The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Bleacher Report has raised the question ...

"The Washington Redskins went 4-12 in 2014 and missed the playoffs.
Do the Redskins need to make the playoffs in 2015 for head coach Jay Gruden to keep his job?
Watch as Stephen Nelson and Bleacher Report NFL Analyst Matt Bowen discuss Gruden's job security in the video ... "

PLAYOFFS?

now I know it's only a question and everyone's goal is to "make the playoffs" but IMO, Gruden just has to show he's a capable HC
he does not really have a chance at getting a 4 win franchise into the playoffs this season

he's just like a lot of players and coaches here - they need to show a lot of improvement to keep their jobs

I think asking Gruden to make the playoffs is an absurd suggestion. I also think Gruden isn't the only guy in the barrel Scott M. should be measured also. Scot M has made a number of FA and draft choices to improve the team we need to see some favorable early returns this fall from his decisions its not all on Gruden.

I don't know about the rest of you guys but all I want this fall is improvement. In order of importance I want to see some improvement in each of these areas:

1. Some defensive improvement. We won 4 games last year and had to score an enormous amount of points to win a game. More than anything we need to play better defense. Lots of room for improvement we need to do better this year. SM made some moves I'd like to see evidence his choices are working out.

2. Better running game. I hope we see better blocking and a better rushing game this fall

3. A QB under center who can competently run Gruden's WCO. We don't have a Brady, Manning or Rogers on the roster I don't expect that level of play or anything like that level of play. All I hope to see is a QB who looks like he knows what he is suppose to do and has some capacity to do it. Someone who well enough to audible when needed, change the protections before the snap, drop to the right depth, make the correct read and throw a decent pass to one of our guys. He doesn't have to even be in the top half of the QB stats but I need to see that our QB knows what is doing and shows some aptitude this year. They all have been in the league 4+ years and it is their second year in the offense, one of them must know how to be at least mediocre this year. Mediocre isn't too much to ask is it? I don't want to see the RO *sh$t* I want Griffin to execute the WCO or take a seat and let McCoy or Cousins play. I want to see someone behind center who can execute Jay's offense not try to steal a win with a high school offense in the NFL.

If we see some progress on 1-3, some good early returns on Scot's FA & draft picks and 6 wins I'll be happy. Just a couple of more wins would be encouraging for me provided we get the wins with a sustainable offense I don't want RO *sh$t* wins because that isn't sustainable.

personally, I feel Scott is on less of a hot seat than Gruden - I do agree that we need to see that Scott did do a good job in who he and the FO added but they really have a lot of work to do and cannot add the players in 1 draft and 1 free agency period - this will take time

Jay Gruden needs to really step up and show that last season was an aberration ...

actually I have more faith in Griffin showing that he's a good NFL QB than Gruden showing that he's a good NFL HC - both have the talent and the ability but Gruden has a little more pressure on him - Scott did not hire Gruden and Scott works for an owner that really likes Griffin

the best thing for this franchise is for Griffin to show that he can be a really good QB

it would be good if Gruden can be the HC but if Griffin shows he's going to be a really good NFL QB and Gruden does not do a good job as a HC, Scott will bring in another HC

and if Gruden cannot make it look like 1 of these QBs is going to be a really good QB he's not going to be here anyway

the playoffs are a dream but the real pressure is on this coaching staff to show improvement

Gruden isnt on the hot seat really this year or next unless he really messes up and the team regresses, or Scot just sees something he doesnt like. I know Scot didnt hire him, but he seems like Scots kind of coach, young, smart, lots of energy, and likes to speak the un-edited truth.

SJ not sure why youve been relatively down on Gruden, I like him a ton. I think hes better than anyone we have had in a while... plus a good GM can help groom a good coach that has the ability by giving him good players, and good direction and support.

When it comes to playoffs.... the skins arent as far off as either of you may think. While I think setting it as an expectation is far fetched... when you look at how bad our defense was, it would take a top 3 calibre offense to make up for it. With a top 1/2 defense and offense (which I think we have IF Robert can play decent, and if our new secondary can hold) then a playoff birth is very possible in the always tight NFC East.

Snyder runs the club so we get whatever he decides but I don't agree with SJ that Gruden should be under more scrutiny than SM. In 2013 the Skins were 3-13 last year they were 4-12 a modest improvement.

OldSchool wrote:I don't want RO *sh$t* wins

Dude, a win is a win. I don't care how we do it, I just want the W.

I think Gruden wanted to be the HC but was not aware of how dysfunctional things were here - I'm sure that given time and with Scott and the FO bringing in players to suit the plan, he can be a good NFL HC

It was not entirely his fault last season but he did not handle his first year here as well as he could

I'm encouraged that Snyder seems to be staying away from things - these guys will be given more than this season to turn things around

everyone is under scrutiny & needs to show improvement but Scott has already shown that he's going to be in charge here for a while

just gotta love that some here can convince themselves that we're close to being a playoff team

Deadskins wrote:

OldSchool wrote:I don't want RO *sh$t* wins

Dude, a win is a win. I don't care how we do it, I just want the W.

exactly - Gruden needs to find a way for the offense to work and it does not have to be WCO or anything specific - we just need to see coaches come up with a game plan that takes advantage of the players they have

trying to make players execute stuff on defense or offense that they are not suited to is why this franchise is in this mess

Scott has started to assemble a new roster, it will take time but it's now up to the coaches to maximize what they get from what they've got

I don't expect much because of the coaches. They are all new to each other, new to their positions and responsibilities. These isn't an 'old pro' that somebody can hang their hat on, it is OJT and if the players don't figure it out for themselves and win some games the media will have a field day. It'll be a 'what were they thinking' kind of media blitz.
Don't get me wrong, they must be talented guys to get where they are and if they have a little luck they'll make it thru the season. But if things go a little sideways there isn't any experience and cohesion to correct it, look at Lovie in Tampa Bay.

Clearly everybody gets measured on their performance every year. I don't personally think Gruden's seat is that hot, and we just hired Scot what, six months ago?

I'm pretty sure I'm on the same page as you, SJ, when it comes to Gruden though. He has to show us more this year. Good coaches are revealed by how they respond in tough games and situations. Gruden frequently looked last year like he had no answers. Gotta be better than that.

Did somebody really complain about not wanting to win via the read option? Tell that to Seattle and Russell Wilson. He's the best read option QB in the game right now. I wouldn't be complaining about any of those wins if I were a Seattle fan.

the offense here will be helped by having a QB play well - hell, the whole offense (coaching and players) needs to show improvement

to your point, Scott has not been here long but he's made a bit of a difference already and I'm sure that he'll make the FO better and given time will also find a way to have the players he feels suit each other and what we want to accomplish here

I really do think that Gruden can do a better job than he showed last season and let's face it he has to, as does everyone else here

Snyder will give these guys a little time but if he doesn't see a much improved group, he's likely to do anything - he's a loose cannon

I'd love to have a playoff run, I just think it's going to take a little time to see an effective O line back in play here

I'm old fashioned and believe that everything starts with the 'big' guys on both lines and having quality depth along both lines

I expect MAJOR improvements this year. The hiring of Callahan was huge for this organization. He's the best O line coach this team has had since Joe Bugel. That alone along with the drafting of Scheriff, Kuandjo, and Long and Moses from last season should mean our O-line improves a lot this season. That was a major problem for us. I also like all of the signings on the defensive side of the ball. I think those signing as well as Haslett getting canned will improve that side of the ball. with some improvement out of RGIII, I don't think 8-8 is out of the question.

I agree that wins are important but I really am tired of not seeing this franchise play with much emotion

We need to change the attitude here and find a way to win - we seem to have lost that

Scot McCloughan has to take control and make things happen so that Snyder does not get involved again - he's clueless about this

8-8 would be fine but it would be even better if we found we had a good NFL QB to build around

SkinsJock wrote:to your point, Scott has not been here long but he's made a bit of a difference already and I'm sure that he'll make the FO better and given time will also find a way to have the players he feels suit each other and what we want to accomplish here

It definitely looks that way. My point was really that it would be kind of crazy to be judging the GM without giving him a couple years. (Not that we're incapable of that type of insanity.)

SkinsJock wrote:I really do think that Gruden can do a better job than he showed last season

I do too. I think one issue was that he was a little naive about DC. This isn't Cincinnati. He needs to be smarter about what he says publicly.

I will say Gruden is on the hot seat a little bit with the defense. He was responsible for the Joe Barry hire. If the defense isn't improved this year, that's definitely going to reflect on him.

PAPDOG67 wrote:I expect MAJOR improvements this year. The hiring of Callahan was huge for this organization. He's the best O line coach this team has had since Joe Bugel. That alone along with the drafting of Scheriff, Kuandjo, and Long and Moses from last season should mean our O-line improves a lot this season. That was a major problem for us. I also like all of the signings on the defensive side of the ball. I think those signing as well as Haslett getting canned will improve that side of the ball. with some improvement out of RGIII, I don't think 8-8 is out of the question.

I agree with you, in theory. The problem is that O-lines need time to gel. It can often take a season+ for guys to get used to playing together and form an effective unit. That said, I think we are starting to get some of the pieces in place to have a good group in the future.

We’ve already had this discussion…as I argued IMO Gruden will have to play meaningful games in December! If you were at FedEx late in the season (highlighted by 30k screaming Boys fans) you understand why Gruden need to win this season. Add to that a new GM who didn’t hire this coach.

I think a bunch of you guys are climbing on the Heartache Express with talk of playoffs or even an 8-8 year. Snyder is a genius at a marketing but a knucklehead with managing the football part of things and I hope he has more sense than the views expressed here. The Skins are a poor team with a serious talent deficit in my opinion in part because they gave so many high draft choices for Griffin and Mcnabb before that and the salary cap fiasco plus we are clearly going through a change of direction in OL blocking schemes. For a lot reasons the Skins don't have the talent to play .500 or better ball and expecting that is foolish in my opinion. I hope Snyder and the others will be happy if the see quiet improvement from the defensive an improved running game and someone under center who can execute an NFL WCO not a high school gimmick offense.

We got 3 wins in 2013, 4 wins in 2014 I hope we improve and make each game tighter and win 6 this year. If the new guys workout, the units show improvement and we have mediocre QB out of a guy running Gruden's WCO I will be happy. A 6-10 year with improvements across the units would be something substantial to build on and they could upgrade further and aim for 8-8 the following year.

OldSchool wrote:We got 3 wins in 2013, 4 wins in 2014 I hope we improve and make each game tighter and win 6 this year. If the new guys workout, the units show improvement and we have mediocre QB out of a guy running Gruden's WCO I will be happy. A 6-10 year with improvements across the units would be something substantial to build on and they could upgrade further and aim for 8-8 the following year.

I wouldn't say I'm "hoping" for this result, but your expectations seem realistic and reasonable.

I'm not going to worry much about W/L for the time being. What I'm really hoping for is to have a team that is worth our time to watch every week.

The only measuring stick for HCs is wins and losses - that said, I agree with the thought that we really need to see improved play and better coaching - it's unfortunate that wins and losses mean so much

I also think that Scot will get time to make things better, but I doubt he get's much time if the play on the field does not translate into wins

the biggest hurdle is at the QB position - if that works out everyone's job is a lot easier

OldSchool wrote:I think a bunch of you guys are climbing on the Heartache Express with talk of playoffs or even an 8-8 year. Snyder is a genius at a marketing but a knucklehead with managing the football part of things and I hope he has more sense than the views expressed here. The Skins are a poor team with a serious talent deficit in my opinion in part because they gave so many high draft choices for Griffin and Mcnabb before that and the salary cap fiasco plus we are clearly going through a change of direction in OL blocking schemes. For a lot reasons the Skins don't have the talent to play .500 or better ball and expecting that is foolish in my opinion. I hope Snyder and the others will be happy if the see quiet improvement from the defensive an improved running game and someone under center who can execute an NFL WCO not a high school gimmick offense.

We got 3 wins in 2013, 4 wins in 2014 I hope we improve and make each game tighter and win 6 this year. If the new guys workout, the units show improvement and we have mediocre QB out of a guy running Gruden's WCO I will be happy. A 6-10 year with improvements across the units would be something substantial to build on and they could upgrade further and aim for 8-8 the following year.

I think there is just a dictinct difference between what you can expect and what is realistically possible.

Look at 2014 there were 3 games we lost by less than 1 score, so even a little better performance in those games means a 7-9 record. Then 3 more games we had over 40 points scored on us, those games cant be blamed on the offense.

In 2013 we lost 7 games by 1 score or less (8 if you wanna say 8 pts is 1 score) so that means a little better performance in those games makes us 10-6 or 11-5.

Tryn that common sense on the senseless again I see... gl w that!

SkinsJock wrote:The only measuring stick for HCs is wins and losses - that said, I agree with the thought that we really need to see improved play and better coaching - it's unfortunate that wins and losses mean so much

I take your point, man. As much as I've said I just wanted to see a competitive team, when we get into these 37-34 shootouts with the Eagles I know it will be crushing me if we don't end up with the W.

Have a good weekend all --

riggofan wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:The only measuring stick for HCs is wins and losses - that said, I agree with the thought that we really need to see improved play and better coaching - it's unfortunate that wins and losses mean so much

I take your point, man. As much as I've said I just wanted to see a competitive team, when we get into these 37-34 shootouts with the Eagles I know it will be crushing me if we don't end up with the W.

Have a good weekend all --

The difference between a mediocre team & a good team is that good teams win the close 1's. Of course for us, mediocrity would be a step up.

^^ what he said ... actually that's true - we have not been a consistently good team for some time - I know the win loss record of 2012 would seem to refute that, but you know what, we found a way to win in 2012 - good, even mediocre teams do that all the time - we do not

this franchise has a way to go and to imply that we're going to be close this season after the last 2 is not a fact - that is a biased fan's opinion

we might get lucky and find a way to win the close games and that's OK - I'm looking for the franchise to do that consistently

I think that Scot can help elevate this franchise but he needs more time than just 1 draft

My expectations & hopes for this season are simply that Griffin shows that he's a good NFL QB and that Gruden can show that he's a good HC

I'd love for the team to have a good win loss record but more important than that is to see marked progress on the field which we can build on

SkinsJock wrote:My expectations & hopes for this season are simply that Griffin shows that he's a good NFL QB and that Gruden can show that he's a good HC

I'd love for the team to have a good win loss record but more important than that is to see marked progress on the field which we can build on

Very reasonable, and certainly achievable. From your keyboard to God's inbox.