The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

What is everyones opinion on players that should be cap casualties, free agents that should stay and go, and players we should add in FA.

Here are the current figures from http://www.overthecap.com

Year Total Liabilities Salary Cap (Projected) Cap Room
2015 $126,377,357 $140,108,621 $13,731,264

Now. I think we have a few key targets to get rid of this year.

Stephen Bowen at $5.5 million
Barry Cofield at $4.12 million
Chris Chester $4 million
Tracy Porter $2.29 million
Logan Paulson $1.75 million

Cutting those 5 gets us to $29.25 million in cap space.

I will also recommend we cut Garcon with the June 1st designation... so....

Pierre Garcon $7.5 million

Now we have cap space of $36.29 million

Now, for our current free agents, this is what I would keep some of them for

Santana Moss $970,000 his veteran leadership and situational play in the slot I think is well worth it.

Niles Paul - $2 million per year for 2 or 3 years. Hes has had decent TE play, stays healthy, and is a solid special teams player

Kai Forbath - $660,000 hes not great at kickoffs but he has been the most accurate FG kicker we have had in a long time. Worth base salary to keep for another year for sure.

Now for new free agents. Ive done a little research on this and tried to be smart with risk vs reward and just overall value for pkayers.

Cecil Shorts WR $2.5 million. He would add a little height to our core at 6'... not towering for a receiver but still. He was part of maybe the worst offense in the NFL, lowering his productivity beyond what it would normally be, and his price. We could likely get him with a cap hit around here per year with a few year contract, and would likely not need a lot of garunteed money in it and more incentives instead.

Clint Boling OT $3 million. Currently a FA from the Bengals he isnt the beast Iupati is in run blocking, but he is a better pass blocker, and at a MUCH better price. Also he can easily play left or right side, and does decent filling in at tackle

Terrance Knighton NT $4 million - One of the top prospects and a good size to boot. Denver has a bad cap situation and cant afford him over other big name players. Terrance has had consistent play, remained mostly healthy, and is a couple years under the 30 mark. He may be available for less than 4 million.

Byron Maxwell CB $4 million - a nice Scot connection here, Byron has solid play for the price. He also comes from a winning organization and the best defense the last few years in a row, experience we need. I will partner this pick with saying we keep D Hall and move him back to safety. With Maxwell on 1 side and Breeland on the other, we should see coverage tighten up on the edges.

That still leaves around $20 million in cap space. I may do some more research on other FA's later, but thats a solod start to get the right kind of guys in our building that have success, are young, and offer great value.

If anyone wants to build off my list, I think a DE, ILB and either a OLB or TE would be good to look into as well.

I'd like to keep Coefield with a new contract...one that doesn't cost us $7.7 against the cap.

I could also see Riley getting cut and saving nearly $2 mil.

I believe you're the second person who broached the idea of keeping Moss one more year, me being the other. All my skins fans say he's gone, 100%. I like his leadership and think he's worth the vet min.

fredp45 wrote:I'd like to keep Coefield with a new contract...one that doesn't cost us $7.7 against the cap.

I could also see Riley getting cut and saving nearly $2 mil.

I believe you're the second person who broached the idea of keeping Moss one more year, me being the other. All my skins fans say he's gone, 100%. I like his leadership and think he's worth the vet min.

If he restructures maybe for cofield, but we can get Terrance Knighton for less and he is younger and been pretty succesful.

Moss is easily worth the vet min for another year, hes a solid fill in player and he has the experience and attitude needed on our offense. There really is no reason not to retain him.

Prowl33 wrote:Here are the current figures from http://www.overthecap.com

Year Total Liabilities Salary Cap (Projected) Cap Room
2015 $126,377,357 $140,108,621 $13,731,264

Now. I think we have a few key targets to get rid of this year.

Stephen Bowen at $5.5 million
Barry Cofield at $4.12 million
Chris Chester $4 million
Tracy Porter $2.29 million
Logan Paulson $1.75 million

Cutting those 5 gets us to $29.25 million in cap space.

I am on board with all of these with the exception of Paulson. We aren't strapped for cash, and he fills a need without breaking the bank. Yes, we could find a rookie UFA with a 50/50 shot to replace his skills at 1/4th the salary, but I think I'd prefer continuity at that position for now.

While I like Garcon, I don't think he's worth even 70% of what we're paying him. I'd hate to see us simply release him, but even more I'd hate to see one of those restructures that just kicks the can down the road and makes cutting him later a liability.

The thing about building through the draft is that you don't need a ton of money up front, because you are gambling on a crop of young players who aren't costing you much at all. We also have a large amount of cap space to work with even without cutting or restructuring our more expensive guys. So I anticipate the team keeping some solid-but-not-great players at high salaries for 1-2 more seasons before clearing them out. They'll get the benefit of an inflated paycheck while our new GM works to field a team with his players. Not an ideal situation, but better than cutting them and trying our luck with still more FAs. We have the cash for it, at any rate.

I think that for the next 6 months we are primarily going to see Scot taking things fairly easy and not being very aggressive with the free agent market PLUS having some time to see what the people he's working with in both the scouting department and the NFL talent evaluators are really like and who he wants to keep and who he wants to bring in ...

this rebuilding process is not going to be short sighted or trying to rebuild this franchise so it can be competitive as soon as possible

Scot is looking to build a franchise that will be competitive year in and year out not just every now and then

we're going to be a very young group here for a while and they will be looking to add through the draft primarily

we may lose some players but I do not see these guys adding many older free agents like we used to

Why keep an aging Moss, when you can give the reps to a young guy for half the salary??

The big thing with cutting some of these overpaid vets is that they are old and/or injury prone and not producing. Why not get a solid prospect in FA coming off his rookie contract. Youll either end up keeping them the year or 2 you sign em while you build through draft and let em go, or you find someone that is a solid starter or backup and is young and healthy enough to contribute for years.

When it comes to moss... he doesnt need a lot of reps, and his value far surpasses what hhhe does on the field. For the price he is well worth it.

Would have agreed with you on Moss before this past year...he wasn't even active for half the games (last 5 I think)...I can't see paying a Vet (which now have minimums) that kind of money if he's not active on Sundays??

I think we have to try to land a safety in free agency this year. Rahim Moore from Denver is only 25 years old and an unrestricted free agency. He won't be cheap, but at his age and that position I think it might make sense to spend some $$$.

There's no guarantee that we'll get a safety in the draft, much less one who can start as a rookie. I'm sure Clark is gone. Merriweather has been unreliable. Nobody really knows what Phillip Thomas is for sure. I don't see how we can possible go through free agency without signing a safety. That should be a top priority.

I could go either way on Garcon. DJax isn't the biggest guy out there and takes some knocks, so its nice having another solid guy like Garcon out there. Its obviously way too much money wrapped up at WR though right now, so I understand if a move has to be made.

I like all of the cuts listed above. Especially some of the high priced older guys.

I thought about Rahim Moore but everything I see about him talks about how he isnt good at reading qbs and not great at pass coverage in general. Plus hes only like 5'10" as well. While hes def better than what we have he will mot be worth the money other teams will pay for him.

Prowl33 wrote:I thought about Rahim Moore but everything I see about him talks about how he isnt good at reading qbs and not great at pass coverage in general. Plus hes only like 5'10" as well. While hes def better than what we have he will mot be worth the money other teams will pay for him.

He's 6'1". We can only spend so much on a safety obviously, but we got cheap at that position last off season and it killed us.

Anyway, if you don't like Rahim Moore, we still absolutely have to sign a safety in free agency IMO.

riggofan wrote:

Prowl33 wrote:I thought about Rahim Moore but everything I see about him talks about how he isnt good at reading qbs and not great at pass coverage in general. Plus hes only like 5'10" as well. While hes def better than what we have he will mot be worth the money other teams will pay for him.

He's 6'1". We can only spend so much on a safety obviously, but we got cheap at that position last off season and it killed us.

Anyway, if you don't like Rahim Moore, we still absolutely have to sign a safety in free agency IMO.

I agree with you we def do. Maybe we go after Marcus Gilchrist. He wont cost a lot, is reliable in pass coverage at SS, and is a young player. We move D Hall to FS assuming he is not hampered by his injury, and he can use his experience and talent at reading QBs and receivers to our advantage. That is a solid temporary solution to our problem until we either draft, or find the right FA as a long term.

D. Hall at safety? While I do like the idea its still not a real possibility yet.
We dont even know if Hall is healthy enough to run. Let alone make a switch to safety. So we cannot depend on D. Hall moving to safety as an option when we arent even sure hell be able to play next year.

Safety must take priority over corner. We already have two young corners who can play if coached up and put in positions to succeed. I agree on your cuts of the old vets who are costing us too much. I think Paulsen is a keeper he isnt getting paid that much. Well worth it he can block like a beast and has good hands. Runs decent routes too.

Moss im neither here nor there. Moss is at the end of his career. What we really need is a big physical receiver or tight end. Jordan Reed if he can stay healthy would take care of this role nicely. But if not it wouldnt hurt to have a big receiver.

NT, OT, OG, S, SS those are our needs at least the immediate needs. Five positions if filled quickly can turn us into playoff contenders. I actually believe we have the QBs already. We just need to get the right enviroment going and coach these players up.

3 reasons I'd keep Moss for another year:

1) A player who has a vet min contract ONLY counts as a portion of the contract toward the cap. We are spending way too much money, and cap space, on WRs;

2) He is a great role model for our younger guys, shows them how to practice, play, act outside the lines, etc...; AND

3) I didn't see DJax lose his mind during the year, I wonder if Moss didn't help with keeping him level. In other words, even our veteran WRs respect him.

HEROHAMO wrote:D. Hall at safety? While I do like the idea its still not a real possibility yet.
We dont even know if Hall is healthy enough to run. Let alone make a switch to safety. So we cannot depend on D. Hall moving to safety as an option when we arent even sure hell be able to play next year.

Safety must take priority over corner. We already have two young corners who can play if coached up and put in positions to succeed. I agree on your cuts of the old vets who are costing us too much. I think Paulsen is a keeper he isnt getting paid that much. Well worth it he can block like a beast and has good hands. Runs decent routes too.

Moss im neither here nor there. Moss is at the end of his career. What we really need is a big physical receiver or tight end. Jordan Reed if he can stay healthy would take care of this role nicely. But if not it wouldnt hurt to have a big receiver.

NT, OT, OG, S, SS those are our needs at least the immediate needs. Five positions if filled quickly can turn us into playoff contenders. I actually believe we have the QBs already. We just need to get the right enviroment going and coach these players up.

Oh I agree the d hall thing is up in the air and cannot be accounted for at all until we hit OTAs and see how he looks.

While safety is a more dire need than corner, if we can find a great player like byron maxwell but not that quality of player at safety, doesnt mean we dont get Byron. If we can improve at a position then we should do it.

The safety class in FA and draft isnt as deep or talented as a lot of the other defensive positions. Be prepared that we may not get a GOOD safety, cause youre gonna see devent players go for too much money and ill bet you Scot wont play that game.

What we can do though is get better at DE NT and OLB and put more pressure on the QB and improve our cocorner and ILB to provide better coverage and then the impact of not having a really solid safety isnt felt as hard... and mediocre players like a phillip thomas so far has been will either look better than he actually is, or even better have a chance to really develop his play.

The BPA approach doesnt have to just be for the draft, it applies to FA as well, albeit applied in a different manor.

I see the Colts just released Laron Landry. Want to bring him back to DC?

riggofan wrote:I see the Colts just released Laron Landry. Want to bring him back to DC?

Haha. Yet another example of someone with talent who let his ego get inflated to the point of bursting.

I still think that had he spent another several years under Sean Taylor's guidance his career would have been a totally different story.

HEROHAMO wrote:D. Hall at safety? While I do like the idea its still not a real possibility yet.
We dont even know if Hall is healthy enough to run. Let alone make a switch to safety. So we cannot depend on D. Hall moving to safety as an option when we arent even sure hell be able to play next year.

Safety must take priority over corner. We already have two young corners who can play if coached up and put in positions to succeed. I agree on your cuts of the old vets who are costing us too much. I think Paulsen is a keeper he isnt getting paid that much. Well worth it he can block like a beast and has good hands. Runs decent routes too.

Moss im neither here nor there. Moss is at the end of his career. What we really need is a big physical receiver or tight end. Jordan Reed if he can stay healthy would take care of this role nicely. But if not it wouldnt hurt to have a big receiver.

NT, OT, OG, S, SS those are our needs at least the immediate needs. Five positions if filled quickly can turn us into playoff contenders. I actually believe we have the QBs already. We just need to get the right enviroment going and coach these players up.

recently, I've agreed with a lot of your posts and I have no worries with bringing in players to fill areas of need but there is no way that this franchise can be a playoff contender in the next 2 years - we have a losing culture here that is not just going away by just adding 5-7 new players, even if they're great - PLUS it's going to take time to get these guys playing well together

This is NOT Fantasy Football where you just find great players and they all start playing well together - that is BS - get real

Scot has a chance, with Jay's help (and if they're left alone) to build this franchise back into a decent product again

IT's GOING TO TAKE TIME and I believe it's mostly going to be through the draft initially

SkinsJock wrote:

HEROHAMO wrote:D. Hall at safety? While I do like the idea its still not a real possibility yet.
We dont even know if Hall is healthy enough to run. Let alone make a switch to safety. So we cannot depend on D. Hall moving to safety as an option when we arent even sure hell be able to play next year.

Safety must take priority over corner. We already have two young corners who can play if coached up and put in positions to succeed. I agree on your cuts of the old vets who are costing us too much. I think Paulsen is a keeper he isnt getting paid that much. Well worth it he can block like a beast and has good hands. Runs decent routes too.

Moss im neither here nor there. Moss is at the end of his career. What we really need is a big physical receiver or tight end. Jordan Reed if he can stay healthy would take care of this role nicely. But if not it wouldnt hurt to have a big receiver.

NT, OT, OG, S, SS those are our needs at least the immediate needs. Five positions if filled quickly can turn us into playoff contenders. I actually believe we have the QBs already. We just need to get the right enviroment going and coach these players up.

recently, I've agreed with a lot of your posts and I have no worries with bringing in players to fill areas of need but there is no way that this franchise can be a playoff contender in the next 2 years - we have a losing culture here that is not just going away by just adding 5-7 new players, even if they're great - PLUS it's going to take time to get these guys playing well together

This is NOT Fantasy Football where you just find great players and they all start playing well together - that is BS - get real

Scot has a chance, with Jay's help (and if they're left alone) to build this franchise back into a decent product again

IT's GOING TO TAKE TIME and I believe it's mostly going to be through the draft initially

And SJ usually I agree with yours but im gonna throw this at ya.

First, everyone SHOULD have the expectation that best case scenario we CAN be a consistant playoff team in 3 years.

You saw what also COULD happen in 2012, the planets align and a little bit of luck and we make it there. It is possible adding the RIGHT free agents, not game changers but solid starters that are consistent, young, and fit the mold of what Scot looks for. Partner that with a solid draft thst nets you an immediate starter or 2, and some solid depth/future starters. Then partner that with our all new position coaches, dc, and other new staff like our strength coach and such. The net of all those things, plus some LUCK, can definitely result in a playoff run next year and the year after.

So its not so far fetched that someone shouldnt say it. But NO one should have it as an expectation.

SkinsJock wrote:

HEROHAMO wrote:D. Hall at safety? While I do like the idea its still not a real possibility yet.
We dont even know if Hall is healthy enough to run. Let alone make a switch to safety. So we cannot depend on D. Hall moving to safety as an option when we arent even sure hell be able to play next year.

Safety must take priority over corner. We already have two young corners who can play if coached up and put in positions to succeed. I agree on your cuts of the old vets who are costing us too much. I think Paulsen is a keeper he isnt getting paid that much. Well worth it he can block like a beast and has good hands. Runs decent routes too.

Moss im neither here nor there. Moss is at the end of his career. What we really need is a big physical receiver or tight end. Jordan Reed if he can stay healthy would take care of this role nicely. But if not it wouldnt hurt to have a big receiver.

NT, OT, OG, S, SS those are our needs at least the immediate needs. Five positions if filled quickly can turn us into playoff contenders. I actually believe we have the QBs already. We just need to get the right enviroment going and coach these players up.

recently, I've agreed with a lot of your posts and I have no worries with bringing in players to fill areas of need but there is no way that this franchise can be a playoff contender in the next 2 years - we have a losing culture here that is not just going away by just adding 5-7 new players, even if they're great - PLUS it's going to take time to get these guys playing well together

This is NOT Fantasy Football where you just find great players and they all start playing well together - that is BS - get real

Scot has a chance, with Jay's help (and if they're left alone) to build this franchise back into a decent product again

IT's GOING TO TAKE TIME and I believe it's mostly going to be through the draft initially

Anything is possible dont forget that. Believe it and take action and it can happen. We just need our players to do so.

Remember RG3 took us to the playoffs his rookie year with Alf. That was two players who almost instantly turned us into a playoff contender.

It can happen again. We just need more continuity this time around. A solid Oline and running game will help this thing along. THe development of Griffin must take at least a step and a half forward.

The losing culture can change. We already have replaced most of our staff. We are going to cut many players and replace them with new ones.

Ill say that strong leadership is needed. I think we have the first piece in place with Scott at the helm. We just need to keep adding leaders. It can happen and I believe it will happen. Im thinking playoffs already.

I'm with ya but I think that the 2017 season is the earliest we can have things together here

2012 was an aberration and this franchise is HOPEFULLY no longer being run and managed with a short term plan

these guys will take it slow and easy IMO and they will not be looking for a quick fix - this is going to be done right and it will take time

I think SJ's comments are mostly right on. We're rebuilding (finally) there is no question about it, and that's not likely to happen in one off season. And I'm not down on Gruden yet, but the jury is still out on whether or not he's capable of turning this mess around.

I'm at least hoping when we've gone through free agency and the draft this spring that we can look at the 2015 roster and honestly say, "This team looks like it can be significantly better than 2014." Do you think that's realistic?

The bar isn't that high, fellas.

Btw nobody has mentioned QB really in "who gets added in FA". We're obviously going to bring in at least one quarterback in free agency.

Do you think there is any possibility they look at someone else to actually compete with Griffin/Cousins? Ryan Mallett maybe?

YES! - I do think that the franchise will be 'better' and I'm hoping that the attitude will be improved as well ...

I really look for limited free agency moves as Scot finds his way here and gets on the same page with Jay Gruden

I have a lot of faith (maybe overly optimistic) that these 2 guys can get this thing on track and back in gear

I really am looking for them to get things turned around and for this franchise to be a whole lot better going into 2017

PLUS - why not bring in another QB - the 2 we have, have a long way to go - and, we've got time

riggofan wrote:Btw nobody has mentioned QB really in "who gets added in FA". We're obviously going to bring in at least one quarterback in free agency.

Do you think there is any possibility they look at someone else to actually compete with Griffin/Cousins? Ryan Mallett maybe?

I think it depends on their mindset, if you are content on keeping RG and Cousins both this season than I think you bring in or draft/sign a young guy. If your thinking is one of them will be gone then I think you go the veteran route with a Hoyer, Mallett , McKown, or …