The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

FanofallthatisGibbs wrote:Simple solution:

Just like when you go skydiving, skiing or bungee jumping - sign a release. The NFL should have all of its players sign releases as a part of their contracts to protect themselves from the natural elements of the game. Let the players make their choices.

I guess the Players Union would never stand for it, but c'mon man, you're a football player and you know the dangers! You also know the money you'll see that 99% of the population will never see.

I think players are more angry at owners getting rich at the expense of their bodies, and I get that. But really, while I sympathize with the damage done, you also knew the risks going in.

Should military personnel sue the US Government every time they are injured or suffer from psychological trauma?

44diesel wrote:Skydiving, bungee jumping, or other activities that require signing a waiver are done only on occasion for recreation and therefor your exposure to the dangers, although real, are limited.

Professional football players are subjected to the risk on a regular basis.

The Hogster wrote:He didn't get those concussions in the 90-91 season.

Countertrey wrote:

The Hogster wrote:He didn't get those concussions in the 90-91 season.

That was an awesome O-line performance... awesome.

44diesel wrote:

FanofallthatisGibbs wrote:Simple solution:

Just like when you go skydiving, skiing or bungee jumping - sign a release. The NFL should have all of its players sign releases as a part of their contracts to protect themselves from the natural elements of the game. Let the players make their choices.

I guess the Players Union would never stand for it, but c'mon man, you're a football player and you know the dangers! You also know the money you'll see that 99% of the population will never see.

I think players are more angry at owners getting rich at the expense of their bodies, and I get that. But really, while I sympathize with the damage done, you also knew the risks going in.

Should military personnel sue the US Government every time they are injured or suffer from psychological trauma?

Skydiving, bungee jumping, or other activities that require signing a waiver are done only on occasion for recreation and therefor your exposure to the dangers, although real, are limited.

Professional football players are subjected to the risk on a regular basis. As for the money players get, I'll give you that many modern players make more than some small countries but that's not the case for most of the older players who have been involved in these claims. With how much money the NFL makes today I think that they should take care of those guys that helped get the league where it is today. The NFL does not have a severance package or retirement plans. Once your contract is up, so's your paycheck.

Sadly, there are even players in the Hall of Fame who never had an endorsement deal, never made a small fortune and are now in need of assisted living, and have numerous medical aliments that can't afford treatment. These guys played for the love of the game. There weren't as many rules in place for players safety nor was the equipment as advanced as it is today.

As for our troops, I think the govt. should do more for the young people who have risked their lives to protect our freedoms. I wouldn't necessarily even begin to compare their extreme sacrifice to an athlete who plays a recreational sport, but I think there is a measure of responsibility that those who put someone in harms way should have a hand in their aftercare. (*edit - Especially if they financially benefit from it.)

Just my two cents.

Countertrey wrote:How would you change it, John? Penalize contact? Go to flag football rules? Rypen would have played exactly the same way, whether fully aware, or not. He enjoyed being thought of as one tough SOB...

I would suggest that if the NFL adequately cared for it's vets, there would not be a suit.

welch wrote:

Countertrey wrote:How would you change it, John? Penalize contact? Go to flag football rules? Rypen would have played exactly the same way, whether fully aware, or not. He enjoyed being thought of as one tough SOB...

I would suggest that if the NFL adequately cared for it's vets, there would not be a suit.

I've been thinking about that. Maybe:

- training (don't lead with your helmet)

- penalize head-first tackles or blocks. You remember how Mike Bass nearly broke his neck...although I think Bass was trying to tackle with a shoulder-pad, and not square on his helmet.

- Maybe less padding. Seems wrong at first, but maybe there would be less concussions if the hitting player did not have so much padding underneath "plastic armor".

- On that, it would be interesting to know some statistics on concussions in the leather-helmet days. Maybe some from rugby, where there seems to be no padding at all.

Before I forget...I'd want to prevent these injuries. Yes, the players should be compensated fairly, but money doesn't make up for a player's having dementia at 45 or 50.

Alex Karras puts face on lawsuit over head injuries in the NFL

By Associated Press, Published: April 14

There’s a new face behind the head injury lawsuits against the NFL, a former All-Pro defensive tackle from the Detroit Lions some may recognize better as the lovable lug of a father from the 1980s sitcom “Webster.”

Before that, Alex Karras played the equally lovable Mongo in “Blazing Saddles,” uttering one of the movie’s best lines when he declared: “Mongo only pawn in game of life.”

He’s 76 now, and suffering from dementia. His wife said this week that a man who used to love to drive his cars can no longer get behind the wheel. She said a man who used to be an amazing cook of Italian and Greek food doesn’t cook anymore because he can’t remember what his recipes were.

He’s among 1,200 former players now suing the NFL, claiming the league misled players about the risks of head injuries and was negligent about their treatment. Many of them are suffering from brain damage, and none of them are getting any better.

For the most part, fans seem to have pretty much discarded them as yesterday’s news. They would rather focus on whether the Cleveland Browns should draft an offensive lineman in the fourth round than whether a former journeyman linebacker or backup safety can tie his shoes or remember what house he lives in.

“It’s the same thing as back in the gladiator days when the gladiators fought to death,” said attorney Craig Mitnick, who represents Karras and hundreds of others in the suit. “Fans care about these guys when they’re playing and they are heroes. But as soon as you’re not a hero and not playing the fan doesn’t really care what happens to them.”

Maybe it’s time we started caring. Debate the merits of the suit all you want — and the NFL will certainly do so — there’s no doubt a lot of former players are paying the price for taking hits to the head during a time when the significance of concussions was either minimized or not entirely known.

Some you may not have ever heard of, or have long forgotten about. Others were once your heroes, taking the field every Sunday for a big paycheck and the chance to bring glory to the franchise.

Jim McMahon was one of those guys. The quarterback who helped bring Chicago a Super Bowl championship was a rebel who clashed with the league, and a fan favorite who prided himself on his toughness and ability to take a hit. Now his girlfriend programs the GPS for their house in case he gets lost, and he gets angry and frustrated at all the things he can’t recall.

“I won’t remember a hell of a lot about this interview in about 10 minutes,” he said in a recent interview on ESPN’s “Outside The Lines.”

Tony Dorsett is a Hall of Famer and one of the greatest running backs in the history of the league. At 57 he’s still relatively young, but the former Dallas Cowboy already forgets people’s names or where he’s heading while driving on the highway. Doctors have told him he’s not getting enough oxygen in the left lobe of his brain, and he fears his memory issues are getting worse.


Yet he and other retirees have no medical insurance from the league, no compensation for their deteriorating health other than the money they earned while they were in the field.

“Yeah, I understand you paid me to do this, but still yet, I put my life on the line for you, I put my health on the line,” Dorsett told The Associated Press just before the Super Bowl. “And yet when the time comes, you turn your back on me? That’s not right. That’s not the American way.”

FanofallthatisGibbs wrote:Still not a fan of them suing, although I completely understand why they are doing it.

What does not sit well with me is that they do not have health insurance coverage from the league. That is one area that the NFL should have conceded a long time ago to minimize bad PR now and in the future. All business aside, it's the right thing to do.

The Players Union should, and perhaps already have renegotiated such a thing, where all players are guaranteed health insurance coverage for themselves and their families as a part of a retirement package upon a minimum level of years played (say, 3-5 minimum).

It might cost the NFL a lot, but it would cost them a lot less than lawsuits, lawyers, etc. It would also benefit the people who served the NFL, not hot shot lawyers looking to make a name for themselves.

I feel for the families. I have known family members to have demensia, and it set in around 60 for my grandmother who lived to the age of 92. That was a long time to go with some serious mental challenges that got progressively worse. I am just not sure how much the NFL is at fault here or liable for the damage done to the players.

FanofallthatisGibbs wrote:What you point out is all true.

Re: lawyers - It's mostly a case of one or two bad apples spoiling the bunch. And those are usually found most often in high profile cases, which I would include this class action lawsuit. They leverage publicity, human emotion, and whatever else they can muster to jack up the award, and in doing so pick up an even bigger paycheck. It's their job. I don't always find it ethical.

I am all for justice. Just remember who is paying all the bills at the end of the day - the ticket holders. Personally, I miss the days of affordable professional sports. For that I now have to have a house party, which while fun is just not the same.

EDIT: And congrats on the new addition last July! I have a 1.5 year old daughter myself. Kids are a blessing!

Alex Karras puts face on lawsuit over head injuries in the NFL

By Associated Press, Published: April 14

There’s a new face behind the head injury lawsuits against the NFL, a former All-Pro defensive tackle from the Detroit Lions some may recognize better as the lovable lug of a father from the 1980s sitcom “Webster.”

Before that, Alex Karras played the equally lovable Mongo in “Blazing Saddles,” uttering one of the movie’s best lines when he declared: “Mongo only pawn in game of life.”

He’s 76 now, and suffering from dementia. His wife said this week that a man who used to love to drive his cars can no longer get behind the wheel. She said a man who used to be an amazing cook of Italian and Greek food doesn’t cook anymore because he can’t remember what his recipes were.

He’s among 1,200 former players now suing the NFL, claiming the league misled players about the risks of head injuries and was negligent about their treatment. Many of them are suffering from brain damage, and none of them are getting any better.

welch wrote:What hits me hard is that the NFL makes a staggering amount of money, limited by nothing. The owners control the salary cap, so they control the vital cost of doing business. Their business rests on the way guys like Karras and Dorsett and Lem Barney and Rypien play.

At the minimum, the players ought to have health insurance.

Oh, and I blame the owners for ticket prices, and the price of beer and food at the stadium.

An old story about old-time football. George Preston Marshall, "the founder", owned about 70 or 80% of the Redskins. A broadcaster named Harry Wismer owned about 20%. Wismer never got a dividend, because Marshall claimed that the Redskins never made any money. When Marshall had a stroke (more or less), it was discovered that the Redskins made a nice profit every season, which Marshall simply marked as his salary as president of the club, or used to buy a townhouse in each NFL city so Marshall had a place to put his girlfriends.

The guy with power-of-attorney had sold Wismer's 20% to a Canadian department store mogul. The Redskins began to use the profits to buy down Marshall's share of the team. The Canadian guy, who was running a basketball team in LA, owned more of the Redskins each year. That's how Jack Kent Cooke came to be majority owner as Edward Bennett Williams directed the Redskins in the '60s and '70s.