The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

The Redskins seriously need to be rebuilt. It seems obvious that neither Jim Zorn, nor any of the coaching staff nor Jason Campbell will be back. With a probable uncapped year next season here's what I do with the Redskins:

-2010-

Get Mike Holmgren as the GM and Jon Gruden as the HC. Fill the staff with like minded WCO minds.

Try and trade Clinton Portis and Moss, release Samuels if he's got a career ending injuries, cut ties with Campbell and any high priced vets who won't be part of the rebuild. It's our chance to avoid cap hell.

Sign Chad Pennington to be the short term solution at QB. Seems like a great choice for a WCO guy and he'll definitely be available. Instead of searching for a young franchise QB right away we need an older veteran who can deal with the growing pains. We need a halfway decent team before adding a young QB.

In the draft get a OT in the first round, maybe try for another OT or OG in the second round. We need to build the line ASAP. If there's good, young options in FA then we could fill the holes that way.

Probably have about a 8-8 season with a two game swing either way.

-2011-

With a rebuilt line the Redskins can look for a franchise QB. Jake Locker, Sam Bradford, whoever is the big star in college and whoever works with the WCO philosophy. Do not trade picks! This QB would sit for a year while they learned the system and studied Pennington.

Start looking also for a stud tailback. Either through a trade, free agency or the draft. Make sure we've still got the defense we need and build up the offense. Maybe add a WR.

Probably a 10-6 season with a one game swing. We'd make the playoffs.

-2012-

By this time we ought to have the team we need to be a big contender. Fill the rest of the team with the pieces we need to be successful and we should be looking at a 12 win team with a two game swing.

Should be a legit Superbowl contender.

-----

I fully believe that any team can become elite with intelligent management. You just need a smart plan and execution. The Redskins can do this, but I fear that Snyder won't. I am worried that Snyder will get al excited by an uncapped year and add flashy skill position players. We may win 10, 11 games and make the playoffs... but we won't have the cohesion to advance and we'll be a huge bunch of underachievers.

Just like we've seen before.

I don't get the fascination with Holmgren as GM. He held that position with the Seahawks for a while... and did not become competitive until he had been relieved of that title.

Agreed, Id rather hire someone else as a GM. Not sure whose out there but anyones gotta be better then the clown we got now

I agree that there needs to be some rebuilding and that O-Line should be the biggest focus at first.

I think you are being rather optimistic regarding the predictions though.

Sign Chad Pennington to be the short term solution at QB. Seems like a great choice for a WCO guy and he'll definitely be available. Instead of searching for a young franchise QB right away we need an older veteran who can deal with the growing pains. We need a halfway decent team before adding a young QB.

Pennington just had surgery on his throwing shoulder for the third time. HE IS DONE.

Countertrey wrote:I don't get the fascination with Holmgren as GM. He held that position with the Seahawks for a while... and did not become competitive until he had been relieved of that title.

No kidding. By all accounts, Holmgren was an unmitigated disaster as a GM, and people want to bring him in?

Seriously, complain about Vinny...and you talk about Holmgren as if he's an improvement?

Mike Holmgren ranks as one of the worst GM's for drafting during the 1999 to 2002 seasons (see rankings below). It is widely accepted that players drafted during the first round should be at least starters on a team. The second and third rounds should provide needed depth and an occasional starter. Rounds 4 through 7 are typically unpredictable, but most assume that it is a "bonus" if any player drafted past round 3 makes the team.

Holmgren drafted 38 players during his GM years, with 6 first round picks. Of those 38 players, only 5 became consistent productive starters - Shaun Alexander, Darrell Jackson, Steve Hutchinson, Ken Lucas, and Rocky Bernard. Obviously, trying to rank the rest of the drafted players has an element of subjectivity. It would appear that the Seahawks produced a total of 8 productive draft picks (players making a significant contribution for their team, for a significant period of time), during the four years in question. This number should be much higher, especially considering the 6 first round picks. Of the 6 first round draft picks, only 2 (Alexander and Hutchinson) became consistent productive starters

Terrible.

How about looking at Steve Keim personnel director of the Arizona Cardinals? He was up for the Lions job last year. He is supposed to be one of the up and coming really good talent evaluators. We could use someone who spots good players!

http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/20 ... hould.html

RedskinTexan wrote:How about looking at Steve Keim personnel director of the Arizona Cardinals? He was up for the Lions job last year. He is supposed to be one of the up and coming really good talent evaluators. We could use someone who spots good players!

http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/20 ... hould.html

Hopefully, this will be the kind of individual that Snyder will begin looking at. There are a number of bright up-and-comers who will someday be making noise.

Wow, you sound so convinced of your plan.....

I find the knock against Holmgren as Seahawks GM to be silly.

For one he was doing two jobs at once, which is nearly impossible for a coach in the NFL.

Secondly, it's not like once the Seahawks brought in another GM that Holmgren just stopped having any input whatsoever.

Mike Holmgren the Seahawks went from awful to elite under his watch and he drafted and traded for some great players. For one, it was him who brought over Matt Hasselbeck.

Also, it's not just that I'm convinced "my" plan will work, I'm convinced ANY plan will work. We want to abandon the WCO, fine let's get someone else in here a HC and GM who agree on an old school smashmouth offense... that doesn't do it for Snyder how about a classic "air it out" system? Just make sure the coach and the GM are on the same page.

The Redskins just need a plan and they need to BUILD around it. It really doesn't matter what system we use, but obviously some cohesive plan needs to be in place.

Wasn't this your plan three years ago as well??

Skinsfan55 wrote:The Redskins seriously need to be rebuilt. It seems obvious that neither Jim Zorn, nor any of the coaching staff nor Jason Campbell will be back. With a probable uncapped year next season here's what I do with the Redskins:

-2010-

Get Mike Holmgren as the GM and Jon Gruden as the HC. Fill the staff with like minded WCO minds.

Try and trade Clinton Portis and Moss, release Samuels if he's got a career ending injuries, cut ties with Campbell and any high priced vets who won't be part of the rebuild. It's our chance to avoid cap hell.

Sign Chad Pennington to be the short term solution at QB. Seems like a great choice for a WCO guy and he'll definitely be available. Instead of searching for a young franchise QB right away we need an older veteran who can deal with the growing pains. We need a halfway decent team before adding a young QB.

In the draft get a OT in the first round, maybe try for another OT or OG in the second round. We need to build the line ASAP. If there's good, young options in FA then we could fill the holes that way.

Probably have about a 8-8 season with a two game swing either way.

-2011-

With a rebuilt line the Redskins can look for a franchise QB. Jake Locker, Sam Bradford, whoever is the big star in college and whoever works with the WCO philosophy. Do not trade picks! This QB would sit for a year while they learned the system and studied Pennington.

Start looking also for a stud tailback. Either through a trade, free agency or the draft. Make sure we've still got the defense we need and build up the offense. Maybe add a WR.

Probably a 10-6 season with a one game swing. We'd make the playoffs.

-2012-

By this time we ought to have the team we need to be a big contender. Fill the rest of the team with the pieces we need to be successful and we should be looking at a 12 win team with a two game swing.

Should be a legit Superbowl contender.

-----

I fully believe that any team can become elite with intelligent management. You just need a smart plan and execution. The Redskins can do this, but I fear that Snyder won't. I am worried that Snyder will get al excited by an uncapped year and add flashy skill position players. We may win 10, 11 games and make the playoffs... but we won't have the cohesion to advance and we'll be a huge bunch of underachievers.

Just like we've seen before.

Yeah, this doesn't make much sense. Besides the fact that Holmgren was a terrible GM, who wants to trade for Portis, Moss and Samuels? Makes more sense just to cut'em as there's no salary cap next year (most likely) and this will just clear the way of imaginary cap space in the event the cap comes back the following year. Why would we want Pennington? The guy is hurt every year. And as for Sam Bradford....Buyer beware. That shoulder may never be right again.

The real problem with any immediate rebuilding is that there is no Free Agent QBs out there that can help. Question: Who is the highest visibility QB free agent available in 2010? Answer: Jason Campbell.

[quote="Skinsfan55"]The Redskins seriously need to be rebuilt. It seems obvious that neither Jim Zorn, nor any of the coaching staff nor Jason Campbell will be back. With a probable uncapped year next season here's what I do with the Redskins:

-2010-

Get Mike Holmgren as the GM and Jon Gruden as the HC. Fill the staff with like minded WCO minds.

Try and trade Clinton Portis and Moss, release Samuels if he's got a career ending injuries, cut ties with Campbell and any high priced vets who won't be part of the rebuild. It's our chance to avoid cap hell.

Sign Chad Pennington to be the short term solution at QB. Seems like a great choice for a WCO guy and he'll definitely be available. Instead of searching for a young franchise QB right away we need an older veteran who can deal with the growing pains. We need a halfway decent team before adding a young QB.

In the draft get a OT in the first round, maybe try for another OT or OG in the second round. We need to build the line ASAP. If there's good, young options in FA then we could fill the holes that way.

Probably have about a 8-8 season with a two game swing either way.

-2011-

With a rebuilt line the Redskins can look for a franchise QB. Jake Locker, Sam Bradford, whoever is the big star in college and whoever works with the WCO philosophy. Do not trade picks! This QB would sit for a year while they learned the system and studied Pennington.

Start looking also for a stud tailback. Either through a trade, free agency or the draft. Make sure we've still got the defense we need and build up the offense. Maybe add a WR.

Probably a 10-6 season with a one game swing. We'd make the playoffs.

-2012-

By this time we ought to have the team we need to be a big contender. Fill the rest of the team with the pieces we need to be successful and we should be looking at a 12 win team with a two game swing.

Should be a legit Superbowl contender.

-----

I fully believe that any team can become elite with intelligent management. You just need a smart plan and execution. The Redskins can do this, but I fear that Snyder won't. I am worried that Snyder will get al excited by an uncapped year and add flashy skill position players. We may win 10, 11 games and make the playoffs... but we won't have the cohesion to advance and we'll be a huge bunch of underachievers.

Just like we've seen before.



You lost me at Chad Pennington

I find the knock against Holmgren as Seahawks GM to be silly.

Good for you. Fact: Holmgren was GM. Fact: Holmgren surrendered that position after several years of no success. Fact: Seahawks began winning.

It is very likely that if Holmgren and the braintrust in Seattle felt that Holmgren was an effective GM, he would have, instead, surrendered the HC position.

That choice speaks volumes to me.

the fact that anyone thinks snyder will allow a real deal GM to come in and take control is laughable.

please, lets keep it to the possibilities of reality knowing who owns this team.

I think there are a ton of flaws with your plan, but your basic point is spot on: it's time to gut the team and rebuild with our eyes on 2012.

As far as GM candidates, I think there are a lot of good ones out there... here are a few, in no particular order (most links are from a series on candidates for the Chiefs job last year):
Jimmy Raye -- http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/1/5/ ... a-gm-jimmy
George Kokinis -- http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/1/2/ ... a-gm-georg
Eric DeCosta -- http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2008/12/3 ... -a-gm-eric
Doug Whaley -- http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2008/12/2 ... -a-gm-doug
Chris Polian -- http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/1/2/ ... a-gm-chris
Ted Sundquist -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Sundquist

Countertrey wrote:

RedskinTexan wrote:How about looking at Steve Keim personnel director of the Arizona Cardinals? He was up for the Lions job last year. He is supposed to be one of the up and coming really good talent evaluators. We could use someone who spots good players!

http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/20 ... hould.html

Hopefully, this will be the kind of individual that Snyder will begin looking at. There are a number of bright up-and-comers who will someday be making noise.

As long as this bright up-and-comer flips off Snyder when Danny Boy comes looking to attach the puppet strings.

Get Mike Holmgren as the GM and Jon Gruden as the HC. Fill the staff with like minded WCO minds.

Why the facination with the WCO? It hasn't worked for us so far.

yupchagee wrote:

Get Mike Holmgren as the GM and Jon Gruden as the HC. Fill the staff with like minded WCO minds.

Why the facination with the WCO? It hasn't worked for us so far.

Vinny came from the 49ers that's why.

I personally hate the west coast offense it's just so un- redskin like.

no one good will come to washington.

why isn't that clear?

Even if they did, it would be for money only. not for the reason of acutally building a winner.

Danny keeps that from happening.

jdubya wrote:no one good will come to washington.

why isn't that clear?

Even if they did, it would be for money only. not for the reason of acutally building a winner.

Danny keeps that from happening.

If that's the case, why are you bothering to troll this board? If it's a lost cause, give up and go home. Danny isn't selling. Not in the next 10 years. So you should at least pray he stops making terrible decisions over and over again.

I'd like the team to moce away from the WCO.

As I've said before: why keep living off someone else's glory days?

These are the Redskins, not the stupid 49'rs ofthe 90's.

Where did we go so wrong?

FireVinny wrote:

jdubya wrote:no one good will come to washington.

why isn't that clear?

Even if they did, it would be for money only. not for the reason of acutally building a winner.

Danny keeps that from happening.

If that's the case, why are you bothering to troll this board? If it's a lost cause, give up and go home. Danny isn't selling. Not in the next 10 years. So you should at least pray he stops making terrible decisions over and over again.

meanwhile, your sig says it all.

I am sure that we will get a great coach who will listen to everything danny and vinny says and will bring us a winner!

This team doesn't need a rebuild, it needs to be completely removed and replaced. Nothing on this team works.

maybe favre will sign for us?

I think the basic idea is right, build the OL, then get a long-term QB. Would be nice to have a franchise QB one day, but they would just get squashed behind the current line.