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Is the Glock 19 the best small handgun or is there one that packs a big punch and possibly cost less while keeping good quality?
Just wondered if anyone had an opinion.. thanks.

"Best" is pretty subjective when it comes to guns.

What do you plan to use it for? Indoor range? Concealed carry? Competition?

Do you want a thumb safety?

Do you want a striker-fire trigger like Glock?

What caliber do you want?

Something for the house.. couple break-ins in surrounding areas have me kind of paranoid right now. I have a dog but I think at best my Lab would lick the person to death. lol.
Thumb safety would be nice.. definitely love the striker-fire trigger.
As for caliber, as long as it does the job ultimately I'm ok with. Would love for the person to not be able to get away if hit (if that makes a difference).
I shouldn't have said "best", you're absolutely right bro cuz not all will fit everyone's preference.

I think you should find a local range with rentals and try different models.

If you like that style of trigger and want a thumb safety, try the Smith & Wesson M&P series, the Springfield XD series, or a Ruger. They're offered in 9mm, .40, and .45 caliber. Beretta is good quality, but uses a different trigger and safety/decocker switch. I personally wouldn't rely on the 1911-style pistols due to the small magazine and being sometimes finicky.

You live in Maryland? Do you guys have magazine size limits down there? Can you buy hollow-point ammo?

Wow, every single one you named were all mentioned to me as very reliable.
As for the mag-size limits I'm not sure but I know that hollow-points are illegal.. or at least they were some years ago since they were labelled as "cop-killers"

langleyparkjoe wrote:As for the mag-size limits I'm not sure but I know that hollow-points are illegal.. or at least they were some years ago since they were labelled as "cop-killers"

Wikipedia tells me you guys in Maryland have a semi-auto magazine limit of 10, which is bullcrap and worse than we have in NJ. You have my pity.

Since you're unfortunately limited to 10 rounds, I suggest you look at .45 caliber full-size handguns. One of the biggest benefits of a smaller caliber such as 9mm is that more rounds can be loaded for the same volume and weight as .45. Maryland's magazine limit makes this point moot, however. Since your max is 10, regardless of caliber, I'd rather have 8 .45s than 10 9mm.

One big pro of smaller 9mm vs .45 is less recoil, but since we're talking about a full size home-defense handgun, it's my personal belief that the size and weight of the gun will help manage recoil and soften the .45 enough to make the 9mm's advantage negligible. Recoil is more of a factor in smaller, lightweight concealable guns.

If indeed you can't purchase hollowpoints, I wouldn't touch anything smaller than a .45. Ball is inferior to hollowpoints on soft targets, so you'd need to shoot the largest bullet possible to make a big hole, especially with the 10 round limit.

Personally, I'm not sold on .40, which is a compromise between 9mm and .45. I haven't shot it much, but it seems to be a lesser .45 that costs just as much. Others may be able to give you more info on it. Shoot it and see. YMMV

I wouldn't hesitate to carry a 1911... any 9mm increases the chances that the criminal is getting a second chance. A .45 increases the chances that the dude is not getting up... at home defense ranges, accuracy is not necessarily an issue... you don't have to be center mass with a .45.

Countertrey wrote:I wouldn't hesitate to carry a 1911... any 9mm increases the chances that the criminal is getting a second chance. A .45 increases the chances that the dude is not getting up... at home defense ranges, accuracy is not necessarily an issue... you don't have to be center mass with a .45.

With the magazine limit he has to work with, I agree with you on using .45 or at least .40 if at all possible. I still stand by there being pros and cons for both 9mm and .45 that make one better than the other in certain situations.

Hooligan wrote:

Countertrey wrote:I wouldn't hesitate to carry a 1911... any 9mm increases the chances that the criminal is getting a second chance. A .45 increases the chances that the dude is not getting up... at home defense ranges, accuracy is not necessarily an issue... you don't have to be center mass with a .45.

With the magazine limit he has to work with, I agree with you on using .45 or at least .40 if at all possible. I still stand by there being pros and cons for both 9mm and .45 that make one better than the other in certain situations.

BTW... the DoD is currently looking to replace the current 9mm's in the arsenal, largely due to the lack of knock down power... but also due to issues with reliability. They are publishing the requirements this week.

Countertrey wrote:BTW... the DoD is currently looking to replace the current 9mm's in the arsenal, largely due to the lack of knock down power... but also due to issues with reliability. They are publishing the requirements this week.

I think they could solve the "stopping power" issue by issuing hollowpoint ammo, but they're still bound to the Hague convention or whatever other nonsensical agreement that rule originated from.

IMHO, with full metal jacketed bullets, they need a rugged .45 built in the U.S. That means backtracking to the 1911 platform or adapting to a newer one. H&K is great, but are they built here? I'd lean toward Springfield or Smith & Wesson for the factory support. I'd like to think they'd take care of our guys.

Hooligan wrote:

Countertrey wrote:BTW... the DoD is currently looking to replace the current 9mm's in the arsenal, largely due to the lack of knock down power... but also due to issues with reliability. They are publishing the requirements this week.

I think they could solve the "stopping power" issue by issuing hollowpoint ammo, but they're still bound to the Hague convention or whatever other nonsensical agreement that rule originated from.

... unfortunately, the conventions on land warfare moot that... the reality is, either one... .45 Ball or a 9mm HP will create a hole that is not compatible with life... but, it is what it is. I'm still partial to the heft and feel of a 1911. sooo...

IMHO, with full metal jacketed bullets, they need a rugged .45 built in the U.S. That means backtracking to the 1911 platform or adapting to a newer one. H&K is great, but are they built here? I'd lean toward Springfield or Smith & Wesson for the factory support. I'd like to think they'd take care of our guys.

... I certainly don't have any objections here. BTW, H&K does have the capacity to produce arms start to finish in the US... I think their plant is in Columbus, GA. They are known for creative thinking and practical innovation. They are certainly capable. Doesn't matter though... this will be an open competition... you can bet that several companies will offer 1911 redo's... but I'll bet H&K gets creative.

H&K is definitely in the running, then. Of course we're also talking about a government contract, meaning they need to price accordingly which may hurt their chances compared to S&W and Springfield. Maybe even Ruger will throw their hat in, too?

Back on track... have you been to the range yet, Langley?

Hooligan wrote:Back on track... have you been to the range yet, Langley?

Interpretation: "Did you shoot a .45? How's your right thumb and wrist?"

Countertrey wrote:

Hooligan wrote:Back on track... have you been to the range yet, Langley?

Interpretation: "Did you shoot a .45? How's your right thumb and wrist?"

I want to go to the range now. I have a S&W 4506 that I haven't fired yet.

Countertrey wrote:

Hooligan wrote:Back on track... have you been to the range yet, Langley?

Interpretation: "Did you shoot a .45? How's your right thumb and wrist?"

... or your face if you held it like this:

Well... it worked for Harry...

It's late, you hear a noise, you are startled. At this point you frantically turn off any fan or noise to get that eerily deep silence, you could hear a pin drop. You start to feel your heat beat in the back of your ears. You are nervous now and maybe turn on a light to deter someone or alert a potential intruder that you are in the house. You quietly reach into wherever you keep your gun and you slowly and quietly prepare for the worst. Your hands need to be firm but not white knuckled, you need to grab the doorknob off hand keeping the weapon close but straight ahead. You creep the door open. its pitch black in your hallway. You turn on a bunch of lights in the house, slowly checking every window and door for signs of forced entry. By this time your hands are sweaty, you are nervous. Everything seems to check out, you and your family are safe.

You can listen to all the advice in the world about caliber, 1911, safeties. It wont matter. It wont matter when you are faced with the above situation. What will matter is how comfortable that gun feels in your hand. Controlled breathing, don't get tunnel vision, stay alert, stay ready. Have a plan. explain to your family how to react to something like this. It may seem ridiculous at the time but in the event of this actually becoming a reality, you will be better off.

I recommend you go to a shooting range and rent as many weapons as you can and try them all. Practice with it, get comfortable with it. Fire a few rounds off with no hearing protection indoors so you know how it feels at 2am in your living room. Train like you fight. Consider a light...

Great stuff,ATX... But,most important of all...put rounds through the weapon... Lots of them.

Countertrey wrote:Great stuff,ATX... But,most important of all...put rounds through the weapon... Lots of them.

Especially whichever rounds you're going to use for defense. Don't buy a whole case of cheap range ammo and one small box of good defense ammo to throw in the nightstand. You have to shoot that stuff, too, so you know it will perform well in your gun.

Consider another dog first...a breed or mix that goes about 60 pounds or more and has a strong sense of defending its territory. I lived through a situation such as ATX describes. My dad worked rotating shifts at a PEPCO generating plant, so he got a small pistol for my mom. One night, they heard noises downstairs. He got the gun and crept down the stairs, puzzling over the gray light from our living room. He sprang down the last few steps...and found me, age four, asleep with my arms around our cocker spaniel and the TV running the test pattern. (Washington TV was not 24 hours a day back in the early '50s. After about midnight or one am, each channel ran a pattern that you used to sharpen focus.)

Point: a dog has better hearing and better sniffing than we do. Something odd will set them to barking, snarling, and charging toward the noise. From my experience in New York City, the last thing a burglar wants to face is a big, angry, woof-dog. That's what I found after a day-time burglar hit two apartments on the floor above mine. (Why burgle in the day-time? Less chance of people being home.). One neighbor got an Akita, who was peaceable but could tear you in half if she got angry. We got Molly, a mix of golden lab and something with guard-dog instincts. Molly allowed no one into the apartment unless one of use brought them in. The poor electric-meter reader gave up...had us record the readings. Whenever this Con Ed guy got off the elevator, Molly woke up, even if she was snoozing at the opposite end of the apartment. She ran down the front hallway, gathering speed, growling and snarling, until she jumped into the air, with a bang that shook the door and a bark that said "death to the invader". She would claw the door as if she thought she could claw though steel.

That was always enough.

When crack dealers too control of a block next to ours, I would take Molly to meet visitors, he was like an icebreaker: the dealers and crack-heads moved back to give us about a six-foot clearance. Each dealing crew had a young guy with a gun, but none of them wanted to battle an angry dog.

Consider a German Shepherd or some mix of border collie and something big. (Friend of mine keeps guns; his son is a police officer. His German Shepherd is the guard, though.)

I'd want both... but the reality is, dogs require a life commitment that a handgun simply doesn't...
... and, I can use my gun to save my dog from an intruder who also has a gun.

Get both.

My advice would be to trust the dog first. Most burglars want money / valuables, but not a fight. Use a gun only if, as CT says, the burglar has shot the dog.

welch wrote:My advice would be to trust the dog first. Most burglars want money / valuables, but not a fight. Use a gun only if, as CT says, the burglar has shot the dog.

That's not quite what I meant. I love my dog... I'm shooting the burglar first...