will have to win right away to keep his job all season. Considering Joe Gibbs's history with quarterbacks, Campbell is a nice dynasty league pick.
http://msn.foxsports.com/fantasy/story/3682508

We gave Denver our 3rd round pick in 2005 and a 1st and 4th round picks next year, in return we got Denver's 1st this year.

How the press came up with 2 number ones out of that, I don't know.

IMO Gibbs got the QB he wanted, but wasn't going to use a top pick on that QB. If Campbell is the QB of the future then we are lucky we got him because he would not have been available in the 3rd round this year or the 1st next year.

When writing about the Skins it sounds better to say...
The Redskins spend 2 first round picks to draft QB, and now have two first round picks at QB

The truth is...
The Redskins gave 2 second day picks to Denver in order to swap No.1's (05 for 06), this allowed the team to groom the rookie QB while the team is lead by the veteran (on the backend of his rookie contract)

ToxicSkin · Post by **ToxicSkin** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:09 pm

Campbell will play like year after next at the least. Ramsey won't give the staff a reason to start Campbell any sooner (or so I hope.) But I wonder.......have their been any QB's taken in the 1st round that didn't start until their 3rd year(assuming he doesn't start until then)?

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:10 pm

The "expert" is saying that the Skins "invested" two first round picks. This is correct; they invested this year's pick when they selected Campbell, as well as next year's, which they traded in order to select him. Selecting a player is the same as investing the pick on the player.

Fuzzy math...

Unless the Redskins had 2 picks in this years draft BEFORE the trade, it is ONE first round pick invested... the one NEXT year.

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:12 pm

Countertrey wrote:
The "expert" is saying that the Skins "invested" two first round picks. This is correct; they invested this year's pick when they selected Campbell, as well as next year's, which they traded in order to select him. Selecting a player is the same as investing the pick on the player.

Fuzzy math...

Unless the Redskins had 2 picks in this years draft BEFORE the trade, it is ONE first round pick invested... the one NEXT year.

Ding! Ding! Ding! :hail:

We have a winner :lol:

Skeletor · Post by **Skeletor** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:15 pm

The "expert" is saying that the Skins "invested" two first round picks. This is correct; they invested this year's pick when they selected Campbell, as well as next year's, which they traded in order to select him. Selecting a player is the same as investing the pick on the player.

No that is not true. They invested next year's first rounder in Campbell. They invested this year's first rounder for Rogers. Why is this so difficult?

Skeletor · Post by **Skeletor** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:17 pm

Oh wait, I get it now! Joe Gibbs is so brilliant he managed to find a way to use three first round picks in one year! Two for Campbell and one for Rogers. No wonder he's won three super bowls!

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 9:08 pm

Skin Diesel wrote:The "expert" is saying that the Skins "invested" two first round picks. This is correct; they invested this year's pick when they selected Campbell, as well as next year's, which they traded in order to select him. Selecting a player is the same as investing the pick on the player.

Check my Sig
If trading the pick means we invested that pick, what do we get when the pick is used?

SkinsLaVar · Post by **SkinsLaVar** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:39 am

I wonder who will play QB in the Preseason....Is it Ramsey?

I'm kinda curious to see if Campbell will get a few reps in the Presason.....

:-k

BossHog · Post by **BossHog** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:22 am

Skeletor wrote:Oh wait, I get it now! Joe Gibbs is so brilliant he managed to find a way to use three first round picks in one year! Two for Campbell and one for Rogers. No wonder he's won three super bowls!

Your sarcasm is only pointing out even more how little you understand this concept.

look... the Redskins had ONE 1st round draft pick this year... they used it to take Rogers. You understand that much I'm sure. It has NOTHING to do with the conversation.

Now until the trade, the Redskins didn't have another first round pick in 2005 right? So they traded their 2006 first round pick to get another pick in this year's draft (plus two other picks but we'll get to them after)

Then they used that pick to get Campbell.

There's no third first round pick... explain to me where you're getting this THIRD first round pick. Please, I beg of you. Don't use sarcasm or be a jerk, just tell me where this third first round pick that you're talking about comes from.

We got TWO first round picks in 2005 by using our own and ONE of someone else's... and for that ONE of someone else's 1st rounders... we gave up ONE 1st rounder NEXT year.

The end result is actually that we got TWO first round picks and we used 4 picks in total to do it:
2005 1st rounder - our own
2005 3rd rounder - sent to Denver
2006 1st rounder - sent to Danver
2006 fourth rounder - sent to Denver

The only thing to remotely complain about in the trade is giving up the 4th rounder in 2006... it is standard practice to give up at least your 3rd round pick to swap for someone's first rounder when you give up the FOLLOWING year's 1st round pick.

Why is this so difficult?

gay4pacman · Post by **gay4pacman** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:50 am

SkinsLaVar wrote:I wonder who will play QB in the Preseason....Is it Ramsey?

I'm kinda curious to see if Campbell will get a few reps in the Presason.....

Ramsey will start the games but campbell will definetly get some reps. I wonder what kind of poise he will show in his nfl debut? I think he has the tools to be a great quarterback i this league one day. For now this is Ramsey's team and there is no expert who is going to tell me any differently.

Skeletor · Post by **Skeletor** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:26 pm

Boss Hog--

Not sure why you're upset with my post. I'm the one pointing out the inaccuracies here. Let's review

Skeletor wrote:

I have now seen two references suggested the Redskins traded two number one draft picks to get Jason Campbell. What is up with these so-called football experts? Is it that hard to do a little research?

Skin Diesel wrote:

The "expert" is saying that the Skins "invested" two first round picks. This is correct; they invested this year's pick when they selected Campbell, as well as next year's, which they traded in order to select him. Selecting a player is the same as investing the pick on the player.

Skeletor (That's me) wrote in reply:

No that is not true. They invested next year's first rounder in Campbell. They invested this year's first rounder for Rogers. Why is this so difficult?

Then Skeletor wrote again (Still me):

Oh wait, I get it now! Joe Gibbs is so brilliant he managed to find a way to use three first round picks in one year! Two for Campbell and one for Rogers. No wonder he's won three super bowls

Note that this is extreme sarcasm. Clearly I know Gibbs used only two first round picks. I'm am laughing at the people who claim we invested two picks in Campbell.

Then Boss Hog wrote:

Your sarcasm is only pointing out even more how little you understand this concept

.

No, my sarcasm underlines the concept that I understand it perfectly. I was the one that pointed out the error! I'm pointing out that if somebody claims that we used two picks on Campbell that would mean that we had 3 picks. Not trying to be a jerk, just trying to point out how stupid this line of thought is.

I'm hoping you just misunderstood or misread what I wrote.

BossHog · Post by **BossHog** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:34 pm

My apologies Skeletor, i think I did mis-read the post I quoted. :hmm:

But i was merely trying to point out the course of events to those that obviously didn't understand... present company excluded. :oops:

HailSkins94 · Post by **HailSkins94** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 1:37 pm

Does anyone else see the striking similiarities here as were with the Chargers of last year with Brees and the young high draft pick Rivers? Lets hope Ramsey can come through as Brees did, if not he is in a contract year and it could spell the end of him.

Bittersweet situation: Ramsey has a pro bowl type year and demands a big contract which the Skins can't take on. Campbell becomes the QB of 07'

OR: Ramsey has a poor year. Cambell is the QB 07'.

The only way I see the Redskins having Ramsey past this year is if he has a big year and then doesn't demand a big contract. I don't think it looks good personally. Let's hope this turns out for the best I like Pat a lot!

Skeletor · Post by **Skeletor** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 2:32 pm

No worries, Boss Hog!

My smart-a** ways usually get me in trouble!

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 8:04 pm

HailSkins94 wrote:The only way I see the Redskins having Ramsey past this year is if he has a big year and then doesn't demand a big contract. I don't think it looks good personally. Let's hope this turns out for the best I like Pat a lot!

Ramsey is under contract for the 2006 season. Regardless of the kind of year he has this year, Ramsey can't holdout in 2006 because Campbell will have had a year in the system and that would hurt Ramsey's position. I hope he earns his big contract, of course he'll have to prove it's not a fluke next year.

I don't see Ramsey going anywhere after this year. I think Brunell is history before the season next year and that would be a lot of turnover at the QB spot in two years.

I can't say how Ramsey will perform this year or next, but I know what I saw from him in the first Gints game last year and what he looked like against the Vikes was like night and day.
Patrick is coached by Gibbs and Gibbs has a track record with QBs. So I thinking he could have a big year in 2005 and Campbell may not see the field until 2007

HailSkins94 · Post by **HailSkins94** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:00 pm

My bad, I was mistaken. Thought it was after this season.

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:20 pm

HailSkins94 wrote:My bad, I was mistaken. Thought it was after this season.

The best source for Skin's Cap Info

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:29 pm

Why is it that everyone is so eager to make the same mistake with Jason that was made with Patrick? Why rush his development? Why not give him time and allow him to gain some comfort in the system before we throw him to the wolves?

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 11:04 pm

We all (or most of us) think (& hope) that Patrick is going to have a very good (great?) year. He will get the contract he deserves and he will be happy to stay and be our (& Joe's) QB. Jason will be here when we need him, and he will be ready to go because Gibbs is in charge.

This is what we as fans should hope for. The reality is he has to show he has the ability and he will be the QB. I also do not think that IF Patrick does not work out that Joe will rush Jason. Joe will know if he is able to handle the job and that is good enough for me!

Enough doom and gloom! - Patrick and the offense are going to have a great year because the "homer" says so! Besides that "history" points to it too!

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