The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

If someone on the Redskins' offense or coaching staff displayed the tiniest bit of competence or actual desire to win.

That would be cool.

Hey Fort Worth, How about this 70 degree weather!

Yes, I agree we look like crap, worse every week.

garbage...

Are the assistant coaches (OC & DC) subject to questioning after games, or does the HC always run interference to deflect those questions? If so, then what would be cool would be to ask HC Shanny, "How is it possible for your OC to develop a game plan in which the offense scores absolutely no points and gives up 9 sacks against the 30th ranked D in the NFL?" And then, "Do you still feel confident in your OC's abilities? How about your DC?" And say BS to going back and looking a the tape. It was as plain as day. No need to go back and look at any tape to see that if that is what a whole week of practice and game-planning results in, then someone, players and coaches, just isn't capable of performing at an NFL level.

SCSkinsFan wrote:Are the assistant coaches (OC & DC) subject to questioning after games, or does the HC always run interference to deflect those questions? If so, then what would be cool would be to ask HC Shanny, "How is it possible for your OC to develop a game plan in which the offense scores absolutely no points and gives up 9 sacks against the 30th ranked D in the NFL?" And then, "Do you still feel confident in your OC's abilities? How about your DC?" And say BS to going back and looking a the tape. It was as plain as day. No need to go back and look at any tape to see that if that is what a whole week of practice and game-planning results in, then someone, players and coaches, just isn't capable of performing at an NFL level.

Thank you. Mike Shanahan is among the best of NFL coaches... but nepotism will be the end of him. Kyle cannot put an offensive game plan together, and cannot prepare a team. His offense has made several of the league's worst defenses look like world beaters... and it's clear that playcalling is as much of a problem as team preparation and talent.

OTOH, this is still a team in transition... Kyle is not the only problem. As a team in transition, we have a significant problem with depth, and still are not there in terms of starter talent at several positions, including quarterback... Those things will get corrected...

I'm just not convinced yet that Kyle Shanahan should be part of that future.

SCSkinsFan wrote:Are the assistant coaches (OC & DC) subject to questioning after games, or does the HC always run interference to deflect those questions? If so, then what would be cool would be to ask HC Shanny, "How is it possible for your OC to develop a game plan in which the offense scores absolutely no points and gives up 9 sacks against the 30th ranked D in the NFL?" And then, "Do you still feel confident in your OC's abilities? How about your DC?" And say BS to going back and looking a the tape. It was as plain as day. No need to go back and look at any tape to see that if that is what a whole week of practice and game-planning results in, then someone, players and coaches, just isn't capable of performing at an NFL level.

Coaching isn't the issue. The problem is our players, for the most part, are awful. Between our qb, running backs, wide receivers, and offensive line, how many would actually start for good NFL teams? I would argue very few. At this point, the online legit talent that we have on offense is Moss, whose injured, and Davis. Williams, also injured, and some others might get there someday, but aren't there yet.

Defense is better but still has issues. Our dline is average at best with nobody even coming close to being a dominant presence.

The linebackers are probably our best unit, but Fletcher is getting old; Orakpo is undisciplined and teams gash us running the ball to his side of the field; Kerrigan has a lot of potential but is only a rookie; and Rocky has been inconsistent.

The secondary is nothing special. Hall is overrated and Wilson looks like a nickle corner. Landry is very talented but still takes bad angles and goes for the big hit too often, and if you saw the exchange between him and Fletcher today, apparently he isn't following his assignments. Otogwe is a very good player.

The secondary is nothing special. Hall is overrated and Wilson looks like a nickle corner. Landry is very talented but still takes bad angles and goes for the big hit too often, and if you saw the exchange between him and Fletcher today, apparently he isn't following his assignments. Otogwe is a very good player.

That was on the second touchdown... It was clear that Fletch was furious that an assignment was blown... I've never seen him like that. Couldn't have been much fun being Landry just then.

I believe it's Coaches and Players that are the issue. Kyle Shanahan is showing that the only reason he is OC is because of Mike. I counted at least 3 times where we went with a Bunch formation and brought Helu out to the other side from the backfield. He needs to mix up more formations and run the ball more. We can't abandon the run just because we are only getting a few yards. Of course players is another issue, mainly our offensive line. Beck is never going to be an all-star QB, but even if Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers played behind our Oline they wouldn't be putting up Pro-Bowl numbers.

Also why is Donte Stallworth on our team?

HailSkins98 wrote:I believe it's Coaches and Players that are the issue.

Really? You don't think it's our cheerleadings or uniforms?

Sorry, just pickin on the new kid

chiefhog44 wrote:

HailSkins98 wrote:I believe it's Coaches and Players that are the issue.

Really? You don't think it's our cheerleadings or uniforms?

Sorry, just pickin on the new kid

Hey Chiefhog44, I should've been more specific my message was towards CanesSkins26 saying that coaching isn't the issue. Our cheerleaders are definitely not the issue.

HailSkins98 wrote:

chiefhog44 wrote:

HailSkins98 wrote:I believe it's Coaches and Players that are the issue.

Really? You don't think it's our cheerleadings or uniforms?

Sorry, just pickin on the new kid

Hey Chiefhog44, I should've been more specific my message was towards CanesSkins26 saying that coaching isn't the issue. Our cheerleaders are definitely not the issue.

Them's just jokes. I know what you meant

HailSkins98 wrote:I believe it's Coaches and Players that are the issue. Kyle Shanahan is showing that the only reason he is OC is because of Mike. I counted at least 3 times where we went with a Bunch formation and brought Helu out to the other side from the backfield. He needs to mix up more formations and run the ball more. We can't abandon the run just because we are only getting a few yards. Of course players is another issue, mainly our offensive line. Beck is never going to be an all-star QB, but even if Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers played behind our Oline they wouldn't be putting up Pro-Bowl numbers.

Also why is Donte Stallworth on our team?

Sure, there are some things that the coaches could do better. However, the main issue is talent. And you can't scheme around a lack of talent.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

SCSkinsFan wrote:Are the assistant coaches (OC & DC) subject to questioning after games, or does the HC always run interference to deflect those questions? If so, then what would be cool would be to ask HC Shanny, "How is it possible for your OC to develop a game plan in which the offense scores absolutely no points and gives up 9 sacks against the 30th ranked D in the NFL?" And then, "Do you still feel confident in your OC's abilities? How about your DC?" And say BS to going back and looking a the tape. It was as plain as day. No need to go back and look at any tape to see that if that is what a whole week of practice and game-planning results in, then someone, players and coaches, just isn't capable of performing at an NFL level.

Coaching isn't the issue. The problem is our players, for the most part, are awful. Between our qb, running backs, wide receivers, and offensive line, how many would actually start for good NFL teams? I would argue very few. At this point, the online legit talent that we have on offense is Moss, whose injured, and Davis. Williams, also injured, and some others might get there someday, but aren't there yet.

Defense is better but still has issues. Our dline is average at best with nobody even coming close to being a dominant presence.

The linebackers are probably our best unit, but Fletcher is getting old; Orakpo is undisciplined and teams gash us running the ball to his side of the field; Kerrigan has a lot of potential but is only a rookie; and Rocky has been inconsistent.

The secondary is nothing special. Hall is overrated and Wilson looks like a nickle corner. Landry is very talented but still takes bad angles and goes for the big hit too often, and if you saw the exchange between him and Fletcher today, apparently he isn't following his assignments. Otogwe is a very good player.

You really don't think coaching is part of the problem? Even Shanny said after the Panther's game that he needed to do a better job of getting his team prepared. And this is what they, the palyers and coaches, came up with after another week of preparation? Above-average coaches can develop a game plan to get the most of the talent available to them, get them to perform with maximum effort, and at least appear to be competitive on the field. I have seen little evidence of that in the last three cames since the bye week.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

HailSkins98 wrote:I believe it's Coaches and Players that are the issue. Kyle Shanahan is showing that the only reason he is OC is because of Mike. I counted at least 3 times where we went with a Bunch formation and brought Helu out to the other side from the backfield. He needs to mix up more formations and run the ball more. We can't abandon the run just because we are only getting a few yards. Of course players is another issue, mainly our offensive line. Beck is never going to be an all-star QB, but even if Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers played behind our Oline they wouldn't be putting up Pro-Bowl numbers.

Also why is Donte Stallworth on our team?

Sure, there are some things that the coaches could do better. However, the main issue is talent. And you can't scheme around a lack of talent.

I tend to agree. I think it is safe to say that offensively, there was not one single player worth keeping out there besides maybe Davis. Really. I mean this. Name one other offensive player that is halfway decent? We literally do not have one single offensive player worth anything on this team.

I guess that's what happens when (for the past decade and a half) you've had an incompetent owner -- who didn't even play grade school football -- playing "GM".

SCSkinsFan wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

SCSkinsFan wrote:Are the assistant coaches (OC & DC) subject to questioning after games, or does the HC always run interference to deflect those questions? If so, then what would be cool would be to ask HC Shanny, "How is it possible for your OC to develop a game plan in which the offense scores absolutely no points and gives up 9 sacks against the 30th ranked D in the NFL?" And then, "Do you still feel confident in your OC's abilities? How about your DC?" And say BS to going back and looking a the tape. It was as plain as day. No need to go back and look at any tape to see that if that is what a whole week of practice and game-planning results in, then someone, players and coaches, just isn't capable of performing at an NFL level.

Coaching isn't the issue. The problem is our players, for the most part, are awful. Between our qb, running backs, wide receivers, and offensive line, how many would actually start for good NFL teams? I would argue very few. At this point, the online legit talent that we have on offense is Moss, whose injured, and Davis. Williams, also injured, and some others might get there someday, but aren't there yet.

Defense is better but still has issues. Our dline is average at best with nobody even coming close to being a dominant presence.

The linebackers are probably our best unit, but Fletcher is getting old; Orakpo is undisciplined and teams gash us running the ball to his side of the field; Kerrigan has a lot of potential but is only a rookie; and Rocky has been inconsistent.

The secondary is nothing special. Hall is overrated and Wilson looks like a nickle corner. Landry is very talented but still takes bad angles and goes for the big hit too often, and if you saw the exchange between him and Fletcher today, apparently he isn't following his assignments. Otogwe is a very good player.

You really don't think coaching is part of the problem? Even Shanny said after the Panther's game that he needed to do a better job of getting his team prepared.

Do you honestly believe that MS actually was telling you what he was really thinking??? That was him trying not to call the players out in a presser and making it appear he is taking responsibility. Come on man -- you should know better than that.

SCSkinsFan wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

SCSkinsFan wrote:Are the assistant coaches (OC & DC) subject to questioning after games, or does the HC always run interference to deflect those questions? If so, then what would be cool would be to ask HC Shanny, "How is it possible for your OC to develop a game plan in which the offense scores absolutely no points and gives up 9 sacks against the 30th ranked D in the NFL?" And then, "Do you still feel confident in your OC's abilities? How about your DC?" And say BS to going back and looking a the tape. It was as plain as day. No need to go back and look at any tape to see that if that is what a whole week of practice and game-planning results in, then someone, players and coaches, just isn't capable of performing at an NFL level.

Coaching isn't the issue. The problem is our players, for the most part, are awful. Between our qb, running backs, wide receivers, and offensive line, how many would actually start for good NFL teams? I would argue very few. At this point, the online legit talent that we have on offense is Moss, whose injured, and Davis. Williams, also injured, and some others might get there someday, but aren't there yet.

Defense is better but still has issues. Our dline is average at best with nobody even coming close to being a dominant presence.

The linebackers are probably our best unit, but Fletcher is getting old; Orakpo is undisciplined and teams gash us running the ball to his side of the field; Kerrigan has a lot of potential but is only a rookie; and Rocky has been inconsistent.

The secondary is nothing special. Hall is overrated and Wilson looks like a nickle corner. Landry is very talented but still takes bad angles and goes for the big hit too often, and if you saw the exchange between him and Fletcher today, apparently he isn't following his assignments. Otogwe is a very good player.

You really don't think coaching is part of the problem? Even Shanny said after the Panther's game that he needed to do a better job of getting his team prepared. And this is what they, the palyers and coaches, came up with after another week of preparation? Above-average coaches can develop a game plan to get the most of the talent available to them, get them to perform with maximum effort, and at least appear to be competitive on the field. I have seen little evidence of that in the last three cames since the bye week.

What do you expect Shanahan to say, "my players suck"? Just look at who we are throwing out there on offense...Beck, Armstrong, Gaffney, Paul, Stallworth, Hankerson, Torrain, Helu, Davis. Seriously, other than Davis, which of those players does an opposing defense really need to be concerned about at this point?

It's not like Buffalo was doing anything exotic to confuse us today. They rushed 4 guys and they managed to manhandle our offensive line. Our receivers couldn't get any separation. Beck had no time most of the day, and when he did have time he held onto the ball for too long and generally crapped all over himself.

We had a mediocre team when the season started and the injuries we've sustained have turned our team from mediocre to terrible. Talent is the major issue with this team,

markshark84 wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

HailSkins98 wrote:I believe it's Coaches and Players that are the issue. Kyle Shanahan is showing that the only reason he is OC is because of Mike. I counted at least 3 times where we went with a Bunch formation and brought Helu out to the other side from the backfield. He needs to mix up more formations and run the ball more. We can't abandon the run just because we are only getting a few yards. Of course players is another issue, mainly our offensive line. Beck is never going to be an all-star QB, but even if Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers played behind our Oline they wouldn't be putting up Pro-Bowl numbers.

Also why is Donte Stallworth on our team?

Sure, there are some things that the coaches could do better. However, the main issue is talent. And you can't scheme around a lack of talent.

I tend to agree. I think it is safe to say that offensively, there was not one single player worth keeping out there besides maybe Davis. Really. I mean this. Name one other offensive player that is halfway decent? We literally do not have one single offensive player worth anything on this team.

I guess that's what happens when (for the past decade and a half) you've had an incompetent owner -- who didn't even play grade school football -- playing "GM".

I almost agree. Davis is a stud and could play for anyone. I don't feel the same way about Williams, by the way. I think he'll be an average player, at best.

i think Torain and Helu are good if there is any blocking to be found and they're not getting hit 3 yards in the backfield on every single damn play, but your overall point is certainly taken, CS26.

i do think our starters are improved from the last couple years but unfortunately half of them aren't out there at this point. the backup OL certainly appears to be as atrocious as the old starting OL. but at least these guys are backups now. can't turn over the whole putrid roster Vinny and Snyder left Shanahan to work with in one or even 2 offseasons, unfortunately. patience...

Judge wrote:If someone on the Redskins' offense or coaching staff displayed the tiniest bit of competence or actual desire to win.

That would be cool.

If the entire team and coaching staff and owner were killed in a plane crash, all dying accept London Fletcher. That would be cool.

^ Brilliant...

The reign of the bashers goes on!

I'm not sure why I seem to be the only one who keeps bringing up that our team, particularly on O, was mostly on the sidelines. It was reserves and replacements who got hammered. That actually is material information.

Hmm...when we had our starters we were 3-1. When they were going out one after the other we went 0-3. Clearly that has little to do with it...

A lot of new members on THN.. welcome to the site folks. It's sad that we have to meet under these circumstances but just for the record let me get this out the way:

Don't give up, this is our team and if Saints fans can endure wearing paper bags over their heads, we can be patient under Shan's regime. It's only his second year and he's still trying to fixup Cerrato's and Snyder's past mess.

If you get tired of not being able to PROPERLY vent, take a walk over to the smack section.. some of our best members hang out there. *cough cough*

CanesSkins26 wrote:

SCSkinsFan wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

SCSkinsFan wrote:Are the assistant coaches (OC & DC) subject to questioning after games, or does the HC always run interference to deflect those questions? If so, then what would be cool would be to ask HC Shanny, "How is it possible for your OC to develop a game plan in which the offense scores absolutely no points and gives up 9 sacks against the 30th ranked D in the NFL?" And then, "Do you still feel confident in your OC's abilities? How about your DC?" And say BS to going back and looking a the tape. It was as plain as day. No need to go back and look at any tape to see that if that is what a whole week of practice and game-planning results in, then someone, players and coaches, just isn't capable of performing at an NFL level.

Coaching isn't the issue. The problem is our players, for the most part, are awful. Between our qb, running backs, wide receivers, and offensive line, how many would actually start for good NFL teams? I would argue very few. At this point, the online legit talent that we have on offense is Moss, whose injured, and Davis. Williams, also injured, and some others might get there someday, but aren't there yet.

Defense is better but still has issues. Our dline is average at best with nobody even coming close to being a dominant presence.

The linebackers are probably our best unit, but Fletcher is getting old; Orakpo is undisciplined and teams gash us running the ball to his side of the field; Kerrigan has a lot of potential but is only a rookie; and Rocky has been inconsistent.

The secondary is nothing special. Hall is overrated and Wilson looks like a nickle corner. Landry is very talented but still takes bad angles and goes for the big hit too often, and if you saw the exchange between him and Fletcher today, apparently he isn't following his assignments. Otogwe is a very good player.

You really don't think coaching is part of the problem? Even Shanny said after the Panther's game that he needed to do a better job of getting his team prepared. And this is what they, the palyers and coaches, came up with after another week of preparation? Above-average coaches can develop a game plan to get the most of the talent available to them, get them to perform with maximum effort, and at least appear to be competitive on the field. I have seen little evidence of that in the last three cames since the bye week.

What do you expect Shanahan to say, "my players suck"? Just look at who we are throwing out there on offense...Beck, Armstrong, Gaffney, Paul, Stallworth, Hankerson, Torrain, Helu, Davis. Seriously, other than Davis, which of those players does an opposing defense really need to be concerned about at this point?

It's not like Buffalo was doing anything exotic to confuse us today. They rushed 4 guys and they managed to manhandle our offensive line. Our receivers couldn't get any separation. Beck had no time most of the day, and when he did have time he held onto the ball for too long and generally crapped all over himself.

We had a mediocre team when the season started and the injuries we've sustained have turned our team from mediocre to terrible. Talent is the major issue with this team,

Ok, so don't take my word for it, but just read the wide selection of articles in today's paper including opinions of former Redskin players that seem to address the same point of view.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:The reign of the bashers goes on!

I'm not sure why I seem to be the only one who keeps bringing up that our team, particularly on O, was mostly on the sidelines. It was reserves and replacements who got hammered. That actually is material information.

Hmm...when we had our starters we were 3-1. When they were going out one after the other we went 0-3. Clearly that has little to do with it...

That same excuse get's old, we are missing only one lineman and Locklear has played just as good if not better than Trent, losing ey? Sorry he wasn't that much of a difference than what Logan Paulsen is currently doing. Moss and Hightower, okay I can see a small drop off but not that much. There are NO INJURED PLAYERS ON DEFENSE! So that TO ME means that Haslett and his play calling has GOTTEN WORSE, face it he SUCKS! FIRE HIM AND KYLE!!! and that OFFENSIVE LINE COACH WHO SUCKS TOO!

Russ Penman wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:The reign of the bashers goes on!

I'm not sure why I seem to be the only one who keeps bringing up that our team, particularly on O, was mostly on the sidelines. It was reserves and replacements who got hammered. That actually is material information.

Hmm...when we had our starters we were 3-1. When they were going out one after the other we went 0-3. Clearly that has little to do with it...

That same excuse get's old, we are missing only one lineman and Locklear has played just as good if not better than Trent, losing ey? Sorry he wasn't that much of a difference than what Logan Paulsen is currently doing. Moss and Hightower, okay I can see a small drop off but not that much. There are NO INJURED PLAYERS ON DEFENSE! So that TO ME means that Haslett and his play calling has GOTTEN WORSE, face it he SUCKS! FIRE HIM AND KYLE!!! and that OFFENSIVE LINE COACH WHO SUCKS TOO!

Congratulations on that