What does Moss bring to the table?

VASkin27 · Post by **VASkin27** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 3:55 pm

I'm going to be honest, I don't know too much about Santana. I realize that he is a scatty reciever just like Coles with kick returning skills, but other than that what does he bring to the table? Does he open any doors that LColes didn't?

SirSmizzy · Post by **SirSmizzy** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 3:57 pm

He's healthier and younger and cheaper & faster....but Coles is a better football player.

4bz · Post by **4bz** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 3:59 pm

As somebody said it before. "Moss wants to be here, Coles doesn't!" That's plenty enough for me.

JPM36 · Post by **JPM36** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:05 pm

10 good toes?

ATV · Post by **ATV** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:14 pm

I guess I'm a little surprised that you're not familiar with this guy. Santana has been around for quite a while. His music is largely a soft rock, and now mainstream pop, infused with unique Latin American guitar strokes. While once restricted to the airwaves on Classic Rock stations, you can now hear his music on your typical Britney Spears stations and on the overhead at your local Wal-Mart.

Jake · Post by **Jake** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:14 pm

SirSmizzy wrote:He's healthier and younger and cheaper & faster

All of the above and he has the ability to field punts and kickoffs.

JPM36 wrote:10 good toes?

Hopefully.

SirSmizzy · Post by **SirSmizzy** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:23 pm

Jake wrote:
SirSmizzy wrote:He's healthier and younger and cheaper & faster

All of the above and he has the ability to field punts and kickoffs.

JPM36 wrote:10 good toes?

Hopefully.

He won't touch a kickoff,he will return punt....35 yards west and 3 yards north.

Jake · Post by **Jake** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:27 pm

SirSmizzy wrote:35 yards west and 3 yards north.

Reminds me of a running back I played with a few years ago. :lol:

SirSmizzy · Post by **SirSmizzy** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:28 pm

Jake wrote:
SirSmizzy wrote:35 yards west and 3 yards north.

Reminds me of a running back I played with a few years ago.

Pop Warner??

Fios · Post by **Fios** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:30 pm

The Jets have to get a kick returner now though. They lost Santana's huge skill level on returns.

YoungJetsFan wrote this,he's a smart kid and i think this is dead on.Just wanted to share it.

Smizzy, you aren't being consistent here.

Jake · Post by **Jake** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:30 pm

SirSmizzy wrote:
Jake wrote:
SirSmizzy wrote:35 yards west and 3 yards north.

Reminds me of a running back I played with a few years ago.
Pop Warner??

Yup. He didn't seem to like running forward when he got the ball but he wasn't too bad when he did.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:35 pm

I just posted this in the "other" Moss thread but I'll say it again here.

I think Joe will get more out of Moss than the Jets offensive gurus did!

I also think it is a bad mistake to think that Coles is going to be anywhere near what he used to be with the Jets.

I think this is a good trade for both teams because we got a player who wants to play here and the Jets got a guy who thinks he wants to play there.

We got a healthy player and they got a player who thinks he's healthy.

Skinsfan55 · Post by **Skinsfan55** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:47 pm

Scouting Report-

Moss explodes out of cuts, runs precise routes and excels at generating separation working against man coverage. Changes directions without losing much speed in transition, shows effective double moves and will occasionally turns defensive backs around. Has the elusiveness to make multiple defenders miss and is a threat to make something happen every time touches the ball. Shows great body control and can adjust to the ball while it's in the air. Catches the ball with hands away from frame, can catch the ball at its highest point and will make some acrobatic receptions. Moss generally uses his quick feet and rare agility to avoid the jam at the line but he lacks prototypical size, he lacks the upper body strength to beat the jam when a corner gets into his frame and bigger corners will have some success muscling him out of his routes. Lacks bulk, doesn't show great power at the point of attack and offers little as a blocker though gives good effort. He is a marginal No. 1 and an excellent No. 2.

He makes the most out of his 5'10 185 pounds, he's all effort and as fast as an olympic sprinter!

This is a great move, I think we're upgrading AND saving money! How much better does it get?

Now all we need is a big guy to play on the other side of the field... Mike Williams anyone?

SirSmizzy · Post by **SirSmizzy** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 5:06 pm

SkinsJock wrote:I just posted this in the "other" Moss thread but I'll say it again here.

I think Joe will get more out of Moss than the Jets offensive gurus did!

I also think it is a bad mistake to think that Coles is going to be anywhere near what he used to be with the Jets.

I think this is a good trade for both teams because we got a player who wants to play here and the Jets got a guy who thinks he wants to play there.

We got a healthy player and they got a player who thinks he's healthy.

You're a glass half full kinda guy i see.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 5:16 pm

I don't know the specifics of this deal, but I guess this isnt too bad. I didn't want Coles here if he wasn't 100% Regardless if Coles is the better player when he's 100% that doesn't apply now.

We picked up a slot WR, and #2 in Moss and we still have Thrash, Jacobs and McCants....

No one their is an easy choice as a #1 WR, which makes me wonder if we'll be drafting one. O and Gardener is still here.

skinsfan#33 · Post by **skinsfan#33** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 5:43 pm

SirSmizzy wrote:He's healthier and younger and cheaper & faster....but Coles is a better football player.

He runs faster than a 4.19 40 (Cole's time), he isn't fatser, thougher, or better in ANY way.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 5:44 pm

skinsfan#33 wrote:
SirSmizzy wrote:He's healthier and younger and cheaper & faster....but Coles is a better football player.

He runs faster than a 4.19 40 (Cole's time), he isn't fatser, thougher, or better in ANY way.

Except in the fact he wants to be hear... I dont like the trade either but Coles had to go.

skinsfan#33 · Post by **skinsfan#33** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 5:46 pm

Chris Luva Luva wrote:
skinsfan#33 wrote:
SirSmizzy wrote:He's healthier and younger and cheaper & faster....but Coles is a better football player.

He runs faster than a 4.19 40 (Cole's time), he isn't fatser, thougher, or better in ANY way.

Except in the fact he wants to be hear... I dont like the trade either but Coles had to go.

That is fine, but we should have gotten close to equal value AND WE DIDN'T!

Fios · Post by **Fios** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 5:55 pm

To those of you ripping this trade: I'm curious as to what you would have done given the situtation with Coles. You have a player who has made it clear he does not want to play for you. That same player has a medicial condition which your team doctors say requires a surgical procedure which the player refuses to undergo.
You are left with no choice but to trade that player. OK, you'll argue, but the Redskins didn't get maximum value for Coles. Are you aware of some better offer? Do you honestly believe that some team was willing to part with a receiver of Moss' caliber and a first round pick and the Skins said "no thanks, we'll take the lesser deal"?
Yes, Moss is a downgrade at wideout. But I will take a cheaper player who wants to be a Redskin over a very well compensated player who values his individual statistics more than anything else.

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 7:23 pm

I think Fios is saying he's down with it because he has to be. We all have to be.
It's a sound philosophy.

lamont_jordan_rules · Post by **lamont_jordan_rules** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 7:26 pm

... santana will be a very solid receiver for you guys ... his size would be the only thing towards the negative side ... it definitely causes him to make some self-preservation decisions as a wr & pr ... both coles(healthy) & tana have sprinter speed ... he has good hands & will make most catches in his vicinity ... ramsey just better not hang him out to dry over the middle or with a cb/s coming right at him ... in those situations he is going to choose to protect himself...

... he will give you some nice returns & he is at the top of the league as far as returners, ... but ... he will frustrate you with the large amount of his east/west yardage ... was morton returning punts last season for you ? i guess it comes down to who was returning previously & how does he compare to tana as far as how the skins faithful will feel about him in the return game...

l_j_r

truskinsfan18 · Post by **truskinsfan18** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 8:49 pm

I kinda liked antonio brown idk about you guys

skinsfan#33 · Post by **skinsfan#33** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 9:41 pm

Fios wrote:To those of you ripping this trade: I'm curious as to what you would have done given the situtation with Coles. You have a player who has made it clear he does not want to play for you. That same player has a medicial condition which your team doctors say requires a surgical procedure which the player refuses to undergo.
You are left with no choice but to trade that player. OK, you'll argue, but the Redskins didn't get maximum value for Coles. Are you aware of some better offer? Do you honestly believe that some team was willing to part with a receiver of Moss' caliber and a first round pick and the Skins said "no thanks, we'll take the lesser deal"?
Yes, Moss is a downgrade at wideout. But I will take a cheaper player who wants to be a Redskin over a very well compensated player who values his individual statistics more than anything else.

I would have kept Coles and made him play or docked him his pay if he didn't play. Either way we wouldn't be out $9,000,000 this year and we might have been able to replace him. Personnal I think Coles would have played and caught another 80 or 90 balls, either way once Mar 2 passed and we were going to have to soak up the entire $9M this year if we moved him, I wouldn't have moved him. We took a big step down at WR and got hit with $9M for someone that is no longer here.
Did he give any of his money back? If not he is a THIEF!

DiRTyHoG3026 · Post by **DiRTyHoG3026** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 10:49 pm

I think that Moss and Coles are very much alike. But what seperates Moss from Coles is that he brings the ability to make defenders miss.

Hogfather · Post by **Hogfather** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 10:56 pm

SirSmizzy wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:I just posted this in the "other" Moss thread but I'll say it again here.

I think Joe will get more out of Moss than the Jets offensive gurus did!

I also think it is a bad mistake to think that Coles is going to be anywhere near what he used to be with the Jets.

I think this is a good trade for both teams because we got a player who wants to play here and the Jets got a guy who thinks he wants to play there.

We got a healthy player and they got a player who thinks he's healthy.

You're a glass half full kinda guy i see.

I guess I'm a glass half full kind of guy too because I agree with Skinsjock. You'll always get more out of a guy who wants to play for you verses the guy who doesn't.