The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Weigh in. Is the defense actually that bad?

I personally dont think so. We got a solid front 7. We need a good right OLB and maybe a beast on the line. Upgrade at ILB wouldnt hurt, but is not a must have. So thats 2 players out of 7 needed.

How about the db's? Amerson is going into his 3rd season which is when most db's really start to get it and he still shows promise. D Hall has proven he can hang with the best receivers with little to no help and offers great leaderahip. Breeland is a beast for his rookie seasom and will only get better. Meriweather is decent in coverage but is a hell of a hitter, every backfield needs that. Which really just leaves us needing a very good cover safety.

So if only 3 of our 11 starters are not adequate individually, then maybe the issue is all coaching. Londona ts a few weeks ago confirmed what everyone suspected to be true, and maybe worse. London is a stand up guy, and I believe every word he said.

So, a new coach, a few good players, and some depth I believe can flip the defense from one of the leagues worst to one of the best... and it wont cost a fortune on cap space to do it.

Its a good question. I like a lot of the younger guys: Keenan, Breeland, Perry Riley, Amerson, Philip Thomas, Trent Murphy + Kerrigan of course.

It still seems to me like what we're really missing on defense is that one stud play maker. Orakpo should have been that guy. He's been good but I don't think he's been the impact guy for as high as he was drafted (not to mention being injured all the time).

This is going to be the real dilemma in the draft to me. I would love to see o-line picked with that first pick, but there is no question we need that guy on defense.

IMO - the Redskins issues on defense are a lot easier to 'make better' than the offensive concerns

we have heard from a number of different sources that the players (on defense) are being put in a position to succeed by their coaches and are, in many cases, just not making the plays - I think this reflects badly on Haslett - I would not be surprised to see a lot better defense next season with only a few key additions + a new DC

I still would love to get Landon Collins with the first pick and find a really good big guy for the defensive line

This defense will be upgraded immediately with a change at DC. Haslett's schemes are laughable. I like Collins, but he's more of a big hitter than a cover guy IMO. I think for a more immediate upgrade we take the best pass rusher in round 1 and grab a cover safety later on. There are a lot of good cover safeties in this draft.....good not great, but anything will help.

I don't know whether his schemes are laughable or not. Given the amount of time he's spent as a coordinator in the league, I kinda doubt that statement is true. Our defense has been consistently bad though since he's been here, so I'd be in favor of bringing in somebody new.

I was just checking out Gruden's presser from today. There was a lot in there about how we've had all of these significant injuries on defense all year (which is true: Rak, Merriweather, Hall, etc) and he thinks Haslett has done a good job in spite of that. I don't really agree with that, but it has me wondering if Haslett is coming back.

I'm not a fan of overreacting or change just for the sake of change, but I think the fans will be justifiably p***d off if we get to the end of this season and there isn't some change made. Defensive coordinator is the obvious one. Possibly promoting AJ Smith to GM too.

I think gruden is just smart enough to not publically burn a coach he decided to keep here, while the season is still ongoing. Gruden is a smart guy. He will make the right decision.

Breeland has been a great surprise. What's the early verdict on P. Thomas?

I'm not sure that Haslett is gone but he's going to have a tough time in the press and from the fans if he returns

we have heard from various sources that the film shows he has not done a bad job and he lost some key components to injury

I just don't think that Gruden and the FO will keep him here - that being said, it's not a given that a new DC will magically make the defense better - we need to address the secondary and we need to be able to pressure the QB without blitzing

I really like how some here took advantage of their opportunity - we will see a better defense next season even if it's still under Haslett

Neo wrote:Breeland has been a great surprise. What's the early verdict on P. Thomas?

Seems to be progressing!

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/foo ... ip-thomas/

Sidelined for all of his rookie season and a member of Washington’s practice squad for the first half of this year, Thomas has taken over as the starter at strong safety with Brandon Meriweather lost for the season because of a toe injury.

Thomas, a fourth-round pick in 2013, on Sunday recorded a career-high seven tackles, and in the eyes of his coaches displayed improvement in some areas. But Thomas still has room to improve, Coach Jay Gruden said.

“He did pretty good,” Gruden said. “He did some good things. … I thought Phillip, he tackled well and did a pretty good job. I’d like to see him get his hands on some balls, but otherwise, I think he filled in nicely.”

IMO, yes it is that far off from being good. There are only two starting quality players, Breeland and Kerrigan. Yes, there are some other good players but would they actually be starters anywhere else? Maybe a partial year of experience and an off-season will get them there. As for Haslett, his defense is right where it has almost always been, lower middle of the road. I fail to see how he has been a defensive coordinator for as long as he has.

riggofan wrote:

Neo wrote:Breeland has been a great surprise. What's the early verdict on P. Thomas?

Seems to be progressing!

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/foo ... ip-thomas/

Sidelined for all of his rookie season and a member of Washington’s practice squad for the first half of this year, Thomas has taken over as the starter at strong safety with Brandon Meriweather lost for the season because of a toe injury.

Thomas, a fourth-round pick in 2013, on Sunday recorded a career-high seven tackles, and in the eyes of his coaches displayed improvement in some areas. But Thomas still has room to improve, Coach Jay Gruden said.

“He did pretty good,” Gruden said. “He did some good things. … I thought Phillip, he tackled well and did a pretty good job. I’d like to see him get his hands on some balls, but otherwise, I think he filled in nicely.”

Thanks for the link Riggo! Really hope he keeps moving forward; its been frustrating waiting to see what he can do.

Now is he the one that many were saying is better suited as a SS as opposed to a FS?

aswas71788 wrote:IMO, yes it is that far off from being good. There are only two starting quality players, Breeland and Kerrigan. Yes, there are some other good players but would they actually be starters anywhere else? Maybe a partial year of experience and an off-season will get them there. As for Haslett, his defense is right where it has almost always been, lower middle of the road. I fail to see how he has been a defensive coordinator for as long as he has.

Really though? No love for Keenan or Hatcher?

A lot of people have been writing off Hatcher's performance, but I think the drop off was all due to unhealed injury; he was looking very promising early in the year.

aswas71788 wrote:IMO, yes it is that far off from being good. There are only two starting quality players, Breeland and Kerrigan. Yes, there are some other good players but would they actually be starters anywhere else? Maybe a partial year of experience and an off-season will get them there. As for Haslett, his defense is right where it has almost always been, lower middle of the road. I fail to see how he has been a defensive coordinator for as long as he has.

There are plenty of guys who would start on other teams. Hatcher and Coefield for starters would be scooped up immediately if we released them. Riley would be sought after by many teams as well. I believe there will be a decent market for Jenkins this off-season as I believe he is a FA, and many people would be interested in Baker or Amerson if we got rid of them. Kennan Robinson also had a nice season going until he went down. The only position we are extremely terrible at on defesne is Safety......and that would be both safety positions. Clark has been horrendous and we've had a revolving door at the other spot. That is where we need he biggest upgrade. That and a pass rusher.

First off we have some talent on the defensive side. We could use upgrades at nose tackle and maybe another DT/DE who can put pressure on the QB. We have plenty of LB talent. Im serious about our LBs. We have some good ones.
Corner backs I think we have a solid duo. Saftey is where we need upgrades bad. We need at least one very good saftey.

Lastly our defensive coordinator needs to be upgraded. How many times has Hazlett given us a top ten D? Never in fact he never will. Its time to let it go and move on.

Is the defense really that far off from being good?

Yep.

Trying to remember how George Allen created a good defense in his first season. He kept:

- Pat Fischer, tough CB
- Mike Bass, another tough CB
- Brig Owens, free safety
- Chris Hanburger, fine outside LB
- Bill Brundige, DT

That's about all I remember. Just checked, and I'd forgotten Rusty Tillman and Ted Vactor, who special teams players.

Looks like Allen replaced six of the starting eleven on defense. Not so much a "rebuilding" job as a "gut-rehab".

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/re ... story.html

Great write up on breeland. Kid could turn into the sh7t down corner we need after a few years experience.

welch wrote:Trying to remember how George Allen created a good defense in his first season. He kept:

- Pat Fischer, tough CB
- Mike Bass, another tough CB
- Brig Owens, free safety
- Chris Hanburger, fine outside LB
- Bill Brundige, DT

That's about all I remember. Just checked, and I'd forgotten Rusty Tillman and Ted Vactor, who special teams players.

Looks like Allen replaced six of the starting eleven on defense. Not so much a "rebuilding" job as a "gut-rehab".

Ramskins

Neo wrote:

aswas71788 wrote:IMO, yes it is that far off from being good. There are only two starting quality players, Breeland and Kerrigan. Yes, there are some other good players but would they actually be starters anywhere else? Maybe a partial year of experience and an off-season will get them there. As for Haslett, his defense is right where it has almost always been, lower middle of the road. I fail to see how he has been a defensive coordinator for as long as he has.

Really though? No love for Keenan or Hatcher?

A lot of people have been writing off Hatcher's performance, but I think the drop off was all due to unhealed injury; he was looking very promising early in the year.

I'm not sure how to judge Hatcher, but completely agree with you about Keenan Robinson. One of the best players on defense. Love that he's a guy we drafted and developed. One of Haslett's few bright spots IMO. Guy needs to stay healthy for a full year though.

Not if Haslett is returning as DC. I read that Jay Gruden wants him back. However, the caveat is that he says it's not only up to him but Snyder and Allen. So, I'm assuming by that it's not a lock that he returns.

^ Just following up with the sources of Gruden wanting Haslett back. http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/201 ... ett-retur/

SkinsJock wrote:IMO - the Redskins issues on defense are a lot easier to 'make better' than the offensive concerns

we have heard from a number of different sources that the players (on defense) are being put in a position to succeed by their coaches and are, in many cases, just not making the plays - I think this reflects badly on Haslett - I would not be surprised to see a lot better defense next season with only a few key additions + a new DC

I still would love to get Landon Collins with the first pick and find a really good big guy for the defensive line

It's the DC's job to put players in position to make plays. If they aren't making them, it's on them or the position players.

Neo wrote:

aswas71788 wrote:IMO, yes it is that far off from being good. There are only two starting quality players, Breeland and Kerrigan. Yes, there are some other good players but would they actually be starters anywhere else? Maybe a partial year of experience and an off-season will get them there. As for Haslett, his defense is right where it has almost always been, lower middle of the road. I fail to see how he has been a defensive coordinator for as long as he has.

Really though? No love for Keenan or Hatcher?

A lot of people have been writing off Hatcher's performance, but I think the drop off was all due to unhealed injury; he was looking very promising early in the year.

Hatcher has had the 2nd most sacks in his career. Anyone who expected him to match his '13 numbers was delusional.

yupchagee wrote:It's the DC's job to put players in position to make plays. If they aren't making them, it's on them or the position players.

OK - the fans want a change at DC - the HC is stating that the DC is doing his job and the players are not - who do you think is right?

At the end of the day the coaches are responsible. Our HC has been here 1 year, our DC has been here 4. In those 4 years through different players we are plagued by the sane thing. Only being able to pressure the qb by blitzing, and giving up big plays that lead to scores.

I really dont think anyone that supports keeping Haslett knows a whole lot about football.