The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Posted: **Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:17 pm**

I don't understand all the negativity towards Tim Tebow. Seriously, what has the guy done so wrong for people to think that he can't be a starting QB. Before I begin I will make myself very clear that all of my information is based off of NFL Total Access, Around The League, Sports Center. This guy has been absolutely screwed in this situation. Let's begin by Tebow being told that he is going to be the starting QB before the lockout started. During the lockout Tebow was being a leader by organizing player workouts, then the lockout ends and then the Orton trade doesn't go through and because of that Tebow has NEVER practiced with the first team offense. In fact he has only played with the 2nd and third team unit offense and has gone up against the first team defense in doing so. How fair is that? You are on the 2nd or third team offense going up against your starting defense? Then the guy goes out there in his first preseason game and this is what he does. He goes for 6-7, 91 yards and had a 40 yard bomb. Plus he had 2 rushes for 15 yards. And he also scored on a TD but was called back on a penalty. Yes, there was an INT he threw but it was because the guy pass interfered with the pass. Then his reward is being moved to third string QB? Are you kidding me? Look, I know the guy has somethings to work on, but this is not even a fair competition. And with time Tebow will get better The guy is a winner and a leader and can take command in the huddle. And, so what if he loves the Lord. At least, you know that you never have to worry about the off the field issues like other players in the league.

Posted: **Mon Aug 22, 2011 8:37 pm**

Have Faith my friend....as Timmy has plenty of Faith. He'll yet surprise the League......

Posted: **Mon Aug 22, 2011 9:46 pm**

tribeofjudah wrote:Have Faith my friend....as Timmy has plenty of Faith. He'll yet surprise the League......

+1

Posted: **Mon Aug 22, 2011 11:17 pm**

yupchagee wrote:
tribeofjudah wrote:Have Faith my friend....as Timmy has plenty of Faith. He'll yet surprise the League......

+1

But for now he's behind Brady Quinn on the depth chart

Posted: **Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:22 am**

I do find it bizarre that a QB can enter training camp as #1 and rumors fly that last year's #1 will be traded, last year's #1 becomes #1 and the projected #1 moves to third string after a posting good stats in the first preseason game; however, I suspect that there are some underlying circumstances about this situation.

In the article below Fox seems to be not too pleased Tebow improvising a little bit too much - we all know where that can get a QB.

John Fox thought Orton was sharp, Tebow a “work in progress”

Broncos coach John Fox seems to like certainty from his quarterbacks. Kyle Orton provides that.

While Tim Tebow showed promise on Thursday night, Fox made it clear sometimes the plays didn’t go as planned.

“Quarterbacking-wise, I thought Kyle was sharp and I thought Tim is a work in progress,” Fox said. “[Tebow] made some things happen. He’s learning, and I thought Brady [Quinn] stepped in and did a decent job, scored some points to take the lead.”

Quinn had the best numbers, like he did in the team’s recent scrimmage. Those numbers again came against third teamers, but we were impressed by Quinn’s accuracy. Fox did seem intrigued by Tebow’s playmaking.

“His M.O. when I got here was he does like to ad lib some,” Fox said. “You don’t ever want to take that away from a player.”

This last statement could be taken as, it is OK to do a little bit of ad libbing, but Tebow is doing too much. How do I get that from that statement? The article says that Fox made it clear that plays didn't go as planned.

I don't make anything of the stuff that Tebow will be traded or cut. I think that this is Fox's version of Shanny's benching of McNabb. If you don't do as I say, then we will give you a little time to think about it.

This also shows you that one coaches diamond, Josh McDaniel's, is another coach's ziconia, John Fox's.

We have that action going on too Beck is Shanny's diamond and to Parcells and Newsome, Beck is zirconia.

Business as usual in the NFL.

Posted: **Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:46 am**

^^^ what he said

seems that Fox must think that Orton is the better QB :wink:

I also know that just because a couple of highly regarded coaches and talent evaluators did not like what they 'saw' means little really

Belicheat could never become a great HC based on what we saw in Cleveland

Brady was very good at Michigan, a 'winner' according to his HC - yet he goes in the 6th round and really ONLY gets a chance to play QB because of an injury to Bledsoe

in a lot of cases - players and coaches just need the right supporting cast to suddenly look like they 'know' what they're doing

I'm NOT convinced AT ALL that Beck or Grossman are really good QBs or will become really good QBs
I do know that Mike will find a really good QB or a QB that he can make really good - NO DOUBT

We are VERY fortunate to have Mike Shanahan as HC - we're even MORE fortunate to have Mike Shanahan running this franchise (with Bruce Allen)

these guys are doing a good job and it seems the assistants and players are "all in" on what is happening here NOW

Tebow needs to just do his job as he always has and then when he get's the opportunity he needs to grab it - it will happen
He might not be a really good QB but he needs to do whatever it takes to stay on the right side of his HC

Posted: **Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:48 am**

If he was THAT good, he'd be starting. Those "intangibles" are worthless if you can't perform on Sundays.

The Broncos staff see him every day. If they thought there was even a chance he would be any good, he'd be starting right now, instead of sitting behind another first round bust as the 3rd QB.

Being a good guy who gives his all doesn't mean a thing. You can have every good "intangible" in the world, and you still will suck as a QB if you don't have the tangibles. Plenty of people on this forum would work as hard as they could to be an NFL player, and would never bring negative attention to a team and would get cut within 5 minutes of the tryout. LOL. Myself included.

tribeofjudah wrote:Have Faith my friend....as Timmy has plenty of Faith. He'll yet surprise the League......

Faith doesn't make you an accurate passer. lol

Red_One43 wrote:I do find it bizarre that a QB can enter training camp
as #1

Bizarre? You make it seem as if he came into camp as the #1 after mini-camps and OTA's. He was simply "penciled" in but when it came to reality he wasn't cutting it.

Red_One43 wrote:In the article below Fox seems to be not too pleased Tebow improvising a little bit too much - we all know where that can get a QB.

That's because these new mechanics aren't his game. It's too late in the game for him to unlearn and relearn how to throw a football. Under pressure he's going to revert back to what he knows.

Posted: **Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:42 am**

jeremyroyce wrote:I don't understand all the negativity towards Tim Tebow. Seriously, what has the guy done so wrong

Are you kidding me? I hate Tim Tebow. The guy buys random chemicals just to dump them in streams in the woods. He shoots animals just to watch them die. No one has proven anything, but the homeless constantly disappear in his neighborhood never to be seen again. He puts itching powder in his teammates uniforms. The guy has never tipped a waiter in his life. He's complete and utter scum, how can you defend him?

Posted: **Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:10 pm**

Chris Luva Luva wrote:...That's because these new mechanics aren't his game. It's too late in the game for him to unlearn and relearn how to throw a football. Under pressure he's going to revert back to what he knows.

Agreed. While I have never, nor will I ever be paid as a talent scout for the NFL -- or Pop Warner for that matter -- I see Tebow's throwing motion, his footwork, his release point, as problems that his size, athleticism and speed simply cannot overcome in the game at this level.

That is not to say he won't have a long, quality career. I just don't see him doing it behind center.

Posted: **Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:13 pm**

Faith doesn't make you an accurate passer. lol

If it can move mountains....how much more.....?

Posted: **Tue Aug 23, 2011 3:11 pm**

tribeofjudah wrote:
Faith doesn't make you an accurate passer. lol

If it can move mountains....how much more.....?

LMAO right.

Posted: **Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:04 pm**

“If everything was totally equal, and this were a competition based only on performance at this camp, Tebow would probably be the fourth-string guy,” one source told Silver. “Kyle [Orton] is far and away the best, and Tebow’s way behind [Brady] Quinn, too. And I’m telling you, Adam Weber is flat-out better right now.”

Weber, an undrafted rookie, has no chance to actually pass Tebow on the depth chart. But Weber has looked impressive when given the chance, and Tebow is struggling to work under center or grasp a pro offense.
One Broncos executive says to, “Forget about how [Tebow] delivers the ball, or how accurate it is. First he has to know where to go with it.”
We’re getting to the point that this feels like piling on. It seems clear Tebow has a long way to go, and this Broncos staff may never fully embrace him as the answer. They see him as a project.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... b-in-camp/

Posted: **Wed Aug 24, 2011 8:18 am**

I thought that most ALWAYS thought of Tebow as a prospect

The kid is an athlete and he played a position in college ball in a way that won a lot of games - the NFL is DIFFERENT and the coaches and assistants don't care - they know what they want a QB to be and what they want him to do is DIFFERENT than what he's comfortable with

Tebow needs to adjust and learn to do what the coaches want

this kid was drafted with the hope that he could eventually become a QB - he was looked at as a project and it seems he's still a work in progress - it's going to take longer than the coaches want BUT this kid will find a way to play QB EFFECTIVELY and well in the NFL
This kid is a winner

his Faith will support him through this - Faith may not move mountains but it is certainly very helpful to those that trust in Him

Posted: **Wed Aug 24, 2011 2:28 pm**

SkinsJock wrote:this kid was drafted with the hope that he could eventually become a QB

1. You don't draft projects in the first round.
2. You don't draft someone in the 1st round based on hope.

SkinsJock wrote:his Faith will support him through this - Faith may not move mountains but it is certainly very helpful to those that trust in Him

I too am a man of faith but faith alone won't make you a NFL QB. Faith does not equal skill, which is what he's lacking to compete at this level.

However, his faith will help him once he eventually gets released or told that he's no longer be considered for the QB position.

Posted: **Wed Aug 24, 2011 2:35 pm**

Move aside, Merril Hoge. You now have competition as Tim Tebow’s harshest critic.

Boomer Esiason, the former Bengals quarterback and current CBS analyst, says Tebow has no business being an NFL quarterback, and just because Tebow was successful at Florida, that’s no reason to think he’ll ever be any good with the Broncos.

“He can’t play. He can’t throw,” Esiason said, via Mike McCarthy of USA Today. “I’m not here to insult him. The reality is he was a great college football player, maybe the greatest college football player of his time. But he’s not an NFL quarterback right now. Just because he’s God-fearing, and a great person off the field, and was a winner with the team that had the best athletes in college football, doesn’t mean his game is going to translate to the NFL.”

Esiason says he can’t imagine why the old coaching staff wanted Tebow and doesn’t see what good it does for the current coaching staff to keep him around.

“What Josh McDaniel saw in him God only knows. Maybe God does know — because the rest of us don’t,” Esiason said.

All indications are that Tebow’s job is safe, even though he may not even be the third-best quarterback in camp. But there are a whole lot of people watching Tebow who think the Broncos would be better off without him.

Posted: **Wed Aug 24, 2011 3:14 pm**

Chris Luva Luva wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:this kid was drafted with the hope that he could eventually become a QB

1. You don't draft projects in the first round.
2. You don't draft someone in the 1st round based on hope.

SkinsJock wrote:his Faith will support him through this - Faith may not move mountains but it is certainly very helpful to those that trust in Him

I too am a man of faith but faith alone won't make you a NFL QB. Faith does not equal skill, which is what he's lacking to compete at this level.

However, his faith will help him once he eventually gets released or told that he's no longer be considered for the QB position.

I was personally blown away when the Broncos picked him where they picked him... he's loaded with potential based purely on athleticism and leadership skills measuring off the chart... but he knows litererally nothing of being an NFL quarterback... I expected a quarterback rich team, like the Colts, or Patriots, to grab him in perhaps round 5 or 6, where he could learn to be a quarterback, and perhaps, contribute as a wildcat or short yardage quarterback. No team that NEEDED a quarterback... including Denver... should have even considered him.

Posted: **Wed Aug 24, 2011 3:58 pm**

Broncos officials: Tebow 4th-best QB in camp

Some members of the Broncos organization tell Mike Silver of Yahoo! Sports that Tim Tebow is the fourth-best QB in training camp.

"If everything was totally equal, and this were a competition based only on performance at this camp, Tebow would probably be the fourth-string guy," one source said. "Kyle [Orton] is far and away the best, and Tebow's way behind [Brady] Quinn, too. And I'm telling you, Adam Weber is flat-out better right now." Added another Broncos exec, "Forget about how [Tebow] delivers the ball, or how accurate it is. First he has to know where to go with it." Team officials are now relieved that the Dolphins opted against meeting Denver's third-round asking price on Orton. Tebow was always expected to be a developmental project, but this year's camp has been a blow to his long-term outlook.

Posted: **Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:07 pm**

Chris Luva Luva wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:this kid was drafted with the hope that he could eventually become a QB

1. You don't draft projects in the first round.
2. You don't draft someone in the 1st round based on hope.

So go tell the Broncos - don't try and make out like I think it was a good idea

I wouldn't give this kid a job - he's not worth it

this guy's just a great college QB and he only knows how to win

thankfully he's not here

Posted: **Thu Aug 25, 2011 9:02 am**

Chris Luva Luva wrote:You don't draft someone in the 1st round based on hope.

You just elect Presidents that way...

I'm totally with you that he's a huge first round stretch, but what I find odd are the endless threads in his support. It's like Babe Laughingstock, only at the NFL level. All we are say...ing...is give Tim a chance...

I'm waiting for people to start setting themselves on fire.

Posted: **Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:20 am**

KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Chris Luva Luva wrote:You don't draft someone in the 1st round based on hope.

You just elect Presidents that way...

I'm totally with you that he's a huge first round stretch, but what I find odd are the endless threads in his support. It's like Babe Laughingstock, only at the NFL level. All we are say...ing...is give Tim a chance...

I'm waiting for people to start setting themselves on fire.

ain't it the truth - thankfully we didn't go this route

Tim Tebow as an NFL Qb does seem to 'generate' a lot of bashing AND support :shock:

Posted: **Fri Aug 26, 2011 6:59 pm**

KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Chris Luva Luva wrote:You don't draft someone in the 1st round based on hope.

You just elect Presidents that way...

I'm totally with you that he's a huge first round stretch, but what I find odd are the endless threads in his support. It's like Babe Laughingstock, only at the NFL level. All we are say...ing...is give Tim a chance...

I'm waiting for people to start setting themselves on fire.

Either on hope or, you know, being fed up with stupidity and needing grown ups to address grown up problems. Either way.

How Tebow ever got drafted in the first round is beyond me. We'd all like to re-live college days, but the truth is, when its over its over. All this "he just knows how to win" pertains to college. Clearly, in the pros, he just knows how to suck.

Posted: **Sat Aug 27, 2011 11:29 am**

emoses14 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Chris Luva Luva wrote:You don't draft someone in the 1st round based on hope.

You just elect Presidents that way...

I'm totally with you that he's a huge first round stretch, but what I find odd are the endless threads in his support. It's like Babe Laughingstock, only at the NFL level. All we are say...ing...is give Tim a chance...

I'm waiting for people to start setting themselves on fire.

Either on hope or, you know, being fed up with stupidity and needing grown ups to address grown up problems. Either way.

How Tebow ever got drafted in the first round is beyond me. We'd all like to re-live college days, but the truth is, when its over its over. All this "he just knows how to win" pertains to college.
Clearly, in the pros, he just knows how to suck.

... AND like EVERYTHING ELSE he does ....

He's doing it well :wink:

Posted: **Sat Aug 27, 2011 12:03 pm**

SkinsJock wrote:
emoses14 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Chris Luva Luva wrote:You don't draft someone in the 1st round based on hope.

You just elect Presidents that way...

I'm totally with you that he's a huge first round stretch, but what I find odd are the endless threads in his support. It's like Babe Laughingstock, only at the NFL level. All we are say...ing...is give Tim a chance...

I'm waiting for people to start setting themselves on fire.

Either on hope or, you know, being fed up with stupidity and needing grown ups to address grown up problems. Either way.

How Tebow ever got drafted in the first round is beyond me. We'd all like to re-live college days, but the truth is, when its over its over. All this "he just knows how to win" pertains to college.
Clearly, in the pros, he just knows how to suck.

... AND like EVERYTHING ELSE he does ....

He's doing it well

Posted: **Sun Aug 28, 2011 11:31 am**

Tebow keeps Quinn on the bench this time around

First things first: Kyle Orton looked excellent on Saturday night once again.

He led the Broncos to a 17-3 lead early in the third quarter with two long touchdown drives against Seattle. He averaged more than 10 yards-per-attempt and showed terrific accuracy often fitting the ball into tight windows. Orton is ready for the season.

Now on to the main story: The backups!

This time around, it was Tim Tebow that kept Brady Quinn watching on the sideline. It was a mixed performance with good, bad, and a game-winning field goal mixed in.

Tebow directed five drives that led to six points, including the winning three. He fumbled twice, but one of those fumbles was on a bad center shotgun snap. He took three sacks, but made a number of big plays with his arm and his feet. (He finished 6-of-11 for 93 yards and ran for 24 yards.)

There were plenty of exciting plays and plenty to work on. More than once Tebow took too long to make decisions. There was a broken play or two. Sacks happened. More than once, Tebow escaped pressure to make something out of nothing.

While the offense stagnated overall with Tebow, he did lead them on a game-winning 50-yard drive with 1:13 left.

Essentially, Tebow’s detractors will find enough material to criticize here. Tebow’s supporters will say this proves he’s a “gamer.”

The reality is that the second-year quarterback is developing, not ready yet, and no one knows where this is going.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... me-around/

The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Tim Tebow

Tim Tebow

Re: Tim Tebow