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How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Tue May 19, 2015 6:57 pm
by Prowl33
Curious of everyones thoughts on how this may play out? Murphy played good last year in replacing orakpo, hes not as good of an edge rusher (he did say he has been working a ton on his strength and explosiveness this offseaso but he plays the run and the pass well.
Then we got Preston Smith, who is a monster of a man, and can penetrate with ease, not your traditional around the edge rusher though. Good at stopping the run, has some work to do defending the pass.
So does 1 win the job and 1 is a backup? Use one on certain downs or packages and the other in different ones? Or is there another solution?
I think we take Riley out, and we interchangeably use Murphy and Smith in eithee inside spot, and maybe either outside spot if Kerrigan can be effective on the right. Then Smith could be coming from any of the 4 lb positions, kerrigan could be coming from either OLB spot, and Murphy could be in any 4 spots. In the 4-3 sets you could put Smith in any of the front 7 positions, kerrigan on either DE or OLB spot, and Murphy in any 3 LB positions.
If they can work interchangably it would really make it impossible for defenses to plan for pass coverage inside, and to predict where the pass rush is coming from, and may be more of an overall advantage than say having a Beasley who just rushes the right side.
Opinions?
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Tue May 19, 2015 9:09 pm
by yupchagee
Prowl33 wrote:Curious of everyones thoughts on how this may play out? Murphy played good last year in replacing orakpo, hes not as good of an edge rusher (he did say he has been working a ton on his strength and explosiveness this offseaso but he plays the run and the pass well.
Then we got Preston Smith, who is a monster of a man, and can penetrate with ease, not your traditional around the edge rusher though. Good at stopping the run, has some work to do defending the pass.
So does 1 win the job and 1 is a backup? Use one on certain downs or packages and the other in different ones? Or is there another solution?
I think we take Riley out, and we interchangeably use Murphy and Smith in eithee inside spot, and maybe either outside spot if Kerrigan can be effective on the right. Then Smith could be coming from any of the 4 lb positions, kerrigan could be coming from either OLB spot, and Murphy could be in any 4 spots. In the 4-3 sets you could put Smith in any of the front 7 positions, kerrigan on either DE or OLB spot, and Murphy in any 3 LB positions.
If they can work interchangably it would really make it impossible for defenses to plan for pass coverage inside, and to predict where the pass rush is coming from, and may be more of an overall advantage than say having a Beasley who just rushes the right side.
Opinions?
Depends on how they do from now till the season starts. Who ever plays best will play the most.
Don't be so quick to write off Riley. Granted he's coming off a down year, but I expect him to contribute.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Tue May 19, 2015 9:23 pm
by Prowl33
Im not as down on him as some. I do think that if Smith beats out Murphy, that Murphy could actuall be moved inside and perform much better. Riley I think would be good to sub in for murphy and robinson to keep them fresh.
My main thing is that if Smith wins, which he likely will, it would be a shame to have a talent like Murphy keep the bench warm for a majority of games.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Wed May 20, 2015 6:18 pm
by oj
I don't see Riley as part of this equation. Murphy has won the starting job, I don't see Smith challenging him. Smith has got a lot to learn, give him some time.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Wed May 20, 2015 7:59 pm
by yupchagee
oj wrote:I don't see Riley as part of this equation. Murphy has won the starting job, I don't see Smith challenging him. Smith has got a lot to learn, give him some time.
I think Riley will be part of things. Don't write him off after 1 bad year. Murphy hasn't won anything yet. If the season started today, he would be the starter, but the job will be won between now & Sept. They didn't pick Smith in the 2nd round for him to ride the pines.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Wed May 20, 2015 10:25 pm
by Countertrey
I have a feeling that we are going to be very surprised by a very competitive corps of linebackers through training camp... I have a feeling that there is depth that we are not yet aware of in what I have a feeling is a very rich rookie crop... including an inside LB who (reportedly) once knocked out 3 team mates during ONE practice (oops).
I said it's a feeling... you know...
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Wed May 20, 2015 11:00 pm
by brad7686
I could see Spaight taking Riley's job, I don't think Trent Murpy, who was a Defensive End in college and a somewhat underwhelming OLB last year, can just switch to be a starting MLB like that. I do personally think that Murphy and Smith will battle it out and the loser will be relegated to extra blitzer on 3rd down status.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 8:56 am
by Deadskins
Countertrey wrote:I have a feeling that we are going to be very surprised by a very competitive corps of linebackers through training camp... I have a feeling that there is depth that we are not yet aware of in what I have a feeling is a very rich rookie crop... including an inside LB who (reportedly) once knocked out 3 team mates during practice (oops).
I said it's a feeling... you know...
Sing it, CT!
Feelings! Nothing more than feelings.
...
Feelings! Whoa whoa whoa, feelings!
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 9:11 am
by Prowl33
We have the raw talent and scheme to have one of the best front 7's in football at this point.
Now the question is can the coaching staff utilize it, and can the secondary hold.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 9:15 am
by oj
yupchagee wrote:oj wrote:I don't see Riley as part of this equation. Murphy has won the starting job, I don't see Smith challenging him. Smith has got a lot to learn, give him some time.
I think Riley will be part of things. Don't write him off after 1 bad year. Murphy hasn't won anything yet. If the season started today, he would be the starter, but the job will be won between now & Sept. They didn't pick Smith in the 2nd round for him to ride the pines.
I didn't mean Riley is out after a bad year, I meant he wasn't part of the Murphy/Smith equation. And you're right, Murphy isn't the named starter. I think he has the lead position for the job and it is fair to say the position is his to lose.
Riley took a beating on converage last year, there was lots of bad coverage on his side of the field. What Amerson was doing kinda dictated what Riley did.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 12:23 pm
by markshark84
oj wrote:I don't see Riley as part of this equation. Murphy has won the starting job, I don't see Smith challenging him. Smith has got a lot to learn, give him some time.
Not sure about this one.....
Riley will be part of the LB corps. He has had 3 solid years in DC. How much? Who knows. We have good depth with Riley, Robinson, Kerrigan, Preston, and Murphy along with potential depth in Spaight and other rookies.
I am not sure Murphy "won" the starting job. Orakpo got hurt. He "won" the replacement job by default. Smith is a HIGH 2nd round pick. "Giving him some time" doesn't apply to guys taken in rds 1 and 2. A second rounder should be considered an immediate starter or someone challenging for it.
I see MLBs in 3-4 to be more speed type guys that can also play the run (which Murphy can) but more imporantly be all over the field (which I don't see in Murphy). That being said, we play a ton of nickel so I would think both will get some time and their performance on the field will determine their roles moving forward.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 1:56 pm
by oj
markshark84 wrote:oj wrote:I don't see Riley as part of this equation. Murphy has won the starting job, I don't see Smith challenging him. Smith has got a lot to learn, give him some time.
Not sure about this one.....
Riley will be part of the LB corps. He has had 3 solid years in DC. How much? Who knows. We have good depth with Riley, Robinson, Kerrigan, Preston, and Murphy along with potential depth in Spaight and other rookies.
I am not sure Murphy "won" the starting job. Orakpo got hurt. He "won" the replacement job by default.
Smith is a HIGH 2nd round pick. "Giving him some time" doesn't apply to guys taken in rds 1 and 2. A second rounder should be considered an immediate starter or someone challenging for it. I see MLBs in 3-4 to be more speed type guys that can also play the run (which Murphy can) but more imporantly be all over the field (which I don't see in Murphy). That being said, we play a ton of nickel so I would think both will get some time and their performance on the field will determine their roles moving forward.
I'd agree if we were speaking about a running back or a receiver but Linebacker? That is a position of crafty subtlities, they don't learn that in college. I'm conservative, teach the man and put him in when he is ready to dominate.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2015 7:45 pm
by fredp45
I can see Murphy and Smith both playing a bunch this year...maybe platooning at OLB and maybe both playing on obvious passing downs. Murphy is very tough against the run and not bad in pass coverage...not convinced Smith is ready Day 1 to stand up and cover TEs and RBs. He could be a good pass rusher next to Hatcher though. On passing downs, it might be Kerrigan, Paea, Hatcher, Smith and Murphy.
Remember, Murphy was a second round pick too. Hearing a lot of good stuff about him getting stronger and quicker too.
Spaight will be a special teams guy ONLY this year. He is not capable of covering anyone at this point. Riley and Robinson will start at ILB.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2015 8:08 pm
by DarthMonk
Strengths:
Productive pass-rusher
Repertoire of moves
Shedding blocks
Active hands
Instincts
Consistently makes splash plays
Enough speed to rush off the edge
Can to sink his hips/shoulder
Excellent motor
Closing speed
Pursuit skills
Makes plays in and out of his gap
Excellent fit for a 3-4 defense
Quality run-defender
Fights, holds his ground
Intelligent
Hard worker
Experienced
Good character
Intangibles
Weaknesses:
Lacks speed
Lacks explosion
Not big enough to fit at defensive end in a 4-3
Will need to add weight to play end in a 4-3 defense
Summary: Murphy was one of the leaders of Stanford's tough defense over the past three seasons. He was a dangerous pass-rusher off the edge and a physical defender who set the tone for the Cardinal's front seven. In those three years, Murphy steadily improved his game to the point where he was the best pass-rusher in the nation as a senior.
Murphy made an impact in 2011 with 40 tackles, 10 tackles for a loss and 6.5 sacks as a sophomore. 2012 was a breakout season for Murphy as he totaled 56 tackles with 10 sacks, 18 tackles for a loss, four passes broken up, one interception and a forced fumble.
As a senior, Murphy was one of the best players in college football. He started out his season with a multi-sack game against San Jose State and stayed consistent through the end of the year. Murphy had an interception returned for a 30-yard touchdown against Washington State. Versus Washington, he had two sacks and deflected a pass that was intercepted near the end zone late in the fourth quarter to protect Stanford's narrow win over the Huskies.
Murphy had other multi-sack games against UCLA and USC. Against Oregon State, he was an animal, totaling eight tackles, 2.5 sacks, two batted passes and 4.5 tackles for a loss. In 2013, Murphy put together 15 sacks, 24.5 tackles for a loss, 62 tackles, six passes batted, one forced fumble and an interception returned 30 yards for a touchdown. He led the nation in sacks. His only ugly game came at the hands of Notre Dame left tackle Zack Martin, as the likely first-round pick was able to shut down Murphy.
At the Senior Bowl, Murphy continued to struggle with Martin but was able to win some pass rushing one-on-ones against other tackles. Murphy checked in a little smaller than advertised and looks like he fits as a 3-4 outside linebacker. He would need to add weight to be a base end in a 4-3 defense. Coming from Stanford's 3-4, Murphy has experience lining up in a variety of spots and has used his pass-rushing ability to beat guards and right tackles as well. He also can execute in pass coverage.
Murphy is a physical defender who beats linemen with power and technique. He is fast enough to get by as an pass-rusher in the NFL, but he won't be a speed demon off the edge. Murphy has a nice repertoire of moves with good hands to fight off blocks. He is instinctive and consistently puts himself in position to make splash plays. Murphy also does a nice job at defending the run. He can hold his ground and shed blockers to make tackles in the ground game. Murphy is skilled in pursuit of ball-carriers, which is one reason why he is such a good pass-rusher. Murphy also showed some ability in college to function dropping into pass coverage.
The only thing keeping Murphy from being a first-round pick is a lack of speed and elite athleticism. However, plenty of good NFL players had the same criticism coming out of college. Murphy has the intangibles and enough of a skill set to overcome that. He could easily end up being a steal as a second-round pick. Murphy may not be a first-round pick in the 2014 NFL Draft, but years from now teams could be regretting not taking him on Thursday night.
Re: How do we best utilize Preston Smith and Trent Murphy?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2015 8:50 pm
by yupchagee
oj wrote:markshark84 wrote:oj wrote:I don't see Riley as part of this equation. Murphy has won the starting job, I don't see Smith challenging him. Smith has got a lot to learn, give him some time.
Not sure about this one.....
Riley will be part of the LB corps. He has had 3 solid years in DC. How much? Who knows. We have good depth with Riley, Robinson, Kerrigan, Preston, and Murphy along with potential depth in Spaight and other rookies.
I am not sure Murphy "won" the starting job. Orakpo got hurt. He "won" the replacement job by default.
Smith is a HIGH 2nd round pick. "Giving him some time" doesn't apply to guys taken in rds 1 and 2. A second rounder should be considered an immediate starter or someone challenging for it. I see MLBs in 3-4 to be more speed type guys that can also play the run (which Murphy can) but more imporantly be all over the field (which I don't see in Murphy). That being said, we play a ton of nickel so I would think both will get some time and their performance on the field will determine their roles moving forward.
I'd agree if we were speaking about a running back or a receiver but Linebacker? That is a position of crafty subtlities, they don't learn that in college. I'm conservative, teach the man and put him in when he is ready to dominate.
The best way to learn to play football is to play football. Smith will develop more quickly if he gets meaningfull snaps.