The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Why is this guy still kicking for us? He's been the absolute worst kicker in the league 2 years in a row. He's not only inconsistent on FGs, but he's had several kicks blocked, and has kicked off out of bounds 2 out of the last 3 weeks.

Put simply, this guy sucks and there has to be someone, whether a FA or a guy in college, that can kick better than this guy.

Why is he still on the team?

Is he Shanahan's nephew?

Does he have embarrassing pictures of Snyder?

What gives?

The Hogster wrote:Why is this guy still kicking for us? He's been the absolute worst kicker in the league 2 years in a row. He's not only inconsistent on FGs, but he's had several kicks blocked, and has kicked off out of bounds 2 out of the last 3 weeks.

The blocked kicks were not his fault, per the Redskins coaches; they were blocking issues. He has flubbed a few kickoffs this year when the coaches have him trying to pin a team in the corner. Whenever he's told to boom it out of the end zone, he's one of the best in the league at doing just that. And aside from those three flubs, our kickoffs have been excellent — one of the few bright spots of this season.

His record on FGs speaks for itself. However, due to his positives and his youth, I do not think it's sufficient reason to want him gone this instant. My position is that we should bring in the best competition we can find for next year's camp, and keep the better performer after preseason. Simple.

Put simply, this guy sucks and there has to be someone, whether a FA or a guy in college, that can kick better than this guy.

Why is he still on the team?

He's still on the team because he earned the spot in preseason, and the chances of replacing him mid-season with a better player are slim. He has enough positives and upside, and the coaches are thankfully cool-headed and patient enough, that we haven't needed to throw our special teams into chaos.

The people who like to hate on Gano should just wait until next September. If he's gone by then, you all will be happy. If he's not gone, you can either try to make the argument that we didn't bring in real competition, or you can let the bitterness and hatred eat away at your soul. But personally, I still like his huge leg and upside. I think there's a decent chance his accuracy will improve with time.

Irn Bru wrote:

The blocked kicks were not his fault, per the Redskins coaches; they were blocking issues. He has flubbed a few kickoffs this year when the coaches have him trying to pin a team in the corner. Whenever he's told to boom it out of the end zone, he's one of the best in the league at doing just that. And aside from those three flubs, our kickoffs have been excellent — one of the few bright spots of this season.

His record on FGs speaks for itself. However, due to his positives and his youth, I do not think it's sufficient reason to want him gone this instant. My position is that we should bring in the best competition we can find for next year's camp, and keep the better performer after preseason. Simple.

I'll concede on your point about the blocks. Blocking was the issue. However, I am not sold on his "big leg" for kickoffs. The rule changes make kicking a Touchback less impressive and more normal. Every team has directional kick strategies. It's not Danny Smith's fault that Gano can't do it without shanking it out of bounds.

As for his Field Goal Kicking--which is the hallmark of any top Kicker--Gano is miserable.

This year, he is ranked 32 out of 32--dead arse last--in Field Goal Percentage. He has a 71 % average. The league leaders are all above 90% and the mean for the league is in the high 80s. This guy is as bad as it gets in FGs.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/playe ... eldGoalPct

I guess that's improvement though, because last season he was dead last again with a 68% Field Goal Percentage. At the end of the day, if you're consistently the absolute worst at your job, you don't deserve to have it any longer.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/playe ... /year/2010

Needless to say, I disagree with your defense of this kid. When you are already dead last, it's tough to convince me that it gets any worse.

The Hogster wrote:Needless to say, I disagree with your defense of this kid. When you are already dead last, it can't get any worse.

It can get worse. People said that it couldn't get worse than Grossman...and then we saw John Beck. It CAN get worse.

- what's the point of swapping him out now, the season is basically over?
- i'm sure the skins aren't ignoring some all-star kicker in free agency
- competition will be brought in during the off-season

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:Needless to say, I disagree with your defense of this kid. When you are already dead last, it can't get any worse.

It can get worse. People said that it couldn't get worse than Grossman...and then we saw John Beck. It CAN get worse.

- what's the point of swapping him out now, the season is basically over?
- i'm sure the skins aren't ignoring some all-star kicker in free agency
- competition will be brought in during the off-season

Well yes, it can get worse in theory. If they brought me in to kick, I would suck worse than he does. But, Shayne Graham, who was his "competition" this season, has kicked much better than this over his career. It's not a stretch to think that he would be an upgrade.

There is no point in swapping him out if you're looking for it to impact our record. But, it does send a message that if you suck @$$ that's not tolerable. Shanahan holds his QBs and other players to that standard. Why not the kicker?

Gano has gotten a pass. Plain & simple. It's about consistency in leadership for me. I can't defend trotting out a guy who has basically proven that he's awful.

Irn-Bru wrote:

The Hogster wrote:Why is this guy still kicking for us? He's been the absolute worst kicker in the league 2 years in a row. He's not only inconsistent on FGs, but he's had several kicks blocked, and has kicked off out of bounds 2 out of the last 3 weeks.

The blocked kicks were not his fault, per the Redskins coaches; they were blocking issues. He has flubbed a few kickoffs this year when the coaches have him trying to pin a team in the corner. Whenever he's told to boom it out of the end zone, he's one of the best in the league at doing just that. And aside from those three flubs, our kickoffs have been excellent — one of the few bright spots of this season.

His record on FGs speaks for itself. However, due to his positives and his youth, I do not think it's sufficient reason to want him gone this instant. My position is that we should bring in the best competition we can find for next year's camp, and keep the better performer after preseason. Simple.

Put simply, this guy sucks and there has to be someone, whether a FA or a guy in college, that can kick better than this guy.

Why is he still on the team?

He's still on the team because he earned the spot in preseason, and the chances of replacing him mid-season with a better player are slim. He has enough positives and upside, and the coaches are thankfully cool-headed and patient enough, that we haven't needed to throw our special teams into chaos.

The people who like to hate on Gano should just wait until next September. If he's gone by then, you all will be happy. If he's not gone, you can either try to make the argument that we didn't bring in real competition, or you can let the bitterness and hatred eat away at your soul. But personally, I still like his huge leg and upside. I think there's a decent chance his accuracy will improve with time.

Plus 1 to this post. Too much upside to give up on with all the other problems we have.

DarthMonk

How many play golf? How many of you hit a slice just by being a little lazy with your grip? Well its very similar to kicking. He just needs to hone his craft but you can't take away that he has a powerful leg.

Men lie. Women lie. Numbers don't.

He's terrible.

I see no point in replacing him now. We have had a history of releasing young, inconsistent kickers who needed time to develop into the pro game (and yes, kickers do need to develop) -- see Akers. While I don't think Gano is Akers, he did perform well in the beginning of the year.

Regardless, the season is over. Losing our remaining games basically gives us the ability to draft the second QB taken after Luck. If this were a playoff team, I wouldn't see an issue with bringing in a kicker to compete with Gano during the week, but this is not the case.

I don't see the point in making player moves to improve the team. We are basically playing for draft picks at this point. While I did see an issue with "not trying to win" prior to losing our 8th game -- at this point it is in our best interests to lose the remainder of our games. Because if we win one more game this year, Miami will draft in front of us and we will be delegated to the 3rd QB in the draft.

Shayne Graham did horrible in the preseason. Gano did not. That is why we're stuck with Gano at least until next year. There's no reason to release him with four games left in a season that's already over.

Nobody here is against bringing in competition. We aren't against possibly releasing him if someone is better. The majority of us are tired of just quitting on things and always thinking the grass will be greener. Let's let these guys grow, while the entire team is growing with them. It's not like we're a SB bound team with a kicker screwing it all up.

The Hogster wrote:However, I am not sold on his "big leg" for kickoffs. The rule changes make kicking a Touchback less impressive and more normal. Every team has directional kick strategies. It's not Danny Smith's fault that Gano can't do it without shanking it out of bounds.

Touchbacks are more common but Gano is still above average in the league in kicking them.

The only reason he isn't top-tier in touchbacks is because more often than not we opt to do directional kicking. Why? Because Gano has a big enough leg to kick it down to the goal line with plenty of hang time, allowing our coverage to get down there. The result? The Redskins have been #1 in kick coverage all year.

IMO you are letting two kickoffs out of bounds and Gano's poor FG performance cloud your judgment of his kickoff abilities. He has been very good on kickoffs for us this year, and he does have a big leg.

This year, he is ranked 32 out of 32--dead arse last--in Field Goal Percentage.

He's tied at the bottom and in the same basic neighborhood as about 5 other kickers. I don't think anyone is saying he hasn't disappointed hugely on FGs.

I guess that's improvement though, because last season he was dead last again with a 68% Field Goal Percentage. At the end of the day, if you're consistently the absolute worst at your job, you don't deserve to have it any longer.

Younger players sometimes need time to develop. I'm not saying that Gano is a great kicker. I'm not saying that Gano has earned a spot next year. All I'm saying is that he's shown enough positives and has enough upside that he deserves another shot at the roster spot in camp. I'm also saying it doesn't make any sense to try to replace him at the very end of a lost season with whatever we can find scraping around the bottom of the barrel.

I really don't see what's so controversial about this.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Nobody here is against bringing in competition. We aren't against possibly releasing him if someone is better. The majority of us are tired of just quitting on things and always thinking the grass will be greener. Let's let these guys grow, while the entire team is growing with them. It's not like we're a SB bound team with a kicker screwing it all up.

Trust me. I know we aren't going anywhere this year. It's not like I think a new kicker will fix us. It won't.

I'm also not going to say we should keep him basically because he sucks and we need him to help us lose.

I want Shanahan to be consistent. If you suck, you're gone. It can't be a rule that applies to everyone but Gano. Gano is young, but he's entering his 4TH year as a pro. He's basically shown you that he is a 7 out of 10 kicker. That's not good enough by a long shot.

David Akers is a bad example. He played 1 game for the Skins and missed 2 kicks. That was an over reaction to cut him. Gano has played 2 years, and has kicked 71 Field Goals.

Hardly an over reaction if he's let go.

The Hogster wrote:I want Shanahan to be consistent.

I think he is, kickers don't have that many chances to prove themselves. U can't judge him on the same scale that U judge another player who gets 40+ snaps.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:Needless to say, I disagree with your defense of this kid. When you are already dead last, it can't get any worse.

It can get worse. People said that it couldn't get worse than Grossman...and then we saw John Beck. It CAN get worse.

- what's the point of swapping him out now, the season is basically over?
- I'm sure the skins aren't ignoring some all-star kicker in free agency
- competition will be brought in during the off-season

I'm with Chris & FFA on this - let's wait and try to get this right

bring in some other kickers NEXT year and see if any of them can beat this kid out

I think Gano has a big time leg and will win the job back next year

SkinsJock wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:Needless to say, I disagree with your defense of this kid. When you are already dead last, it can't get any worse.

It can get worse. People said that it couldn't get worse than Grossman...and then we saw John Beck. It CAN get worse.

- what's the point of swapping him out now, the season is basically over?
- I'm sure the skins aren't ignoring some all-star kicker in free agency
- competition will be brought in during the off-season

I'm with Chris & FFA on this - let's wait and try to get this right

bring in some other kickers NEXT year and see if any of them can beat this kid out

I think Gano has a big time leg and will win the job back next year

Guys, I get all of that. And Skins Jock, you're probably right. And, that is my point. Gano has won offseason competitions before. He also apparently looks good in practice. But, when the pressure is on, he is 7-10.

If you've ever done anything anxiety provoking like play a sport, speak publicly, perform in front of a crowd, you will appreciate how nerves and pressure affects performance for some people.

Gano has a big leg. Fact. Gano has won practice competitions. Fact. In games, Gano has missed 3-4 out of every 10 kicks over 2 years. Fact. That's terrible.

I'm not in favor of hanging onto a guy who has performance anxiety waiting for him to grow out of it. We are a team that will be in close games next year. We can't afford to have a guy--who could literally win or lose a game--be as inconsistent as Graham.

StorminMormon86 wrote:Shayne Graham did horrible in the preseason. Gano did not. That is why we're stuck with Gano at least until next year. There's no reason to release him with four games left in a season that's already over.

Thankfully, there are only 3 games left in this season.

The Hogster wrote:I'm not in favor of hanging onto a guy who has performance anxiety waiting for him to grow out of it. We are a team that will be in close games next year. We can't afford to have a guy--who could literally win or lose a game--be as inconsistent as Graham.

That's fair. I just don't see the point of getting rid of him at the moment. Ride it out the rest of the year, this is just further auditioning for him.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:I want Shanahan to be consistent.

I think he is, kickers don't have that many chances to prove themselves. U can't judge him on the same scale that U judge another player who gets 40+ snaps.

I feel you on that. But, how many kicks does it take to get a good read on him? He's sitting at 71 right now about to wrap up his 3rd season in the NFL.

Kickers are not a dime a dozen. But, there are guys in college and in Free Agency who can make more than 70 percent of their FGs.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:I'm not in favor of hanging onto a guy who has performance anxiety waiting for him to grow out of it. We are a team that will be in close games next year. We can't afford to have a guy--who could literally win or lose a game--be as inconsistent as Graham.

That's fair. I just don't see the point of getting rid of him at the moment. Ride it out the rest of the year, this is just further auditioning for him.

I hear that. If he wins the competition next year though, I will really wonder who is bringing in the competition.

Irn-Bru wrote:

The Hogster wrote:However, I am not sold on his "big leg" for kickoffs. The rule changes make kicking a Touchback less impressive and more normal. Every team has directional kick strategies. It's not Danny Smith's fault that Gano can't do it without shanking it out of bounds.

Touchbacks are more common but Gano is still above average in the league in kicking them.

The only reason he isn't top-tier in touchbacks is because more often than not we opt to do directional kicking. Why? Because Gano has a big enough leg to kick it down to the goal line with plenty of hang time, allowing our coverage to get down there. The result? The Redskins have been #1 in kick coverage all year.

IMO you are letting two kickoffs out of bounds and Gano's poor FG performance cloud your judgment of his kickoff abilities. He has been very good on kickoffs for us this year, and he does have a big leg.

This year, he is ranked 32 out of 32--dead arse last--in Field Goal Percentage.

He's tied at the bottom and in the same basic neighborhood as about 5 other kickers. I don't think anyone is saying he hasn't disappointed hugely on FGs.

I guess that's improvement though, because last season he was dead last again with a 68% Field Goal Percentage. At the end of the day, if you're consistently the absolute worst at your job, you don't deserve to have it any longer.

Younger players sometimes need time to develop. I'm not saying that Gano is a great kicker. I'm not saying that Gano has earned a spot next year. All I'm saying is that he's shown enough positives and has enough upside that he deserves another shot at the roster spot in camp. I'm also saying it doesn't make any sense to try to replace him at the very end of a lost season with whatever we can find scraping around the bottom of the barrel.

I really don't see what's so controversial about this.

What you are saying isn't controversial. I actually agree with part of it. I'm just saying, from a coaching standpoint, I'd like to see the leash be just as short on Gano as it is on Rocky McIntosh, Rex Grossman, Anthony Armstrong or any other player that Shanahan replaces due to performance.

The Hogster wrote:I hear that. If he wins the competition next year though, I will really wonder who is bringing in the competition.

and I wouldn't blame U.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:I'm not in favor of hanging onto a guy who has performance anxiety waiting for him to grow out of it. We are a team that will be in close games next year. We can't afford to have a guy--who could literally win or lose a game--be as inconsistent as Graham.

That's fair. I just don't see the point of getting rid of him at the moment. Ride it out the rest of the year, this is just further auditioning for him.

I will add that the teams coach is going to get a little more scrutiny this off season as well

I agree with the assessment but there is little more to go on - bring in the kickers and let the best man win

I would think that past performances will be factored in - a lot of things that have gone wrong have not all been on Gano


I would hope that EVERY player AND coach gets a thorough evaluation

3 coaches that need to do better jobs - Kyle, Jim and Danny Smith

PAPDOG67 wrote:Thankfully, there are only 3 games left in this season.

You mean you're not thinking playoffs?

The Hogster wrote:I'm just saying, from a coaching standpoint, I'd like to see the leash be just as short on Gano as it is on Rocky McIntosh, Rex Grossman, Anthony Armstrong or any other player that Shanahan replaces due to performance.

The leash can't be as short on Gano because we don't carry two kickers on the roster (and it would be crazy to do so). You can't just bench Gano and send in the other guy; there is no other guy without us paying a high price.

Look, Gano was the best kicker on the team this offseason. He won his spot and since then hasn't performed. Cutting him now would be to take on a sizeable risk without much upside, and at any rate it wouldn't accomplish anything that waiting until the offseason couldn't accomplish.

The fact that Gano is on the team isn't a coaching failure. A coaching failure would be to have a "short leash" and risk throwing our special teams into confusion over nothing.