Philip Buchanon for #9?

SKIN4LIFE · Post by **SKIN4LIFE** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 1:38 pm

I saw in Peter Kings mock draft that the Redskins are looking at trading the #9 pick for Buchanon and a 2nd round pick. He also has us making this trade with Mike Williams still on the board. What do you all think of this. I don't think we can trade this pick for a cornerback that has essentially been a bust since coming into the league. I'm all for getting a second round pick but by doing so I think we should also maintain a first round pick not someone elses first round bust. We've had enough Heath Shuler type of picks (yes I know our picks have been better lately), why take someone elses.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/w ... ith/2.html

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:05 pm

They said Springs would be a bust too...
I know the Greg could turn the two of them into a dynamic duo. One that would make us forget about Smoot and Champ but at what cost? Would it be worth alienating our younger players, not giving them a fair shot? I know you can say that the spot is open but players of the calibur dont come here to be on the bench and they demand a certain money figure. We already have a QB whos not starting making more money then our starter! Lets just build up our own guys for once, please. This would truely frustrate me because we have/had so much talent on rosters and just let it spoil. We dont need him.

I believe offense is the greater problem, and they need all help they can get. I'd like Williams, Edwards, or Clayton.

Skinsfan55 · Post by **Skinsfan55** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:11 pm

I heard that we may trade future picks and then draft Williamson or someone. I'm all for it.

John Manfreda · Post by **John Manfreda** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:11 pm

This isn't going to happen. Guess what the Skins aren't going to draft a corner ethier. Gibbs is playing it up like he wants a corner so people that want recievers don't trade up infront of him. And people who want corners will trade up infront of him so recievers aren't taken. Remember last year when Gibbs played it up like he wanted Winslow and drafted Taylor. No one thought he would pick Taylor. But guess what he did.

skins81 · Post by **skins81** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:20 pm

Peter King wrote:I've been surprised how many people around the league in the last week have talked about Minnesota drafting a running back, like it's some fait accompli. And I'm buying it.

That's because you're a monkey.
He takes a quote from new Vikings O coordinator Loney saying they would put more emphasis on the run and turns that into "the Vikings will draft a RB". The Vikings can't run the ball any less than last year.

Take what he says about the Redskins with a grain of salt.
Peter King. Yea.

ii7-V7 · Post by **ii7-V7** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:32 pm

If this is us getting Buchanon and a second rounder, then I am all for it. I don't think that Buchanon is a bust I just think that he plays for a crappy team! He has the tools to be a shut down corner and I think that Gregg could get it out of him. I like Harris and Wilds, but we need a corner and I think that Buchanon is better than either of those guys. The clincher for me is the second round pick. If we are the ones getting a second rounder then I think that this is a no brainer. Philip B to solve our CB issue and then a WR, and DE in rounds 2 and 3. An MLB, Big Blocking TE, and further depth on both lines in the later rounds. I would definetly call that a success.

Chris, I see your point about letting our young guys play and not birng anyone in from outside, but, guys also get upset when you draft someone in thier position too. So if we were to Go Pac Man or Rolle, then Wilds and Harris would be just as upset.

Chad

fleetus · Post by **fleetus** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:33 pm

Here's a slightly different slant on the Buchanon rumor from ESPN. We wouldn't trade the #9 pick but rather a lower pick and possibly a player. This would allow Gibbs to look at WR's at #9 rather than totally turn his back on defense after losing Smoot and Pierce.

Apr. 18 - Joe Gibbs would like to add another threat on offense. Troy Williamson of South Carolina would be a nice fit with the No. 9 pick, but Gibbs is also concerned about keeping defensive coordinator Gregg Williams equipped. Remember, the Redskins lost cornerback Fred Smoot and middle linebacker Antonio Pierce.
One option being proposed by the Raiders is gaining some interest, according to John Clayton. The Raiders are willing to trade cornerback Phillip Buchanon, an former first-round choice. Buchanon would cost a draft choice and maybe a player, but that trade would give the Redskins the flexibility to take an offensive player at No. 9 or trade down a little in the first round and get an offensive player.

ii7-V7 · Post by **ii7-V7** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:35 pm

fleetus wrote:Here's a slightly different slant on the Buchanon rumor from ESPN. We wouldn't trade the #9 pick but rather a lower pick and possibly a player. This would allow Gibbs to look at WR's at #9 rather than totally turn his back on defense after losing Smoot and Pierce.

Apr. 18 - Joe Gibbs would like to add another threat on offense. Troy Williamson of South Carolina would be a nice fit with the No. 9 pick, but Gibbs is also concerned about keeping defensive coordinator Gregg Williams equipped. Remember, the Redskins lost cornerback Fred Smoot and middle linebacker Antonio Pierce.
One option being proposed by the Raiders is gaining some interest, according to John Clayton. The Raiders are willing to trade cornerback Phillip Buchanon, an former first-round choice. Buchanon would cost a draft choice and maybe a player, but that trade would give the Redskins the flexibility to take an offensive player at No. 9 or trade down a little in the first round and get an offensive player.

Gardner straight up.....or maybe Garnder and a sixth round pick!

Chad

The Hogster · Post by **The Hogster** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:42 pm

I hope that we start grooming our own superstars and solidifying our depth chart, rathern than importing our talent from other teams.

Phillip Buchanon is definitely a good corner, but who is to say that Justin Miller, Carlos Rogers, Adam Jones, or Antrell Rolle will not prove to be much more valuable in the future?

I hope we stay put with the 9, or trade down within the first round and pick up an early 2nd rounder from someone despearate to move up.

Redskins4Life · Post by **Redskins4Life** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:30 pm

I like Buchanon but the notion of passing on Mike Williams for him and a 2nd rounder is not something I wanna do. Like ChadDukes said, Gardner and a 6th, or if we have to, a 4th round pick for Buchanon then I'd do the deal.

REDEEMEDSKIN · Post by **REDEEMEDSKIN** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:24 pm

Isn't Buchanon yet another former hurricane? There's no way Joe accepts that trade, unless, of course, the Skins are planning to move training camp to South Florida.

...in which case....see you at the Beach in 2006!!!!

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:31 pm

chaddukes wrote:If this is us getting Buchanon and a second rounder, then I am all for it. I don't think that Buchanon is a bust I just think that he plays for a crappy team! He has the tools to be a shut down corner and I think that Gregg could get it out of him. I like Harris and Wilds, but we need a corner and I think that Buchanon is better than either of those guys. The clincher for me is the second round pick. If we are the ones getting a second rounder then I think that this is a no brainer. Philip B to solve our CB issue and then a WR, and DE in rounds 2 and 3. An MLB, Big Blocking TE, and further depth on both lines in the later rounds. I would definetly call that a success.

Chris, I see your point about letting our young guys play and not birng anyone in from outside, but, guys also get upset when you draft someone in thier position too. So if we were to Go Pac Man or Rolle, then Wilds and Harris would be just as upset.

Chad

I'm not too hot about getting a CB in the draft either. I want Braylon or Williams. If they aren't available I think I'd like to trade down, garner some more picks and get some jewels hidden in the sofa cushions. We don't need superstars we need guys who get the job done. I learned that we can be very successful with those types of players. Before we've always had a lot of individual guys with oodles of talent. Last year we have a bunch of mediocre guys collectively turn into one mean machine.

Redskins4Life wrote:I like Buchanon but the notion of passing on Mike Williams for him and a 2nd rounder is not something I wanna do. Like ChadDukes said, Gardner and a 6th, or if we have to, a 4th round pick for Buchanon then I'd do the deal.

I'd give up a player and a low pick for Buchanon IF we were in a better cap situation.

ii7-V7 · Post by **ii7-V7** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 5:04 pm

Yeah, the cap situation doesn't help but he is still on his rookie contract so it can't be too horrible...what selection was he overall?

I don't think that we need a first round corner but I belong to the camp that says you can never have enough CB's. We do need a CB, it just doesn't have to be in the first round. But we do need a CB. I'd make this deal. The second round talent in this draft is nearly as good as the first. There isn't the kind of drop off that you get in most years.

Chad

air_hog · Post by **air_hog** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 5:31 pm

Redskins4Life wrote:I like Buchanon but the notion of passing on Mike Williams for him and a 2nd rounder is not something I wanna do. Like ChadDukes said, Gardner and a 6th, or if we have to, a 4th round pick for Buchanon then I'd do the deal.

Mike Williams will not be there at #9. If the Bucs dont take him, the Titans will, and if the Titans dont take him, the Vikings will.

So I am all for Philip and a 2nd rounder for #9.

I mean, Antrell Rolle and Philip Buchannon are like the same player, so if we get Phil and a #2, that would be sweet.

But I bet this rumor is just a RUMOR and it will not happen so we can just get Antrell or Pac Man, which is fine with me.

And I dont like the 2nd rumor about us trading a player (unless its Rod because all of our players have HUGE signing bonus' so we would take a big cap hit)

SkinzCanes · Post by **SkinzCanes** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 6:15 pm

I mean, Antrell Rolle and Philip Buchannon are like the same player, so if we get Phil and a #2, that would be sweet.

Rolle and Buchanon are certainly not the same type of player.

Buchanon:
5'10", 186 pounds, 4.38 second 40

Rolle:
6'0", 201 pounds, 4.49 second 40

These guys are virtually opposite corners, with Rolle using his size and strenght to jam receivers, while Buchanon is much faster. Buchanon can also return punts and has taken 3 back for td's in his 3 year career.

From ESPN:

Cornerback Phillip Buchanon is so frustrated with the way the Oakland Raiders are operating that he wants to be traded.

Buchanon, the Raiders' first-round draft pick in 2002 out of Miami, said he spoke with team personnel chief Michael Lombardi to express his desire to go elsewhere.

"The way I am feeling about the Raiders, I am not happy," Buchanon said Wednesday. "I am just not happy with the organization right now. I am looking forward to a possible trade with somebody else."

Both Lombardi and Buchanon's agent, Terry Williams, declined to comment after learning of Buchanon's statement, made four days before Oakland (5-10) ends another disappointing season at home Sunday against Jacksonville.

This is from last August:

For two seasons Oakland Raiders cornerback Phillip Buchanon has teetered between brilliant and dreadful, often at the same time.

For every big play the former first-round pick made, there were a multitude of inexplicable mistakes balancing the scales.

Now as one of the senior members of Oakland's secondary despite entering just his third NFL season, Buchanon is trying to find a more consistent pattern to his play.

So far, it appears to be working.

Buchanon has received praise almost daily from teammates and coaches alike in Oakland's training camp, where the 5-foot-10, 185-pound cornerback has impressed onlookers with his work in practice.

From Scouts, Inc:

Comment:
Buchanon is a terrific athlete. He has great speed and quickness, he is an aggressive, confident player, he takes a lot of chances, and will gamble, and he has a lot of faith in his abilities. He has excellent ball skills, he has great hips, he is amazingly smooth in his ability to turn and run with receivers without any wasted motion. He breaks on the ball well, he tracks it when it is in the air, he is an outstanding leaper and can go up and get it against bigger and more physical wide receivers. He has the ability, despite his lack of size, to be a bump and run corner because he can simply mirror receiver, and really make it difficult for them to separate. He will struggle at times it the red zone, but his leaping skills keep him in the game. He is not overly physical at the point of attack, he is more of a drag down type tackler. He really gets caught out of position a lot more than he should. For a young player, he is almost at the crossroads of his career because he is not only been somewhat inconsistent, but he has been banged up a lot and has missed a lot of time with nagging injuries.

fleetus · Post by **fleetus** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 6:23 pm

Well, I would bet big money Gibbs is not interested in trading the #9 for Buchanon, even with a 2nd rounder in return. I'd rather trade down. But if we have to use the #9 then take Rolle, Pac-man, Spears or Williamson before trading it for Buchanon. If we Oakland will trade Buchanon for a lower round pick then it may get interesting.

Warmother · Post by **Warmother** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 8:16 pm

As much as I'd like to trade Gardner for Buchanon straight up I don't think it will happen, the Raiders already have Jerry Porter and some guy named Moss.

air_hog · Post by **air_hog** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 8:35 pm

SkinzCanes wrote:Rolle and Buchanon are certainly not the same type of player.

Buchanon:
5'10", 186 pounds, 4.38 second 40

Rolle:
6'0", 201 pounds, 4.49 second 40

These guys are virtually opposite corners, with Rolle using his size and strenght to jam receivers, while Buchanon is much faster. Buchanon can also return punts and has taken 3 back for td's in his 3 year career.

From ESPN:

"The way I am feeling about the Raiders, I am not happy," Buchanon said Wednesday. "I am just not happy with the organization right now. I am looking forward to a possible trade with somebody else."

um... well I uh... I meant Adam Jones 8-[

But I've been thinking about it and I hope we do it mainly for the extra 2nd round pick.

With OAK 2nd rounder (Thirty-Eight) we could get either a
DE-Justin Tuck
WR- Jerome Mathis or Vincent Jackson
ILB- Odell Thurman, but he might play OLB in NFL
TE- maybe Alex Smith

But I just saw this thing on ESPN U on Heath Miller, and I'm starting to like him, yes even at #9...

SkinzCanes · Post by **SkinzCanes** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 8:55 pm

um... well I uh... I meant Adam Jones eusa_shifty.gif

Easy mistake....I go to Miami so I've seen them both play.

Redskins4Life · Post by **Redskins4Life** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 9:11 pm

air_hog wrote:
Redskins4Life wrote:I like Buchanon but the notion of passing on Mike Williams for him and a 2nd rounder is not something I wanna do. Like ChadDukes said, Gardner and a 6th, or if we have to, a 4th round pick for Buchanon then I'd do the deal.

Mike Williams will not be there at #9. If the Bucs dont take him, the Titans will, and if the Titans dont take him, the Vikings will.

So I am all for Philip and a 2nd rounder for #9.

I mean, Antrell Rolle and Philip Buchannon are like the same player, so if we get Phil and a #2, that would be sweet.

But I bet this rumor is just a RUMOR and it will not happen so we can just get Antrell or Pac Man, which is fine with me.

And I dont like the 2nd rumor about us trading a player (unless its Rod because all of our players have HUGE signing bonus' so we would take a big cap hit)

There is a damn good chance Williams will be there at number 9. Contrary to common belief I can guarantee you Tampa Bay will not draft him, instead they'll get Benson/Brown/or Cadillac. Tennessee is probably gonna snag a Cornerback or Alex Barron (LT,Fl.State. That leaves the Vikings who I think will draft a RB because Bennett has injury problems, and Smith and Moore probably arent more than 3rd down backs. Its very conceivable for M.Williams to slip to us at 9, I'm just afraid we might do something stupid like pass him up for a cornerback even though I think Gibbs is probably playing his intention for a CB up as he wants to get an offensive weapon this year.

SkinzCanes · Post by **SkinzCanes** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 9:47 pm

There is a damn good chance Williams will be there at number 9. Contrary to common belief I can guarantee you Tampa Bay will not draft him, instead they'll get Benson/Brown/or Cadillac. Tennessee is probably gonna snag a Cornerback or Alex Barron (LT,Fl.State. That leaves the Vikings who I think will draft a RB because Bennett has injury problems, and Smith and Moore probably arent more than 3rd down backs. Its very conceivable for M.Williams to slip to us at 9, I'm just afraid we might do something stupid like pass him up for a cornerback even though I think Gibbs is probably playing his intention for a CB up as he wants to get an offensive weapon this year.

While I would love to get Williams I don't think it's very likely. It'll be tough for both the Titans and Vikings to pass on him. Also all of the running backs could be gone by the time the Titans and Vikings draft. Miami is supposedly really interested in Browm, Chicago in Benson, and the Bucs are likely going to take the best rb available when they draft. There was also talk today of the Vikings moving up to the first overall pick to draft Edwards, so in a situation like that I can't imagine the Browns letting Williams slip past them.

air_hog · Post by **air_hog** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 10:03 pm

Redskins4Life wrote:There is a damn good chance Williams will be there at number 9. Contrary to common belief I can guarantee you Tampa Bay will not draft him, instead they'll get Benson/Brown/or Cadillac. Tennessee is probably gonna snag a Cornerback or Alex Barron (LT,Fl.State. That leaves the Vikings who I think will draft a RB because Bennett has injury problems, and Smith and Moore probably arent more than 3rd down backs. Its very conceivable for M.Williams to slip to us at 9, I'm just afraid we might do something stupid like pass him up for a cornerback even though I think Gibbs is probably playing his intention for a CB up as he wants to get an offensive weapon this year.

Well if a miracle happens and Mike Williams is there, I bet we wouldnt even hesitate towards taking him.

A true #1 WR is our only glarring need on offense (i mean sure we could use a TE and depth on the o-line but those can be addressed later) and I see Mike as a definant #1 WR.

hkHog · Post by **hkHog** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 1:04 am

Redskins4Life wrote:I think Gibbs is probably playing his intention for a CB up as he wants to get an offensive weapon this year.

You could definately be right there. I remember last year after drafting Taylor Gibbs said that he had let Gregg Williams have his fun but next year he wanted to use the pick for his offense. It was just a silly joke but I think there's something behind that. I would also say that with our current roster even since losing Pierce and Smoot our D is still a lot better than our offense. We had so many injuries last year and our D was still great, those two losses are not going to make a HUGE difference. However, there is a lot of improvement that can be done offensively.

Beast of the East · Post by **Beast of the East** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 7:22 am

hello everyone i am new to the board, and i have a take on this. i believe this would be a no-brainer considering Springs does have a history of injuries. we got by last year but he is a year older and he played very physical last year. Buccannon brings the ability to blitz and an arrogant attitude that should fit in nicely with our defensive scheme. he is also a team player and a hard worker. there is no sure way we will know if pacman or rolle will still be there and i am not convinced pacman would fit into our system..sure he has speed but trying to blitz a 5'8-5'9 corner who is a little lite in the ass would be asking for trouble. take the trade and use the 2nd round pic on a reciever or DE..lets not forget that 2nd round pick would be a fairly high pick...............

skinz74 · Post by **skinz74** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 8:10 am

What is the possibility of Heath Miller dropping to what would be Oaklands' second round pick...??? If so, I wouldn't mind taking the trade. In essence, we pick up a veteran corner, and a great TE prospect. We have two burners in Moss and Patton... Cool

ey and Miller could spread the middle (not to mention additional blocking for Portis.) Just a thought.