The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Every Redskins fan seems to be taking a dump all over Polumbus these days. Most were going as far as saying that Bruce Campbell was his replacement (an absolutely laughable claim, considering that Campbell hasn't done a single thing in the NFL apart from being a combine warrior.)

What is the average Redskins fan's beef with our incumbent RT anyway? Tyler Polumbus was extremely effective last season.

* He committed only one penalty
* Allowed only 4 sacks
* Allowed only 9 hits
* Showed huge strides in pass blocking
* Was rated as Pro Football Focus' 6th best RT in 2013

Sure, his run blocking leaves a little to be desired... but he's a smart player, who doesn't draw flags and who was an absolutely outstanding pass blocker. In today's league, a RT doesn't just become a run blocker. Passing rules today's NFL. He and Trent Williams are arguably the best tackle tandem in the NFL. If Polumbus isn't starting for us in 2014 it should mean he was either injured or we made some blockbuster move to get a mega star RT.

In before someone posts "didn't pass the eyeball test".

The problem with Tyler Polumbus is that the team was 3-13 last year.

Seriously, its a fair question. I'll be curious to see how other people respond. I don't know about his stats last year, but one reason I've heard for possibly replacing Polumbus would be if Gruden wants his line to look more like it did with the Bengals with bigger, stronger linemen.

I don't think that there is necessarily a problem with his play..but to me, at 6'8 and some 300 lbs you want your O linemen especially the RT position to be mean and physical. I personally believe our O line troubles are more interior, but considering RG3 was coming back from a major injury, you and I, as well as Skins fan abroad were probably frustrated with what seemed like a lack of effort/aggression towards the defensive fronts. We all know what we are going to get from Trent Williams, so I think fans at this point want someone who can match his ability, along with interior linemen, so we can protect the GIGANTIC investment we made in RG3...

My biggest gripe about Polumbus is there is to many plays where he allows the defensive line or linebacker to push him within arms reach of our quarterback. He retreats back until the last minute until he puts "punch" to the defender. Whereas, Trent Williams tries to immobilize the defender from a shorter distance from the line of scrimmage. In Polumbus's poor technique, it makes your average quarterback uncomfortable or even difficult to provide a clean lane to throw in.

See people can throw up stats all day long but one of the stats that do not show up is the amount of clean pockets a quarterback gets to throw from. All quarterbacks will tell you this is what makes them comfortable and if they are comfortable they are confident. Its not all Polumbus fault as our interior lineman get pushed back as well, but a QB should be able to take a step in every direction without the presence of their own lineman or defender in the way most of the time.

Clean pocket with passing lanes:


Most good tackles will use the Trent Williams method, putting their hands immediately on the defender as soon as possible forcing them to an alternative move. Other tackles will push the defender away from the quarterback, allowing the defender's momentum to run pass the quarterback. Tyler Polumbus, however not only looks defeated often, but once again he allows a direct line straight to the quarterback.

Decent run blocker, but remember he was brought in as a BACKUP to Jammal Brown. He's not your ideal 16 game + playoff starter. Surprised the Skins didn't attempt to go after a RT like Michael Oher or Anthony Collins. But yeah if we are content on being mediocre yeah keep him.

Skinsfan55 wrote:Every Redskins fan seems to be taking a dump all over Polumbus these days. Most were going as far as saying that Bruce Campbell was his replacement (an absolutely laughable claim, considering that Campbell hasn't done a single thing in the NFL apart from being a combine warrior.)

What is the average Redskins fan's beef with our incumbent RT anyway? Tyler Polumbus was extremely effective last season.

* He committed only one penalty
* Allowed only 4 sacks
* Allowed only 9 hits
* Showed huge strides in pass blocking
* Was rated as Pro Football Focus' 6th best RT in 2013

Sure, his run blocking leaves a little to be desired... but he's a smart player, who doesn't draw flags and who was an absolutely outstanding pass blocker. In today's league, a RT doesn't just become a run blocker. Passing rules today's NFL. He and Trent Williams are arguably the best tackle tandem in the NFL. If Polumbus isn't starting for us in 2014 it should mean he was either injured or we made some blockbuster move to get a mega star RT.

While i'll agree the TP gets a bad wrap, i think you are overselling him a bit (no a lot). He is a passable pass blocker and has improved in that respect, but there were WAY< WAY < WAY too many games were his guy just drove him right back into Robert. No the guy may not have gotten a sack, or caused a "hurry", but a guarantee Robert (or Kirk) never flet comfortable with the DL alomost there. Or how many passes did TP nock off course because the DL just drove him right back into the QB. No the DL never touched the QB, but it matter if it is the the DL knocking into you or your own RT.

That line about us having one of the best OT tandems in the League is plain laughable. Our tandem may be in the top half (closer to the middle) but not one of the best.

If Pro Football Focus had him as the 6th best RT in 2013 then you should never, ever visit that site again! Because they obviouly have no idea what they are talking about.

Don't get me wrong, I think he is much better than what most of the fans give him credit for, but not nearly as good as you (or Pro Football Focus) gives him credit for.

My personal feeling is he is sevrvicable, as long as your QB has no problem with his RT being in very close proimaty to him on obvious passing downs.

I did read somewhere that RGIII bore some responsibility for some of the bad play from the line. Happy feet, moving too quickly where they weren't expecting him. Any truth to that?

MikeBiz wrote:I don't think that there is necessarily a problem with his play..but to me, at 6'8 and some 300 lbs you want your O linemen especially the RT position to be mean and physical. I personally believe our O line troubles are more interior, but considering RG3 was coming back from a major injury, you and I, as well as Skins fan abroad were probably frustrated with what seemed like a lack of effort/aggression towards the defensive fronts. We all know what we are going to get from Trent Williams, so I think fans at this point want someone who can match his ability, along with interior linemen, so we can protect the GIGANTIC investment we made in RG3...

I agree. I consider him to be an average RT. Given our needs elsewhere, I give RT a low priority.

Skinsfan55 wrote:Every Redskins fan seems to be taking a dump all over Polumbus these days. Most were going as far as saying that Bruce Campbell was his replacement (an absolutely laughable claim, considering that Campbell hasn't done a single thing in the NFL apart from being a combine warrior.)

What is the average Redskins fan's beef with our incumbent RT anyway? Tyler Polumbus was extremely effective last season.

* He committed only one penalty
* Allowed only 4 sacks
* Allowed only 9 hits
* Showed huge strides in pass blocking
* Was rated as Pro Football Focus' 6th best RT in 2013

Sure, his run blocking leaves a little to be desired... but he's a smart player, who doesn't draw flags and who was an absolutely outstanding pass blocker. In today's league, a RT doesn't just become a run blocker. Passing rules today's NFL. He and Trent Williams are arguably the best tackle tandem in the NFL. If Polumbus isn't starting for us in 2014 it should mean he was either injured or we made some blockbuster move to get a mega star RT.

The fact that the offensive line needs to be rebuilt and that only 1 starter from 2013 will be a 'starter' here in 2015 is not a reflection on a particular player - it's just that the new HC and OC feel a need to use different players .... this is the NFL - players change teams all the time

all the guys that started on the Redskins O line in 2013 EXCEPT for Trent Williams NEED to be replaced as soon as possible - they might be good players somewhere else

it seems VERY OBVIOUS the new coaching staff feels a need to make changes and I agree with them

Because he's just decent. And as fans, when your team sucks, people blame the "just decent" guys. The thinking is we can do better than decent. The reality is, whose out there? As of right now, not much. So, the logical thought is to look at the Draft. The goal is to improve, and it would be pure comedy to suggest that we can't improve at the Right Tackle position. The debate is just who and when?

As of right now, the only non-debatable guys on our roster in my view are: RGIII, Trent Williams, Alfred Morris, Pierre Garcon, Jordan Reed, Brian Orakpo, Ryan Kerrigan, Perry Riley, D Hall & now Hatcher. Those are the only guys who don't need to be looked at as upgradeable. We obviously can't upgrade everybody. Maybe Polumbus stays. But, to say he's beyond criticism is a joke. He's just a guy.

Btw - PFF is the same site that had him rated the #77 Right Tackle out of 80 the prior year. Who knows what their method is, or how they wind up with their rankings. They're a website. Give me a Coach's Poll or GM Poll and let's talk. But, I doubt any fanbase, new coach, or GM is saying, "Oh, we got Tyler Polumbus? Sweeet. Set at Right Tackle." He's subject to scrutiny and it's deserved. Show me a stat for getting pushed back into the QB's face, or the number of times he has to scramble out to his right side because you're getting mauled.

The Hogster wrote:Btw - PFF is the same site that had him rated the #77 Right Tackle out of 80 the prior year. Who knows what their method is, or how they wind up with their rankings. They're a website. Give me a Coach's Poll or GM Poll and let's talk. But, I doubt any fanbase, new coach, or GM is saying, "Oh, we got Tyler Polumbus? Sweeet. Set at Right Tackle." He's subject to scrutiny and it's deserved. Show me a stat for getting pushed back into the QB's face, or the number of times he has to scramble out to his right side because you're getting mauled.

lmao. Yeah, that is probably the best answer on here to the original question.

I was a little disappointed when Gruden first came in and seemed to indicate that given the players we had on the line, he planned to stick with the ZBS, etc; They seem to be taking a different course in free agency with the players they've been looking at.

Btw you mentioned Morris as one of the "non-debatable" guys on the roster. Don't get me wrong on this, because I'm a big fan of Morris, but I will be really curious to see if he is still the same "elite" player for Gruden. There is a history of RBs who excelled under Shanahan and went on to be average guys in other systems.

The Hogster wrote:As of right now, the only non-debatable guys on our roster in my view are: RGIII, Trent Williams, Alfred Morris, Pierre Garcon, Jordan Reed, Brian Orakpo, Ryan Kerrigan, Perry Riley, D Hall & now Hatcher. Those are the only guys who don't need to be looked at as upgradeable.

To this list I'd add Barry Cofield, David Amerson, Darrel Young, and Kirk Cousins.

riggofan wrote: ... btw you mentioned Morris as one of the "non-debatable" guys on the roster. Don't get me wrong on this, because I'm a big fan of Morris, but I will be really curious to see if he is still the same "elite" player for Gruden. There is a history of RBs who excelled under Shanahan and went on to be average guys in other systems.

there are players that 'fit' certain systems and then there are players that have "IT" - Alfred will prove he's not just another 'system player' - this guy gets it

Scott and Jay will utilize his running ability - Alfred and RG will find a way to make it all work

SkinsJock wrote:

riggofan wrote: ... btw you mentioned Morris as one of the "non-debatable" guys on the roster. Don't get me wrong on this, because I'm a big fan of Morris, but I will be really curious to see if he is still the same "elite" player for Gruden. There is a history of RBs who excelled under Shanahan and went on to be average guys in other systems.

there are players that 'fit' certain systems and then there are players that have "IT" - Alfred will prove he's not just another 'system player' - this guy gets it

Yep. I'm optimistic about him for that reason too. He seems to be a hard working, strong character guy with a fantastic attitude. Now, we just need to see him prove it again on the field this fall, and we need to see that Gruden knows how to get the most out of him. ex. Will JG show patience and stick with the running game through the game? Those times early in the game when Morris isn't getting big chunks of yardage. Gotta stick with him!

Irn-Bru wrote:

The Hogster wrote:As of right now, the only non-debatable guys on our roster in my view are: RGIII, Trent Williams, Alfred Morris, Pierre Garcon, Jordan Reed, Brian Orakpo, Ryan Kerrigan, Perry Riley, D Hall & now Hatcher. Those are the only guys who don't need to be looked at as upgradeable.

To this list I'd add Barry Cofield, David Amerson, Darrel Young, and Kirk Cousins.

I would add them to my personal list too assuming that we keep using a FB. Also curious to see if they plan to use a 4 man line with Cofield, Hatcher, Baker & Bowen in the game at the same time. Interesting to see if Hatcher eats more into Jenkins' time, Bowen's time, or Cofield's (with Baker playing NT more).

Irn-Bru wrote:

The Hogster wrote:As of right now, the only non-debatable guys on our roster in my view are: RGIII, Trent Williams, Alfred Morris, Pierre Garcon, Jordan Reed, Brian Orakpo, Ryan Kerrigan, Perry Riley, D Hall & now Hatcher. Those are the only guys who don't need to be looked at as upgradeable.

To this list I'd add Barry Cofield, David Amerson, Darrel Young, and Kirk Cousins.

For purposes of using a draft pick only, I would add P.Thomas and Rambo to this list. I just don't see the wisdom in bringing in another rookie at a position that takes almost as much time as QB to get right when we have 2 second year players already there. Now FA would have been a different story, but at this point, only a stop gap measure like Clark is a viable option to me. If we draft a Safety before 4th or 5th round, it had better be the second coming of S. Taylor.

Although, come to think of it, since those two were taken in the 4th and 6th round last year, it wouldn't be impossible to cut one of them this/next year if we did draft a safety who was better this year. Hmmm.

emoses14 wrote:Although, come to think of it, since those two were taken in the 4th and 6th round last year, it wouldn't be impossible to cut one of them this/next year if we did draft a safety who was better this year. Hmmm.

I agree with both of your posts. I suspect Thomas is here to stay. Rambo might be fighting for a job, but that wouldn't be the end of the world. No one expects a 6th rounder to provide much value, and if we drafted a safety within the first four rounds I would anticipate Rambo might rightfully start sweating.

At this point, I'm all chips in on the "Best Player Available" approach. Last year, the consensus was we needed a Safety to fill a "need" - we wound up drafting a Tight End, and he ended up making the most impact. We need good players at all positions. The gut of this team is pretty much here already whether we like it or not.

I for one think we are much closer to the 10-6 team of 2012 than we are to a 3-13 team with the main piece being RGIII's knee being healthy. We've got to improve on defense.

riggofan wrote:

The Hogster wrote:Btw - PFF is the same site that had him rated the #77 Right Tackle out of 80 the prior year. Who knows what their method is, or how they wind up with their rankings. They're a website. Give me a Coach's Poll or GM Poll and let's talk. But, I doubt any fanbase, new coach, or GM is saying, "Oh, we got Tyler Polumbus? Sweeet. Set at Right Tackle." He's subject to scrutiny and it's deserved. Show me a stat for getting pushed back into the QB's face, or the number of times he has to scramble out to his right side because you're getting mauled.

lmao. Yeah, that is probably the best answer on here to the original question.

I was a little disappointed when Gruden first came in and seemed to indicate that given the players we had on the line, he planned to stick with the ZBS, etc; They seem to be taking a different course in free agency with the players they've been looking at.

Btw you mentioned Morris as one of the "non-debatable" guys on the roster. Don't get me wrong on this, because I'm a big fan of Morris, but I will be really curious to see if he is still the same "elite" player for Gruden. There is a history of RBs who excelled under Shanahan and went on to be average guys in other systems.

I believe it was because of Morris ability to run like he does in the ZBS that he wants to stick with it and also continuity. The question I have is can Morris run and rack up yards in a smash mouth system? By the way...I agree with you. I was disappointed in sticking with the same scheme also.

Kilmer72 wrote: .. I believe it was because of Morris ability to run like he does in the ZBS that he (Gruden) wants to stick with it and also continuity. The question I have is can Morris run and rack up yards in a smash mouth system? By the way...I agree with you. I was disappointed in sticking with the same scheme also.

The ONLY thing that matters about the offense this season is that it will be different than the offense we had here last season - it will be better

Jay Gruden and the new OC will make the changes needed - the O line will be much improved and more effective ... although, that will not be hard


Both Alfred and Robert are going to have very good seasons mainly because Scott & Jay will have a better offensive scheme for them

SkinsJock wrote:Jay Gruden and the new OC will make the changes needed

Unless they fail.

SkinsJock wrote:the O line will be much improved and more effective

Unless they're not.

SkinsJock wrote:Both Alfred and Robert are going to have very good seasons

Unless they disappoint.

SkinsJock wrote:mainly because Scott & Jay will have a better offensive scheme for them

Unless they don't.

Just trying to temper your unbridled optimism a little bit.

Skinsfan55 wrote:Every Redskins fan seems to be taking a dump all over Polumbus these days. Most were going as far as saying that Bruce Campbell was his replacement (an absolutely laughable claim, considering that Campbell hasn't done a single thing in the NFL apart from being a combine warrior.)

What is the average Redskins fan's beef with our incumbent RT anyway? Tyler Polumbus was extremely effective last season.

* He committed only one penalty
* Allowed only 4 sacks
* Allowed only 9 hits
* Showed huge strides in pass blocking
* Was rated as Pro Football Focus' 6th best RT in 2013

Sure, his run blocking leaves a little to be desired... but he's a smart player, who doesn't draw flags and who was an absolutely outstanding pass blocker. In today's league, a RT doesn't just become a run blocker. Passing rules today's NFL. He and Trent Williams are arguably the best tackle tandem in the NFL. If Polumbus isn't starting for us in 2014 it should mean he was either injured or we made some blockbuster move to get a mega star RT.

Dude, you can't be serious right? I understand that points that you state in your post, but let me ask you a serious question, how many times have you seen him get beat? Seems to me I saw every other passing play was some sort of problem directly related to him. Let's also face the truth that he has TERRIBLE technique, doesn't get any leverage on defensive lineman that rush the passer. One would think that as big as this guy is he would have some nasty streak. Seems to me he has no fire and only made the team and started because of the unfair Cap Penalty. I don't see him nor Chester starting on 99% of all other teams and doubt they would even make the 53 man roster on 40% of all the other teams in the NFL. It's time for us to move away from the Tyler experiment, and its also time to cut Chester as well. They both from what I have seen are terrible, most likely the worst right side offensive line in the NFL.

riggofan wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Jay Gruden and the new OC will make the changes needed

Unless they fail.

SkinsJock wrote:the O line will be much improved and more effective

Unless they're not.

SkinsJock wrote:Both Alfred and Robert are going to have very good seasons

Unless they disappoint.

SkinsJock wrote:mainly because Scott & Jay will have a better offensive scheme for them

Unless they don't.

Just trying to temper your unbridled optimism a little bit.

I wouldn't call it "unbridled optimism" ... but ... the combination of having a FO that will add to what is already here and that the players will benefit from a better 'team' approach to coaching and game planning/preparation than we had last season will result in better play and a better attitude

we have some good players to build around - it will not be hard for these guys to get more out of the roster that we'll end up with this season

there is no way that these guys come in and not make changes for the better and not do a better job than what Mike (& Kyle) did last season - no way

we're not going to dominate the NFC Least but we're going to see improvement in play and attitude from the players and coaches

SkinsJock wrote:we have some good players to build around - it will not be hard for these guys to get more out of the roster that we'll end up with this season

there is no way that these guys come in and not make changes for the better and not do a better job than what Mike (& Kyle) did last season - no way

Just giving you a hard time.

Unlike Shanahan, Gruden gets to start this year clear of the cap penalty and with a healthy RGIII. I'm not ready to proclaim that he's going to do a better job or be a better coach than Mike. But if he can't do better than 3-13 this year, then we have some serious problems.