The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

I am watching his first preseason game against the Conboys. I am soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooOoooooooooooooooooooooo glad he is no longer a skin. Man he is not a threat at all. Scares no team. With McNabb, I feel like there could be a play made at any moment. With JC, it's so JV.

Chief. I'm guessing that you're watching the game that's on NFL Network. Make sure to listen when the Dallas Cowboys commentators even say that Jason Campbell isn't getting any time to throw the ball and his pocket is immediately collapsing. They even said that he's a very good QB who's played on a lot of bad teams. I'm not going to say that he's done but he may be if Oakland doesn't get an offensive line. Thankfully he's got a few weapon's at WR and RB.

frankcal20 wrote:Chief. I'm guessing that you're watching the game that's on NFL Network. Make sure to listen when the Dallas Cowboys commentators even say that Jason Campbell isn't getting any time to throw the ball and his pocket is immediately collapsing. They even said that he's a very good QB who's played on a lot of bad teams. I'm not going to say that he's done but he may be if Oakland doesn't get an offensive line. Thankfully he's got a few weapon's at WR and RB.

Yea its pretty bad luck to be traded from a team that had the worst offensive line of all time last year to one that is pretty close this year.

He had plenty of time to throw in the first quarter. Second quarter was a different story, but he wasn't hitting anything when he had time. Constantly checking down on third down short of the sticks. Throwing his deep ball out of bounds. Same old Campbell.

chiefhog44 wrote:He had plenty of time to throw in the first quarter. Second quarter was a different story, but he wasn't hitting anything when he had time. Constantly checking down on third down short of the sticks. Throwing his deep ball out of bounds. Same old Campbell.

The song remains the same...

Here is all his passes:

1 - incomplete deep pass to DHB
2 - swing pass for 2 yds
3 - pass to zach miller 4 yds
4 - run on 1st/2nd - pass on 3rd & long incomplete
5 - Incomplete deep pass
6 - 7 yd pass to zach miller
7 - deep pass oob's - murphy
8 - 8 yd pass to the RB
9 - dump pass goes for 14 yds
10 - pass for 10 yds
11 - 4 yd pass - miller pushed oob's 1yd short of 1st down
12 - pass to miller incomplete that was tipped.
13 - incomplete pass after 6 runs by rock on 3rd and long.

Here's the link where I got this info: http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/playbypla ... =300812006

Here's the thing, this info doesn't say the whole story. His pocket was collapsing faster than the coast of Malibu in a thunderstorm. It was a terrible game by the line and his accuracy wasn't perfect but it's hard to get really going when out of 15 plays, 4 are over 40 yd passes and the others are short pass plays for your TE or RB. There were not really many calls for intermediate routes. But who really knows once again with such a bad o-line.

frankcal20 wrote:Here is all his passes:

1 - incomplete deep pass to DHB
2 - swing pass for 2 yds
3 - pass to zach miller 4 yds
4 - run on 1st/2nd - pass on 3rd & long incomplete
5 - Incomplete deep pass
6 - 7 yd pass to zach miller
7 - deep pass oob's - murphy
8 - 8 yd pass to the RB
9 - dump pass goes for 14 yds
10 - pass for 10 yds
11 - 4 yd pass - miller pushed oob's 1yd short of 1st down
12 - pass to miller incomplete that was tipped.
13 - incomplete pass after 6 runs by rock on 3rd and long.

Here's the link where I got this info: http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/playbypla ... =300812006

Here's the thing, this info doesn't say the whole story. His pocket was collapsing faster than the coast of Malibu in a thunderstorm. It was a terrible game by the line and his accuracy wasn't perfect but it's hard to get really going when out of 15 plays, 4 are over 40 yd passes and the others are short pass plays for your TE or RB. There were not really many calls for intermediate routes. But who really knows once again with such a bad o-line.

No deep completions. Sounds like the same old Campbell to me.

brad7686 wrote:Yea its pretty bad luck to be traded from a team that had the worst offensive line of all time last year to one that is pretty close this year.

Please!

Deadskins wrote:

frankcal20 wrote:Here is all his passes:

1 - incomplete deep pass to DHB
2 - swing pass for 2 yds
3 - pass to zach miller 4 yds
4 - run on 1st/2nd - pass on 3rd & long incomplete
5 - Incomplete deep pass
6 - 7 yd pass to zach miller
7 - deep pass oob's - murphy
8 - 8 yd pass to the RB
9 - dump pass goes for 14 yds
10 - pass for 10 yds
11 - 4 yd pass - miller pushed oob's 1yd short of 1st down
12 - pass to miller incomplete that was tipped.
13 - incomplete pass after 6 runs by rock on 3rd and long.

Here's the link where I got this info: http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/playbypla ... =300812006

Here's the thing, this info doesn't say the whole story. His pocket was collapsing faster than the coast of Malibu in a thunderstorm. It was a terrible game by the line and his accuracy wasn't perfect but it's hard to get really going when out of 15 plays, 4 are over 40 yd passes and the others are short pass plays for your TE or RB. There were not really many calls for intermediate routes. But who really knows once again with such a bad o-line.

No deep completions. Sounds like the same old Campbell to me.

It's certainly not a strength of his but it does relate to the offensive line a decent portion of the time. Kind of like how even Aaron Rodgers had to go from deeps to Greg Jennings to short stuff with Driver last year with the line he had.

Deadskins wrote:

brad7686 wrote:Yea its pretty bad luck to be traded from a team that had the worst offensive line of all time last year to one that is pretty close this year.

Please!

Two fringe starters and the rest of the team wouldn't make most rosters. Can you prove its not the worst? You're the only person who has argued with me on this.

Deadskins wrote:

frankcal20 wrote:Here is all his passes:

1 - incomplete deep pass to DHB
2 - swing pass for 2 yds
3 - pass to zach miller 4 yds
4 - run on 1st/2nd - pass on 3rd & long incomplete
5 - Incomplete deep pass
6 - 7 yd pass to zach miller
7 - deep pass oob's - murphy
8 - 8 yd pass to the RB
9 - dump pass goes for 14 yds
10 - pass for 10 yds
11 - 4 yd pass - miller pushed oob's 1yd short of 1st down
12 - pass to miller incomplete that was tipped.
13 - incomplete pass after 6 runs by rock on 3rd and long.

Here's the link where I got this info: http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/playbypla ... =300812006

Here's the thing, this info doesn't say the whole story. His pocket was collapsing faster than the coast of Malibu in a thunderstorm. It was a terrible game by the line and his accuracy wasn't perfect but it's hard to get really going when out of 15 plays, 4 are over 40 yd passes and the others are short pass plays for your TE or RB. There were not really many calls for intermediate routes. But who really knows once again with such a bad o-line.

No deep completions. Sounds like the same old Campbell to me.

Let's see. He only had 13 attempts. His longest pass was 14 yards and it's not like Oakland has studs at WR. DHB? Really. Devin Thomas would be their #1 WR and he's on our 3rd string. Rock is getting reps with the #1's at RB only b/c their team STINKS!!! Dude - I live in Los Angeles - Raider country. Even their fan's know they suck and they expect to be a top 5 draft picker next year yet again.

brad7686 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

brad7686 wrote:Yea its pretty bad luck to be traded from a team that had the worst offensive line of all time last year to one that is pretty close this year.

Please!

Two fringe starters and the rest of the team wouldn't make most rosters. Can you prove its not the worst? You're the only person who has argued with me on this.

Dockery and Rabach are not "fringe" starters. I think Heyer could make several rosters, not as a starter but still solid depth. Williams at guard was also not as bad as you would have people believe. And Samuels did play for a quarter of the season. But what I was mostly shocked by was that you could actually believe that that group was the worst of all time. That's simply ridiculous hyperbole.

frankcal20 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

frankcal20 wrote:Here is all his passes:

1 - incomplete deep pass to DHB
2 - swing pass for 2 yds
3 - pass to zach miller 4 yds
4 - run on 1st/2nd - pass on 3rd & long incomplete
5 - Incomplete deep pass
6 - 7 yd pass to zach miller
7 - deep pass oob's - murphy
8 - 8 yd pass to the RB
9 - dump pass goes for 14 yds
10 - pass for 10 yds
11 - 4 yd pass - miller pushed oob's 1yd short of 1st down
12 - pass to miller incomplete that was tipped.
13 - incomplete pass after 6 runs by rock on 3rd and long.

Here's the link where I got this info: http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/playbypla ... =300812006

Here's the thing, this info doesn't say the whole story. His pocket was collapsing faster than the coast of Malibu in a thunderstorm. It was a terrible game by the line and his accuracy wasn't perfect but it's hard to get really going when out of 15 plays, 4 are over 40 yd passes and the others are short pass plays for your TE or RB. There were not really many calls for intermediate routes. But who really knows once again with such a bad o-line.

No deep completions. Sounds like the same old Campbell to me.

Let's see. He only had 13 attempts. His longest pass was 14 yards and it's not like Oakland has studs at WR. DHB? Really. Devin Thomas would be their #1 WR and he's on our 3rd string. Rock is getting reps with the #1's at RB only b/c their team STINKS!!! Dude - I live in Los Angeles - Raider country. Even their fan's know they suck and they expect to be a top 5 draft picker next year yet again.

I never claimed they had a good line or receivers, just that JC has no deep touch. He's fine on intermediate routes, but just plain sucks on the deep stuff. It doesn't matter how much time he has, he never hits anyone in stride on a deep pass. That's not a function of the receiver's talent level.

Deadskins wrote:

brad7686 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

brad7686 wrote:Yea its pretty bad luck to be traded from a team that had the worst offensive line of all time last year to one that is pretty close this year.

Please!

Two fringe starters and the rest of the team wouldn't make most rosters. Can you prove its not the worst? You're the only person who has argued with me on this.

Dockery and Rabach are not "fringe" starters. I think Heyer could make several rosters, not as a starter but still solid depth. Williams at guard was also not as bad as you would have people believe. And Samuels did play for a quarter of the season. But what I was mostly shocked by was that you could actually believe that that group was the worst of all time. That's simply ridiculous hyperbole.

It's really not. If they aren't who is? It's also important to note that the only decent linemen they had were on the interior. And I disagree that Heyer would make several rosters.

Deadskins wrote:

frankcal20 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

frankcal20 wrote:Here is all his passes:

1 - incomplete deep pass to DHB
2 - swing pass for 2 yds
3 - pass to zach miller 4 yds
4 - run on 1st/2nd - pass on 3rd & long incomplete
5 - Incomplete deep pass
6 - 7 yd pass to zach miller
7 - deep pass oob's - murphy
8 - 8 yd pass to the RB
9 - dump pass goes for 14 yds
10 - pass for 10 yds
11 - 4 yd pass - miller pushed oob's 1yd short of 1st down
12 - pass to miller incomplete that was tipped.
13 - incomplete pass after 6 runs by rock on 3rd and long.

Here's the link where I got this info: http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/playbypla ... =300812006

Here's the thing, this info doesn't say the whole story. His pocket was collapsing faster than the coast of Malibu in a thunderstorm. It was a terrible game by the line and his accuracy wasn't perfect but it's hard to get really going when out of 15 plays, 4 are over 40 yd passes and the others are short pass plays for your TE or RB. There were not really many calls for intermediate routes. But who really knows once again with such a bad o-line.

No deep completions. Sounds like the same old Campbell to me.

Let's see. He only had 13 attempts. His longest pass was 14 yards and it's not like Oakland has studs at WR. DHB? Really. Devin Thomas would be their #1 WR and he's on our 3rd string. Rock is getting reps with the #1's at RB only b/c their team STINKS!!! Dude - I live in Los Angeles - Raider country. Even their fan's know they suck and they expect to be a top 5 draft picker next year yet again.

I never claimed they had a good line or receivers, just that JC has no deep touch. He's fine on intermediate routes, but just plain sucks on the deep stuff. It doesn't matter how much time he has, he never hits anyone in stride on a deep pass. That's not a function of the receiver's talent level.

He seemed to do a really good job of that back in college. That was his greatest attribute coming out. His accuracy of the deep ball. Then he comes to the NFL and has to play for some of the worst offensive lines in the NFL.

The expansion Tampa Bay team comes to mind. But I'm sure that over the history of the NFL, there have been at least 30 teams with worse lines than we had last year, and probably many more than that.

DS's, you're probably right but that still doesn't prove your point that he had adequate protection to be a top QB. He was right there in the middle.

Deadskins wrote:The expansion Tampa Bay team comes to mind. But I'm sure that over the history of the NFL, there have been at least 30 teams with worse lines than we had last year, and probably many more than that.

Maybe, they should be a special case. That whole team was unfairly assembled for failure. I wasn't born to see it but I hear it was bad. I doubt there's more than ten that are worse and I'm sure its hard to quantify one way or the other. I can only say that they are the worst I've personally ever seen. I guess I could have said that. Although I got away with what I was saying for quite a long time.

JC... FAIL!.. hahahahhahahahahaa.. but naw seriously, OAK sucks!

brad7686 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

brad7686 wrote:Yea its pretty bad luck to be traded from a team that had the worst offensive line of all time last year to one that is pretty close this year.

Please!

Two fringe starters and the rest of the team wouldn't make most rosters. Can you prove its not the worst? You're the only person who has argued with me on this.

Jurgy played behind some really awfull OL's.

frankcal20 wrote:DS's, you're probably right but that still doesn't prove your point that he had adequate protection to be a top QB. He was right there in the middle.

That's a point I never tried to make. (Can you show me where I said that?) My point was he has never had success (in the NFL) with his long ball, period.

I can agree with that but just to add to that, if you fail to leave out the fact that a very decent QB - like Pat Ramsey - were put on some very bad teams and set up to fail b/c of the system(s) they were in were never going to work mostly due to personel or lack thereof.

yupchagee wrote:

brad7686 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

brad7686 wrote:Yea its pretty bad luck to be traded from a team that had the worst offensive line of all time last year to one that is pretty close this year.

Please!

Two fringe starters and the rest of the team wouldn't make most rosters. Can you prove its not the worst? You're the only person who has argued with me on this.

Jurgy played behind some really awfull OL's.

Yeah, brad's in crazyville. That line was awful, but there have been far worse lines that I've seen play, and recently.

David Carr was sacked 76 times in 2002. SEVENTY SIX times. And that line proved it was as good run blocking as pass blocking, as it supported a rushing attack with a gaudy 3.2 yards per carry average.

Randal Cunningham played behind some awful offensive lines in Philadelphia. In 1986, he was sacked 72 times...and the line gave up another 22 when Jaworski was playing, 9 when Cavanaugh played, and 1 on a Byars fake. That line gave up 104 sacks in one year!!! As bad as they were, the Skins line last year gave up less than half of that.

At least they improved. The next year the Eagles line gave up only 71. Though that was the strike season of only 15 games...

Don't you think JC would have taken a lot more sac's had he not done the one thing that a lot of people criticize him for doing? Hitting the hot route - or the closest player only b/c he didn't have time to make a play?

I'll be the first on in line to support the guy but I'll also be the first one there to let him know that he's got to step it up. Now, if he was playing behind Minnesotta's line or the Jet's, he could probably improve a lot quicker but he's not. So the only solution is to work on improvisation b/c those plays are going to break down and defenders will be in the backfield on a regular basis.

frankcal20 wrote:Here is all his passes:

1 - incomplete deep pass to DHB
2 - swing pass for 2 yds
3 - pass to zach miller 4 yds
4 - run on 1st/2nd - pass on 3rd & long incomplete
5 - Incomplete deep pass
6 - 7 yd pass to zach miller
7 - deep pass oob's - murphy
8 - 8 yd pass to the RB
9 - dump pass goes for 14 yds
10 - pass for 10 yds
11 - 4 yd pass - miller pushed oob's 1yd short of 1st down
12 - pass to miller incomplete that was tipped.
13 - incomplete pass after 6 runs by rock on 3rd and long.

Here's the link where I got this info: http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/playbypla ... =300812006

Here's the thing, this info doesn't say the whole story. His pocket was collapsing faster than the coast of Malibu in a thunderstorm. It was a terrible game by the line and his accuracy wasn't perfect but it's hard to get really going when out of 15 plays, 4 are over 40 yd passes and the others are short pass plays for your TE or RB. There were not really many calls for intermediate routes. But who really knows once again with such a bad o-line.

I watched the game too ... and the pass pro was far from being good. But here's the deal ... I also saw him stand there and get clobbered from the blind side, and he was standing there like a deer caught in headlights ... you either have to move your feet or get rid of the football. And where have we seen this before? Oh yeah ... right here for 4 years.

And though this has been pointed out many times, it's worth repeating .. defenses game plan against opposing offenses ... and guess what ... when the scouting report on a QB says RUSH HIM and he folds like a lawn chair ... you better expect a heavy rush ...

And the ONLY way to stop it is for the QB to burn those defenses that pin their ears back and come after him. They won't stop until they are made to pay the price ... trouble is, Jason never makes them pay for it. And the Cowboys know this as well as anyone.

Being down here in Cowboy land, I promise you, there were no celebrations in response to the Campbell trade ... promise you! I think the cowpoke fans I know might have even offered to chip in part of Jason's salary if the Redskins were to agree to keep him as the starter.

They know what most people know, that the Redskins were no threat offensively with Jason Campbell ... good pass pro or bad ...

And I don't think the Raiders are going to be so patient as Washington was.